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Silent No More...Who Do You Tell

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SisterMilkshake posted 9/22/2018 11:35 AM

Triggering like mad because of something that is all over the news programs in the USA right now.

An "alleged" attempted rape. This post is not political, please don't make it so. This is about why we don't tell and asking who do we tell.

I am triggering like mad because of things I have experienced that, to me, where awful and traumatizing. I tried to tell some what happened. In some cases I was humiliated and blamed. In another, I was laughed at. It seems no one was ever held accountable for what they did to me.

1. I was about 15-16 y.o. I was the girlfriend of the "alpha" male in our little neighborhood. Oftentimes, I was the only girl hanging out with my boyfriend and a group of guys, his friends, who became my friends, too. One evening, for whatever reason, my boyfriend wasn't around. We, about 4-5 guys and I, were hanging out. We were sitting on one of the guys front lawn laughing, joking, talking, being teens. Suddenly, I am flat on my back with something heavy on top of me, almost knocking the wind out of me. I am stunned, and then I realize it is the almost 6 ft., 200# football player (I weighed maybe 90#) "friend", Mike, on top of me, trying to kiss me (?) and groping me, hands everywhere. I start yelling and trying to get away. I got away, I don't really have recollection how. I don't know if the other boys got him off me, I do know they were saying "Mike, WTF are you doing?". I do know I ran home and told no one. Who was I going to tell? I didn't even tell my boyfriend because I knew he would get violent with the other boy. I don't know if the other boys with that night told or not. We all continued to hang out together. I always avoided Mike and was never, ever around him without my boyfriend present. It was like it became a dirty secret. P.S. Mike went on to become a police officer.

2. I was at school. 10th grade. The early 70's. We wore mini skirts. It was lunch time. We had an outdoor (South Florida) lovely area with trees and tables where we ate lunch. I was with our group of friends and there was a boy, Dennis, that really didn't belong to our group but sometimes hung out with us. He was very funny and entertaining. I was walking by him to throw out some lunch trash and he stuck a pencil up my skirt. It actually went into my rectum along with my panties. Rather roughly. I don't think he could have actually done that purposely, but he purposely rammed the pencil up my skirt. I yelled "Hey, what are you doing. That went up my butt you jerk!" Everyone laughed, boys and girls. I was humiliated and violated. Who was I going to tell? I hated Dennis from that day forward.

3. I was walking my dog, same neighborhood about 16 y.o. My dog finds his spot and hunches up to do his job. Dog and I try not to look at each other as it is not comfortable to do so. So, I am looking everywhere else. My eyes fall on the man in the garage directly across the street from me. He is in his open garage with a young child, maybe about 3 y.o., standing in front of him. I am not quite sure I am seeing what I am seeing. And, then, yep I realize I am seeing a man with his pants down around his ankles showing this child his penis. He then turns to me directly to give a full frontal view of him and his exposed penis. I quickly avert looking at him, wait for my dog to finish pooping and quickly go home and tell my parents. They call the police. Two middle aged detectives come to our house after awhile to question me. My parents allow them to question me without them present. The first question they ask me was "What were you wearing?" they asked some more questions and then said to me "We have talked to some of your neighbors and they say you "ball" on your front lawn. Is this true?" I was so embarrassed. I turned bright red, I was burning up. I was 16, I was a virgin, "No I do not!" I replied. I was so humiliated. I was a girl, these were men. How dare they speak to me like that. I was violated all over again. This is why we don't tell. Who was I going to tell? BTW, our pervert neighbor went on to expose himself to my 12 y.o. sister and another 40 y.o. lady neighbor. I don't know what happened to the sick bastard, I don't know if he was ever arrested. I never heard anymore about it. I do know that neither my sister or I were never questioned by a DA or asked for our testimony. What I do know is that I was more traumatized by the way the police treated me than seeing a perverts penis.

