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General :
Completely confused and all over the place

Topic is Sleeping.
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Lurkingsoul12 ( member #82382) posted at 1:02 PM on Monday, April 24th, 2023

You don't want to tell OBS because you don't want to be held accountable and also because you lack empathy for her. That's it. There is no other explanation. These 'ignorance is bliss', 'it will blow up her marriage', 'my kids life will blow up', 'no one knows' etc etc are just your bs attempt to make us believe that you are in a situation that no one has ever been (which it utter bs) and so, your hands are tied.

[This message edited by Lurkingsoul12 at 3:30 PM, Monday, April 24th]

posts: 457   ·   registered: Nov. 12th, 2022
id 8788273
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HellFire ( member #59305) posted at 1:58 PM on Monday, April 24th, 2023

You continue to ignore the fact that those of us who have been here for awhile know better than you about how this plays out. I don't mean that disrespectfully. We know OBS life is already changed. We know her husband will never tell. We also know that affairs are often compared to a drug, by the former waywards here. If your wife stays NC, he's lost his supply, and will find another dealer. We know her life is at risk. We've had BS show up here with HIV. They're now dead. We've had BW who can no longer have children,because their WS gave them an std,and they didn't find out until it was too late. We've also had BW who have lost their babies because of an std. So this "ignorance is bliss" mantra is bullshit.

We can see through the lies you are telling yourself..and us. Your wife isn't attracted to you. She is attracted to him. She loves him. She didn't end the affair because she feels so bad. She ended it because OM made it clear he wouldn't leave his marriage for her. She realized there really wasn't a choice. You won't tell OBS, because you're afraid of OBS finds out, she will divorce OM, and OM will want to fall back on your wife, and she will divorce you to be with him. And that would affect your kids. You are scared of her leaving you,so you're making all kinds of excuses. We see that.

You keep saying she feels so bad. That she doesn't want to divorce. That she doesn't want to lose time with the kids. That wouldn't happen if she truly felt that way. And you know she would end it all if OM were single.

We see that.

I brought up the point that, if your wife is truly NC, then she wouldn't know you told the OBS. Right?

I will be everywhere you look,but nowhere to be found. And that will be my revenge.

posts: 6626   ·   registered: Jun. 20th, 2017   ·   location: The Midwest
id 8788282
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BluerThanBlue ( member #74855) posted at 3:15 PM on Monday, April 24th, 2023

I'm going to try asking this question again because I've asked it multiple times and you've never answered.

If you're so certain that your wife would never want to get divorced and lose time with the kids, then why did you feel your hands were tied when it came to agreeing to her affair and not telling the OBS?

BW, 40s

Divorced WH in 2015; now happily remarried

I edit my comments a lot for spelling, grammar, typos, etc.

posts: 1894   ·   registered: Jul. 13th, 2020
id 8788291
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Greto ( member #80904) posted at 4:13 PM on Monday, April 24th, 2023

I can tell you my H gave me the ILYBNILWY (I love you but not in love with you) during his 2nd affair. He was planning to D me. To say I was blindsided was an understatement.

If Ozzy's wife said she loved him but wasn't in love I think that is "easier" to get work through than "I lost all sexual/physical attraction to you and can't even kiss you."

Ozzy, if your wife can get IC and get to the root of why she lost attraction to you, your marriage may have a chance. If she does not do the work to rekindle the attraction, then I don't see it working. There is nothing you can do at this moment except set boundaries and you both get into IC.

posts: 113   ·   registered: Sep. 9th, 2022   ·   location: Sandusky, Ohio
id 8788302
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bob7777 ( member #79867) posted at 4:15 PM on Monday, April 24th, 2023

POSOM also has regret, maybe he will tell her, maybe he won't. But in their relationship, as it stands maybe things will be stronger as he realises what a POSOM he has been. I am not going to interfere in their process. Sorry again if this triggers and this may well be the end of me on this forum, or maybe I do need to move to the R thread, I don't know.


That's understandable and reasonable from your point of view. From my experience, it's better to address crucial and critical points at their actual time. Possibly there will be a time in the future, when all this has run out, possibly not with a happy ending style, where you possibly will think that you should have told your wife or OBS this, but then you are at a point where it doesn't matter anymore and it's gonna frustrate you even more because you gambled your opportunity away. Life is always a power play, use your options and opportunities before they don't matter anymore. Everyone needs some satisfaction.

Has anyone come back from their WS having no physical attraction for them? She acknowledges that I am good looking (as I said previously, despite everything my confidence in myself is high right now, I think I will do fine if this fell apart) but for the families sake I would still like things to work. A lot of healing to be done on my part but she has been much more empathetic to what has happened over the weekend so that is a start.


