SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

First thank you for responding everyone and sorry if things are discombobulated. I know this sounds weak but I don't want to see a lawyer yet. I know it can just be for information gathering, but I'm not even completely understanding the scope of what's happening and who my H really is yet, I don't even know what to say or ask.

I know it's scary, been there done that, but part of seeing an attorney first is that they can help you find out the scope of what's happened and how it might affect your direction going forward. Most will be able to refer you to private investigators as well as computer and/or financial forensic specialists if necessary. They'll tell you what's possible and what isn't. Is divorcing on grounds an option for you if it becomes necessary? What's involved with that? In many states, condonation can take 'adultery as grounds' off the table, meaning that if you know he's cheating but you resume sexual congress or continue cohabitation past a certain cut-off point, the court considers you to have tacitly forgiven him. These can be important questions. Sometimes the WS isn't contrite at all after dday and they're fine with screwing their betrayed partner over in the divorce. There's no way to know. If you're worried that an expense will show and force a confrontation before you're ready, many attorneys offer free or limited cost consultations.

Only a very small number of BS's are ready to file this close to dday, so you're not abnormal, weak, passive, or anything even remotely like that. You do need to be prepared to protect yourself though and if you think about it, that's probably why you posted here, to find out where the pot holes are. Don't be afraid to get your ducks lined up. We're here for you and ready to talk anytime you need to get things off your chest. Serial cheaters don't have the best prognosis for recovery though and I think you would do well to be very realistic with yourself about that.

Just remember that you're going to be okay. It's going to suck and it's going to seem like it takes forever to get to the other side of this thing, but you WILL make it. We're all living proof.

((big hugs))

I’m sending you big hugs. The supersized entitlement it takes to give himself the permission to conduct long term affairs and hire escorts all while setting himself up as a man of religious integrity (that counsel’s others🥵)is mind blowing.

He took away your agency to decide if you wanted to partner with someone who wasn’t monogamous ……period… never mind what’s in his (cold black)heart. He put your health at risk, the rash scenario is a perfect example of his operating with information you don’t have and putting your health at risk.

Take your time. It is so much to absorb. Right now you have to rewrite your life with all of this new information.

Gather evidence. Put it in a safe spot. Protect yourself. Do not have sex with him(perhaps claim illness or yeast infection). Build up your support network and keep posting.

Do you mind if I ask about your phrasing ‘Husband religious community’? Are you not a part of the religion?

Is it a community you feel safe in, that you are confident will hold him accountable or sweep it under the rug with forgiveness…..

You are doing so well. I know that’s hard to hear but the effort it must have taken push down the confrontation and anger and gather information is very admirable.

Take care of you!!!!

First, let me say that I'm new here, just 8 weeks post D-day, so I'm not sure if my advice will be any good. Our stories have lots of similarities though: mine was 20 year relationship, one child, and never in a million years I would suspect him of cheating and lying to me. Yet it happened.

One thing I regret is that I confronted him too soon, before I gathered all the information. I already had enough to know he is a serial cheater, but I regret not finding out the entire truth, because now he refuses to share it with me claiming that he doesn't remember or that it didn't happened. He changed all his passwords and deleted bunch of evidence. Again, not sure if this is a good advice, but I would dig deeper, because chances are, he will deny it and you won't have another opportunity to do it again.

I'm so sorry this has happened to you.

I need to clarify this. I am not qualified to diagnose anyone. That said your husband sounds very much like a sociopath. Charming, facile, makes sure the public sees a good guy and appears to have no guilt or remorse. Sociopaths cannot be fixed. Again, this is just supposition and not a diagnosis.

Please listen to these experts. One thing all bs have to deal with is being married/living with/dating someone who lies by commission or omission. Cheating is lying. Every single day. The only marriages that recover are ones whose WS does the work, over and over and over again. Forever.

See an expert(psychologist) who deals with Personality Disorders. See an attorney. Stay low, stay quiet until you have your ducks in a row.

Giant hugs to you. Hang on. Stay here. Use this place to vent, ask questions.

There's an old joke: How do you know when a politician is lying? Their lips are moving.

I found this to be true of my XWH. He was always lying. A saying around here is that cheaters are lying liars who lie.