4. I was 17 y.o. and riding bicycles with my guy friend, Andy, at Fort Lauderdale Beach on A1A. Wearing my bikini top and shorts, like all the girls did down on the beach. A FPL utility truck crowds me into the curb and the man sitting in the passenger side seat reaches out his window and grabs my ass. My bicycle bounces on the curb, I lose control and hit the back of the truck as it finishes passing. The next thing I know someone is carrying me in their arms from the middle of the 4 lane very busy AIA, two lanes in each direction. There is a great crowd of people surrounding me. I am confused. Turns out I was thrown from my bicycle and hit the street...hard. I was knocked out. The cops arrive. I am given a ticket for failure to yield. I am blamed for my assault! The FPL truck is just told they are free to go. The police do not call an ambulance for me. I have a huge egg on my head and cuts and scrapes on my body. I go home and wind up with the worst headache. My parents take me to the ER. I have a concussion. Who am I going to tell? The judge? We go to court. The judge doesn't want to listen to me. He, in fact, lectures me on what I did wrong. Again, no one wants to address the fact that I was assaulted, that I was a victim. I could have been killed. It was a miracle I wasn't killed by a car as AIA is one of the busiest roads in Fort Lauderdale.

5. I was 19 and I worked at a bar/grill. He was my co-worker. If any you have jobs in the restaurant/bar business and you are young and work the night shift it is very difficult to just go home and go to bed. A busy bar and restaurant has your adrenaline revved up for hours, you need time to wind down. Oftentimes, we were able to go to places opened later than our place or someone's home to have some drinks and wind down. Anyway, co-worker needs a ride home after work. It is about 1:30 -2:00 am ish. I offer to give him a ride home as it isn't far out of my way. He had always been nice and polite to me at work. We didn't flirt with each other, just polite conversations when there was a little down time. Never gave me the creep vibe, no gut telling me anything. We get to his home. He invites me in to smoke a joint. I say okay as it will help me wind down. We go in. I drop my purse and keys by the door. We go sit on his couch. He serves some non-alcoholic beverage and we smoke a little. We make small talk. All of a sudden he pushes me back on the couch and he is on top of me. He has me pinned. I am yelling "No, no, no!" over and over again. I am kicking, I am flailing. He pins my arms above my head with one hand, with the other he is grabbing at my clothes. I am still struggling, kicking and yelling, trying to get loose. He is pulling at my blouse, he pulls my skirt up over my waist. I am yelling "Stop, no, stop, stop, stop, no, no, no!" I am fighting. It is no use, he is strong, I am overpowered. He is pulling at my panties now and I realize I am going to get raped, I can't stop this. I go limp and just start crying. He is somewhat shocked or surprised, I don't know what, but he lets go of my arms, he relaxes his pressure against my body. I am somehow able to roll off the couch from under him. I run for the front door. My purse and keys are there where I left them, I get to my car and take off. I am crying, I am shaking. I am hysterical. Who am I going to tell? It is 2:30 am, I went into a mans house to smoke a joint, I was almost raped. Are the cops going to treat me like shit, like I did something to deserve this? I go home and crawl into bed and try to forget and sleep. See co-worker at work next time we work together. I ignore him. He tries to speak to me. He is from some South American country. I think Chile, wouldn't swear to it. But he tells me at work, "I am sorry, in my country when a woman says "no" she really means "yes"." I scream at him, in the restaurant, "When a woman here in the USA says "no" she means "no"!" I wonder how many women this nice, polite man has raped. I quit this job soon after.

There were a few more incidents, similar to these, that happened when I was in my teens, but these are the highlights. More happened in my 20's. These are the main incidents that upset me most, though, and what I have been triggering about. And, I find I am angry with myself. For telling myself it wasn't bad what happened to me. All girls/women have these things happen. It is part of being female. No big deal. You are tough, Milkshake, you put on your big girl panties and deal. Worse has happened to others, what happened to you wasn't that bad. I have been through therapy many times. Weird thing is, I never brought these issues up. Ever. Why is that? I buried them deep, thought I dealt with them? No big deal? My fault for being naive, for being where I was, for wearing what I was wearing, for smoking a joint?

And, the really sad thing is, I know I am not some unique flower. This has happened to so many of us. I wonder if there are any women that haven't had anything happen to them like this, too.

So, what I would like to know is if there are any females that are reading this that have never encountered any kind of inappropriate behaviour? Also, if you have experienced inappropriate behaviour, did you tell? Who did you tell and what happened? If you encountered inappropriate behaviour and never told, tell it here!

I know this is long. Thank you if you were able to trudge through it.