That plays a bit into the power play I mentioned. IME women like a challenge, a person who challenges them, that attracts them. Being accommodating is nice but not sexy and not attractive. You might be good looking on the outside but how you handled your SO is not attractive at all, you catered to your SO's will, you let her walk over you, let her get with another man and share her because you were afraid of losing her and your relationship, that's a "meek" behavior. You gave her what she wanted, that's nice but as the saying go you always want what you don't get. IME women don't find those traits attractive.

posts: 106   ·   registered: Feb. 1st, 2022
id 8788304
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Edie ( member #26133) posted at 4:53 PM on Monday, April 24th, 2023

Sounds like a good sex therapist might well be very useful for you both once you are both a bit further down the road of your own IC.

Maybe a long walk in the Hindu Kush would do it?
BW (me) 52
FWS 55
Together 29 years; 2 kids 15 & 12
Dday Dec 08 (confessed) R'd.

posts: 6638   ·   registered: Nov. 9th, 2009   ·   location: Europe
id 8788308
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 Ozzy1788 (original poster member #83108) posted at 5:15 PM on Monday, April 24th, 2023

I'm going to try asking this question again because I've asked it multiple times and you've never answered.

If you're so certain that your wife would never want to get divorced and lose time with the kids, then why did you feel your hands were tied when it came to agreeing to her affair and not telling the OBS?

I thought I had answered these bits multiple times, if not, apologies.

My wife doesn't want to get divorced. She also doesn't have feelings for me right now. I agreed to her being with someone else as I thought briefly I would be OK with it, we actually had a few days of being very close after the first time. We thought we are not like other couples etc etc. Turns out that feeling didn't last long on my part, and looking at it in the way you all see it disgusted me prompting me to call an end to it.

Having agreed to it, telling the OBS seems counterintuitive to our agreement. I have apologised for my naivety several times. As I said a few pages ago though, if I hadn't found this website and reached out, I don't think I would have had the courage to end it so quickly.

Hellfire - I am the only one who knows. So if OBS finds out, even anonymously, it is clearly me who told her and then it comes back.

My wife had some tests recently and got checked for STDs. All clear. So that reason isn't needed if that helps.

Other than the reason of her deserving to know there isn't any other reason. And as the affair has ended I struggle with that reason. I can 100% blow up their marriage or let them sort it out.

Sounds like a good sex therapist might well be very useful for you both once you are both a bit further down the road of your own IC.

This is good advice and something we have spoken about. At the moment I think she needs time and IC to process. It may not come across in posts but I am not being clingy to her, I know the situation, she knows that this has damaged the relationship in a huge way from my end too. The idea of starting afresh has a lot of appeal to me. But for the sake of the kids (again) we are not going to give up that easily.

(And it isn't just about the kids - we are very fond of each other, I find her attractive sexually so the only piece missing is her attraction to me, assuming we can get back to a decent place). A few of our chats have led us both to realise that we may be Covid victims - I know most of you are US based but in the UK we had to home school and be in the house together a very long time. If we give each other breathing space then it may give the relationship space.

Still less than 3 months since the initial chat so way too soon to be making massive decisions, would everyone not agree?

We are on holiday without the children next week (this was booked a year ago!) so that will be an even better test since at least the affair itself is behind us (even if there is still fallout).

posts: 168   ·   registered: Mar. 23rd, 2023   ·   location: UK
id 8788311
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HellFire ( member #59305) posted at 5:33 PM on Monday, April 24th, 2023

Hellfire - I am the only one who knows. So if OBS finds out, even anonymously, it is clearly me who told her and then it comes back.

My wife had some tests recently and got checked for STDs. All clear. So that reason isn't needed if that helps.

Other than the reason of her deserving to know there isn't any other reason. And as the affair has ended I struggle with that reason. I can 100% blow up their marriage or let them sort it out.

Let's break this down.

If your wife is NC,and has blocked him,how would she find out you told? Unless,of course she is still messaging him,and in contact with him.

If that's the case, the affair continues, emotionally. She can't have any contact at all, if she chooses the marriage.

Also, you are completely dismissing the fact that its extremely possible OM told his buddies. Cheating husbands often like to brag to their friends. They also like to show any sexy pics they got from their OW. One of his buddies could tell his wife. Or one of their girlfriend's will tell.

It's also extremely possible he didn't delete everything. Any idea how many WS here were caught, because they didn't delete
everything, and their BS found it?