Please, take anything he says with a grain of salt and verify.

So sorry for you and that you had to join us.

OP if he's been lying and cheating for years, and he's in his 40's now... this is who he is.

If you stay married to him, you should have every expectation of him cheating on you going forward.

Next trip he goes on, that will be fun wondering what nasty crap he's up to this time. Secret girlfriends, escorts, secretly buying sex toys, there is something very wrong with your husband.

Long painful road ahead if he promises to 'fix' himself and you go along for the ride. It's possible after cheating on you for years he just might stop all that terrible behaviour. It's possible.

I wouldn't bet a dime on it.

[This message edited by SnowToArmPits at 7:48 AM, Friday, August 19th]

I’m so sorry you are here OP. What you’ve written is horrendous. I just want to give you a hug because what you discovered is everyone’s nightmare.

There is no "better than yours" infidelity but I have to say that the first thought that comes to mind reading your story is that only someone with some sort of personality disorder can be capable of this type of cold blooded betrayal. To spend ALL his married life with a dualism approach, no guilt, no second thoughts… to be asked to advice young couples on marriage success and do so when he knew his own marriage was a lie.

I remember on dday being floored that my husband was in love with another woman. I discovered it because he couldn’t deal with the pressure and had a tearful moment when he told me how miserable he felt (without telling me why) and I started digging. That was guilt. That was pressure, that was "this isn’t normal".

As time went by I struggled and I still do at times with the level of planned deceit that goes into an affair. I kept getting these memories of us being happy together during his affair and wondered how the hell was he capable to kiss me, hug me, tell me he loved me whilst he was in his affair as well.

My husband’s affair was 6 months and I’m pretty certain, based on his reaction to everything, that is was unique in our marriage. As I said I still have moments when I look at him and I cannot understand how could he be so deceitful although we are still together and I do believe he worked hard and changed. 6 months of lies giving me a lifetime of trauma, yes I’ve recovered, I’m pretty much healed, but facts don’t change, I will always be married to a man who had sex during his lunch breaks and kissed another woman and then came home to me.

I cannot see how there’s any coming back from your story, it’s a lifetime of lies. At "best" 2 years affair. At worst 20 years of lies, deceit, 20 years of a-ha moments when suddenly his actions at some point in the past will make sense to you.

This man allegedly cheated all his life. He does it as a sport. He isn’t a normally principled man who “forgot” his values temporary for some fucked up reason, he has no morals that tell him he shouldn’t deceive another person ALL THEIR LIVES because he couldn’t be asked to inform them they’re not monogamous at heart.

I truly wonder why cheaters who decide they aren’t monogamous at heart forget to inform their spouses so they can also "benefit" from this lack of monogamy too. They’re not monogamous at heart but they expect monogamy from their spouses…

Please go an see a lawyer to understand what your life without him will look like. You don’t have to divorce. You just need to gather your facts and know what divorce looks like for you.

[This message edited by Luna10 at 11:01 AM, Friday, August 19th]

Ma'am, first of all, my solicitudes for the horrifuc betrayal that you've uncovered. It made my blood boil to read what you have found out to date. Again, I am so very sorry. Your world must be spinning and you are in shock.

Youve received tremendous responses already that have laid out an immediate tactical path. Its ok right now to just deal with whats in front of you and not think too far ahead. The "immediate" that I am referencing is getting an std/i check which you are doing, seeing a therapist to help process the trauma, and consult with a lawyer as soon as you are able. The reason a legal consult is important early on is that as you process this, you may start thinking of a direction to take that is not in your best interest legally and knowing where you stand as it pertains to the laws of your state can actually help diminish some level of stress down the road. As others have said, eat right, exercise, stay hydrated.

Now, no matter how this plays out, please do not try to go it alone. You will need people on team YOU for support including professionals mentioned above, trusted family and friends, and of course SI. I am not advocating reaching out to family and friends immediately, just start thinking about who you will include in that support circle. You may well need it sooner than later.

My betrayal is old, but the scars and lessons learned endure. I will tell you this, if I had had just half of the great experinced direction that you and so many others receive here, things may have gone so very different for me.