Jeaniegirl posted 9/22/2018 11:55 AM

Thank you for your post. I'm thinking most women here have had some of your experiences.

High School. Mock elections, like a huge convention in the school auditorium. Voting booths. Lines to vote. My turn came to vote, I went in the booth. The bottom part of the booths are open. I am voting. A hand comes up from the next booth, went all the way up my skirt to my private areas. I yelped, loudly. Ran out the same time as the groper came out of his booth next to mine. It's the football quarterback, the darling of the school and he's grinning ear to ear. I was so upset, embarrassed and humiliated. My gitl friends said ..'oh! maybe he likes you!" Boys were laughing, leering at me. No teachers around in the area. Did I tell? No. He was the most popular boy in the school, the 'darling' of the coaches and teachers. Today he is a famous artist, well-known. About two years ago I went to an art show and he was there. I turned around and left.

No one would have believed me back then. No one would believe me now. That's just the way it was.

I understand he's went through three divorces. Doesn't surprise me.

[This message edited by Jeaniegirl at 3:10 PM, September 22nd (Saturday)]

Lionne posted 9/22/2018 11:59 AM

I'm so, so sorry you experienced this.
The double standard is infuriating, indeed. I sure hope young women today are internalizing the concept that it isn't your fault, no matter the circumstances.
I'm luckier than you. No overt assaults. Plenty double entendre, leering comments, suggestive conversation. And like you I wound up feeling humiliated and ashamed.
We have been conditioned to hide these encounters, made to feel that it's our fault for having bodies.

I remember my mother insisting I wear a girdle so I didn't jiggle. I was probably 90 lbs and 4'10. Nothing to jiggle, although I was an early bloomer and had to wear a bra at 10. I remember having a dress code that prohibited girls wearing pants because they might be suggestive. Even today, girls are regularly sent home from events for wearing (not really) "inappropriate" clothing.
It has to change. It is changing. Too slow, not soon enough.

Jeaniegirl posted 9/22/2018 12:01 PM

Sister, I'd like to add that what happened to me made me stronger, which is one blessing. If that event happened today, I would have turned those card board voting booths over and slapped the hell out of him. And yelled to the world what he'd done.

Seeing him at that art show, I almost confronted him but thought I'd be seen as just some crazy woman. I'm guessing, just like many men today, he has, of course "forgotten" what he did to me back then. Selective memory, you know?

hopeandnohope posted 9/22/2018 14:27 PM

I'm sorry for the things that happened in your past and sorry for women everywhere who have experienced this kind of crap. I have many stories also that I never speak of now. Hopefully the world is going to change for the better for future young women.

Hope the 3 year old was at least never left alone with that pervert again! Very sad for her as I expect she had a lot more sexual abuse in her life.

Men have caused a lot of damage to women. When I meet men in my working environment that truly treat women as equals, with no sexual undertones, it's wonderful. Not the usual but so very nice to see.

ZenMumWalking posted 9/22/2018 14:32 PM


I appreciate you posting about this, and how difficult it must have been for you to get it all out. Sadly, many of us here can relate.

I am so fucking sick of all the 'alleged' and 'if that really happened then why didn't they do (blah blah blah) and 'they are only saying this now to get attention' and 'it was so long ago' and 'no one can remember something from that long ago' and 'well if it did happen then the guy was only a kid' and 'she must have wanted it' and 'he's a good guy' and my personal favorite: 'here's a bunch of people that he DIDN'T assault/rape' .....

I mean, how many murderers have murdered every single person they have encountered? From all accounts, BTK was a stand-up guy in his church and as a husband.

There are so many reasons that we do NOT speak up, and I find it so sad that things have changed so little in the last 40 years. Yes, there has been some positive change, but not nearly enough. For what other crimes does the victim get blamed? Is it your fault that you were mugged because you sometimes like to pay for things? Because you were walking home?

slight t/j: I am so proud of DS for his handling of his rape. He called the ambulance right away. He is co-operating with the police (who btw have been very helpful and understanding). He has sought out therapy. He is working past the shame. He is working to get himself on track to be the person he wants to be. And he SPEAKS UP when he sees others being mistreated.