It's also possible she will decide to look at the phone bill,and see your wife's number hundreds of times. Or she could find the charges for the hotel room.

If any of that happens, you should prepare yourself for the fallout. When BW find out everyone else knew,and the BH gave his permission (not an unusual thing, we've seen it here before), she tends to get very upset. She could post your wife on a homewrecker site. And you can not ask her to leave your family alone..because you lost that right.

Ok. No stds. That doesn't mean his wife hasn't gotten BV, which isn't necessarily an std, but often occurs because your partner has been with someone new,and exposed you,so it throws your ph off balance. If she believes her husband is faithful, she won't get tested during a pap smear,and the BV, which often has no symptoms, can develop into pelvic inflammatory disease. So saying that telling his wife doesn't matter because your wife has no stds, means nothing.

You've been given dozens of reasons as to why she should be told. You ignore them all.

I'd still like to know how your kids lives will blow up,if your wife has said she doesn't want a divorce, and doesn't want to lose time with the kids. Because you changed an agreement that you were coerced into,and now that you no better,you should act better? Didn't she agree to NC, yet broke that agreement? She's the only one who can change the agreement?

To end, there is no sorting out their marriage. There is a woman who has been abused,and betrayed,by a man who she doesn't even know,who claims to be her husband. The lie will continue. Until she eventually finds out. Good luck when that happens.

It's clear you aren't listening to 99% of the advice you're getting. There are people here who want the help, so I can't continue to try and help you. It's a waste of my time here.

[This message edited by HellFire at 5:37 PM, Monday, April 24th]

I will be everywhere you look,but nowhere to be found. And that will be my revenge.

posts: 6626   ·   registered: Jun. 20th, 2017   ·   location: The Midwest
id 8788318
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BluerThanBlue ( member #74855) posted at 6:07 PM on Monday, April 24th, 2023

Ozzy, if what you're saying is true-- that your wife doesn't want to divorce and doesn't want to lose time with her kids-- then why have your actions (from the start until now) reflected nothing but fear of losing her? Why are you acting like a man with a losing hand when you're actually holding a royal flush?

There's a reason we say on this site that in order to save your marriage, you have to be willing to lose it. As long as you continue to act in desperation and convey to your wife that she is the more valuable partner in the relationship, the more contempt she will have for you.

BW, 40s

Divorced WH in 2015; now happily remarried

I edit my comments a lot for spelling, grammar, typos, etc.

posts: 1894   ·   registered: Jul. 13th, 2020
id 8788322
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BeingNaive ( member #30652) posted at 6:07 PM on Monday, April 24th, 2023

A few of our chats have led us both to realise that we may be Covid victims - I know most of you are US based but in the UK we had to home school and be in the house together a very long time.

Same here and I'm in the US so don't be thinking that makes your circumstances much different. As someone here stated, the only difference than the majority of those experiencing infidelity here is that you granted her permission to do so.

[This message edited by BeingNaive at 6:08 PM, Monday, April 24th]

posts: 307   ·   registered: Jan. 6th, 2011   ·   location: Michigan
id 8788323
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swoned ( member #54719) posted at 6:08 PM on Monday, April 24th, 2023

Ozzy


Your situation is not different.
You are not Unique.
There is absolutely nothing that makes your situation different from anyone else.
I see many have tried to tell you this. The collective wisdom of SI is absolute.

Your wife is honest. (she's not)
The affair is over. (it's not)
We are moving on. (She's not)
OBS is in ignorant bliss (she's not)


I both pity you and am furious with you.

D-Day 6/22/16Ended in Divorce 07/02/18Remarried.

posts: 221   ·   registered: Aug. 19th, 2016
id 8788324
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hatefulnow ( member #35603) posted at 7:07 PM on Monday, April 24th, 2023

Long time lurker, sometime poster here. Take it from me, telling the other spouse is the BEST and ONLY positive option for you. First, shoe on the other foot, you'd want her to tell you. By holding this in you are denying her CRITICAL, NEED TO KNOW information about her marriage and life. She may have no idea of an affair and thinks AP is just being in a funk or that it's her fault somehow. She could be trying and trying to connect and getting nowhere fast. She could be suffering, and you'd give her the opportunity to end that suffering, whatever that means for her. BTW, if it causes the dissolution of their marriage, you are blameless. You didn't come to her with a pack of lies.

