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Your husband has untreated bipolar disorder. Everything you have described is a symptom of this incurable debilitating disease. I know. I am bipolar. Before I was diagnosed and properly medicated,I was a pretty crappy husband. Almost twenty years later, we are very happily married. It requires scrupulous adherence to a medication schedule, regular visits with a psychiatrist and the support of friends and loved ones.
Your husband is sick. Like cancer or heart disease, bipolar is not the patient’s fault. He desperately needs treatment.

You don't know this, you aren't a doctor. Only a psychiatrist can diagnose him as anything. This man has been physically, sexually and emotionally abusive towards KB. Nothing excuses that.

Notsure, did you do dangerous things like this? I have known of a couple of people with bipolar and they were taking trips, spending money. They were not physically hurting other people.

This man is dangerous and she needs safety.

That sounds sociopathic to me.

[This message edited by Cooley2here at 5:47 AM, Friday, January 13th]

NoMud,
The OP wrote that her husband was diagnosed with bipolar. Based on his actions as the OP related them, I 100% believe him to be bipolar and desperately in need of treatment. His behavior is unacceptable. OP is better off without him. But he is sick and he needs help.

Notsureaboutit, I don't doubt you are right. He was diagnosed years ago before we dated. After being married he was taking meds regularly and things were going smoothly for a little while. Then we separated and when we reconciled he was suddenly "undiagnosed" by another Dr. Apparently that Dr said his opioid addiction was causing bipolar symptoms. His mom is a nurse and uses drs she works for that aren't trained in certain things to write rxs, etc and I believe she had one of them "undiagnose" Him honestly.

I think there's definitely more going on besides bipolar though. Reading about narcissism was very eye opening. Some of his behaviors also pulled up sociopaths. I'm no dr. So I can't diagnose him but it's safe to say there's definitely something going on there. Regardless he has gotten very abusive and I couldnt chance being with him anymore. Not just because of the harm he's caused me but also the harm he has caused my children. Thank you for the support and taking the time to respond.

NoMud and Cooley, thank you both for your continued support as well. I appreciate every single one of you guys.

This man is dangerous and she needs safety.

No matter what clinical Rx he receives, the above matters most. This isn't some manic moment; he's been abusive for years. It just turned out to be so slow that Kb wound up being the frog boiling in water. Now that she views it from a different perspective, the alarm bells are finally going off.

His family isn't doing him any favors. But soon they will have him, and his baggage, full-time.

JB thank you. The "frog boiling in water" analogy is perfect. I used to excuse much of his behavior bc "he's adopted and not knowing his birth parents is killing him,hes bipolar, his Dr has changed his meds again, he's an addict and can't help his behaviors, etc." I was always supportive even when he put me in danger. Tried to "help" him.

One incident while dating, an ex called him. Said he'd been calling her. I demanded to see the phone records. We were at his parents and only his mom was there. He grabbed a shotgun and went outside saying he was going to shoot himself. I yanked the gun away from him. Then he got pity from both me and his mom and didn't have to be held accountable for his actions of calling his ex. See how that worked in his favor?

That's what he does to avoid being held accountable for his wrongs. The night before Christmas eve, me noticing something was off with him, he flipped out and threw a drink on me, knocked holes in the wall, broke our bathroom door, broke a mirror. And I completely stopped questioning what was "off" with him. In his eyes he won bc I stopped questioning him.

The night before new years, same deal. He got caught, broke my phone (destroy evidence but I have backups) Physically attacked me. And suddenly what was on his phone isn't the main focus anymore.

His motto "cause a scene, scare them to death if they question me and then they won't question me anymore. "

13 years of dating, a few more as good friends before dating, 11 years of marriage. I now realize many people have the same "issues" he's blamed his behavior on, and still don't get violent. Don't cheat. Don't steal. Etc. I used to excuse stuff he did to my mom and she'd say "are you sure this isn't just him?" I guess I didn't want to believe that.

He has always used his "issues" as excuses for the violent behaviors and other things. His parents have as well so this is a lifelong pattern he's accustom too. He used to at least pretend to be sorry when he got violent in the early years. But the last hf of our relationship he has downplayed it and made it my fault much of the time.

Now I definitely see him for what he is. And I'm so thankful to be away from it. Thank you for the support.