All we can do is try to overcome our shame and self-blame so that we can speak our truth the best we can, when we can, to whom we can. To ourselves by journaling. To our trusted friends, who can comfort and console us. To appropriate authorities in the event of a crime. To those who might be the next victims of these predators.

But still, somehow that does not seem enough. We have to know that we WILL be taken seriously.

I'm so sorry for your attacks and that no one listened to you to help.


marji posted 9/22/2018 15:55 PM

Thank. you for sharing all this Sister. You asked for responses from women reading your story who had not ever experienced this kind of crap; don't think you'll be getting lots of "never happened to me" stories.

I have too many did happen to me stories. One I did report to the police after going to the hospital as they advised. It was many years ago; the hospital staff was very, very nasty; the detectives were very professional but said without finger prints it was unlikely they'd find the guy until he repeated. The comfort they offered was that they most often did repeat and eventually got caught.

When I was very young I told no one. When I was older I told my closest friend but not the police. Let's hope that times are really changing and that females of all ages will no longer keep silent.

[This message edited by marji at 10:06 PM, September 22nd (Saturday)]

latebloomer45 posted 9/22/2018 18:02 PM

SisterMilkshake, my friend:

I am so sorry that this has happened to you as well. The fact that those in authority made it So.Much.Worse makes me want to vomit again.

I posted my story in general and in far more detail on FB. (Friday was the 39th anniversary of that rape. ) I think part of #timesup means we talk about these very old assaults. I do feel better for doing so, although sad that only two responses were male. Even if they don't know what to say, an "I'm so sorry you had to experience that" would be nice. I do understand that for men, the world seems upside down right now. "Suddenly" the rules are different. Except it isn't suddenly. It's never been fucking OK, we just now have the power and strength to speak up. We'd get over these old assaults IF THEY WOULD ONLY STOP NOW.

And there is NO FUCKING PLACE IN THE WORLD WHERE "NO" means "YES". God DAMN it that pisses me off.

I will share that a year after the 1979 rape I spoke about, I was drugged at a bar and woke up in a stranger's bed. I was with two friends, one male, one female, this guy offered to buy the girls drinks and we said yes. (1980, I was still naive as fuck. Thought this going out with two friends was the safe thing to do.) It was at least a decade later before I learned that drugging drinks is a thing. I always thought the one drink I'd had must of changed me somehow, that maybe I really was a slut. (again with the self blame!) I have only flashes of memory of that night. Kissing a guy enthusiastically in the backseat of a car and then fighting him when he tried to get my panties off. A bedroom with men going in and out. (At least twice.) (I have no memory of any man in the bed except the first guy, but who the fuck knows .I do remember guys arguing.) All these memories are like 3-8 seconds long only. Waking up and his being VERY worried that I wasn't going to wake up. I weighed about 100 # and have always been overly sensitive to drugs..every time I've had anesthesia they have struggled to wake me up. God only knows how close he came to murdering me by accident. He drove me back home (I was supposed to have spent the night with the female friend.) I was so freaked about what I had done (in my mind) that I never told a soul at the time. I DID get checked for STDs. But didn't tell the doctor the truth. Due to pains I felt, I believe I was raped anally as well. But it's so very very foggy, very much like anesthesia. I try really hard to not think about that one. And it's easy BECAUSE my memory is so fragmented. I had zero recourse as I don't even know the guys name. Even when he dropped me home I was still really out of it. The friends told me I left the bar willingly with the guy, they didn't know me well (we all worked together for one summer only and this was about a month in). The male, who happened to be Iranian (this was during the hostage crisis) told me repeatedly for over a week that he had no idea I was such a slut. (I had a boyfriend at college, this was in the summer.) Always said with a sly grin. Finally the female friend told him to shut the fuck up. As an Iranian in those days , a lot of people were mean to him. Even customers, they put him at dishwasher to get him out of the public eye. He didn't have enough friends to be losing one. Only recently has it occurred to me that he might have been in on it. Probably not. But still a dick who made it worse.

So many of the "little' events that I can't even remember many of them, they fade compared to the rapes. Ones I do remember:

- My own brother pantsing me in front of his friends, he was 16, I was 12. Underwear AND shorts.

