SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Hi everyone.
It saddens me to write about this as I've been dealing with this for many years now.
My wife and I have been married for 28 years. We have a daughter who is 19 going to college. She's my little love. Last weekend I was crushed from what I discovered. I caught her sexting another man that she got to know over social media. A couple weeks back I felt something was off and talked with her about how I felt that she was hiding something from me. She was on her phone when I surprised her. She closed her phone suddenly but not before I thought I'd seen a pic of a man shirtless. Its was quick but I was sure I saw that. As I ask her what she was looking at, she said just FB. I felt she was lying and demanded for her to show me her phone. I looked at it and saw nothing of the sort. I told her what I saw and she just said was probably band members on stage as she does follow bands/Artist. I wanted to believe her but I couldn't. At this point I was ready to throw in the towel not just because of this but because of this happening a few times in the past with our marriage. YES, this was not the first time we've had marital issue like this. About 7 years or so back, similarly we had a situation where I found out she was sexting a co-worker. This was at least a month or two going on as she said it started out harmlessly. My daughter was much younger and I may have been done at that point however I had my little girl in mind and we decided to seek marriage counseling. After a month or two of therapy we both found our flaws and worked through them building the relationship. After time things were good and we had been doing well. The determination from therapy was she does not communicate and really never has been good at it. She had a rough upbringing with bad parents that showed no love, just a hostile environment. We have been together since she was 19. I took her away from that and we had never looked back. Now years later, ten approx...first time I found infidelity with us. I found out she was messing with a co worker at her job at the time. As far as I've learn she never has had any intercourse with him just touching and playing. We seeked counseling for that as our first time. No excuses what she did was wrong and I didn't help based on counselors view. I was not paying much attention to her and devoted more time to friend with leisure activities. Because of this first instance I was good with working things to not only fix my issue but to fix us as well. Back to now. This last weekend I again caught her in bedroom on her phone as she was quickly closing as she saw me and started folding laundry. I saw and felt the trigger/red flag but acted normal even though I was biting my tongue. She went about folding laundry an I asked what she was doing prior. She said just thumbing through FB. I said, Ohh, ok. I just kept looking at her as she was folding laundry but didn't say anything. As I stand there for a few more moments and shes busy folding I just muttered out...Open you phone now, I want to see it! She acted a bit surprised and hesitated but handed me her phone without unlocking. I said you need to unlock and she did so. I proceeding to look and saw what apps were open. I saw IG and open it and it was chat window. I saw the first chat line open it and a mans name that I've never heard of before. When I opened it is when the ton of bricks fell on me. I was crush at what I was reading. Everything love of my life that could have been said was there like poems. I scrolled a bit and it was a lot of the same. I quickly stopped and looked at her as she is still folding laundry and said this how you intended to fix us? And I said you know were done now, right?! She sadly glance over as tears were rolling and said yes. I threw her phone down and walked away as she was saying "I was going to end it". I turned and walked back toward her and demanded she open it again. She did. I then said give me 15 mins and walked away to another room to view all messages. As I was walking away she warned me, "You are not going to like what you see"! I said I'll see for myself. As I read most of the hundred of messages that were written were shown as cant wait to be in your arms to eventually nude pics of my wife to him. My heart plummeted. I could believe that this would have ever happened again in my life. I love this woman, she is my life of over 30 years with a great daughter. Aside from all these issue in our marriage timeline we have been super happy together. Always vacationing when we can. Raising our daughter with the highest of standards. Our sex life has and always has never been a problem. In fact I find her just a attractive or more as she has aged. I don't grow tired of her in bed and she shows and says the same. Apparently love is what she feels is missing or doesn't fully understand the meaning of it. I told her life is busy and we arent always going to be able to show love like when we were younger. We have gotten into a routine over 30 years I guess. She has also been on meds for anxiety and depression for quite some time. She doesn't have many friends outside of work or even a true friend. She has no interests or hobbies. She tries to find things to keep her busy but nothing ever sparks her interest. She's tried puzzles but not so much anymore. She does enjoy reading but she will tire or get sleepy after so long. We do enjoy watching shows and movies together but I believe she's feeling she needs more. Right now I am on fence about what to do. 30+ years with this woman who I love and care for and never ever cheated on her as I could imagine even doing so. I don't want to lose her but at the same time I am afraid to keep her.
I desperately need help. I've started to seek counseling for myself so I don't make any bad decisions at this point. I can't see myself throwing 30 years of happy experiences/memories with in our lives and I don't want to make a poor decision.

