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Covid vaccine

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million pieces posted 12/9/2020 19:20 PM

I funded graduate school with experimental vaccines. In the 90s, I was vaccinated agains Cholera, Lymes and something else I can't remember. I remember they were going to challenge me with the the Cholera, inject the virus into me and admit me, I was going to make $2K, but I had to start my internship? I also started on Singulair before it was out, miracle drug for my asthma about 2 years before others got it. I'm more cautious now, but clearly I've trusted researchers before.

I'm a healthcare worker at a large University medical system that works on the COVID IMC unit. I think I'll be vaccinated next week. I'll let you know

WalkinOnEggshelz posted 12/9/2020 19:38 PM

I mentioned on the other thread that I will be vaccinated on Dec. 21st. Iím excited to be able to have this opportunity. Itís my belief that Covid will not go away unless vaccinations are successful.

I will be happy share my experience with you all.

HFSSC posted 12/9/2020 19:59 PM

Pretty disheartened to see the info about allergies. I had a severe reaction to a flu shot back around 2004. We were finally able to narrow it down to thimerosal as the offender. I'm hopeful that I'll still be able to take this vaccine because it sounds like it's free of preservatives since it has to be kept below a certain temperature.

We shall see.

zebra25 posted 12/9/2020 20:05 PM

Is the allergy information referring specifically to reactions to vaccines or allergies to drugs in general?

[This message edited by zebra25 at 8:06 PM, December 9th (Wednesday)]

number4 posted 12/9/2020 20:13 PM

I'm hopeful that I'll still be able to take this vaccine because it sounds like it's free of preservatives since it has to be kept below a certain temperature.

Yup, it doesn't have thimerosal! You should be able to get it.

number4 posted 12/9/2020 20:19 PM

@zebra25 - these people who had the reactions carried Epipens with them on a daily basis, so I'm assuming they were allergies that they could come into contact with that could cause anaphylactic shock. So not necessarily other drugs, but could be. But maybe also other things.

Candyman66 posted 12/9/2020 20:34 PM

The answer to the question "how did they do this so fast" is obvious if you think about it.

Computer power. They are simply so fast now that it is astounding and so the complex computations that took months to solve are now being done in a few hours. that and the very large, and getting larger all the time, database we have generated from previous research also helped. It's the advantage of science folks, we can learn from what others have learned and as such we do NOT have to start from scratch every time.

It's kind of like a four man best ball thing in golf. In a four man "best ball" tournament you join together with 3 other "golfers" (I had never golfed before) you let them all tee off and then you figure out who's shot was best and then ALL of you shoot from there. It's a blast because you not all time dealing with YOUR horrible shots but from wherever the best shot landed and you sc ore as if it was just one player so you don't care that in reality you shot 130 on a par 3 golf course. (and just for your info NONE of my shots was best it was just fun though)

With the development work on the vaccines it was top scientists working in top laboratories and great teamwork.

Bleu posted 12/9/2020 20:37 PM

Thank you for this thread. It's a great place for questions and honest, unbiased (well, slightly biased) answers.

I am quite pleased with the safety results thus far and will line up when my number is called.

FaithFool posted 12/10/2020 00:07 AM

I've been saying all along that the thing that reassures me the most is that there are a LOT of really smart people showing up for work every day to make this happen.

After hanging out here for so many years, it's easy to grow cynical and jaded.

This just gives me hope.

Jeaniegirl posted 12/10/2020 00:19 AM

I too have hope. But at the same time, with my horrible reaction to just a Flu shot, I'm also scared about taking the vaccine. But I probably will. With the flu shot I was totally down for three weeks.

Bigger posted 12/10/2020 03:50 AM

I second the computer-power theory mentioned above and add to it the increased knowledge about DNA and DNA mapping. I read an article by a guy doing DNA mapping and he said that they were doing emulations today in an hour that took over 3 days a few years ago.

It is my understanding that itís recommended procedure with ANY flu-vaccine to wait 20 minutes after being injected to see if you have allergy reactions. This ďstandardĒ procedure has been mostly overlooked with flu-shots because most of us are familiar with them and our allergic reactions. Sort of like the recommended procedure before setting off in a car is to walk around it and check the lights and tire-pressure Ė something we never do.
The worry in my neck of the woods is that the procedure for administrating the shot is rather complex, with social distancing, protective clothing and all that. Providing safe space for people to wait the 20 minutes creates a major bottleneck.

I would be OK with those that have known allergies that might trigger with the vaccine skip out if a) they are under 50 and b) donít have underlying health-issues. Or maybe have designated areas for those that fear allergic reactions where medical staff and waiting/recovery space is available. The key issue (according to my understanding) is to get the number of vaccinated to >60% and then statistically the virus should die simply because it canít find new hosts.

Personally Ė Iím slightly allergic to cats and Christmas trees (only if I handle them). Iím getting the shot the minute itís available to me as long as there is no feline product in it, and it doesnít smell of pine.

ZenMumWalking posted 12/10/2020 04:21 AM

HF (and others): the recommendation (for everyone but especially those who have had previous allergic reactions to ANYTHING) is to receive the vaccine in an environnement that can accommodate adverse reactions, ie has epinephrine and resuscitation capability.

So don't go to a pharm or your average mainstream clinic to get it, get it at your health facility (HF and other health care workers) or a facility with these capabilities.