-Waking up at a friends house (also neighbors) to find her brother masturbating while looking at us. Tried to shove it in my mouth when he realized I was awake. I was ten, he was 14. His sister woke up and flung a heavy book at his crotch before he could get very close. Apparently she'd seen that shit before. He cried in pain. Poor baby. Told my mom and she said I'd probably dreamed it. Much later I found out she called him to mow our lawn, when he showed up she said if anyone with my last name ever saw his dick again that'd be the last time HE saw it, too. Had a knife in her hand at the time. I wish she'd told me that when it happened. She thought she was protecting me by telling me it was a dream. She was not, but she at least was trying to help me.

-My horrible brother in law trying to do a "growth inspection" on my 12 year old chest. He was such a fuckwad in every way, he beat his first wife, then my sister, then his third wife. He killed 3rd wife's cat in front of her and then she shot him dead. I was 19 by then, I testified in her trial, as did a couple dozen other people, about what a complete asshole he was, and she got off on self defense.

-Pulling out my time card at a job at 16 and finding Playgirl magazine photos taped to the bottom. Turns out the 26 year old MANAGER did that. To all the females. I am proud to say I walked into his office and said "I will have your goddamn job if anything like that ever happens again." He was already married with 3 kids, a "good Catholic boy". My ass.

-Been flashed four times in my life. Last guy threatened to fuck me until I was dead. When he realized I was calling the cops he fled. (My dog was with me so he didn't get TOO close.) That was in 2004, to this day I'm pissed that I did't take his picture before I called the cops....

-Ass grabbed or verbally propositioned more times than I can count as I was working in restaurants from age 16-23. Mind you, I weighed 90-100 lbs and had ZERO boobs and my actual high school nickname was NoAssAtAll. Doesn't matter. I guess I attracted the pedos.

Not to even mention comments on my looks by total strangers. That really IS uncountable.

My beautiful wonderful niece says by speaking out we are #fuelingthechange. I'm ready to set the whole damn world on fire if it puts an end to this shit being SO FUCKING COMMON.

((((SisterMilkshake)))) ((((Marj)))) ((((JeanieGirl))) ((((Lionne))) ((((ZMW's DS)))) (((all the silent sufferers))))

sewardak posted 9/22/2018 18:35 PM

I'm so sorry SM, and everyone else. I have stories much like these. People wonder why we don't tell.

"Not to even mention comments on my looks by total strangers."

why do people think this is ok? this has happened to me very recently. why? do you think I'm flattered? Because i'm not. i'd like to know if anyone here does this to someone they think is attractive and how they think it's ok.

and this doesn't even come close to what everyone else has experienced.

for me: so many close calls that were overt sexual harrassment at the very least and this close to assault, with an actual rape thrown in there. what is wrong with people?

WhatsRight posted 9/22/2018 19:28 PM

Oh my God! Just, oh my God!

Words cannot express my horror at what you ladies have been through. I simply cannot imagine it.

I have to say that I am one of those women who have never experienced this. I think I played doctor with the next-door neighbor boy when we were both very very young. And once, I was in a picture with the mascot for the Atlanta Braves, and I could have sworn that when he put his arm around me for the picture his hand got amazingly close to my breast.

But never ever any other situation. Never.

And I cannot tell you why. I almost have guilt for it never having happened to me.

To be perfectly honest, as a mother of three boys, I have worried from time to time that a young lady feeling remorse the next morning could possibly accuse my sonĎs of something they did not do. But that is certainly not to say that I believe that that happens very often.

And as far as what is happening now in the news, One of the things that is the most incredulous to me is the argument that if someone cannot remember the exact house they were in, then how could they remember the details of an attack?. Are you effing kidding me?

Iím pretty sure that someoneís street address would not occupy a place in my mind to anywhere near the same extent that a physical attack would.

Again, Iím so very very very sorry that you all have been through this. My heart goes out to all of you.

I just canít imagine.

UKgirl posted 9/23/2018 04:34 AM

The usual comments and unwelcome touches/gropes in pubs & nightclubs. Two rapes by guys I knew and one by a stranger while at college. The two by the guys I knew I've kind of got over but not forgotten. I got myself into a "situation" and that's just what happened. A "that was then, this is now" - when it would be classified as rape. But not then. The stranger dragging me over a wall was reported to the police. Who made out it was my fault for walking back to student digs at 3am. In a lot of ways, dealing with the police was worse than the rape. I wished I'd never reported it. My parents were told. Quite a number of people knew - because it had been reported. A local paper thought it was acceptable to try and interview me. Of course the attitude of the police changed when he went on to rape a married woman of 29 and another girl of 17. Never caught him.