Second, somewhere along the way your spouse lost respect for you. Don't know why but I've seen it before. It happened to me. You spouse, like mine, never probably stopped caring for you, the father of her children, but to have an affair and continue when you know about it is the height of disrespect. Without respect THERE IS NO LOVE. Not truly, anyway. For her to respect you she has to see you as strong and realize there are consequences to her actions. That it's NOT okay for her to do what she did. Biting the bullet, doing the hard thing and not taking this crap lying down would demonstrate that.

Third, having been through this, many here will tell you that OM was probably never really interested in your spouse, except for sexually. If he was he would have divorced his wife already and asked your wife to run away with him. The kids, etc., would not get in the way. If he was concerned about those things, he wouldn't have been with your spouse in the first place. No, he won't be coming after your wife if his wife leaves. The typical cheater playbook say he will go into 'save his ass' mode and he'll throw your wife completely under the bus. Probably say it was all her fault, that she threw herself at him and call her every name in the book. It would be good if your wife can see what a coward he really is. Her seeing a yellow streak in a man is like throwing ice cold water on a woman's passion. All the more reason for you to step up.

You seem like a gentle, non-confrontational type. That may be, through no fault of your own, the reason her feelings have waned.

Whatever you choose, please have courage and good luck.

posts: 269   ·   registered: May. 17th, 2012
id 8788343
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Edie ( member #26133) posted at 7:52 PM on Monday, April 24th, 2023

I find her attractive sexually so the only piece missing is her attraction to me

Again it all sounds a bit pouty to me, especially when telling you about how repellent the idea of kissing you feels, which to me feels quite passive aggressively punitive to you for spoiling her fun, but that bit of judg-iness from me arises from me reading her from afar as not taking real and imaginative reflexive responsibility for her own destiny, and is only surmise therefore.

The difference between desire and arousal is not for you to solve. Let’s see if she can find a more sensitive and empathic way of discovery on the matter and self growth. Her lack of curiosity in terms of the literature widely available concerns me

If we give each other breathing space then it may give the relationship space.

Which of course is what the 180 is about. Still not convinced you’re doing it with any consistency or commitment.

[This message edited by Edie at 8:11 PM, Monday, April 24th]

Maybe a long walk in the Hindu Kush would do it?
BW (me) 52
FWS 55
Together 29 years; 2 kids 15 & 12
Dday Dec 08 (confessed) R'd.

posts: 6638   ·   registered: Nov. 9th, 2009   ·   location: Europe
id 8788349
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Abalone123 ( member #82896) posted at 9:22 PM on Monday, April 24th, 2023

Ozzy, a good time to cash in on the perks you found attractive when you decided to open up the marriage, the hall pass! This time find a partner for you who is single, or married but whose spouse knows what they are upto . Preferable if this person also looks forward to kissing you !

[This message edited by Abalone123 at 9:22 PM, Monday, April 24th]

posts: 273   ·   registered: Feb. 18th, 2023
id 8788370
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Mamabear2813 ( new member #83216) posted at 9:37 PM on Monday, April 24th, 2023

Ozzy I just wanted you to know that I had all the same reasons for not telling the OBS as you.

Want to guess what that got me?

A second D-day, 2 years later. Because the affair wasn’t properly blown up/outted, it was much easier for them to rekindle things a bit down the line when reconciliation got hard. When the marriage got hard again, he still had her to turn to, and she still had nothing to lose since her spouse didn’t know.

You think not telling protects your relationship, but the reality is that it makes it MUCH more vulnerable.

I blew it up the second time, shared with the OBS all of the info I had from both affairs (and apologized profusely), threw my husband out, and filed for divorce.

Know what happened then? My WS actually started to be honest in therapy, engaged HARD in it 2x weekly for 6 months while we remained separated and shared custody of our 3 young children. At that time I heard him out, what he had learned and been working on—- his "whys" for the affair as he understood them then— and was willing to consider reconciliation. He moved back in after 9 months, and we’ve been reconciled for 4 years now. Much happier marriage than the "first" one we had.

Save yourself the heartache of the second dday. It was awful and it changed me as a person. I needed 2 years of intense therapy to move through what happened in a way where I felt whole again, because the second dday was such a shock to my nervous system and brain in a way I can’t even explain. You don’t deserve that and neither does OBS.

Hope you can see that you’re opening yourself up to significantly more risk this way, even if you take the OBS’s right to know out of the equation.

Good luck of you.

posts: 13   ·   registered: Apr. 17th, 2023   ·   location: RI
id 8788375
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Tron ( member #50936) posted at 9:48 PM on Monday, April 24th, 2023

Ozzy, a good time to cash in on the perks you found attractive when you decided to open up the marriage, the hall pass! This time find a partner for you who is single, or married but whose spouse knows what they are up to . Preferable if this person also looks forward to kissing you !

