SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Let me preface this by saying that I do not feel suicidal or have any intention to commit suicide. However, for as long as I can remember, I've had thoughts about dying/suicide. The first time I went to therapy was around 7/8ish when my teachers/parents discovered something I had written about wanting to die.

Anyways. I periodically have random thoughts about suicide. Mostly I either find myself thinking about how I would do it, OR a more persistent/annoying thought pops in my head like, "You should slit your wrists."

FWIW, I'm currently taking 25mg of sertraline (generic zoloft), and have been since my WH's A in late 2017. I started to wean off last March but stopped -- during a pandemic when we could hear ambulance sirens at all hours of the day and night was not the right time, I started having a lot of panicky episodes. I am not currently seeing a therapist.

Today has just been a day full of anxiety over, really, silly volunteer-y stuff at my 4yos school. I'm working virtually on a committee with a fellow mom that I loathe (she's pretty condescending and insufferable, but she gets stuff done for the school so 🤷‍♀️ ), and thought I was responsible for finding volunteers, and then passing them along to the rest of the committee to vet. I did not realize that I would have to do some zoom meetings with alumni parents and make small talk and schmooze and see if we can get them to do some volunteer work for the school. I hate small talk. I'm not good at schmoozing. I'm generally pretty quiet/shy/reserved and have found that keeping my mouth shut and my eyes open has served me better in life than trying to make awkward, uncomfortable chitchat.

So... pretty much nonstop today I've had this loop of annoying thoughts -- "You can't do this. You should go kill yourself. Why did you think you could do this? You should go slit your wrists."

Again, to be clear, I do not want to kill myself. What I want is for these thoughts to go away, or to figure out something better than hearing this loop in my head, catching myself, and trying to redirect my thoughts, only for the loop to start up again five minutes later.

Google is not much help, because it brings me to suicide hotlines, and I'm not worried that I'm actually going to do this. But man, this is not helping my anxiety, and definitely not going to help me muddle through virtual small talk with some people I haven't seen in nearly a decade.

I mentioned this to WH, and he was a little alarmed, rubbed my shoulders and neck (because I've been so tense today), and advised me to take a break from working, and go do some meditative breathing, which helped a little bit temporarily. I don't want to mention this to my IRL BFFs because... this is kind of a weird/jarring thing to say to people, and I don't want to alarm them.

Any tips/advice on how to get rid of these thoughts? Anyone else deal with thoughts of suicide, but don't have any desire or intentions to follow through?

[This message edited by ibonnie at 9:35 PM, February 5th (Friday)]

I'm so sorry you're struggling.

Honestly tho, calling the suicide hotline might be a good start. They may have some resources for you that are more effective than Google. I'm sure you aren't alone with these kinds of thoughts, especially after the delightful year we all just endured.

Sending you hugs and lots of good juju!

It's just a thought. Just like any other thought. As you have stated, it does not necessarily follow that you will act on it.

Write it on some toilet paper and flush. Create a new association for when you have those thoughts and implement that new thought - first consciously, then again and again until it becomes unconscious, and then with the time shortened from the suicidal thought to the associated thought perhaps the suicidal thoughts will become less frequent and eventually go away.

The thoughts in and of themselves are not harmful - only when you can't resist the impulse to act on them are they harmful. Even so, you might want to check with your doctor about your AD dose.

How about when you think 'slit my wrist' you associate 'flit the twist'.....meaningless and harmless.

Might that work for you??

Sending you strength and positive, healing thoughts as you traverse the path toward more helpful thoughts. These thoughts might be serving some purpose, try to figure out what that is.

((((ibonnie))))

..(((((ibonnie))))))

Listen....I think that covid-19 or whatever fucking number you put after it, ..has pretty much ALL of US thinking about death a whole lot more than normal.

Don't we all ask ourselves How? Why? When? Where? we will meet our Maker?

There are just so many variables...space aliens taking me aboard... for "experiments"...?

Ever since we bought the city condo..on the 15th floor, I've thought "Hey, there's my ticket ..to say goodbye cruel world." if I ever truly felt the need.

The infidelity alone has had me thinking thousands of times.. and I'll bet I'm not alone!?

Find a task, a diversion, a hobby, a book that requires your concentration.. phone a friend?