His motto "cause a scene, scare them to death if they question me and then they won't question me anymore."

I'm sure there's some level of untreated mental illness/personality disorder happening here too, but seriously? He's basically just a grown-ass toddler. He didn't get disciplined when he was three and it shows.

You are exactly right tho Kb - WHY he is how he is really doesn't matter. The only thing that matters right now is how his behaviors affect you and your kiddos.

Now I definitely see him for what he is. And I'm so thankful to be away from it.

Perfect proof of the 'when you know better, you do better' idea. And I'm so glad you're extricating you and your kids from this too!

Thanks Ellie. It's definitely like a tantrum of a 3 year old, only he's 6'2 and 220 lbs so it's both scary and repulsive. Being away has helped me see it for what it is.

Updqte/check in: I spoke with my "bulldog" lawyer yesterday and i already like her. Much better than the young guy I spoke with last week. She emailed divorce papers which i filled out and got back to her last night. I was oy able to tell her a small amount of the situation and she immediately said "we need to request supervised visitation for the time being". I have my first hearing for the order of protection Tuesday. She can't be there but is sending another lawyer in her place. So far so good. I feel like she's fighting for me and my kids already. Her retainer is only $500 more than the young guy quoted and he was self admittingly not a "fighting/bulldog" lawyer. Just wanted my money to beg WHs lawyer to agree to my terms i guess. A good lawyer matters. I will keep you updated on how this whole process goes. I know it's going to be a fight but at least I have someone on my side fighting with me now. Thanks for all the support.

I have finally just now read this thread. My heart breaks for you.

My ex husband had some of these characteristics… Gaslighting, turning things on to me rather than taking responsibility, etc. But they were NOTHING like what you are describing.

I have three adopted sons. I do believe that being adopted can be tough. All of my sons also have issues due to fetal alcohol syndrome and being addicted at birth. My husband and I were frantic to have a family. We were older. All of these things can play into "not a perfect experience". I know that through the years I have tended to… Not make excuses for their behaviors as much as keep their issues in mind when dealing with their behaviors. But there is a huge difference between a reason that something happened, and thinking that those reasons EXCUSE the behavior.

I say all that to say this… NOTHING that anyone has ever experienced in their life EXCUSES his behavior toward you and your children. I totally believe that people have mental/psychological disorders, and agree that they need help.

But that is not the issue here. We can all hope that this insane man can get the help that he needs. He’s a human being, and I have no problem hoping that he gets his life straightened out.

BUT HE DOESN’T GET TO DO IT WITH YOU!

THAT is the issue here. That ship has sailed. You are not abandoning someone in need. You are protecting yourself and your family from certain stress and misery, probable future issues themselves, and even possible danger.

So, in my humble opinion, the concern for him and the concern for you and the kids are not mutually exclusive. AS LONG AS YOU DIVORCE HIM (figuratively and literally).

I’m so very sorry for all that you are going through. I know how hard living in strife can be. All of us here know that. Probably most of us do not know it to the extent that you do. And you have five kids that you are protecting, and trying to support on your own… I’m sure it is just totally devastating.

I admire your strength so very much. Please do not think that in the past you have been weak. You are a person that finds it hard to believe what is happening. I’m guessing that not only did he make every effort to gaslight you and to turn it around on you and to make you think/believe that maybe he did really think it was a box in the closet. Because it’s easier to believe that, than to have the awareness of the hell that you are in.

But now you are putting your strength towards freedom for you and your kids. They are lucky to have you for a Mom.

Please continue to post here. We are all pulling for you and sending good thoughts/prayers.

[This message edited by WhatsRight at 3:22 PM, Saturday, January 14th]

How are you doing today KB

Hi Nomud, doing pretty good. Hope you are too! I worked overtime today at work. I apologize for not checking in. Thank you for checking on me. Things have been quiet. I know WH was served with Order of Protection but haven't heard from him or his parents anymore, so that's good. I've had some anxiety lately, but overall doing good. The anxiety is nothing like the anxiety I had when he was here though. Just anxious for what's to come and still sort of in shock from everything I guess.

