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Finally grey rock

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Marz posted 5/8/2021 23:08 PM

No discussion. Get up and walk away.

She canít force you into a discussion if you arenít there to have one

guvensiz posted 5/8/2021 23:09 PM

Didn't you make it clear that you don't want to talk to her? How can she persistently ask questions like that over and over?
Don't ever talk to her if possible. If she has something to say, she should write an e-mail. But if you have to talk because you are in the same house, cut it short, don't get into any argument about the essence of the matter, don't even argue your righteousness. Just say you don't want to hear any of her words. You don't need to say what you know. It is enough for you to know that her A continues, there is nothing to argue about this.

DanielJK posted 5/9/2021 08:27 AM

One of the issues I'm having is that the divorce is not final yet.

I'm trying to play nice right now. There are a couple of issues she can push for in the divorce, but hasn't...like when I was going to keep the house I pushed for estimates of work for fixes that need completing so I could deduct it from the equity I owed her...now she is keeping the house and she has not pushed that ...(yet). If she does, I would just ask for a second appraisal...real estate is that hot, just a month from the first appraisal and I would bet the number would go up.

I feel like I'm in a difficult position of ignore her... but don't piss her off too much. Trying to keep up a happy go lucky attitude...not sure it's worth it...just have to make it another 17 days.

Just as an aside...when we started the divorce process I told her...our retirement accounts are about equal, just tell your attorney (and i will do the same) to ignore the retirement accounts (including pensions)...saves time and legal expenses...she said this (insert nasally, whiney voice here):
"That's not fair!"

Turns out she owes me money from her retirement. She works for the government and has a good pension. Karma is a bitch.

I think below is my best bet. Hard for me to keep my mouth shut, but I'm just going to smile and say it's too little too late. Not "arguing my righteousness" is the hardest part for me...what she did is so wrong and she still balmes me...even after a year of her cheating...and arguing my righteousness is usually when I end up in a rabbit hole.

don't get into any argument about the essence of the matter, don't even argue your righteousness. Just say you don't want to hear any of her words. You don't need to say what you know. It is enough for you to know that her A continues, there is nothing to argue about this.

She's been seeing this guy for a year...and somehow it's still my fault that she had to go have sex with him on 4/16/2021. ...after starting an EA one year ago...it's still my fault.

The wayward mind is fascinating.

leafields posted 5/9/2021 08:48 AM

And you have that extra layer of narc on top. She's projecting her dysfunction on to you, or it's more gaslighting. She's still getting supply from you, so keep grey rocking.

DON'T
Defend
Engage
Explain
Personalize

You're getting close to being out, so keep the next goal in sight.

ETA: Remember, she isn't listening to you and she doesn't care.

[This message edited by leafields at 8:59 AM, May 9th (Sunday)]

Dude67 posted 5/9/2021 10:22 AM

What specifically is your fault? What are you being blamed for then vs now, if the two are different?

DanielJK posted 5/9/2021 11:27 AM

Thank you Lea, I will try.

Dude...I have no idea what I'm blamed for at the moment. In the beginning it was everything...I didn't do enough, I wasn't affectionate enough, I didn't support her enough with the kids, it "didn't feel like we were a team" I didn't do, I didn't say, I wasn't enough...

Stay with me, these are hard times. I don't understand why I feel worse now than I did on dday.

I'm avoiding her at the moment. I'm literally sitting in the middle of a forest with my dog just sitting here and staring (he's such a good dog, no leash and he just stays by my side no matter what I do, I love him). We'll end up having a good long walk.

She mentioned buying a car for my 16 year old. What fucking money are we going to use to buy a car? We just spent 20k on divorce attorneys, I just had to put a giant down payment on a house to avoid PMI, I'll have to take money from my IRA to pay all the closing costs, I have to furnish half a house...I don't even have a bed to sleep in when I move yet (I have a fucking cot)...and she's talking about a car for my daughter. I won't know what my cash flow looks like until I spend a few months in the new house paying for things on my own. I don't think it's too much to ask to wait a couple of months so I can see what my cash flow is like, is it? Cash flow on paper looks good, but who the fuck knows.