Make a fresh pot of coffee...or smoke some fresh POT!!

..your Si friend..smy

I wonder: do you have any OCD tendencies? Sometimes, well-formed intrusive thoughts like these, when not attached to ideation/intent, really represent a compulsion, rather than any relationship to suicide (beyond their content, which is sort of meaningless when removed from the context of intent).

I don't know if that will resonate with you, and I'd certainly encourage you to talk with your doctor about it, but it may help to know that many people do have this sort of self-talk that really is NOT indicative of much more than the neuro glitches of OCD.

FWIW, some people also report that their OCD is made worse sertraline. It might be worth talking with your doctor about trying another SSRI. Citalopram (Celexa) is one associated with positive outcomes vis-a-vis OCD, and the lowest incidence of SSRI side effects, overall. (It's also a good one because it can be dispensed as a liquid; when you're ready to wean, you can switch to that form to titrate dose down slowly and completely bypass any withdrawal symptoms.)

Therapy--particularly a form of CBT called exposure and response prevention (ERP) can be really helpful, too.

Ibonnie, so sorry you are struggling

I have been sad most of my adult life, on and off, so I can relate. I tried CBT but that didn’t help because, although it gives some good practical strategies to cope, it doesn’t go to the root of the problem. Counselling has been a life saver for me and I would urge you to resume that as soon as possible. You cannot do this alone Ibonnie, and that’s ok. We cannot be expected to be strong all the time! It’s one dangerous loop that reinforces our sense of inadequacy and failure. We need to be able and willing to ask for help.

Something else that has helped me is exercise. I got myself a rowing machine and I found that working out really clears my mind. That combined with long walks seems to keep things in check for me. I hadn’t exercised in years so I can really notice the difference. You might want to give that a go.

I hope you can turn a corner soon Ibonnie. We are here whenever you need to get stuff off your chest

CBT for sure whether that's a rubber band on your wrist or visualizing a stop sign or whatever but you need a therapist to help with this. Additionally your meds aren't therapeutic or helping you if you are struggling like this. There are lots of other ADs out there and meds that can better help with OCD type behaviors and thoughts.

Please make an appt with you mental health professional on Monday.

I am not sure why we all have such a hard time with the word no. Someone guilted you into doing this volunteer work that you are not suited for. I can talk to anyone about anything but I am very reticent about having people come in my house without calling first. All of us have quirks. Don’t try to fight yours just let someone else, who enjoys this, do it. Look after yourself. No one else will.

Once, I had already accepted a job when I was offered one much better. I was in agony over feeling guilty about wanting the second job. My husband pretty well put it straight. He said that they would walk over my still warm body to have someone else. I should take the job I wanted. I did and it’s been a great fit.

Look after yourself at home and out “there”. And learn to say no.

[This message edited by Cooley2here at 7:57 AM, February 7th (Sunday)]

2nd the CBT that’s what really helped me after my suicide attempt and ideation. I still get thoughts of wishing I would die but they are just thoughts and they pass.

From my understanding, 25 mgs of Zoloft is a very low dose. I'm not a Dr. but maybe explain to your Dr. what's going on. Would an increase in the dosage help? For my DD13, we are introducing Wellbutrin to her SSRI Lexapro.

I agree with Ellie. Maybe a call to the hotline would be helpful. Just simply state what you explained here.

Also, you mentioned you are not currently seeing a therapist. I don't recall if you saw an IC in the past but maybe now is a good time. Where I'm at, they are online/zoom meetings. No schmoozing.

Let the committee know that you aren't able to continue doing the volunteering anymore. They don't need a reason from you. Its definitely causing you unnecessary anxiety and stress levels which has negative effects in our body and mind.

Hang in there! Wish I had a good solution. Little steps at a time may turn into better days.

Some really good ideas here.

I think all of us have negative self talk. I do.

Generally your emotions which are reflected in your self talk are giving you information.

You are unhappy with the volunteering role but have been doing it. Stop. Say no. Even tell them why. This person maybe capable but toxic people always have a cost. The price should not be at cost to you.

Do volunteering that makes you feel good. If this is bring you to a point of suicidal self talk, change your situation. You do not have to do it. Put your mental health and happiness first.

Then have a convo with yourself saying how proud you are of you. I think you should be proud already.

