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Newest Member: Beschaedigt

Just Found Out :
Well, here I am.

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Bigger ( Attaché #8354) posted at 10:13 PM on Friday, November 11th, 2022

Confirm this with your attorney but post nups are seldom worth the paper they are written on. A draconian post-nup where you get the house, the pension the cutlery and the dog is highly unlikely to hold water at court. Any competent attorney will convince an already convinced judge that the agreement was signed under duress.

What a post-nup could do is give you first call to the house, the option of keeping your savings/pension or maybe select what vehicle you take with you. Maybe minimize alimony.

Look – if you R you R, if you D you D. You definitely set requirements to reconcile, but you can’t reconcile with your wife feeling like she has her neck in a noose.

"If, therefore, any be unhappy, let him remember that he is unhappy by reason of himself alone." Epictetus

posts: 11130   ·   registered: Sep. 29th, 2005
id 8764836
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 RoverGuy (original poster member #82321) posted at 10:41 PM on Friday, November 11th, 2022

Look – if you R you R, if you D you D. You definitely set requirements to reconcile, but you can’t reconcile with your wife feeling like she has her neck in a noose.

Thanks, bigger.

I thought long and hard about dropping the money to retain a lawyer. I know I can't use this as a way to force R, and I'm not. After last night, and her inability to apologize, show remorse, and telling me she won't grovel, I knew we would never R to my terms.

I did retain an attorney today. I'm glad I took the advice of the forum to have at least 3 consultations. I chose the last attorney as she seemed very level headed and the best answer for what I should do now. She was between the first, who suggested I don't do anything for a while and see what happens, and the second who said we should go after her balls to the wall. I need to remember that even after D, WW will still be in my life via our 2 children. That won't keep me from fighting to make sure she didn't get shit in the divorce, but I don't have to start off a complete asshole.

And bigger, a huge thank you to you for responses to my post. They have helped me navigate and keep a cool head. Actually, all of you who responded are incredible humans. Thank you.

posts: 76   ·   registered: Nov. 4th, 2022
id 8764839
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Legatus ( member #79152) posted at 5:20 AM on Saturday, November 12th, 2022

Answering your question. I work in the family court as a CPS agent. I polled the attorneys and judges when I was considering a post nup. They aren’t solid. My wife did sign one. I tried to make it fair and equitable. That’s important. She was willing to give me everything. That wouldn’t have held water. Most importantly I,ve been trying to make the marriage work since it was signed. I think the validly if a post nup is if it was signed in good faith verses a way to position yourself. I can tell you want to make it work with her. You’re a week or so out. I don’t know if R is good or not for you, but she’s still deep in the fog. It’s sucks, but you have to wait to see. She might turn back to you still or she may not. I think the way you’re moving forward is good.

posts: 108   ·   registered: Jul. 21st, 2021
id 8764872
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Dude67 ( member #75700) posted at 11:11 AM on Saturday, November 12th, 2022

I agree with the comments re the legality of a postnup. I think, however, it’s worth is more about boundary setting and establishing expectations versus who gets what if you D.

Same goes for a poly to verify the timeline. Although I agree on the scientific efficacy of polygraphs, it’s also very much about your WW’s attitude towards doing one that I think will be helpful in your determination whether to pursue R or not.

posts: 566   ·   registered: Oct. 21st, 2020
id 8764881
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gr8ful ( member #58180) posted at 2:12 PM on Saturday, November 12th, 2022

To everyone saying post-nups are worthless: how about we let Rover’s attorney make the decision on that, and then craft the agreement? Hint: that’s what lawyers are for!

posts: 149   ·   registered: Apr. 6th, 2017
id 8764894
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 RoverGuy (original poster member #82321) posted at 2:38 PM on Saturday, November 12th, 2022

To everyone saying post-nups are worthless: how about we let Rover’s attorney make the decision on that, and then craft the agreement? Hint: that’s what lawyers are for!