I'll probably go price a bed for me, maybe bedroom sets for the girls later today...she's going to have to let me take one from the house or she'll have to buy one bedroom set for one of my daughters. I might have to piece something together from yard sales (like my mother did for us when I was young, God rest her soul, happy mother's day mom).

This really sucks. My mind is not right. It's been a fucking year and my mind is still not right. I pulled my phone out of my pocket twice today to see what time it was...I put the phone back in my pocket and would not be able to tell you the time...I'm losing it.

99problems posted 5/9/2021 12:40 PM

Hey DJK,

Just wanted to say that I'm rooting for ya. You can make it through this. If I can, then anyone can.

It really, really, sucks sometimes though.
And when it does you just focus on surviving. Like just that and nothing else.
Just staunch the bleeding and hang on.

And days pass, and things get better. And then they get worse, and then better, and worse again...

But the good days start to outnumber the bad days. And maybe you go 2 weeks without any bad days at all. Maybe a month. And you realize that healing happened, and you didn't even know it.

To change the subject a tiny bit, here's my response to being accused of being bitter by my ex or her associates:

"I'm not bitter at all! I just hate that bitch."
:)

Marz posted 5/9/2021 13:37 PM

She mentioned buying a car for my 16 year old.

At 16 under the circumstances she doesnít need a car. Your response. Ignore. Explain it directly to your daughter.

Whether you know or realize it yet. You have total control over your life. Use it wisely..

The first thing you should think of when dealing with the x is. Does it even require a response? Most often youíll find itís a no.

Ignoring is good. She ignored you, your marriage and family.

Return that and do yourself a big favor.

[This message edited by Marz at 1:39 PM, May 9th (Sunday)]

BetrayedGamer posted 5/9/2021 15:49 PM

Mine tried to pull the "retirement accounts" fairness argument. I have more in cash, she has a pension. I warned her that a pension is calculated differently, it's not by current value. I also had to show her in the divorce paperwork the income disparity payments she'd have to make. We agreed to waive that AND the retirement account bullshit.

Stay strong, you are almost there. Don't stress over the finances too much, buy things in stages don't try to replace everything all at once. Trust me it will start to get a little fun, redoing the house in your own image, so to speak.

Buster123 posted 5/9/2021 20:31 PM

Just ignore her, tell her you're no longer interested, then turn around and watch a movie or walk the dog.

HalfTime2017 posted 5/10/2021 11:49 AM

DJK -

A few thoughts here on your home stretch to dumping that exWW of yours for good.

Stop checking her phone and reading her text. First of all, you are in a Divorce proceeding, its not a good idea to be looking at her correspondence at this point since you are doing to D. You would hate to have her catch you, and it blow up in your face when she tells her attorney. I would suggest you stay clear of her phone, email and social media. There is no point now.

Additionally, if you have not turned off the hopium pipe, now would be a good time to put that down for good. There is nothing left for you in this marriage. She is not going to miraculously say anything that will make things better or change. She literally just 5 days ago said it would be nice to be spooning her AP. That is where she is at with her love life. She wants the AP, not DJK, no matter what she tells you. YOu have the insight of that by reading her text, but let that be the last time she hurts you.

Also, when you go snooping, it just hurts you more. For some, it might help their resolve to divorce, but not for everyone. YOu are about to be done, don't let her sidetrack you. If she owes you more from her pension, than ask for it. It will help you down the road. Don't just walk away from what you're entitled to by law. If she has a retirement pension, you're going to need a QDRO, as your attorney about this.

Lastly, go read No More Mr. Nice Guy. It'll probably help you. Don't fall for her shit anymore. There is no need to talk. Talking = more hurt for you. You already know shes shacking up with the AP, while lying to your face. What's the value of talking to someone who just lies to your face. Might as well not talk, its better than being lied to.