I also recommend you write her name on toilet paper, and “really” use it, and enjoy the symbolic freeing of her.

Ibonnie, I only see great posts from you. You are a great person, be kind to you.

From my understanding, 25 mgs of Zoloft is a very low dose.

Yea, that's what I was thinking. That is a very low dose that isn't even therapeutic; you can always ask for a blood serum level to see if you're in a therapeutic dose range for the Zoloft. For context, I'm on 200mg of Zoloft for anxiety. I'm on the high end definitely, but 25 mg. is a baby dose. Are you seeing a psychiatrist for your meds? I am a firm believer that psychiatrists are the only ones who should dole out psychiatric medications - it's really an art that someone with lots of experience should be handling.

Due to chronic anxiety, I have a long history of psychiatric issues that have included a couple of hospitalizations and trials of many, many medications. I've done CBT and DBT - they helped a little, but were not the magic elixir for me. I have PTSD and am working on accepting that that is part of who I am, and seeing a therapist will always be a part of taking care of my health.

^^^^

THIS

Thanks all. Just to reiterate, I am not suicidal. Friday was just a really anxious days with lots of intrusive thoughts. I was stuck on a loop and beating myself up for no reason.

Listen....I think that covid-19 or whatever fucking number you put after it, ..has pretty much ALL of US thinking about death a whole lot more than normal.

I think everyone I know is just kind of... losing it, a bit, tbh. We're all cooped up in small NYC apartments, working and doing virtual school from home. I haven't seen my friends and most of my family since last March, and we've had six family members pass away in less than a year.

or smoke some fresh POT!!

Ha! I wish, but I have zero chill whenevr I've smoked. It just makes me incredibly anxious, paranoid, physically twitchy, bur unable to get up from wherever I'm sitting... and that's onlt after one or two pulls!

I wonder: do you have any OCD tendencies? Sometimes, well-formed intrusive thoughts like these, when not attached to ideation/intent, really represent a compulsion, rather than any relationship to suicide (beyond their content, which is sort of meaningless when removed from the context of intent).

I do! And I've mentioned it in passing to previous therapists, but have never really pursued it any further, because it doesn't really impact my life too negatively? For example, I shower the exact same way every day. If I shower that way, I know it will be a good day. If something happens, and I can't shower that exact way (like oversleep and running late, or problem w/ hot water), I am off. I feel unclean. I can muddle through, but it won't be a good day, I'll keep thinking about it, and things won't be okay again until I can shower correctly to set things right.

FWIW, some people also report that their OCD is made worse sertraline. It might be worth talking with your doctor about trying another SSRI. Citalopram (Celexa) is one associated with positive outcomes vis-a-vis OCD, and the lowest incidence of SSRI side effects, overall. (It's also a good one because it can be dispensed as a liquid; when you're ready to wean, you can switch to that form to titrate dose down slowly and completely bypass any withdrawal symptoms.)

I did not know this, so thank you for sharing! I'll def. look into this more.

Also, you mentioned you are not currently seeing a therapist. I don't recall if you saw an IC in the past but maybe now is a good time. Where I'm at, they are online/zoom meetings. No schmoozing.

I've been to therapy 3x in my life, most recently when I suspected my WH's A, but he was gaslightling me, so I thought I was losing my mind. I stopped when I felt like I had plateaued -- the therapist was nice, and a life safer post-d-day, but idk. I just felt like I hit a wall with her, and just needed time to process everything that happened. But I did see her for awhile.

Honestly this last year feels surreal, because we have gone almost nowhere, and have done almost nothing that we normally would. When the weather's been nice, we've tried to plan outdoorsy day trips places where we won't run into too many other people. I haven't looked into therapy just because I'm literally almost never alone, as DS is doing virtual school from home full-time, and it's almost impossible to get any privacy these days.

I am not sure why we all have such a hard time with the word no. Someone guilted you into doing this volunteer work that you are not suited for. I can talk to anyone about anything but I am very reticent about having people come in my house without calling first. All of us have quirks. Don’t try to fight yours just let someone else, who enjoys this, do it. Look after yourself. No one else will.

