SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Hi, first post, but SI has been my refuge in many respects these past 8 months.I have learned so much, and my journey from DDay to this point has been foretold almost, in many of the posts that I have read.
I'm the WH, 51, married 24 years to my childhood sweetheart of the same age, 3 adult kids neither of whom live with us, nice home, nice life, everthing anyone could possibly ask for. I had an EA initially over a period of 5 years, and this turned into a full PA latterly for a period of 3 years.AP is 11 years younger, unmarried with no family.Dday was 8 months ago after my BS discovered messages on my cell phone.To say I have destroyed everything would be putting it mildly. Everything still feels very hopeless for me.I am on medication, unable to sleep, and no longer feel any joy in life.My quandry is that i am in love with my AP, and she feels the same way. But i have remained in the family home, for the sake of my BS, because i cannot bare to see the pain she is going through,and leaving her while she is like this is really hard for me to do. We have separated a number of times over the last 8 months,but only for a couple of weeks, and i find myself being pulled back, out of a sense of duty and just anxiety that she isn't coping on her own. My BS was a SAHM and has only ever worked part time.I have been the main breadwinner throughout the marriage. This more than anything bothers me, as although i'd be happy to leave her the home (mortgage free)and half my earnings, it still wouldn't give her the life she has become accustomed to. I still love her and have a strong sense of duty to her as the mother of my children. My BS wants reconcilliation and has tried everything to help me, but my feelings aren't what they were. I am unable to show any intimacy to her, something she craves, but i cannot bring myself to touch her. She's more like my best friend these days.I just no longer have the desire. I am constantly thinking about my AP and long to be with her again. I understand that the offer of a second chance is a gift, but as much as I try to fight my feelings, i just cannot. I am so conflicted. Do I try and continue to live like this forever, to please others, or do I try to make myself happy, as selfish as that may sound and feel.I have nobody I can speak to about what I'm going through, but if I get one reply then at least I know it's from someone who understands and speaks from the heart.

I would read about romantic infidelity by Dr Frank Pittman. When you can see the predictable pattern of your behavior you can get under it. This is not some special love story, it’s actually predictable human behavior.

I believe you have an addiction. I would also advise therapy. If you are willing to go completely no contact with the AP, and go to therapy and really try and work this out then I would say stay and give it a shot with your wife.

But honestly, by reading what you wrote here I am not sure that you will be capable of no contact. You have told yourself a lot to justify your affair, and how true any of these narratives are we can’t possibly know. So if you are going to continue to cheat why stay and destroy her any further?

I will say when I was in your shoes I did feel that struggle initially. But I spent some time sitting to appreciate my husband, and I remembered why I fell in love with him to begin with. I also recognized someone who will cheat with you is assuredly flawed themselves in deep ways. It took time to understand the dependency my brain had to the copious amounts of dopamine after having been in a dark state for too long.

Your wife does not deserve to have someone there who just feels sorry for her. Especially someone who has been betraying her for five years running.

Be in 100 percent or leave this poor woman alone. Therapy. Transparency. No contact. Full effort.

The thing that is true about love is it’s kept alive by the effort you put into it. The fact you just spent five years giving that effort to someone else and then act as if it’s your wife’s fault you don’t love her anymore is something that you must examine. Our butterflies come from the giving, not as much the receiving. It’s really hard to tell what a fantastic marriage you could have had if you’d chosen not to deprive it of its fidelity. That’s not on your wife, sir.

D day 8 months ago.

When is the last time you had any sort of contact with the other women?

Have you maintained some line of communication with her?

If you have you have not even tried reconciliation, in my opinion. Your efforts will have all been window-dressing.

[This message edited by straightup at 4:53 AM, Sunday, February 11th]

No stop sign.

You have to choose one or the other. Right now you are straddling the fence. Hence you're confusing / conflicting feelings. You're doing that to yourself.