SadPadre,

I am so sorry that you are here. Infidelity cuts to the core of you, your marriage and your family. There are no easy decisions when this happens. You have choices, but all of them come with pain and loss. It's the most miserable of places to be.

Know this though, whatever you decide, you will be ok. Healing does happen if you allow it and do the work to achieve it. It will not always feel this devastating.

You will get lots of advice here. Take what you need and leave the rest.

I would like to say though that YOU did not throw away 30 years of marriage. Your wife has done that repeatedly. The decision you have to make now is what is the path forward that best serves you. Not her, not your daughter, you. You've been abused and it's high time you put yourself first. Oddly enough, that is the path forward to saving the marriage and/or divorcing and healing on your own.

It's hard to see our spouse's without our rose colored love glasses on, but eventually, you need to face the reality of who she is. Not who she was or who you hope she could be, but who she actually is.

She's a serial cheater. She behaves like someone with a deep need for something that is missing. She lets that need drive her choices. She lets that need hurt you. She lets that need destroy her family. She is also a person that knew the consequences if she did this again. She told you she knew this meant the end. She did it anyway.

That's the reality you need to accept. Please know this too: you cannot fix her. Nothing you did caused her to act out this way. It is something that lives in her and something she has not addressed or taken any action to fix.

So knowing this, knowing that she will cheat and betray to get her needs met. Knowing that she will lie and hide to manipulate you. Knowing that she is willing to risk you and your marriage for another man, how do you stay? Can you live with that? Can you be happy?

Tough questions but really try to see her without those love glasses. Make a list if you have to. There is no chance for your marriage (if you end up wanting to try) without facing the stark reality of who she is and what she has done. Or if you decide to divorce, you will see more clearly why it couldn't work.

Sorry you found the need to be here.

From an outside perspective it does seem you love your wife but she does not love you back.

She went on a loop being "unsatisfied" (the ethernal unsatisfacton of a serial cheater) and you always allowing her to mistreat you and disrespect you. She is not respecting you by constantly going against what you told her and she knows will hurt you. You already told her so. Saying you won't allow it is not enough. Specially when the same happens again and again. Think about it. You know what you need to do. And you know what your WW will not do to prevent you from doing it. She already showned you that time and time again.

A loving wife does not allow her time to be spent with a stranger. A loving wife does not make love with the husband and then continue going about her life happily confiding with a stranger. A loving wife does not spend countless hours messaging a stranger. A loving wife does not miss the oportunity to spend said time with her loving husband.

You need to put YOURSELF FIRST. Until you do that you are marked to be second choice. It does not matter the problems a relationship bring. People figure things out, one way or the other. Disrespecting the partner is never the answer or justification.

Again, you need to put YOURSELF FIRST. Your self well being deserves that. Your daughter deserves that from her father.

One can never know the outcome of the mess. But letting your WW know you are feed up being disrespected is priority number one. For your own good. Its you being released from hours and hours of disrespect and disregard. Wherever the cards fall then is not your bussiness. You being out of that misconduct IS.

Take care of yourself. Take back control over your own life as an individual. If you do so, the rest will come. Respect and care will follow. The least a respectful spouse deserves.

It may not seem like it. But your self respect is worth more than continuing sharing a life with someone who does not value or respects you.

You will be ok - no matter what. Stay strong. And demand the respect you present others with.

[This message edited by justanotherperson at 12:07 AM, Thursday, February 2nd]

Any therapist who told you,and your wife,that she cheated because you weren't meeting her needs, did you a great disservice. People don't cheat to get their needs met. If one isn't happy,they talk to their spouse. If things don't change,there's divorce, or separation. She chose to cheat because she wanted to. Period. Nothing you did, or didn't do caused her to cheat.

Since she is a serial cheater, who blames you for her multiple affairs, your best bet is divorce. You deserve so much better than this abuse.