Strength to you now. Remember to breath deep and blow the stress out.

You husband probably has other accounts you're not aware of. Looking into other checking or banking accounts, and then double check credit cards. Maybe some of them are taking crypto, like bitcoin for the escorts, I can see them using an alt currency so that they don't get tracked.

Your husband is a great liar, and you have only heard and seen the tip of the iceberg. You have to ask yourself, is this a deal breaker. If this is hurting you like it is, can you deal with the other two long term girlfriends that you don't even know the details to yet? Better think long and hard on that, and if its a deal killer, go see a lawyer.

I’m so sorry. This is heartbreaking to read.

You have already gotten tons of advice from all the best here. Just one thought I had, if it wasn’t mentioned already, is that you may not want to reveal everything that you know/found when you confront him. See what he admits to first. Maybe he will give you info or a lead on something you don’t already know about.

Also, maybe you will want a support (your sister?) near or with you when you confront him. I know that I had every intention of a calm but firm approach when I confronted but something took over me and I completely lost my shit on him. Almost like an out of body experience.

You are doing an amazing job to be able to keep it together while you gather evidence and plan you next move.

Hope you are doing ok considering. Something slamsunk said made me want to tell you this - for me, in the early discovery phases I could not get my heart rate under control, it was pounding out of my chest. That led to panic attacks, emotional flooding and panic flight mode. Remember to breathe and keep an eye on your pulse rate. Under 100 is good, over is going to produce stress chemicals and make it harder for you to stay calm and collected. Breathe. You will survive this. Trust yourself above anyone else. I hope the support from your sister is what you need and helps you navigate this journey. Take care.

I agree with so much doble wrote. This is brutal stuff. How do I know? Because I lived with a man who had a double life.

I gave him extra time and chances to hurt me. He was capable of things I did not see coming. I can't say what is best for you but I will always forward choose to protect myself first and foremost and when someone shows me who they really are (not mask they show the Church or others), then I 💯 believe them the first time and act accordingly. One lie is my new deal breaker.

"He took away your agency to decide if you wanted to partner with someone who wasn’t monogamous"

I fully agree with this and it happened to me. WH and I had a one woman one man monogamous spiritual marriage contract. At least that's what it overtly was. What it really was was him making the rules and not telling me what they were, risking my life, lying to me, deceiving me.
I have no contact with him anymore. He is not safe for me at any speed.

I wish you wisdom and healing and peace.

He told the group he commonly sees escorts for massage and more, sometimes as much as twice a month!!

Do you know his username on this group? Maybe the woman who told you about this group will tell you what his username is. Even though these groups...like this site...have anonymous users...YOU may be able to glean some information from his posts on this group.

Sigyn,

You have been a trusting and loyal partner and did nothing to deserve your husband's brutal and repeated betrayal.

We should be able to trust our committed partners. Full stop.

The fact that all of the betrayed spouses on this site have not be able to speaks to our partner's lack of integrity, their self-centeredness and the flexible morality they've used in their minds to justify their choices to betray those who love them.

You are very much still in shock, of course.

The vast majority of us believed we were in happy, loving, and loyal relationships before we discovered the betrayal. Shock and numbness sprinkled with bouts of anger and sadness are absolutely normal....and I'm so sad that there is a "normal" response to this trauma. Damn. It shouldn't be happening enough for there to be a "normal" response...yet, here we are.

I hope your sister is offering the support you deserve.

Gather more evidence if you believe you need to. The helpful advice someone once gave me was this: You only need enough proof to convince yourself. You don't need to convince your spouse or your family or friends. You can take whatever action you need to in order to feel (more) safe.

With that said, I totally relate to the need to understand the full breadth and depth of the deception. It cuts you off at the knees and hollows you out to discover that there has been a completely separate "reality" to your marriage and relationship with the one you should be able to trust the most.

I see your strength though. You know that you don't deserve this. You know that he's been using his focus and energy to willingly make these choices. You know that a guy who can carry on this level and length of betrayal can manage to pick up some takeout food on his own.

You take care of you and your child.
Strength to you dear lady!