I emailed w/ another person on the committee, who thanked me for the potential leads, and said they would handle reaching out to the one person I was most nervous about. I was able to think about it on Saturday, and I've been able to find two people who are definitely interested (plus three other maybes), which is four people more than the last person tasked with this responsibility was able to do, and their one potential volunteer didn't even pan out.

I'm perfectly capable of saying no to things that I'm really not comfortable with, but I'm not good at saying that I can't complete a task that I volunteered for. I have until the end of this crazy school year (June!) and then I'm done. I know why I'm not good at saying no in instances like this -- it's my mom's voice in my head saying, "Don't say you can't do it. Say, 'how can I make this work?' and then figure out a way to do it." There's a whole bunch of mental health issues and transgeneration family trauma there to unpack though.

Then have a convo with yourself saying how proud you are of you. I think you should be proud already.

Ibonnie, I only see great posts from you. You are a great person, be kind to you

Thank you! That's very kind of you to say, and much appreciated. I do try to do my best and be a helpful person to others, but I'm always surprised when other people notice, because I try to help from in the wings, rather than center stage.

Yea, that's what I was thinking. That is a very low dose that isn't even therapeutic; you can always ask for a blood serum level to see if you're in a therapeutic dose range for the Zoloft. For context, I'm on 200mg of Zoloft for anxiety. I'm on the high end definitely, but 25 mg. is a baby dose. Are you seeing a psychiatrist for your meds? I am a firm believer that psychiatrists are the only ones who should dole out psychiatric medications - it's really an art that someone with lots of experience should be handling.

I'm not. I was originally directed to my ob/gyn because I was still EBF, and they said that sertraline was extremely safe to use while nursing, that there had been numerous studies showing it's safe in breastmilk, etc., and that's why that specific SSRI was prescribed to me. My kid has long since been weaned though.

And yes, it is a low dose, but I do feel a difference. Most of the side effects I experienced when I started it have gone away, but there's one weird one I feel -- if something specific happens that would normally make me extremely anxious, I get this tingly feeling at the back of my head, going down my neck/upper back. It happens right after, and I'm aware that it's a situation that might have caused a panic attack, except now I can kind of look at the situation more logically, since I'm not feeling anxious.

Thank you all though, for the responses. Just getting these thoughts out of my head and onto this post was helpful, and I have more information now to start looking into, in regards to the dose of sertraline that I'm currently taking.

I just wanted to let you know that obviously we have all been through extreme trauma. And I wanted to share my side story. My kids were told of their Dad’s cheating soon after I found out...I had a panic attack and they saw. At the same time their Dad was dying from terminal cancer...they suffered a lot of trauma from both.

My eldest son took it the hardest. It started with intrusive thoughts about becoming like his Dad...and a fear of becoming a “bad” person and cheating later in life. This escalated to dark intrusive thoughts. About self harm. I ended up having to take him to the hospital for a day. The thought comes into his mind...he knows he won’t do it but he ruminates. And he couldn’t stop the thoughts. It’s scary for him (and me) but I am proud he reached out for help.

He had been in therapy ever since. He very recently was diagnosed with a specific form of OCD...harm OCD. He has no repetitive behaviors, just repetitive thoughts. I had never heard of it before and have tried to educate myself on it. There are YouTube videos about it and it’s specific therapy to manage it...exposure therapy.

He is now about 80% better than a year ago. But still he has good days and bad. There is hope and help out there.

The reason I mention...it because you spoke of OCD tendencies. Not saying this is you...I obviously don’t know you, but I wanted to let you know that it exists. You are not alone and there is help.

Wishing you all the best. Therapy can be a big help to getting your life back.

Any tips/advice on how to get rid of these thoughts? Anyone else deal with thoughts of suicide, but don't have any desire or intentions to follow through?

I totally get this and I am guessing that about everyone who has had moderate to severe depression gets this.

I would caution you, though, to take this more seriously than you seem to be. It concerns me a little more that you have a specific plan for suicide (slitting your wrists), which is a step beyond "I want to die," in general. Should your mental health worsen, then you are no longer having suicidal ideations... because then you will be seriously contemplating suicide.

As others suggested, CBT is probably a really good start. It will help you understand these thoughts are just thoughts and it will teach you ways to manage them.