If you choose to stay married, you owe it to your wife and your self to go all in. And that means zero contact with AP. I mean, nada. This is the harder choice imo because you are going to go through withdrawal and you will have tons of work to do to grieve that loss, figure out who you are and why you cheated, and then repair your marriage. It is NOT for the faint of heart. And you can't even begin that journey before you end the affair in every possible way.

If you choose your AP, then do so quickly. Your wife will suffer, no doubt. But she suffers now and will suffer more with you sitting up there on that fence. You see her pain and feel bad. Yet you continue to hurt her with your actions. Unless your wife has some mental or physical issue that prevents her from an independent life, she will heal, move on and probably live a full, perhaps even happier life. You are replaceable. She will learn that once the bleeding stops.

So choose. And then move 100% toward that choice with as much kindness and love as you can.

You have Best of Both Worlds syndrome. And you are not Hannah Montana. So you need to smack yourself back into reality.

Be 100% all in with your BS - which means cutting AP out of every aspect of your life like yesterday - and keeping it that way for the remainder of your days.

OR

Divorce your BS immediately and be 100% honest about her about why (that you chose AP - and in no way do you blame your BS for that choice).

What you are doing is buttering your bread on both sides while being indescribably cruel to all involved.

Your situation as you describe it really isn't that special - it the same old story over and over and over if you stick around here long enough you'll realize that. I hope you do. R or D there is a lot of wisdom around here that can help you if you are honest with yourself and open to it.

But you need to choose and own that choice once and for all.

Another BS here, because you took the STOP sign off. If you want a STOP sign attached to your thread, open a 'Mod, Please' thread.

Do I try and continue to live like this forever, to please others, or do I try to make myself happy, as selfish as that may sound and feel.I have nobody I can speak to about what I'm going through, but if I get one reply then at least I know it's from someone who understands and speaks from the heart.

Gently, I think you're confusing yourself.

I urge you to think about the benefits you're getting now. Once you've got them listed, you can evaluate them and decide which ones you really want and which ones you don't. Then you're likely to know what actions to take. Personally, I think you like to think of yourself as being loved by 2 women and as being a martyr, and if I'm right about that, you've made a bad bargain, IMO. But I can be wrong, and you know the benefits you're getting much better than I do.

I agree with hikingout and others - Therapy. Transparency. No contact. Full effort. One goal of therapy should be 'to change from 'people pleaser' to 'authentic human being'.

Give up trying to control the outcome. Start getting authentic - then you'll know what to do.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 8:27 PM, Sunday, February 11th]

Wow. Right now, you are behaving reprehensibly. You are doing no one any favors. It’s delusional thinking to suggest otherwise. Get help. Your wife and adult kids deserve so much more than you’ve apparently ever offered. If you were truly in love with your AP you’d be with her. And if your reason for staying truly was out of love and concern for your wife you wouldn’t continue to betray her. At least own your shit even if you’re not yet brave enough to conquer it.

SI has been my refuge in many respects these past 8 months.I have learned so much, and my journey from DDay to this point has been foretold almost, in many of the posts that I have read.

I affirm you posting here and assume that, in doing so, you are looking for some serious straight talk concerning your affair. I am curious though. You say that youve learned so much here, may I ask, what is it that you've learned? Can you bullet point a few of the insights you've gained here to date? Imo, this would be helpful as to giving more directed & specific feedback.

My AP and I work for the same firm,and although we are located in separate branches, our paths cross on occasion: once per month. We have exchanged emails while at work, but less so as months pass. AP, although hurt that i have been unable to fulfill the promises I made to her about leaving, is respectful of the fact that I have chosen to try reconcilliation. As cliche as it sounds, I do love my wife , but I feel that I am no longer in love with her in the way she would want me to be. It's just so hard being here, but thinking of my AP and what that life could look like.
One thing I find intriguing, and something I read here often, is that someone who has had an affair with you, is more than likely to cheat on you. How true is that? I've known my AP for 11 years and that isn't who she is. I too have been faithful until now. Neither of us went into this lightly, we just couldnt fight it. It's neither infatuation nor limerance.We both want the same thing.

