SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

New to your thread and want to say that I am sorry you are facing this betrayal.

Youve already received great input and know you are trying to work the 180.

From reading your posts, it sounds as if you have been severely beaten down and need a massive dose of self assertiveness and confidence. I would like to recommend two titles for you to read:

• No More Mister Nice Guy

• The Way of The Superior Man

Take courage to face this down. Your "wife" has turned you into what I call an "Intimacy Widower" what with not having sex with her for five years. Why stay?

Strength to you.

[This message edited by DobleTraicion at 10:27 PM, Saturday, May 13th]

There’s one point of The Tactical Primer I personally don’t agree with, that is employing The 180 for 3-6 months while waiting for your actively cheating spouse to get with the program.

Personally, I told my WS that if she’s interested in reconciliation and building a new marriage on the ashes of this heap, she better go NC immediately and come running after me cuz I’m on my way to the attorney’s office.

She stopped me in my tracks heading out the door, immediately went NC, and began the required initial actions to establish R.

I can’t imagine living under the same roof with someone maintaining contact with their AP, actively betraying me, stuck in the idiotic "Affair Bubble". I’ve never understood anyone’s tolerance of "The Affair Bubble" and sitting in 180 limbo for 3-6 months while being actively humiliated. If my WS needs 3-6 months to figure out if they want to be my forever…

Sorry, I know The Tactical Primer and The 180 is gospel around here, but just have to personally disagree with Step #5.

I believe if your WS doesn’t come running after you after D-Day, just keep heading West.

If your WS doesn’t convince you that they’re truly remorseful in the 6-months to 1-year (depending on your state or jurisdiction) before the divorce becomes final, then they just don’t have what it takes and you’re well on your way to deliverance.

Life is just too short and my personal standards just too high to sit around playing 180 “make the marriage a good place to be” games while waiting for my spouse to ease on out of their affair bubble at their convenience.

Unless I’m totally misinterpreting Step 5 of the Tactical Primer.

[This message edited by RealityBlows at 12:40 AM, Sunday, May 14th]

You are grieving. That means some days are 1 step forward and 3 back. The next day will be different. Grief is usually the term people use but I think the better one is despair, or hopelessness, or helplessness. The feeling that your entire world has been ripped away from you and you have no say so in any of it.
A psychologist said that despair is so debilitating that it is impossible to live with and that is why anger takes over. We can control anger but not despair.
At some point your mind is going to either get angry or crash. Either way you MUST look after your health. Each day that you let this defeat you is a day that has a negative impact on your health. Stress is cumulative. If you need medicine to help you through ask for it. The same with sleep.

Please look after yourself.

I don’t want to be callous, but maybe it might of woken her up a bit if you had told her maybe her AP should be the one to help her since he’s the one she wants to be intimate with. Why do you continue to be her helpmate when she won’t cut contact with her AP? Push her off the fence.

I totally agree with RealityBlows on the waiting 3-6 months bit regarding the Tactical Primer, but I think it’s more an issue of not clearly enough written directions or the ability to interpret them the wrong way.

The key should be that IN GENERAL don’t take any rash and/or irrevocable decisions or actions that you might regret.
I think simply waiting without action is a formula for disaster. There are certain actions and decisions you should be doing – or at the very least – preparing.

So, you should definitely IMHO confront – let the WS know you know. You should definitely research and prepare for divorce, and at the very least be prepared to file – but I’m not so keen on the insistence of many that you have to file right away. You shouldn’t accept being in an infidelity relationship – and by waiting without some reaction for 3-6 months you basically are doing so.

If I take examples from my personal experience:
I decided more-or-less the moment I found out that I wasn’t marrying her the fourth Saturday from d-day as planned. Within 48 hours of d-day I had decided to end our long-term relationship and our engagement, had moved out and was totally 100% committed to that decision. That is an example of decisions you face after d-day and waiting 3-6 months to reach those decisions and to implement them would have been wrong.

About 2 weeks later I sent a very snarky cancelation mail to the guest-list to our wedding. This is pre-email, so I had to write it, type it, print it out on my old ImageWriter impact-printer, photocopy, hand-write the addresses on envelopes and lick about 50 stamps before dropping them all off at the post-office. It’s a lot of thought and a lot of work and a lot of cost… It’s also probably one of the things in life that I regret the most. It wasn’t necessary and it’s something I did for revenge. It’s true what they say that revenge is a double-edged sword. It hurt her for a week or two, but has gnawed at me for decades.

Infidelity takes so much from us – we don’t have to let it take our dignity too.

I believe if your WS doesn’t come running after you after D-Day, just keep heading West.

Pretty much my take. I'm all for reconciliation it's clear that that is what both the BS and WS desire. If there is any dithering from the WS than the 180 and moving towards divorce is the best plan of action. R is hard and painful enough with both doing the work. I wouldn't bother with someone not certain that they want to R.

I have to admit that parts of the 180 are very liberating and feel really good. Booked myself a theatre trip next weekend to see a show that I WANT to see. Previously I would have asked WS and as I suspect she would not want to go I probably would not have gone either. On this occasion I did not ask.

This has also clearly showed me one of the changes I will be making if we do R. I am no longer going to not do something just because she does not want too. I will just decide to do something and if she wants to come along fine, if not I am not missing out just because I put her feelings first. This would be a massive change in the dynamics of our M and if she does not like it tough. She will need to remember that it is her actions that have caused this upheaval in our M, and her actions that have changed who I am and my outlook on life.