In my state, it's actually called a reconciliation agreement. Many on here are correct that a post-nup is not legally binding and may be construed as signing under duress to keep from having to move out. There are requirements in my state that make the reconciliation agreement binding.

We must be legally separated when the agreement is drafted and signed. That means different homes and at least one party wants the separation to permanent. Only then is it binding.

It really doesn't matter which path I choose now, R or D. I keep going back to Biggers parable about the journey I need to take and the R road being closed. If I choose R, a requirement is a reconciliation agreement and that can only happen if WW moves out. So either choice results in separation.

posts: 76   ·   registered: Nov. 4th, 2022
id 8764895
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DroppedShoe ( new member #80500) posted at 2:56 PM on Saturday, November 12th, 2022

In case something changes and you find yourself in marriage counseling (MC) here’s the warning: Marriage counselors say things like "both parties contributed to the state of the marriage" and that " you both need to change". BS. The affair was because your wife has a character flaw, a lying a cheating problem. Nothing you did or didn’t do created her character flaw. If you find yourself in MC and if the counselor starts in on this walk out.

Wishing you the best. I am currently going through divorce with a remorseless WH with two similarly aged kids at home. I figure the best thing I can do for them is to try to keep their routines as normal as possible. Unfortunately I can’t contribute too much on this site anymore as he monitors it and trolls me.

Let this be the lose weight kind of stress not the gain weight kind.

posts: 47   ·   registered: Aug. 9th, 2022   ·   location: Los Angeles
id 8764898
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RealityBlows ( member #41108) posted at 6:38 PM on Saturday, November 12th, 2022

I sometimes wonder in cases of infidelity if the best Postnup is a Prenup.

Just divorce them and start all over with a Prenup.

If they’re sincere, genuinely and altruistically interested in Reconciliation, they shouldn’t mind starting all over again from scratch, with a Prenup.

When you cheat, you’re fundamentally nullifying the marriage. You’ve broken just about every vow.

If you want to reconcile because you’re truly in love with your spouse, and want no other, and are confident you will never stray again, you’d think one would not hesitate to accept an offer to start again from scratch, with a prenup, and under zero duress.

posts: 990   ·   registered: Oct. 25th, 2013
id 8764923
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LostInHisFog ( member #78503) posted at 10:24 PM on Saturday, November 12th, 2022

The ABAJournal online (link not allowed) reported a Maryland BS won her postnuptial agreement earlier this month. The WH tried to drag it through the courts as invalid, assuming it could never get anywhere but the courts rules in her favour, said it was absolutely valid. The key component however was he was actively involved writing the Post-Nup, BS had asked for far less but it was him that settled on the sum and conditions. BS was a smart cookie and kept all proof WH was involved, it just wasn’t her lawyers who wrote it and he signed, he was in no way influenced, manipulated or coerced as proof showed he played a role in creating the legal document, it showed he practiced his free will and that was key to her post nup.

I was 100% trusting in my lawyer, as much as I wanted revenge I was ultimately paying someone to get me out of infidelity permanently and they knew how to do it. If your lawyer says no post nup then drop it. There was things mine said ‘we could try’ so I said try it and things they said will do me no good or delay the process so I dropped it. In the end I feel I ended up better off than him, I always imagined 50/50 but that isn’t so clean in a divorce, it sucks but there are compromises and sacrifices still to come in order to get this done, but ultimately trusting I hired the "right" lawyer left me in a good starting position post divorce. If you’re after D tips, write out your ultimate to-do list that gets you from where you are today to the future where you’re standing divorced. Write it in detail and write down in order, steps like looking for places, refinancing, movers, buying boxes, renting storage, selling furniture buying furniture, internet plans, do you want a pet? do you want a tree/sea/city change? change jobs?... whatever you need. Include addresses and contacts for a one stop place to go to because there are a lot of different companies you will be dealing with and it’s better than having multiple tabs open or bookmarks to hunt through. I found crossing off these steps gave me visual progress which helped me when things did get delayed or when I was getting overwhelmed, the steps are unemotional steps you have to do so it helped with detachment which is so very hard but so important with recovery when divorcing.