Stay strong. a little more than 2 weeks to go.

BetrayedGamer posted 5/10/2021 12:38 PM

Also, when you go snooping, it just hurts you more. For some, it might help their resolve to divorce, but not for everyone.

Wow that hits home. I've been doing a lot in the last few months, and that is exactly how it's affected me...hurts, increases resolve.

At a certain point you have enough resolve and are sick of the hurt...once you find that point the snooping does no more good.

guvensiz posted 5/12/2021 20:29 PM

Daniel,

I hope everything is alright.

DanielJK posted 5/13/2021 17:19 PM

Everything is OK...just OK...I guess, I donít know.

Not sure how to tell you guys this. I've been honest here...my story is real...I'm not putting you on...I'm not pulling your leg...I know I have not followed some sound advice, you're not wrong...I'm doing my best, I hope you won't leave my side.

STBXWW wanted to talk to me about "recreating our marriage." She asked if I wanted to try conciliation and a post nup agreement.

That's what she wanted to talk about.

Essentially the divorce decree would be written and agreed to, no court battles, equitable division of assets that are basically already agreed to, I would buy the new house, current house will be moved to her name only (both closings already scheduled), all property legally divided (like the cars, utilities in one name only, etc)...and we would stay married? Work on our marriage? I have no idea what that looks like in practice, but I might find out.

I don't know what to do. I still love her...why? I don't know. I'm still smoking hopium.

I'm still buying the new house, that's not stopping. Not sure I can back out at this point anyway. Closing in 2 weeks.

Conciliation would include counseling. She admits that all contact with AP would have to stop and has given assurances that the instruction to AP was provided to stop contacting her (I did not witness it and I was not shown the communication). She's searching for a counselor for us. The last MC was such a disaster, I'm terrified.

It's a weird situation and I'm sure many of you think I'm crazy.

I don't know if I can do it, I feel like she's doing that thing again where she mopes around because I just forced her to break up with her boyfriend...again (I think this is at least the 5th time).

We've been intimate, HB(?).

I'm going to try it. The divorce agreement will essentially be final...I now have a place to go immediately if things go bad.

I get excited when she tells me she wants to work things out...then reality sets in. I don't think I can do it, then I think maybe it can work, then I think I can't do it...then...

I've done this dance before..., many times.

I feel like I'm going to do the dance one more time and see what happens. The divorce will be done...the living arrangements will be done...if it doesn't work I can just step away immediately and with very little effort.

In 2 weeks I can just step away regardless of what happens...the new house will be mine.

Not sure I'm ready to move to the R forum, but maybe they have some advice for me. Has there ever been someone on the D and R forum at the same time?

I have no idea what I'm doing. I'm one year from dday...but probably more importantly I'm just weeks from her last encounter with AP. 8 to 10 months ago I would have welcomed this opportunity with open arms...now? Meh.

I'm open to your feedback, let me have it.

This0is0Fine posted 5/13/2021 17:31 PM

What's going to be different this time?

This is the question you need to answer to yourself. Not to me or this board. Why do you think this dance could have a different outcome this time? What has changed in her behavior? In your attitude? How can you be (relatively) sure your needs will be met and she will lead the repair efforts?

How about this.

You do complete the D, like you said.

If you want, you can choose to date your ex-wife. No rules against that. I think, for your sake though, you shouldn't.

You also need to stop fucking her even if you date her. Take it slow. See if you like her as a person. You might still love her, but do you still like her? Your little head is confusing your big one.

gmc94 posted 5/13/2021 17:35 PM

Personally (and that's me and my life, not yours), I would DIVORCE. Don't backtrack on anything legal. You've put in the time and the $ and you might as well be D. Even if all the documents are signed, if you stop the D, who knows what happens? Who knows how legally sound those documents will be in a month, or 6, or 12, if R fails? That is a ton of risk to you for someone who is a known liar and cheater, and whose most recent PA was what, 4-5 weeks ago?