Kids have been mostly good also. They've been a little emotional at times but we are starting to get into our own routine and to a "new normal". Overall they seem less anxious and stressed too. They went to church with their nana today and had a good day. Cleaned their rooms when the got home without being asked! Also good.

My first court date is Tuesday. I will check in tomorrow and update after the court date as well. Thank you for being a friend. I appreciate you and everyone else on this site. I have some unread inboxes from some of you that I haven't gotten to yet but plan to do that tomorrow also. Thanks so much.

I'm glad to hear you're doing okay KB. I think the anxiety is to be expected considering that your life is kind of up in the air right now. I'm so glad to hear that your kids are doing okay, considering everything. I hope court goes your way, I'm sending positive vibes your way!

Sorry for the long PM, but glad to hear you are doing good and that things seem to be moving in the right direction for you. Strength to you and your babies in this difficult time.

WhatsRight, I just saw your message somehow. I apologize. Thank you so much for the support. I appreciate it so much.

Nomud, thank you as always for your support. And Bor, I still haven't read your pm but am heading to do so now.
Thank you for your continued support as well.

The past few days I had severe anxiety and couldn't think straight. But now I can breath a little again.

Update: Today was the first court date and hearing for order of protection and visitation with the children. When I got there he and both parents were there. 1 parent sitting on either side of him. I was alone, as my mom was watching my children and close friends are out of state. The officer walked me to find my lawyer that was representing me today. She was awesome, and was sent there on behalf of my lawyer bc my lawyer had a trial she had to be at. At first they were saying we would have a hearing, where both me and WH get put on the stand and asked questions. I wasn't fond of that idea as I've always hated public speaking, but I was mentally preparing for it. Then his lawyer came to mine and asked to go talk privately to try to come to an agreement of some sort.

Summary, The order of protection stands. He has supervised visits on Saturdays and Sundays at the children's discretion, and on Sundays only between morning and night church since they are super involved in their church and love it. He was trying to fight me and get overnights, and I stood firm. I also made sure the disclaimer "at the children's discretion" was added. I had asked the kids the day before how they felt about visiting him. They told me they were nervous, not sure if they were ready, and definitely no overnights. I promised them I'd fight for them and that's what I did today. He and his parents weren't happy and kept trying to push back. I overheard his dad saying "this is what she does. She's awful". WH was sobbing. The same guy that left them alone for over 3 hours " to go do man things" with the neighbors the last day he was here. It was a long day but overall worth it.

My lawyer told me that when they went to discuss terms it was mainly his parents doing the talking. That WH wasn't saying much. That's how they've always been. He's almost 40 years old and they treat him like a child. WHs attorney came and said hello to me, and told me that when I called for a consultation with him (he was the first attorney I called), WH had already retained him and he apologized for not returning my call. He was very polite and friendly to me. My attorney told me that she doesn't believe his attorney is going to represent him for the divorce. She said to "keep that between us". I'm assuming the in-laws drove him nuts and he realized there's quite a bit of evidence against my husband. Our next court date is in march to review how the terms decided today have worked out. My Attorney is also working on the divorce. I will keep updating. Thanks for all the continued support.

Sounds like today's court appearance has helped you to see better the situation for what it is. I'm so glad to hear that you fought for your kids with that agreement. It's also pretty sad that a 40 year old man cannot be bothered to act like a grownup with his parents. Kind of makes you wonder, chicken and the egg kind of thing, is it their helicopter parenting through the years that has stunted his growth or is it his, to them, obvious lack of ability to grow up that has them constantly helicoptering for him? Or stated another way, has he always been this awful at life so they've tried to cover for him and don't know any different or has he always been kind of a tremendous fuckup knowing that no matter what he does, his parents will always bail his ass out? Kind of interesting to think about because they do lead to similar but still distinguishable outcomes.

Or maybe you don't think about it, since coming soon he won't be your manbaby to worry about.

KB it sounds like you got the best possible outcome with court. I'm so glad to hear that. Keep updating us! You are so strong, look how far you've come. The way you fought for your kids is amazing.