As for the preservative issue, both the Pfizer and Moderna should not have this problem, they need to be stored at low temperatures. That make these vaccines more problematic in countries with lower access to refrigeration. iirc the Oxford/AstraZeneca vaccine has the advantage of not needing refrigeration but it has other problems and I don't think that it will be approved by the fda anytime soon. So I'm pretty sure that in the US you will be getting the Pfizer vaccine (but I don't live in the US, so this is just my guess based on news reports).

Candyman and Bigger are both right. There has been previous groundwork laid and subsequent work has also been sped up due to increased computing power and decreased computing cost.

Also, there has been an increased emphasis in parallelization on the computing end of things, meaning that the calculations can be split between computers (technically between processers, so could also be within a single computer acting like multiple computers), speeding things up in that way as well.

Lab assays are also high throughput these days and can be done in parallel rather than serially. So a speed-up on the lab end as well, meaning you can get results faster, decide and carry out your next experiment faster, everything goes faster.

tn - did you get the green light from your rheum doc?

homewrecked2011 posted 12/10/2020 04:34 AM

Regarding the speed of the vaccine being available; I remember early on one company stating they usually wait for FDA approval b4 making the doses. This time, they were so sure of their vaccine they were producing millions of doses of the vaccine, so that when it was approved they were ready to go. (Just did a google search online-and an illustration showed up which supports my statement. It also says existing distribution companies are being used and kits (needles,syringes, alcohol swabs) are shipped with the vaccine. )

The 2 physicians and 2 RN friends I have as friends are all in on the vaccine. One stated she is hoping those who fear the vaccine will be encouraged to get it, once they see the success.

Bigger posted 12/10/2020 05:05 AM

Iím also quite certain that the relevant Government agencies have been working at top-speed to validate and do the relevant paperwork and tests. I donít think lab overtime, computer access or 16 hour shifts for confirmation of data regarding the vaccine has been an issue. Iím guessing turnaround for results, further info and so on that was in weeks or even months pre-covid is now measured in hours or days and data more freely shared between agencies.

Lionne posted 12/10/2020 08:44 AM

Fascinating information! And yes, Tush, hoping you are cleared for it.
A related question...if a day of minor reaction, ie. body aches, slight fever, are an indication that your body is producing the correct immune response, what if you have NO reaction? The only medications I've ever had that kind of reaction are the second shingles shot and a long ago infusion of osteoporosis meds.

[This message edited by Lionne at 6:10 PM, December 10th (Thursday)]

barcher144 posted 12/10/2020 12:00 PM

Not everyone CAN be vaxed - like those with allergies or people with autoimmune or rheum (like tn).

I have not read closely everyone's responses (and some folks seem to refer to what I am about to mention) but I did see this last night on the news.

Apparently, one of the trials for one of the vaccines (I didn't catch which) specifically excluded people with known issues with allergies... and then a couple of people in the UK had a sufficiently strong allergic reaction that they needed to use their epipen after getting the vaccine.

So, if you have a history of problems with allergies... definitely bring this up before getting the vaccine (or any vaccine).

ZenMumWalking posted 12/10/2020 12:58 PM

Lionne - lack of an apparent reaction does not equate to lack of effictiveness. Not everyone has similar macroscopic reactions. This doesn't mean the vaccine is not working.

The only real proof that it is not working in an individual is if they get both shots and then are later challenged with covid-19 and get the disease. But that is a different trial - ordinary people getting the vax aren't going to be challenged with covid-19 just to 'make sure' the vax is working.

barcher - this is what I was talking about, and it's with the Pfizer vax. It is being given to NHS health care workers, and it was 2 of them who got a shot then needed their epi-pens.

So: snafu..... According to Pfizer's criteria they should have never received the vax. The UK needs to tighten up on their distribution procedures.

number4 posted 12/10/2020 14:05 PM

The worry in my neck of the woods is that the procedure for administrating the shot is rather complex, with social distancing, protective clothing and all that. Providing safe space for people to wait the 20 minutes creates a major bottleneck.

Last week, a small 'pop-up' trailer appeared in our CVS parking lot with the CVS logo on it. It had two doors on it and was probably 20'x30'. We figured it had something to do with the vaccine program. Now, they may use the Minute Clinic inside for the vaccines, where people can wait, and move the Minute Clinic into the parking lot trailer, or the trailer may be what they're going to use to administer the vaccine. Not sure. We were going to ask when we went in, but forgot. Will ask next time we go in, but I doubt that will be before they start the vaccine program, which, hopefully will be tomorrow.

But this was last week, so it is reassuring that they have already planned ahead for some logistics.

number4 posted 12/10/2020 14:14 PM

I remember early on one company stating they usually wait for FDA approval b4 making the doses.

Major pharmaceuticals that make it that far in Phase 3 trials with new drugs, with favorable results start making that drug weeks ahead of time, so that they're ready for shipment the next day. Several years ago, a major new drug came out to treat a chronic illness that was life-changing for many people. It was FDA-approved on a late Friday afternoon, and by Sunday, shipments were going out. We had a party for H's direct reports to celebrate the FDA approval on Friday night, and there was a lot of back-patting going on - it truly was a wonderful thing to be a part of... to see how all of their hard work paid off, and so many lives would be changed forever.

So, yea, pharmaceuticals start ramping up production long before the final FDA approval; is it risky? Could be, but the clinical trials/studies have been so favorable to that point, that they're willing to take that risk.

number4 posted 12/10/2020 14:24 PM

I'm actually watching the FDA hearing right now.

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