If you want to date AFTER the D is final, then that is a different issue.

But I would NOT stop the D proceedings, and I would not allow her continued mindfuckery (technical term) to - AGAIN - stop you in your tracks.

There is ONE person in your M that needs to do some SERIOUS HEAVY LIFTING... and it ain't you.

Divorce her. And IF she manages to make the HUGE changes she needs to make, then you can date and work on R. You would not be the 1st couple to R after D. Years ago I worked for a man who lived near me with his "wife". A few months after I started I learned that they'd divorced a few years prior, but had reconciled after D (and that his "wife" was not legally his wife). I always suspected someone cheated, but never knew who. They are still together today - and still not remarried. It happens.

fareast posted 5/13/2021 17:54 PM

I agree with everything gmc94 shared. Itís your life. You do what feels right to you. But I would at least complete the D process and protect yourself legally. You have been through enough. There have been others who have gone through the D process but ended up staying together, you might check the posts from hatefulnow.

[This message edited by fareast at 7:38 PM, May 13th (Thursday)]

asc1226 posted 5/13/2021 18:16 PM

Everything else aside, why are you bothering with MC? Do I need to say it? The M didnít cheat on you. She needs IC with someone who will hold her feet to the fire. Do you think she has it in her to do the work? Even then will you ever trust her again? At this point I think weíre talking powerball odds.

Has she said why she wants to try again? Are those reasons about the coming disruptions in her life and how hard things will be for her?

Has she acknowledged even some of the damage sheís done? The agony she has put you through for a year? Has she indicated that she has any idea how hard this is going to be? Not said ďI know this will be hardĒ but shown some indication that she is about tackle Everest wearing sandals and a summer dress?

And forget what sheís saying, what is she doing? Going NC without showing you the message? You know the drill. Words mean nothing.

Slanted posted 5/13/2021 18:29 PM

Got to agree with the others. Divorcing takes away the pick-me dance, and reveals two people and who they are on their own. It puts you in charge, not weighing options and considering. It means she has to come to you and win you back if she's going to. Starting from zero, not from 50-50. Or as in my case, it may quickly reveal that you were completely correct to walk away and take away any possibility of regrets. I think the clarity that is likely to come from that is worth a whole lot, and you've done nearly everything already to put yourself there.

DanielJK posted 5/13/2021 19:50 PM

I guess I was more concerned about living arrangements than the divorce. I'd rather have a place to stay and not be divorced, as opposed to divorced and no place to stay. The house settles that, I can just move out.

TOIF- not much different so far...and yes I have to admit the little guy is doing too much thinking. I do still like her, it's nice when we are together. I feel good when I'm with her. What is she doing different this time?...it remains to be seen and I don't know yet if my needs will be met. A year of history should tell me probably not.

GMC94 I see your points on the legal issues. I will ask my attorney about how the agreements work. Neither of us want to go through the motions again...we're in agreement there, she said she does not want to have to do the document production again, etc. and neither do I. I'll ask about how that works. I agree that I don't want to be in a bad position a month from now.

Heavy lifting? She's making the arrangements...researching a MC...not much more than that.


Asc1226 - we've been to 2 MCs...I know, it's not a good idea...I believe it's part of the conciliation process. I'm not hopeful, but at least I know now what to look for. I'm not going to stand for any esther perel kind of nonsense.

I will ask why she wants to do this and what is different this time. I deserve answers to those questions. Problem is I have always been a rugsweeper...I'll do better this time.

And she has not necessarily acknowledged the damage she has done or the work that still needs to be done. My thought was to bring that up during MC.

I don't disagree with you on the powerball odds. I just feel like I don't have much to lose at this point...if it doesn't work I just walk out. The living arrangements were my biggest worry until now. I was desperate for a place to stay, now I have it.

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