What you've done and allowed her to do doesn't generally garner much respect from a wife. They are hard wired to be attracted to strong men who will protect them, who mate guard. Men who allow their wives to push them around, and to go out and F other men are not generally perceived as strong and attractive. So you have a couple strikes against you right there that need to be addressed.

If your spouse knows there are other women interested in you, preferably younger and better looking women, and she perceives that she is about to lose you, your attraction levels go way up. She much more likely to put on the full court press to "win" you back.

posts: 170   ·   registered: Dec. 24th, 2015   ·   location: Texas
id 8788378
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bob7777 ( member #79867) posted at 10:39 PM on Monday, April 24th, 2023

It's really textbook Ozzy, that your wife doesn't want a divorce although she doesn't have feelings for you right now is easy explainable. It's called convenience, being in a "relationship" has it's perks, you have a "warm" home, someone who gives you emotional and financial support, life is generally easier living like this than doing it all alone. I often say this to BS when they realize that they were betrayed, get honest with yourself and try to come out of your denial phase. The fight your having is not with your SO, it's you.

We thought we are not like other couples etc


Man, literally everyone here thought this. You're average, so please start accepting advice from people here who just lived a similar story.

posts: 106   ·   registered: Feb. 1st, 2022
id 8788391
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HalfTime2017 ( member #64366) posted at 12:50 AM on Tuesday, April 25th, 2023

Ozz, your WW is using you like a plan B. You accepting of this as what it is, shows that you need major IC work. Please get yourself in IC, tell your counselor all that you've told us, and I'd bet they will come to a similar conclusion.

Don't be your wife's plan B. Don't be anyones plan B. Work on yourself, YOU deserve sooo much more.

posts: 1424   ·   registered: Jul. 5th, 2018   ·   location: Cali
id 8788405
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ChamomileTea ( Moderator #53574) posted at 2:32 AM on Tuesday, April 25th, 2023

@ Mamabear2813... Thanks for sharing that post with us today. It's often so helpful for new members to read anecdotal accounts from others while they're mulling over their own situation. I do remember when I was in the JFO stage how I poured over books and threads looking for other people's stories. What a great share on your first post. smile

BW: 2004(online EAs), 2014 (multiple PAs)
Married 40 years; in R with fWH for 8

posts: 7017   ·   registered: Jun. 8th, 2016   ·   location: U.S.
id 8788423
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Trdd ( member #65989) posted at 4:15 AM on Tuesday, April 25th, 2023

I agree with Lurkingsoul12's post about the pick me dance on page 21. You started there, came out of it nicely but now would be well served by taking two more giant steps forward and concentrating on you. If there is any chance of your wife's head getting straight it will be helped by her seeing you as confident, healthy and strong.

I have no idea about your wife regaining her passion but I can tell you that it is pretty typical for it to wax and wane over time in a long relationship. She may have broken, unrealistic expectations about what true love actually is. Many people think they need the type of sexual spark they had with a brand new relationship or the love is gone. That thinking is BS. Most people have to work hard to keep the fire stoked and most couples fail at some point in their marriage. Usually due to busy parenting and stressful jobs. ALL THAT IS NORMAL. Then posom comes along, hits on her in small ways and the EA starts. Now the sex drive is back but for him. That is how affairs operate. It does not mean true love, but she doesn't quite grasp that.

And it is the chicken or the egg. I mean shit, if she literally told you she doesn't even want to kiss you... then ask her this: was she feeling that way toward you before the EA started with this guy? Way back when they first began talking more intimately? Long before the sex? I bet she wasn't. Her passion had waned but she was still ok with you. Then it shifted to him, and that killed it for you because she really is monogamous. The Affair acclerated her lack of passion to a place she otherwise may never have gotten to without it. Plausible? Easily. Likely? I think so.

I think people are beating you up about the OBS as if their personal lives depended on it. I've mostly stated my pov but I want to add that what some people said here and I hinted at earlier could very well be true... she is still in limerance over the posom. She is still pining for him and thinks that it was true love. You do have to take that seriously. Their last meeting was probably "we made a terrible mistake but I'll always remember our passion and connection. And "love" if they've been saying that. If that is the case, reconnection is possible and even if they don't, the connection is still present in her mind.

If all that is accurate and doesn't change over the coming weeks, then telling the OBS gains credibility from a "stop the affair" perspective.

posts: 943   ·   registered: Aug. 27th, 2018   ·   location: US
id 8788434
Topic is Sleeping.
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