A lot of things have changed since the 70s, but there is still a long, long way to go.

latebloomer45 posted 9/23/2018 05:41 AM

But never ever any other situation. Never.

And I cannot tell you why. I almost have guilt for it never having happened to me.

Oh, dear WR, it makes me happy that some women have never experienced this. (I'm not going to count playing doctor if you weren't forced.) I will say your life has had plenty of strife and sorrow, please do NOT feel guilty.

I think plenty of girls have had remorse and framed it in their minds/to their parents as assault. VERY few have gone to the cops or the press.

These stories of being victimized a second time by authorities make me literally sick. Sort of glad I didn't report further on my rapes. How fucked up is THAT?

(((((all of us)))))

Thistles posted 9/23/2018 08:44 AM

This thread has been eye opening.
I have been through so many other things in life that I
had forgotten about the incidents in high school that
I hadnít even realized were assaults.
And I told no one.

xswimmer posted 9/23/2018 08:58 AM

I am so fucking sick of all the 'alleged'

What ever happened to due process?

I am certainly not in a position to make any judgments about what is being presented in the news.

Not to minimize what happened to the OP, but how often on SI do we recommend that (generally male) BS get a VAR because of false accusations of abuse by WW in order to get an advantage in the D process?

I was a victim of domestic violence. I could have reported it to police, and now I wish I had done so. But I didn't and I will accept that I have to live with that decision. And it impacts me now, over 4 years after the D.

Adlham posted 9/23/2018 09:18 AM

I'm about one more assault coming to light away from either a nervous breakdown or a multi-state killing spree.

Ok, that second one was a joke. Angry and in poor taste, but it's my imagination is how I cope.

1) It was the 80's. I was sexually abused by my mother's husband. I did tell.

1979- my mom said it was all a fantasy in my head. I was 8.

1984- my teacher, who did nothing with the information.

1985- my priest, who did nothing because as it turned out, he'd been molesting the altar boys for years.

1986- local LEO, who said it was a "family matter."

Did I mention that he was a former cop in the area?

2) I was date raped at an underage party. I blamed myself for being drunk and vulnerable. Because that's how victims were treated and I wanted no part of that. Being raped was punishment enough. I did not need my sexual history paraded in court for everyone to decide I was just a slut who had it coming.

3) my boss, who sexually harassed a lot of us women on the job. I didn't tell at first because I thought maybe I was overly sensitive. Because I am. Turns out, I wasn't imagining things and I wasn't alone. He was reported. The company told us he'd been let go. 10 years later, I apply for a position in a facility clear across the state from where this had happened. Blind box ad. Guess who calls me for an interview, still with the same damn company?!? Those bastards didn't fire him. They just relocated him 5 hours away.

Even when we do report, we're still often treated with scorn.

In my community, there was a man who first came to people's attention in the late 60's at a school. He was quietly let go, admonished and told never to work with kids.

In the early 90's, he was finally arrested and convicted on 70+ counts of sexually assaulting boys entrusted in his care as a Boy Scout leader. Many of my male friends were among his victims. It took 30+ years for that bastard to end up with just a few years in prison.

Meanwhile, we victims/survivors serve a life sentence with this. I'm barely coping right now. Thank God for my husband, who is my rock.

But it's been relentless. It's been one story after another coming to light over the last few years and even though I practice a lot of self care, I'm struggling more and more.

Edited for typos and to add...

Right now, the hardest part is seeing everyone else's experiences. It's one thing to know intellectually that it happens to a lot of men and women, but the sheer volume of people coming forward breaks my heart. I'm grateful to not feel alone, but the number of people who can relate is devastating. It's so much worse than I could have imagined.

[This message edited by Adlham at 9:23 AM, September 23rd (Sunday)]

latebloomer45 posted 9/23/2018 09:30 AM

What ever happened to due process?