Please get tested for stds. Cheaters lie. A lot. Since several of her affair partners were coworkers, distance isn't a factor. When distance isn't a factor, there is almost always sex involved. They are adults. They behave as adults do. They have sex. Men don't get involved with married women to exchange pics,send kiss. They're in it for the sex.

You need to call their wives and tell them. They deserve to know what has happened in their marriage, and they need to know their health has been risked.

Hellfire hit the nail squarely on the head.

Also, I don't know how many times I have read where marriage counselors try to place some or all of the blame on the betrayed. The marriage did not cheat. Your wife cheated. Marriage counselors have the marriage as a client... not the cheater, nor the betrayed.

All I can say is that she is definitely a serial cheater. Something is seriously wrong with the wiring in her brain that allows her to repeatedly disrespect and betray you. Can that flawed wiring be corrected in the remaining years she has on this earth? You can probably answer that better than any of us.

Please think about that and know, almost for sure, if she doesn't correct it, that she will cheat on you again if you stay with her.

Others will be along with better advice than I can give you.

Good luck on how this goes for you.

She doesn't have many friends outside of work or even a true friend. She has no interests or hobbies. She tries to find things to keep her busy but nothing ever sparks her interest.

She had a rough upbringing with bad parents that showed no love, just a hostile environment. We have been together since she was 19. I took her away from that and we had never looked back. Now years later, ten approx...first time I found infidelity with us.

It's not normal for a healthy person to not have any friends. Her family of original caused her to have severely broken handling mechanisms. It sounds like that was never directly addressed. It may not be treatable, but it really sounds like you focused on MC instead of intensive IC for her and the MC focused on what you could do as a couple instead of fixing the root cause. Covert Narc. Borderline personality disorder. Doesn't really matter at this point. What do you want in light of her failure to figure out how to deal with life and relationships in a healthy manner over the last 3 decades? No matter what your WW is at a high risk to reoffend.

IC for you is a great start. IC for her if she really gets it and wants to fix what's broken inside of her. Then maybe you can work together to save the marriage. It's ok to punt the decision down the road until you stablize. It's ok for you to decide enough is enough and move forward with D. The only thing that isn't ok is to promise to reconcile. Because you can't know whether that's feasible or even possible at this point.

HellFire has it right:

Any therapist who told you,and your wife,that she cheated because you weren't meeting her needs, did you a great disservice.

By allowing your wayward wife to blame you/the relationship, she didn't have to dig down to the core issues that allowed her to cheat and really change those coping skills.

You say that she had a terrible/hostile upbringing and doesn't communicate well, but she still hasn't changed her communication skills.

She is making choices, over and over again, that are destructive to you and the marriage. Yet she continues to try to feel better about herself by seeking out new men to start flirting and sexting with.

This is no failing of yours. It is a huge failing in her boundaries, moral code, and conscious choices.

Please keep yourself safe--emotionally, mentally, and physically.

Get some distance from her (in house or outside of the house). Get tested for STIs. See some legal counsel.

You deserve much, much better. Believe that.

I don't think your situation is hopeless if R is what's on your mind. I don't even believe that sex necessarily had to have happened. This sexting behavior does tend to escalate, no doubt about that. Motive, means, and opportunity are going to be strong indicators of whether or not the affair became physical. There is payoff to the reward center of the brain though which works a lot like illicit drugs either way. Bear in mind that there's nothing in cocaine, for example, that makes a person high. It's they way it causes the body to release a feel-good chemical cocktail that gives you a buzz, and illicit affairs work much the same way. They can start small and escalate over time or people can jump right into the deep end. In this age of easy internet access, that drug is always readily available.

You've said a couple of things which make me think that your WW's depression could be playing a big role in this. You've said she's already on medication and that she's got no friends or hobbies. Depressed people have been known to self-isolate and become apathetic, so those things could be indicators. Here's the thing though and this is important... depression doesn't MAKE people cheat. There's nothing that can "make" someone cheat. Lots an lots of depressed people would NEVER do it. That's because no matter what else might be happening, cheating is ultimately about character, integrity, and boundaries.