Then we certainly can’t help you. But stop dragging your wife through it. Feelings of being in love are created in a long term relationship, any long term relationship. Your love had died because you allowed it and because you took all your efforts and gave them to someone else.

I think I would rather be poor and eat beans every day than have a man who really isn’t there. That is the world worst form of loneliness.

I am sorry but I think you are a fool.

You just glossed right over the responses and questions that you've received.

You say that SI has been your refuge and you've learned so much, and then you post more drivel waxing poetic about the AP and denying that it's limerence or infatuation. (Psst. That's exactly what it is.)

Tell us what you've learned. Because I'm not seeing any lessons having sunk in for you.

I've known my AP for 11 years and that isn't who she is.

That's exactly who she is. She's no angel, and she's certainly not relationship material, at least not until she figures out why she settled for an unavailable man for several years.

[This message edited by SacredSoul33 at 11:59 PM, Monday, February 12th]

One thing I find intriguing, and something I read here often, is that someone who has had an affair with you, is more than likely to cheat on you. How true is that?

It's interesting to me that you're questioning how faithful she might remain to you in the future, having cheated with you. You're not thinking of anyone but yourself and how you should hedge your bets.

What do you want from this community? You’ve read enough here to know how this would come across. You aren’t asking questions, just kind of waxing poetic about your tragic situation.

To the question you asked, about cheaters cheating on cheaters: you say you work for a "firm"? I’m guessing you can work that one out for yourself.

If you aren’t going to even try to give your wife the respect and love she deserves, then stop torturing her and make it crystal clear. Do her a last kindness, get yourself out of her life and give her a favorable divorce settlement.

I have learned so much

Again, I ask you, what have you learned here?

One thing I find intriguing, and something I read here often, is that someone who has had an affair with you, is more than likely to cheat on you. How true is that? I've known my AP for 11 years and that isn't who she is.

I would put the chances at 100% that within say 5 years of a relationship, very likely much sooner than that, one of you will have cheated on your new relationship. You wanna know why? Because you are not starting a relationship off on a foundation of honesty, integrity, and trust...because let's face it, neither of you have any of those virtues, otherwise, you wouldn't be having an affair...so rather than your relationship being built on a concrete foundation, the foundation of your relationship would be like building a house on top of paper mache. Your relationship as it exists today is entirely based on lies and it is a total fantasy. You see this woman at work, you see her for a dinner date and a bang session, but you don't actually have a real relationship with this woman and neither does she with you because it's a total bullshit fantasy. Your wife and you have raised children to adulthood which is not easy, you likely made tough decisions, usually together about raising those children, finances, family vacations, losing loved ones, etc. etc. You had a real relationship with your wife and you choose to flush that all away to chase a piece of ass that you've been lusting after for 11 years. The first time that your new relationship with the AP gets put to the test in any of those ways, one of you is gonna crack, because that is both who you are, broken individuals who run from their problems and would rather bury themselves in another's genitals than face themselves in the mirror. I mean, the first real fight you have with the AP, don't be surprised if you find her in bed with another dude shortly thereafter or she catches you in bed with someone. It's because your relationship with her is a total house of cards and it will not take much for it to come completely crashing down.

Neither of us went into this lightly, we just couldnt fight it. It's neither infatuation nor limerance.We both want the same thing.

Did someone put a gun to your head and require you to fuck her? Get the hell out of here with that weaksauce "we just couldn't fight it"...that is such a child's excuse...and to be fair my kids know better than that. You and her have shit boundaries, which is again, the point I'm making about the near certainty that she would cheat on you or you on her at some point because you have such shit boundaries that you had an affair at work. Not only was it something that could cost you your career and source of income, but you also could've brought home all sorts of diseases from your AP and exposed your BW to them, because, despite your protestations, you don't know shit about this woman. I've told the story on here about how I hired a PI to find my wife's AP, because he lived in another state, and he spent years cultivating an image that my wife bought into, they were star-crossed lovers, etc. etc...until the PI gets back to me that this guy had a wife and kids at home. Suddenly, she didn't feel quite so special when she realized that the guy she had been "in-love" with was using her. APs are showing you a mirror of who you want them to be and we only see them for how they want us to see them. We do not actually see the real person, because it's all an act to extract the most ego kibbles and dopamine we can from our interactions with the other person.