It shows that even after 20 years we still dont really know someone. When I found out I was totally shocked. Being shocked is an understatement. I was totally flabbergasted. After 10 years being together I thought we had the best marriage. People were envious of the relationship we had. He was looked up to by family and loved ones and he even played a great part. I thought he was an amazing guy who would never hurt me. I foolishly compared my marriage with two of my sisters marriage. Their husbands were not as loving and would not help them around the house with chores or cooking. Mine did everything and still managed to cheat on me. Amazing time management i guess because I did not suspect a thing. I was too busy in our fantasy land to even notice the signs and when I did he was already totally in love and leaving me and also divorcing me all in one night.

Till this day I completely dumbfounded how he managed to pull it off. He crashed my world. He broke me to pieces. He caused me to have uneccessary panic and anxiety attacks. He killed the part of me that showed him compassion and love. He made me feel like it was my fault. He didnt directly blame me. I started picking at my own flaws i.e the way I looked, the way i dressed. I wanted to create a new me because I thought he hated me. I learnt later that it has nothing to do with me. It was all on him. His character and his own flaws. However he took something away from me that I feel like I cant get back...being content. I no longer am content in life.

Fast forward 5 years I am not the same person I was. I am alot stronger mentally. I do not allow myself to be dependent on him. I do things for myself. I have my own finances and I have my own life. He can choose to be apart of it if he wants but I will not be that naive person I was. He cannot break me anymore because Ive learnt to heal myself without him. Yes he has supported me but I will not allow him to heal me because I need to do that myself. I was reading a blog and it mentioned how the the person that breaks you cannot heal you. I completely believe this and live by it. You need to be able to heal yourself.

Youre not at the healing stage yet but all I am saying is that you will get there with or without him in your life. You may feel completely at lost right now and totally numb and also totally flabbergasted. He has destroyed what you thought was 20 years of an amazing marriage with an amazing partner. You believe everything you had is a lie but it was not a lie for you. You were the honest person and you did everything right by nature. Its him thats at fault and its him that is the cold hearted pig. You are not to be blamed at all. You did nothing wrong. All I wanted to say is please do not blame yourself for his wrongdoings.

I don't know what to do. I don't know how much verification to get before confronting him.

Others have given you very good information.

Your experience is kind of similar to mine in that my then-wife was living a completely separate and secret adulterous-as-fuck fantasy world while pretending to be all about family, her faith, and marriage.

The real actual lie is the one they are living with you.

He, like my now ex-wife, is likely a narcissistic sociopath.

No amount of therapy, counseling, or psychiatry will ever fix or "cure" them of this behavior.

Any claim of "I’m not that person anymore!" is simply continued manipulation.

The worst thing in the mind of this type of person is having the proverbial "mirror" placed in front of them.

I divorced my ex-wife over 10 years ago and she is the same exact person she was back then.

As others have suggested, I would also strongly, strongly urge you to consult with a very highly experienced divorce attorney and continue to get as much evidence as possible - especially if it regards him taking time away from his children to conduct any extramarital activities.

DO NOT tell him you know anything until after you have acquired ample evidence and have an attorney working with you.

He seems like a stranger now, but after confronting him and exposing his behavior, he may become your worst enemy.

As difficult as it may seem to face this, it is imperative that you be well prepared.

[This message edited by keptmyword at 8:28 PM, Saturday, August 20th]

I am so sorry you find yourself here. Take care of yourself and your needs first. You've been dealt a body blow.

a woman who had been involved with my H, had ended her relationship with him so she said, and apparently wanted to let me know about his secret life.

In a few words I'll say that you may be right that she is single. If she is, your WH has been her entire world for the last two or so years. A MOW has her own family to tend and runs the same risks as her MAP. An affair between two MAPs has a sort of equilibrium until one leaves their spouse. A single AP dotes on her MM and either never thinks of the spouse or views her as the obstacle to her happiness.

It seems to me that you and your WH are well off and enjoy a comfortable lifestyle. Not everyone can enjoy trips, traveling, BnBs and the dinners out, the shopping and the gifts he may be lavishing on these women. A single AP may want to make such a lifestyle permanent.

I sometimes read that the majority of affairs last from 3 or 6 months to about 2 years. Also that two years is usually when an AP starts making demands about commitment.