There's something in your WW which allows for lies and perfidy, and it's that way with a lot of people. We don't typically think much about our values system until it has failed. People say their marriage vows and make promises and they believe it at the time, but when push comes to shove, some folks don't always stand for what they say. IOW, your WW claims to believe, really believe, in Fidelity. She claimed that when she married you and when times became difficult, that belief turned out to be weak and permeable. When you consider that our boundaries are built around our truest beliefs, it's easy to see that the cheater's boundaries are completely insufficient. Life got hard and there was NOTHING in your WW's character which could put a hard stop to cheating because her truest values aren't what she thought they were. Getting that dopamine band-aid became more important than the vows she had made.

This is not to say that cheaters can't recover and do better. I have to believe that people are capable of real change. I've seen real change. But it is hard. It requires painfully humbling introspection and work. Some make it and some don't.

Remember that nothing you did (or didn't do) could have made your WW do these things. We just don't have that kind of power over other people. If her values had been firm, she couldn't have just thrown them aside like that.

I have some thoughts on the "unmet needs" model of therapy that so may therapists still employ in my profile. You can find it by clicking the little person icon at the upper right of this post. Long post made shorter though.. you didn't do this. You didn't cause it and you can't fix it. Only she can. It's early days and time will tell, but your outcomes are still open.

My two cents.

I agree with chamomiletea. Depression, the kind your wife obviously has, distorts reality. Everything is a dark cloud because her depression is so bad. A friend said it is the blackest darkest hole in the world when you have it and you will do anything to feel better. I’m sure that’s where the Sexting came from. One thing I know from being married to someone who has mild depression it is in control unless they get therapy and medication. My husband finally admitted how bad it was and he’s been on medicine for a few years and he said it has made such a difference in his life. He started reading again and cracking jokes again and singing around the house again. I think you need to push her into finding why she’s not getting better with medication. If she has some serious childhood issues I would suggest, and I always do, EMDR. Also other therapies that quickly get to those hidden demons and help bring him out into the sunlight. After that is a lot of talk therapy and she should have a dr who keeps up with her medication so that if things change in her body her medication can change. It’s not a one time thing. Depression is a chronic illness like diabetes and asthma. It has to be treated as such.

I never mentioned your marriage. I think it’s not my business because something else is still in the way and that’s your wife’s depression. It is the engine running her life and consequently your life. It’s a faulty engine with fits, starts, sputters but it works good enough to run things and it’s coming from her subconscious and that horrible depression. I don’t know if you need to reconcile or divorce because I think at this point trying to help her get better is paramount.

Good lord, all these replies making excuses for your wife.

First...your therapist sucked and is an idiot.

Next, your wife is a serial cheater. They never stop.

Lastly, irt to ask these replies excusing your wife bc of her depression, that's nonsense. My wife has severe clinical depression and has never cheated (18 years together).

So now, for the first time, you need to make decisions based on taking care of you.

GoldenR - I don't think they were excusing wife because of her depression. They were only explaining how depression might have played its role as a catalyst in her indiscretions.

As long as she has this catalyst she will keep on doing this. She will always be unsafe unless she addresses and work on her character flaws. She needs to find different sources of joy that are healthy and harmless. She needs to find healthy coping mechanism to deal with her depression. It's a difficult road ahead. She has three challenges- difficulty in her personality, difficulty in her value system and difficulty in her mental state.

I wish all the strength to you, OP.

GoldenR - I don't think they were excusing wife because of her depression. They were only explaining how depression might have played its role as a catalyst in her indiscretions.

Here's the thing, over on the Wayward side, if someone shows up there saying they suffer from depression and it played a part in their cheating, they'll get lambasted saying millions of people have that and don't cheat and mental health is never a reason/excuse to cheat.

Over here, we got people going "ohhh, she suffers from depression. Well that explains it".

Makes no sense.

[This message edited by GoldenR at 8:28 AM, Thursday, February 2nd]

Golden, depression has different behaviors in different people. If they inherit some personality traits that are then subjected to childhood trauma you will see wildly divergent reactions. One child might be able to override it simply by the gift of dna while another might fall apart "thanks" to dna.
We can only react on what the poster has written. In this case he discusses depression so that appears to be a major issue for him.

Sadpadre, I generally feel that people who are active in repairing themselves, by means of intense therapy, and show genuine remorse might be good candidates for R. On the other hand you have had trauma and it is up to you to decide if you can remain married knowing what you know. I think ws can change by "showing up" every day. This means no further bad behaviors, including attitudes. If you get the, "When are you going to let this go", attitude she is not R material.