By all means though, if you are convinced that you must pursue the AP, at least grow the hell up, file for divorce, and move out of your marital home, leaving your wife in peace and agency. No one wants to continue to be married to someone who doesn't value them or cherish them and at least at this moment, while your head is still decidedly lodged up your backside, you don't seem to have a care in the world about what you have done to your BW and your family with your betrayal. It's best to take the coward's way out and divorce her, it may be the only honorable thing you do as a man.

No stop sign.

My husband told his AP that he was teetotal, anti drugs, anti porn and our relationship was over.

In reality we were having regular sex, he was texting me how much he loves me, he was hiding his alcohol consumption and porn use.

He was a lie. He lied to himself and to her and to me. Text messages for example - can be written and then pondered over, then rewritten then sent.

His AP (online) is likely a scam artist. But apparently she was the best thing since sliced bread. A true soul mate. A wonderful woman who farted rainbows. In reality she was either a low quality women with self esteem issues who was prepared to be a dirty secret or she was a basement troll looking to make a quick buck. At the time I agree she was an appropriate soul mate for him. A Perfect match.

Give your wife the house and half your income (as you state below) and leave. Or get rid of the AP. Basically shit or get off the pot. I am sure she doesn’t want the life you are really giving her, a life that is a lie, the risk of STDs and HPV which increases cancer risk. The ptsd and trauma which is ongoing if you are still lying. She wants who she thought you were. But you aren’t him.

Your affair partner knows you are a cheater and that is good enough for her. She’s happy to settle for someone who isn’t truthful. You are prepared to settle for a woman who is happy to be kept in the shadows. Will either of you cheat? Are either of you lying now? We don’t know. But we know you both have some poor characteristics that many people would run a mile from.

You are choosing to control your wife’s truth and that really isn’t cool. Why do you think you should know the full story of your relationship yet your faithful wife only gets to know the bits you decide she deserves to know? Why do you deserve to make choices based on reality but she doesn’t deserve to do that?why do you deserve a second relationship and she doesn’t? She’s not a child, she deserves agency. If you are incapable of dropping your AP then Let your wife move on and hopefully find someone honest to share moments with. Treat her well in the divorce. You have wasted enough of her life and that is really unkind.

ABCDE89,
I disagree, we do know both he and his AP are liars. What we don’t know is what if anything they say has an element of truth.

WRT your ap cheating on you, why is that an issue? If you are in love with her and love her, isn't that enough? You have to take risks in life.

I do love my wife , but I feel that I am no longer in love with her in the way she would want me to be.

Gently, bro, if my W weren't IL with me, if she didn't desire me, if she were IL with someone else, I'd want her to tell me and leave. What really keeps you from knowing that - and acting upon it?

At the very least, you're hurting yourself and your family. I urge you to find a good therapist and come clean - first with yourself, then with your W and family. If you commit to coming clean and to living authentically, you'll be the prime beneficiary, and you are fully capable of coming clean and becoming authentic. It's the best way out of your pain.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 5:55 PM, Tuesday, February 13th]

"You just glossed right over the questions and responses you've received"
SacredSoul33, I am so sorry that I appear to have come across as being dismissive of anyone who has taken the time to reply. I am unsure of how to reply to individual responses as the 'reply to topic'function seems to be just at the head and foot of the thread.I'm not techy in any way, so if someone was kind enough to advise, then I will ensure I respond to everyone who has taken time out of their day to help me.My apologies if I have caused offence in the meantime.Thank you

If you want to have the quoted material in a box, you copy/paste the text, highlight it, and then hit the quotation box up by the emoji’s.

It is also entirely acceptable to just copy and paste, or just refer to people’s questions and comments in general.

No right or wrong ways to reply to questions.

I admire that you’ve come back after that slate of tough comments.