Once you’ve served her consider implementing the grey rock method. Personally I feel the 180 is brilliant for post Dday BS and early day R couples but for your mental and emotional wellness D couples need to detach and discard and the grey rock does help with that.

They can make as many promises as they want, but if they don't put action behind it, it doesn't mean anything.

I edit because I'm fluent in typo & autocorrect hates me.

posts: 300   ·   registered: Mar. 14th, 2021
id 8764941
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 RoverGuy (original poster member #82321) posted at 4:04 PM on Sunday, November 13th, 2022

Well, not much progress, I'm afraid.

Yesterday she didn't come home until after 10pm. She got off work at 1pm. She had lunch with a friend and went back to his house to talk for over 6 hours. This guy is a client and she talked to him about his divorce when he was going through one 2 years ago. The optics, though. How is that remotely close to acceptable?

She told me I can text her anytime to see where she is if I am concerned. She also told me I can ask her anything. I don't know if she meant about just the day or for everything. I told her it was none of my business and I don't need to know where she is. Then I left. She slept with the door wide open again.

The worst is that she is not talking to me either. Not even trying. It's like she is doing the 180 with me, although this is her MO, she has always been like this.

It's gonna be a long day.

posts: 76   ·   registered: Nov. 4th, 2022
id 8764997
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LegsWideShut ( member #80302) posted at 4:23 PM on Sunday, November 13th, 2022

Thats a wife that certainly doesnt get it. She is so far removed from being R ready as possible.
She may be one of those ones that will burn their own bridges just because.....
Sorry she isn't making any attempts at changing.

posts: 83   ·   registered: May. 9th, 2022   ·   location: New England
id 8765000
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longsadstory1952 ( member #29048) posted at 4:59 PM on Sunday, November 13th, 2022

6 hours to talk,eh? About what, the state of the war in Europe? His divorce from two years ago because? How much time does it take to cover every topic in the Sunday Times?

But, while they were alone for six hours they undoubtedly sat at a long table like Putin and his generals, at least ten feet from each other!

She is not only not R material. She is going out of her way to rub your nose in it.

posts: 1134   ·   registered: Jul. 14th, 2010
id 8765003
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RealityBlows ( member #41108) posted at 5:52 PM on Sunday, November 13th, 2022

GTF out of here.

She spent 9 hours with a male colleague, dinner out, and then 6-hours alone with him at his house all on the horns of just getting caught cheating? She does this when she’s trying to convince you, should be trying to convince you, she is a safe partner?

And who’s THIS guy?

posts: 990   ·   registered: Oct. 25th, 2013
id 8765010
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 RoverGuy (original poster member #82321) posted at 5:59 PM on Sunday, November 13th, 2022

And who’s THIS guy?

He is a student from her studio. He went through a divorce a little while ago and my WW helped him through it. They went to lunch after class on Saturday and then back to his house. She said she talked about all the stuff going on in her life.

Do I say anything?

[This message edited by RoverGuy at 6:02 PM, Sunday, November 13th]

posts: 76   ·   registered: Nov. 4th, 2022
id 8765012
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 RoverGuy (original poster member #82321) posted at 6:46 PM on Sunday, November 13th, 2022

I answered my own question. I'm not saying a word.

I have 2 older sisters and one of them has gone through this before. They said if she was comppletely open with me about talking to this guy then she probably isn't hiding anything. That he may be the first person she has opened up to about this (besides her mother, who is the root cause of her issues) and that yes, 6 hours is about right. If she is starting to come to the realization that she ruined a family, a marriage, lost a DD, right around the holidays, then it will take a while to get that all out.

So I'm not saying shit. I put it in my notes for my attorney. I think someone mentioned at some point I should just believe what she says. Not about the affair, mind you, but about other stuff. So unless I see a pattern, I should be ok with her finding someone to talk to. It may help her come to the realization how bad she f'd up.