You and I have some similarities. Married 30+ years and find sexting infidelities on our spouses’ phone. I went through 2 and 1/2 years of the cheating, lying, etc until my WH finally saw through. The reason I didn’t leave was because I could see how my life was and will be affected forever. In my life, I wonder every day since if he still has kept his promise to be done with sites and sexting. So far he has… But the reason I stuck to reconcile was because the 30+ years were mostly great years, however, he took this sexting route for 21/2 years. Another big reason I chose to stay was because my life was "ruined" in the sense that our marriage will never be the same, but I couldn’t ruin my two girls’ lives as well. They have held my fWH up on a pedestal because he has been a great dad to them, and I just couldn’t take that image away and ruin their lives, too. They have had too many stories to me about their own friends’ parents cheating on each other through PA and EA. It is taking a lot of hard work on his part for this marriage to feel its new normal. We did it through MC and IC. I’m doing it through humor and teasing him when I see a teasable moment. I have a few lady friends I’m talking to for someone to lean on. But know this, the next time I find something on his phone, it will be the last. I can’t go this route twice. Good luck to you, my friend. This place has given me hope over the years.

SadPadre, your wife keeps cheating and you keep giving her a pass.

The only way you can get out of infidelity is if you do something differently this time around.

This^^^^^^^^.

Blue has it correctly. You need to think about YOU now. You have supported her and her choices for too long. You need to become selfish now because of the situation she placed you in for many years.

I think what is happening is: sadpadre, your W keeps cheating, and you've sought MC prematurely.

IMO, your W is probably seeking what we call external validation to fill up some sort of metaphorical hole inside herself, and external validation simply can't fill an internal hole. No attention from you or from anybody else can help unless she gives herself the proper attention.

MC treats the M, but your M didn't fail. Your W did. From what you say, I don't see how she can heal herself without help for herself - that's therapy/IC.

Your W has cheated multiple times, but she really can change if she does the work she needs to do. She can become a good candidate for R.

For R to succeed, both partners need to do a lot of work, and you really can't do that work unless you want to R, too. I think a good IC can help you figure out what you want. If you want R, a good IC can help you figure out whether your W is a good bet and actually do the necessary work.

But first things first: figure out what you want.

We can help, too, whether you want D or R.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 3:46 PM, Thursday, February 2nd]

In my opinion mental illness doesn't make people cheat. At the end of the day, the decision to cheat comes down to character. Mental illness may make it more LIKELY that someone with bad character may cheat, but it doesn't make them do it.

It's like how smoking marijuana or doing psychedelics doesn't make people experience a mental break or make someone develop schizophrenia, but it DOES make it more likely that someone already predisposed to those illnesses will experience them, does that make sense?

I think that's something us BS have a hard time coming to terms with sometimes. The fact that nothing made our waywards cheat, they always had that character flaw inside them.

Like everyone has been saying, focus on you. If your wife wants to change she will show you with actions.

I'm with GoldenR's perspective here. Have depression? So what!! - we all go through sh*t and we have to own it. *Everyone* has problem. That doesn't excuse sticking a knife in your spouse and twisting it around. What does being depressed and deciding to cheat have to do with one and other? No mercy what so ever for cheaters unless they own it through and through. It really gets my blood boiling how we increasingly live in a society where people don't own their decisions and actions - literally the worst trend ever. Even suggesting the idea that we're not responsible for our actions or some outside force "made me do it" is so repugnant I would literally run out of the room if someone conjured this excuse. The blame culture in our society is creating a bunch of pathetic weak mind people.

Just one mans opinion: without total ownership there is *zero* chance at reconciliation. What would accepting that we are not in control of our actions lead to ... think about it? "You know I love you honey but I just had waaaaaay too much to drink and lost control and banged the guy" -- "I'm loyal babe but I had tacos last night and you know how horny tacos make me so I had to bang her". These retroactively constructed excuses are pure BS and denote incredibly low character. Anyone worth their salt and have an ounce of maturity and integrity would accept their choices and decisions through and through. If they didn't it would be an instant D with no chance of reconciliation for me.