If she was beginning to suspect that the dynamics of our relationship have changed before, it has now hit her straight between the eyes. She was very shocked and confused yesterday when she found out that I was going to the theatre and had not spoken to her about it before I decided.

Then this morning she was complaining that she never knows when I will be home during the working day. I generally work 8 to 4, but as I work a hybrid of office and work from home, I just say that I will be home lunchtimeish. She was complaining that this "could be anytime between 12.00 and 15.30", she is finding this unsettling and she does not like my new unpredictability, even though she has complained many times that I am too predictable.

Of course she doesn’t like unpredictability during the day given she was using your time at work as opportunity to see AP.

She’s still in contact, you said yourself she hasn’t had the opportunity to see him. I bet she’s trying to keep up some sort of charade and you coming when she’s out would impact that.

I sure hope you have her location on Find Friends or life 360 as a bare minimum. I feel like sanity would require at least that.

I agree with others regarding waiting around. I set a deadline. I wish I had not given him the 2 months to get her out of his office but as she was his assistant and he needed to avoid a harassment lawsuit it was kind of necessary. Two weeks before quit day he kind of balked about how he was gonna do it. I assured him that was fine but he would not be living with me after that date. He put her on a 6 week leave. At the end he flubbed again and let her come back for a week. I went scorched earth and showed up at the office and screamed out what they had done in front of everyone. After that HR pushed her out without me doing anything. It’s been done since then.

My point is I agree with an ultimatum and a set deadline. To which you are willing to adhere if she doesn’t comply. Maybe that doesn’t work with your marriage, everyone’s different. But it seems incredibly cruel for you to have to sit back and tolerate it while she messes around with her decision. Why pretend you don’t care when obviously you do. She makes a decision or she’s gone.

How is it going?

Anything new since you last posted a few days ago?

Here is wishing you the best.

Hi lrpprl, thanks for your best wishes. I went to the theatre at the weekend, and while the show was a bit cheesy and not brilliant (it was an Abba Tribute act), it felt great to get out and have some fun. I have always loved live theatre/shows and actually worked at that exact theatre for a few years, it was such a buzz.

The one slight change to the plans was that WS wanted to go with me so I said yes, and we actually had a very good time together. She is also being attentive and affectionate and does seem to be making an effort for us to be closer.

We seem to have entered a new phase where she has either ended the affair (at least not seeing him, not sure about whatsapp yet), or she has increased her lying to a massive degree. Obviously I want to believe the former but am wary about the latter. For myself I am waiting to see how this goes but in a very strange way I feel relieved that a tipping point has been reached. Either she is working with me to see if we can R, or I will find out she has been lying massively and in my head she would have crossed a line that I will not accept and I will be ready to proceed to D.

She is definately making sure I know where she is at all times (or where she says she is), and her actions do seem to be supporting this, but obviously I do not fully trust her and won't for a very long time. She is also initiating more physical contact, hugs, kisses and touches than has been the case previously.

Personally I am feeling much calmer, I think this is a combination of the meds, having had more time to process my thoughts post Dday, and that things feel much more relaxed between myself and WS. I am also feeling much better because I developed an overeating disorder during the past 2 years and put on a massive amount of weight. I have been controlling my diet for the past 4 months and have lost some weight (nearly 5 stone/ 31 kg) so am feeling better and have had to buy new clothes which feels great.

One major bridge still to cross is that she still does not seem to feel that she has done anything massively wrong and does not want to talk about it, it seems that she is denying it happened in her own head and that by talking about it it will make it real. She also does not understand how much this has hurt me deep down, I know that she would not feel the same way, we are just different, but I do need her to understand that and how hurt I am. I have printed out an article from this website about the 'tears of the betrayed spouse' and intend to read through this with her at an appopriate point, because to me that article EXACTLY describes how I felt.

Still early days here (6 weeks post Dday) so I still do not know where this will end up or even exactly where I want it to end up at the moment, but I will keep going and see how things work out.

[This message edited by Iamenough666 at 2:58 PM, Tuesday, May 30th]

One major bridge still to cross is that she still does not seem to feel that she has done anything massively wrong and does not want to talk about it, it seems that she is denying it happened in her own head and that by talking about it it will make it real. She also does not understand how much this has hurt me deep down, I know that she would not feel the same way, we are just different, but I do need her to understand that and how hurt I am.

She doesn't understand your pain because she is not in your shoes. WS are not known for empathy. So, your wife understanding your pain on her own is rather slim. Only way she will understand it is when you express it through your words, and actions. Right now, you are being very cordial with her, very receptive towards her and spending quality times with her. You have not even expressed what works and boundaries she must follow to become eligible for reconciliation. This will obviously sends her a wrong message. From her perspective - You are doing well. You are getting past her affair. You are not letting her face any consequences of her affair. You don't even seem to that bothered by her continued contact with her AP. There is nothing she is supposed to do to save this marriage. Not all of her observations are true but without you expressing your pain and suffering through any definitive actions to her, and without you expressing your basic requirements that she needs to follow to become a trustworthy and safer partner,she has no alternative to believe. I know, 6 weeks is not that long. You are in early stages of grief. So, your mistakes and softer pick me dance are understandable. But, the longer you play this dance, more you will suffer. Limbo damages one's personality and self respect. Don't be stuck in there for longer.

I have printed out an article from this website about the 'tears of the betrayed spouse' and intend to read through this with her at an appopriate point

Just a word of caution, if you don’t want her reading your posts here make sure you cut off any references to SI.

"intend to read through this with her at an appopriate point"

I don't know what the appropriate time would be. If she leaves then there is no reason, if you reconcile is there a point to sharing it?