Bor, definitely something to consider. I'm not sure which came first. They are very unhealthy people. That's what I do know. When dating WH, FIL made a pass at me one day. Up until right around this point I was close to them. Considered them family. Right before this happened I had found WHs birth parents. Mil had made it clear (privately to me) she wasn't happy about it. She would act overjoyed for WH in front of him, but privately told me "he wasn't ready for this." "I hope he doesn't leave me". Things like that. I have always thought they falsified records for years PURPOSELY so WH WOULDN'T find them actually. His birth certificate stated he was born in one hospital, but he was actually born in another in the area. When I found his birth mom, I told him everything matches BUT the hospital. I messaged the birth mom anyway and we eventually discovered it was in fact his birth mother.

Anyway, when FIL made a pass at me, i had went up to their house bc at this time WH was diagnosed Bipolar and the dr was changing up his meds. He was acting nuts. I had been told it was bc of the bipolar, and was trying to be supportive and help him work through it. I trusted his parents at this time and would go to them for help. I went to their home this day, we lived right down the road in another home the family owned. I was talking to FIL. He was drinking screwdrivers. Made me one. Mil was working. WH (fiance at the time) was acting nuts and had left the home we shared during an argument. All the sudden the conversation changed. Fil started telling me MIL was unable to have sex after hysterectomy bc it hurt, so she had told him to get his needs met elsewhere if necessary. I was extremely uncomfortable, kept trying to change the subject. He kept talking about what good shape I was in. How Mil used to be also. He kept talking about their sex life and then says "well I know something you can do for me" and winked at me. Gross! I got up and told him I was leaving. he then got angry and started saying things about my family. That my mom had whored around with a woman he knew back in the 80s.(1000% not true). That one of my sisters wasn't my dad's, that she's part Hispanic bc my mom cheated on my dad with a Hispanic, that's why this sister has a more olive complexion than me and my other sister. ALL of which is not true. He had heard this from a nosey neighbor of his that my dad had rented from when he and my mom divorced, and obviously ran his mouth full of lies to. But fil had never acted like he even knew my family up until this point. Started attacking me and my family bc I turned down his inappropriate pass and called him out on it. (Sounds pretty familiar now). Ding Ding Ding

Long story short, I left immediately after we exchanged some words and immediately went to the house we rented from them and started packing my things. WH was gone and called me. I told him what happened. That I couldn't live there anymore. I understood if he wanted to stay but I was out of there. Suprisingly, he took my side and said he was coming with me. Said his ex had made a similar claim of his dad hitting on her years ago. He came back and we decided to go see his birth dad in Alabama for a few days and cool off. I was embarrassed. Shocked. Heartbroken. I felt bad for both WH and his mom. I remember WH being super upset also and calling his mom, asking if what his dad had told me about their marriage was true. She said "of course not, you know how girls lie". So now double shock. Double heartbreak. she was mad at ME, not her husband. Said i was lying. We went to Alabama. I kept thinking " FIL was drunk. he's going to wake up tomorrow feeling horrible and apologize ". That day never came. WH and I moved to a different house. wh didnt speak to his dad for months. Finally " had a talk" with him. I didnt want him to never speak to his parents again or have a bad relationship with them over me. So i sort of "forgave and forgot", but made sure to never be alone with Fil again.

Looking back over the last 13 years there's been SO many toxic things. His parents are obviously toxic. They have an unhealthy " who cares about the truth. Protect each other at all costs" motto. I'd definitely say some of WHs issues are bc of this. He attacks when caught doing something wrong, very similar to how his dad acted that day. I think his mom has always covered for them both. But at this point, despite how toxic his parents are, he's an adult and had a choice to be different.

I am definitely at the point I see the situation for what it is and this is stuff I've been holding in for so many years. Trying to "keep the peace" and make my marriage work. Its just pouring out of me now. Thanks or listening.

Nomud, thank you so much! You have been so kind and uplifting. You don't know how much I appreciate you.

KB, that is awful about your fil and I am very sorry you had to deal with that, and all of their toxicity. You're welcome, and you deserve support, don't ever let anyone tell you that you don't!

Just eww. Your stbxwh and his family sound just gross. Gross and insanely dysfunctional. I'm so glad you're on your way away from all that.

You think you're feeling good now? Just wait until you get that divorce decree! Your life is gonna be so awesome! I'm just hugging myself over here for you and giving you virtual high fives. You're fucking amazing.

I'm so glad court went well for you today too. I bet that allayed a lot of your fears.