I'm going to guess the OW gave your WH an ultimatum and he chose to stay married. That your WH went through a grieving period indicates there were feelings on both their parts. Messaging you was her last desperate act to get your WH back. If she couldn't threaten or charm him into leaving you, then obviously her only chance is to get you to throw him out.

Do not underestimate how desperate and manipulating her contacting you is. If I were you I wouldn't talk to her at all. It will only give her more insight into your M.

If you do, let her know that whatever she thought was her role in your M, it's over now and she needs to move on and find peace without bothering you and your H again.

I strongly urge you to seek out an attorney with the eye to engaging a forensic accountant. Your WH has been spending a fortune on his secret lifestyle. All of this could have and should have been going to you and your child, your child's education and eventually, your child's inheritance.

I caution you not to let her think you depend on her for information in any way because I'm sure whatever you say to her will be sent to those chat groups they were involved in. People you don't even know will know you. Much better to cut her off completely.

One last thing. Your WH and she will get in contact again. The urge to find out how the other is doing can be overwhelming. She is going to tell your WH that she talked to you. I doubt she's finished meddling in your M and she certainly didn't finally clue you in because her conscience bothered her.

If and when she tells your WH you know, what will he do? I think he will cover his tracks, especially financially, so even though you can put off thoughts of D, you should make some moves to figure out the financial infidelity.

I'm really overwhelmed with the amount of support and good advice you're all giving me and I can't tell you how much it means to me. I feel like I have so many people in my corner right now who are all speaking the same language and on the same wavelength, while before this it was just me holding everything in and wondering if I could be crazy. I can't believe how much has changed in my head in the couple of days since I posted here and then yesterday when I told my sister. I was so afraid to make it real but it turns out that at least for today, it feels a little empowering to look at something "real" when my marriage was anything but. Even if the reality makes me sick.

I will update first and then go back and re-read all of your posts and respond, my H and son are camping this weekend, I said I had a migraine and stayed home.

I had my STD tests including blood tests and will get results electronically through the app, nothing will come to my house. I spent yesterday at my sister's and told her everything and had a massive emotional breakdown. I let her read my posts here and my back and forth with the OW and she was as shocked as I was and at first before she read the OW messages she thought it could be someone scamming me online. She'd also thought that I'd asked her to stay home so I could tell her something terrible about HER husband, I feel so badly about that, I was so wrapped up in my own shock I didn't even think of what assumptions she'd make. But then she read the messages and I showed her the calendar and it just felt too legitimate to dismiss.

Sister is a list maker, so she pulled out a notebook and we now have: a list of family lawyers, a list of questions to ask a lawyer, a timeline based on H's calendar, and a list of things to ask the OW. She (sister) composed the message to OW, I suddenly couldn't stomach it, asking the OW for three things - screen grabs of texts or anything that verified they were traveling together or seeing each other, pictures of them together, and any of his posts from the online group where they met.

About 4pm I was about to leave sister's house and the OW replied! She supplied screen grabs of texts arranging dates, with H mentioning my schedule and my son's schedule, using our names, and then giving a prospective set of travel dates. In the text it shows that she chose a set of dates and he confirmed them, and in fact those dates match with one of his 'solo' bike trips. There were other screen grabs of him saying he had such a good time in xxxx national park with her. She also sent screen grabs of his messages from their online group, so I have his user name. She didn't send any pictures of them together but sent a screengrab of a video session they had in which he was on our bed and she scribbled out her own face in the other little video window. I can see part of her hair, shoulders and the neck of her shirt and she looks young, and unfamiliar. I don't think it's anyone I know. So that's all the proof I need for myself now and I never want to hear from this woman again. I feel like she's been enjoying the drama of the collapse of my life and if like my sister suspects she's actually trying to pry our marriage apart by telling me, she simply wouldn't have had the power to do that if he hadn't handed it to her. But I still never want to talk to her again.

I went home and said I had a migraine and bowed out of the camping trip this weekend. I don't know how I'll keep a normal face on when they get home. My sister has been such a rock. She cried with me, and she's so incredibly angry. I want to be angry too but I just feel so heartbroken.