[This message edited by RoverGuy at 6:47 PM, Sunday, November 13th]

posts: 76   ·   registered: Nov. 4th, 2022
id 8765016
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Justsomeguy ( member #65583) posted at 7:32 PM on Sunday, November 13th, 2022

I think for your own mental health, you need to decide that your M is over. Period. I really think that to basterdize Princess Bride, you feel it is mostly over, which translates into slightly alive. This isn't healthy for you. If you operate from a "There's still a chance" position, it will inform everything you do, it will seep into you thought processes and decision making.

Think of your STBXWW as dead to you. Thecwoman you married and the M you had are gone. Put them to rest and live the rest of your life. If at-home point, your EXWW returns, penitent and hat in hand, you may reevaluate how you feel and decide to date her. I've never seen it happen, but I think we have a few cases here. Do not, and I repeat, do not use the D process as a tactic to secretly win her back. You will just bectwisting yourself into a pretzel. Engage in an authentic detachment and if things change, reevaluate and decide if you want to attach again.

Me:55 STBXWW:55 DD#1: false confession of EA Dec. 2016. False R for a year.DD#2: confessed to year long PA Dec. 2 2017 (was about to be outed)Called it off and filed. Denied having an affair in court papers.

Divorced 2022!!!!

posts: 1359   ·   registered: Jul. 25th, 2018   ·   location: Canada
id 8765019
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blahblahblahe ( member #62231) posted at 8:51 PM on Sunday, November 13th, 2022

Well, it does help provide absolute clarity regarding your STXWW.......

posts: 319   ·   registered: Jan. 11th, 2018   ·   location: Europe and USA
id 8765029
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RealityBlows ( member #41108) posted at 9:08 PM on Sunday, November 13th, 2022

They said if she was completely open with me about talking to this guy then she probably isn't hiding anything.

That’s not the point. Optics aren’t the point. It doesn’t just LOOK bad, it’s extremely insensitive, inconsiderate of you and what she’s JUST put you through. It shows extremely poor judgment, empathy impairment, and poor boundaries.

If she’s at all serious about R, about re-building trust and boundaries, about demonstrating remorse-empathy, she’s blowing it.

Even without doing the most preliminary reading of affair recovery recovery books, articles, blogs, forums…common sense and empathy alone should have signaled her that hanging out all evening, discussing your intimate marital issues with a single man, right after your affair was discovered, is not a smart move.

posts: 990   ·   registered: Oct. 25th, 2013
id 8765032
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Aletheia ( member #79172) posted at 3:18 AM on Monday, November 14th, 2022

They said if she was comppletely open with me about talking to this guy then she probably isn't hiding anything.


Or that's exactly what you're supposed to think. Cheaters can be cunning. For example, sometimes cheaters encourage their spouse and AP to become friends because 1. The cheater couldn't possibly be cheating with that person if they want them to be friends right? 2. Distracts from the actual affair 3. Greater access. Your sister could be right but she could also be very wrong.

All your wife's actions indicate a fundamental inability to get it.

posts: 282   ·   registered: Jul. 25th, 2021
id 8765063
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Troutman523 ( member #80426) posted at 3:22 PM on Monday, November 14th, 2022

He went through a divorce a little while ago and my WW helped him through it.

Oh man, my WW did the EXACT same thing with her future AP when he was going through his divorce.

If she is starting to come to the realization that she ruined a family, a marriage, lost a DD, right around the holidays, then it will take a while to get that all out.

Apparently mine is starting to figure this out now too with some info I've heard lately. Amazing how they just can't see that BEFORE they do this.

Sorry man...

[This message edited by Troutman523 at 3:29 PM, Monday, November 14th]

Me BH:57, Her WW:54 DDay: 6/22. She walked right out on DDay and moved in with AP. Filed for divorce.

posts: 110   ·   registered: Jul. 12th, 2022   ·   location: PA
id 8765102
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