No one is trying to undo due process. If I may assume what Sister is saying, she's sick of the smarmy way it is said by people trying to cut the accuser down, ASSUMING she's making it up. Trying to influence public opinion. Hurting all victims in the process.

That's the whole point of this thread, xswimmer. To unburden ourselves of years of pain from unreported assaults, men who faced ZERO consequences, and loved ones and the authorities telling us we were lying, dreaming, or deserved it.

Maybe by facing this pain we can change things for OUR children.

[This message edited by latebloomer45 at 9:31 AM, September 23rd (Sunday)]

ZenMumWalking posted 9/23/2018 10:24 AM

If I may assume what Sister is saying

That was me, not SMS, and yes latebloomer that's exactly what I meant (maybe I said it badly). Thanks for helping to clear that up.

Not being believed even to the point of there being any INVESTIGATION of an allegation is the type of dismissal that we are tired of. If you are put off even if you DO tell, then what is the point? Where is anyone to turn?

That is the whole point here.

Leaving aside all the breast grabbing/grab-assing from various jobs I had in high school or university.... I was raped 2 times.

Once by my (gay male) roommate. I woke up on my stomach and he was anally raping me. I was pinned down and could not get away. I finally managed to maneuver so that he was 'only' vaginally raping me. So I could at least make my rape more 'comfortable'. WTF??

I told my boyfriend at the time and he said I was just trying to make him jealous. After that, I thought that there would be no point in reporting if even he didn't think I was believable. It was in the SF Bay Area in the early 1980's, there were plenty of gay men around for my roommate so why would he 'sleep with' a woman (according to police thinking at the time - I called about coming in and making a report, but this was the logic they gave and I ultimately decided not to).

The other time was by an older co-worker who managed to get me alone in a more isolated part of the work place. He was behind me, grabbed my hair, punched me in the face, pulled me down to fellate him and when I bit him he pinched my nose so that I could not breathe and forced it. Then he kicked me in the head and turned me around and anally raped me while he had his belt tied around my neck so I was choking the whole time. I kept trying to keep the belt loose because he was strangling me. He finished himself off on my face.

I went home early that day without reporting it to my manager. Why? HE WAS MY MANAGER. And later, I did find out I wasn't the only one. Another sad example of each of us feeling shame and guilt and not getting together in a 'metoo' kind of way to try to put a stop to this guy. Again though, that was the 80's, not sure how much effect this would have had.

Hugs to us all.

latebloomer45 posted 9/23/2018 10:40 AM

Ah, ZMW, it's also the second line of SM's OP.

Your story is horrifying. I am so deeply sad and furious for you.

I really hope there is a special place in hell for these fuckers.


k8la posted 9/23/2018 12:24 PM

I'm a sexual assault survivor. But the perps in my case had a track record of doing this to other co-eds. There was a trail of evidence via bad behavior. What concerns me the most is I'm also a mother of sons. What if, down the road, they were aspiring for success and some accusation came out of the blue with similar lack of corroborating behavior/victims, no date, no location - no way to prove innocence, and by the time they are grown, "innocent until proven guilty" becomes "guilty until proven innocent."?

I'm triggering as well -lots of old memories. Studies of socio-cultural development, especially a chapter entitled "The Sexual Auction Block" that was way too close to home.

But I'm also seeing a rush to judgment and the unraveling of due process, where due process absolutely cannot be served for either party in this case. If we don't believe her as a victim, we're perpetuating the boys will be boys theme. If we believe her, and he actually never behaved that way toward a girl, we're equally as negligent in administering justice.

I have sons. I'm scared to death of the world they face, where the scales of justice deny them due-process because of their gender, and the track record of bad men before them, and society/culture that allowed/encouraged the bad behavior.

undertherug posted 9/23/2018 12:33 PM

It's been over 30 years ago. A man broke in where I was living and tried to rape me. Fortunately he was interrupted, ran, and was never found. When I told my mother, she asked what I had done to cause it -- was I walking around in front of an open window naked or something? Our relationship was never the same after that, but that is how people treat victims of sexual assault. A neighbor later asked me if I was the girl who "almost got herself raped." I will say that if one is sexually assaulted, the details are never forgotten. Even now, when I enter a room I note all the entrances and exits so I will never feel trapped again.

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