Current feeling is that this is unfixable. H didn't just "have an affair" - he is a different person than he presented to me, to all of us. He is remorseless, his texts and his messages on the online group are those of a very happy man. He is in his element in those spaces. It's not a question of him changing his behavior, this is who he is inside. I can't fathom that.

Messaging you was her last desperate act to get your WH back. If she couldn't threaten or charm him into leaving you, then obviously her only chance is to get you to throw him out.

I believe this. I get that vibe from her completely. I can't let any feelings about her distract me from my choices right now, but I know I won't participate in a competition with her for him. I need to make choices for myself and my son without visions of her plaguing me. I don't know how at the moment though....

No amount of therapy, counseling, or psychiatry will ever fix or "cure" them of this behavior.

I also believe this! I saw just a small glimpse of his messages to his community online, he was absolutely expressing his real self, his sincere words and thoughts.

I foolishly compared my marriage with two of my sisters marriage. Their husbands were not as loving and would not help them around the house with chores or cooking. Mine did everything and still managed to cheat on me. Amazing time management i guess because I did not suspect a thing.

I so relate to this and am so sorry! I also foolishly thought I had it made and wished my sister could find a husband like mine. Now if only I had a husband flaky at finances and thoughtless at gift giving. I'd trade that for this in a heartbeat. I'm so sorry for what you went through. I hope I feel strong like you someday. It's reassuring but also terrifying. How many people are married to a stranger?

Do you know his username on this group?

I do now!!! Sister is looking into this for me, don't have the stomach for it right now.

ou husband probably has other accounts you're not aware of. Looking into other checking or banking accounts, and then double check credit cards.

It's on one of my lists! Also venmo!! I have to do this part myself. I do have all of the passwords, and I have access to both of our credit reports which should tell me about official accounts I don't know about.

I cannot see how there’s any coming back from your story, it’s a lifetime of lies. At "best" 2 years affair. At worst 20 years of lies, deceit, 20 years of a-ha moments when suddenly his actions at some point in the past will make sense to you.

I think the horrific truth that I was numbing myself from was that very fact. It's not something he did, it is someone he is. It's not a matter of forgiving an act, it's a matter of whether I can love who he actually is, which includes being a very prolific liar among all of the sexual and romantic betrayals. If he presented himself that way to me 20 years ago - and his words to his friends indicate he's felt this way even then - would I have dated him? No. And he knows that. He knows me, at least, because I am the same person inside as I am outside except for right now carrying HIS secrets as if they are mine, and it's eating me up inside. How does he live with secrets like this and act normally? Is he a machine??

Do you mind if I ask about your phrasing ‘Husband religious community’? Are you not a part of the religion?

I'm not an official member of his religion, which is considered a culture as much as a religion, but I participate in the social and cultural aspects very happily. I'm not a religious person, but the community and belief system is beautiful to me and I respect it greatly.

I'm sorry I haven't responded to everyone individually. A lot of the legal things I'm leaving until I have some emotional energy left. I want to at least consult with an attorney before telling my H that I know, I agree with everyone who recommended that. I need to be able to say with honesty that I spoke with multiple attorneys. I need to look him in the eyes when I tell him that I have evidence, and it is in safe hands. I selfishly want him to see that I too can hide things directly relevant to him and his life, and he can be the one to walk through a room of landmines while blindfolded.

It's not selfish to protect yourself. For all this time, you believed that you had someone looking out for you, someone who would prioritize your best interests. It turns out that you were at risk, medically, financially, and emotionally.

I do think it's wise to see several attorneys. Do a little research and find out who the best ones are, then interview them. Bear in mind that it generally creates a conflict of interest so that if they talk to you, they can't work for him. Not that you need to put one on retainer yet. You don't. But think of it this way, your WH has had years, decades even, to think about what happens if he gets caught. Hell, he could be gaming you right now, waiting for the kids to go to college or whatever. We tend to assume that just because a WS hasn't walked yet that they never plan to, and really, that's true more often than it isn't. Still though, he's got a crazy amount of lead time on you in terms of making any potential plans. Better to be prepared.

So glad you talked with your sister. A real life support network is so important. ((hugs))