You seem to specifically be having some issues with anxiety. It's no secret that I find marijuana very helpful as a short-term band-aid, but it doesn't seem to agree with you. You could see a psychiatrist for some anti-anxiety meds to use as needed, but my recollection is that they are all habit-forming... so tread carefully if you go that route.

It's also possible that your dose of sertraline could be increased. As others have said, 25 mg per day is about the lowest dose that you can take. I got as high as 125 mg per day...

So, "Dr." barcher144 makes the following recommendations:

1. I definitely recommend that you see a legitimate physician (probably a psychiatrist) to evaluate your current meds and to see if there are better things out there.

2. I also recommend additional therapy (especially CBT)...

3. I think that you just need re-evaluate your activities and how they are affecting you. It sounds like you should quit the volunteer-y stuff at school.

4. Make a list of phone numbers/names of people that you can call if you ever get to the point where you are seriously attempting suicide. Put the suicide hotline number on there last. Keep the list with you at all times so that you have it in case of emergency. I don't know about you, but I'd rather talk to someone that I know than someone that I don't know. Even better, having this list just helped me feel better/safer, which means that the list literally helped me with my problems in addition to be a back-up plan.

I was originally directed to my ob/gyn because I was still EBF

You wouldn't go to a psychiatrist to deliver your baby, so please get a referral to a psychiatrist to help you with your meds

I get that OB/GYNs see a lot of postpartum depression and think they know psychiatric meds, but it's just not possible. But of course, this requires you being honest with a doc about what's going on... they can't help you unless you tell them what you're experiencing.

I wanted to echo the suggestion about the possibility of OCD. I'm not diagnosing but your initial phrasing to describe your thoughts is so textbook - irrational, intrusive, obsessive, repetitive thoughts. It begins with the obsessive thoughts, triggered by something external or internal. I believe that harm to self or others are the most common type of obsessive thoughts. With some women it starts after childbirth. Internal triggers are hardest to identify and treat, but "obsessive" is the operative word because it takes on a life of its own.

The compulsions are of a ritualistic nature, repetitive, performed in response to and with the intention of stopping the obsessive thoughts. The most common compulsions are handwashing, cleaning rituals, also hoarding. Some forms of the compulsive response are also internal - e.g., counter-thoughts, counting, special words - which is harder to treat but can be done, as in my son's case. The association between trigger, thought, compulsions becomes fixed and inextricable.

ERP works to break up the automatic cause and effect. Cognitive behavioral therapy goes with it to get to the bottom of the theme behind the thoughts.

I'm not diagnosing - just sharing what I know - information is power. My son had it, and I say "had it" very carefully. He received medication then finally beat it with Exposure Response Prevention (ERP) therapy. Our notice of it began in his adolescence, but he says he had it before. We saw him doing odd, repetitive actions. Soon after, he told me he was consumed with "voices," in his head. Long story short, he got the OCD diagnosis, took medication, did ERP and in his early 20s, defeated it.

Please see a professional and good luck.

Could you simply call the jerk woman who are you do not like, and tell her that you have found through this volunteer work that has been assigned to you, that small talk is not a skill or an activity that you are good at or enjoy. Tell her that you would be pleased to do some other tasks, but that you would like to hand that over to someone else to do.

I am very bad about accepting any responsibilities asked of me and feeling guilty if I do not do them properly. But your health and your well being is so much more important.

Life is just too short.

Big hugs. 💕💕💕

So... that sucks. I concur with the above mention get to the dr posts.

From my personal experience, some things that helped me with the thoughts were:

Happiness tracker in journal - trying to keep up a tracker for what and when I was happy kept me focused on good thoughts. It also let me know when overindulgence in things I liked limited happiness.

Pushing it off until tomorrow. When destructive thoughts I was having became particularly overwhelming, I... procrastinate. And most of the time I felt differently the next day.

Rubberband method. I've heard of it and tried it for smoking, but it could probably also be used for this. Crux of it is to wear a rubber band on your wrist, and when you catch yourself thinking destructive thoughts, tell yourself "no!" And reinforce with a snap of the band. Course it didn't work for my smoking habit, but that doesn't mean the method won't work for you.

Also, start thinking of things you like that ate upcoming. New season of the Expanse you want to see? Really want to go to the zztop concert when covid lets up? Things like that.

Anywho, hope this helps.