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Just Found Out :
Help! Wife's friend is having an affair with older guy she met at a party in my house.

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 Ragn3rK1n (original poster member #84340) posted at 3:34 AM on Tuesday, January 23rd, 2024

I have not yet shared my story and will do so when ready, but have a more immediate infidelity situation within our friend circle that could use some sage advice.

Short story - My (late 40s) wife's (mid 40s) female coworker and friend (call her N) is having an affair with someone known to all of us and the fallout could get ugly

Both N and her hubby (H) are in their late 30s and they have two young kids. I'd say our families are close friends. N is attractive and charismatic. She can effortlessly charm an entire room with her personality. N looks up to my wife as a mentor and an older sister. Per my wife, N is known as a rising star at their company, destined for great things. Their older DD and my younger DD are BFFs, have the same dance teacher, etc. H works in the same field as me we even play in the same Fantasy Football league together.

The alleged OM (call him Doc) is a prominent, wealthy surgeon in his mid 50s who I got to know via a charity that I once volunteered for. Doc is on the board of that organization. I admire and am grateful to Doc because he went out of his way to help my younger daughter get life saving medical care. DD was born prematurely at 28 weeks and had a brain hemorrhage within a day at the NICU. There was a risky but potentially lifesaving treatment available and I had to make a choice. Doc pulled some strings and helped me get invaluable second opinion from a top expert at Johns Hopkins. I said ok and the treatment worked! Doc is also known as an all around nice guy, generous with his time and money, pillar of community, etc. He was recently widowed and is an empty nester.

A few weeks ago, H chatted me up outside the dance studio while we were waiting to pick up our respective DDs. H asked if he could pick my brain on something in private. I said sure and we met for drinks at a nearby tavern that evening. After a couple of drinks, H asked me if I had seen Doc recently. I was puzzled but I told him, not recently but why? H said he is sure that N has been having an affair with Doc for a couple of years. I was taken aback and asked him if he had any evidence or basis to suspect N. He said that someone he knows told him that they saw N and Doc having walking out holding hands after dinner at a $$$$ restaurant in town. H was out of town for work that week. He also said that he believes N and Doc first met at a party at my house a couple of years ago. I vaguely recall introducing the two families. H said that he has GPS data that proves that N was at Doc's home address for 1-2 hrs at a time on a few occasions, all during school days when H was out of town. He also showed me what he said were pictures of Telegram chats with OM on N's phone. I told him I was sorry he was going through this and would help him in any way. H said that he hasn't confronted N yet and he cannot do so without MY help.

H then dropped a bombshell and said that he thinks my wife is aware of and is helping N keep the A under wraps. I felt light headed and went to the restroom to splash some cold water on my face. Then I asked H what evidence he has that my wife was involved in any of this. H said on at least a couple of occasions N said she was grabbing lunch with my wife as an alibi for her rendezvous with Doc. He shared the two dates with me. H told me that he is working on a plan to "fix this" without public scandal but that I need to "do my part by keeping my wife in line." I snapped at him saying he has no right to talk about my wife that way. He called me later that evening and apologized for his outburst but begged me to get my wife to convince N to end the A and also to share any info about the A that N might have revealed to my wife. I told him I'll need to chew on this because this is a lot but asked him to keep cool and talk to a therapist ASAP.

All of this brought back PTSD from my wife's past A. Before talking to my wife, I looked at my Ring doorbell camera events for the two dates in question. My wife works from home and she didn't leave the house on one of the dates. We didn't have recordings dating back to the other date. I was relieved knowing that N was lying. I then talked to my wife and asked her if she knows how N is doing. Wife was like "I was going to talk to you about N" but first wanted to know what prompted my query. I told her what H told me. She sighed and said this is going to be a clusterfvck. Apparently N reached out to my wife around the same time as H and I were chatting. N told my wife that she has fallen in love with a dashing older man and realized that she never loved H. She said that her AP is single, successful, a true gentleman and will be a wonderful stepdad for her children. Wife said N was in a daze, calling the AP her soul mate / kindred spirit etc. Wife said N didn't confess to having sex with AP but did they they held hands, kissed etc. Wife said that her woman's intuition is that N had sex with AP. N also told my wife that she and AP will go public after the end of the school year. N claimed that H may start to suspect something but probably doesn't know. Just in case it's needed, N asked my wife to say that they were catching up over lunch on some occasions. It's all going to be over by summer, so can you please tell a couple of white lies for the sake of our friendship and my happiness, N asked. Wife said that she didn't say yes or no to N re alibi but told her to talk to a therapist. She also asked N if she thought about life with AP 15 years from now and whether she is prepared to be a wet nurse for an old guy when her kids are in college. N was offended and said that AP is in great shape and is young for his age. Besides he's a doctor and takes great care of himself. Apparently AP will help the kids get into Ivy League colleges and the lovebirds will spend time taking luxury cruises around the world. N also said that she feels badly for H but hopes that H will not stand in the way of her true happiness.

So my wife and I are devastated because this is a tragedy waiting to happen to N's poor husband and children. We're conviced that Doc is surely N's mystery AP. Our house is on the route from N's to Doc's neighborhood, so N's alibis would be plausible if my wife played along. Even before I asked her, wife said she will NOT give alibi for N's dates. We agreed that we'd be ready to share the Ring camera logs if called for.

But we are not sure what else to do. I'm so disappointed with Doc. I thought he could walk on water and am still grateful for his help. But if the timeline is correct, his affair with N started well before his wife passed away (heart failure due to chronic diabetes). To be honest, N always gave out some weird vibes. Always had to be the center of attention, flirty, often wore borderline inappropriate clothes for kids' birthday parties, get tipsy and blurt out stuff like she needs to a get a Brazilian before pool season. But I didn't think much of it because not all flirty, loose lipped women cheat on their husbands.

I had texted H saying that I'm available to talk any time and also that he was incorrect about my wife. It's been a couple of weeks and H has gone radio silent. N still appears to be logged on to Teams during work hours per my wife.

I don't see any way this ends well. I am already resigned to face the blowback from Doc, potential entanglement in a messy divorce fight etc. I fear mainly for H and the poor kids. What can we do to help?

BH (late 40s), fWW (mid 40s), M ~18 years, T ~22 years
DDay was ~15 years ago.
Informally separated for ~2 years and then reconciled and moved on. Have two amazing kiddos now.

posts: 131   ·   registered: Jan. 8th, 2024   ·   location: USA
id 8822107
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Jajaynumb ( member #83674) posted at 8:06 AM on Tuesday, January 23rd, 2024

I think all you can do is support the BH. Maybe show him this place and the path out of infidelity.

Your FWW has basically enabled the affair. I’d be worried she doesn’t really understand the damage it causes people.

https://library.survivinginfidelity.com/topics/661294/worse-than-hell-yes-its-all-true/

posts: 174   ·   registered: Aug. 1st, 2023   ·   location: Europe
id 8822115
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Beachgirl73 ( member #74764) posted at 12:59 PM on Tuesday, January 23rd, 2024

I disagree with Jajaynumb. I do not think your wife has enabled this affair in any way. IMO, only N and Doc are at fault here.

posts: 139   ·   registered: Jul. 3rd, 2020
id 8822119
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Bigger ( Attaché #8354) posted at 1:15 PM on Tuesday, January 23rd, 2024

Your friend and his wife sound like the stereotypical BS and WS respectively. If there is anything to be learned from this site is that stereotypical is not good…

IMHO you might be dealing with two issues:
There is the involvement of your wife and the connections that might have to her past affair. The PTSD, triggers and all that. IMHO THAT is the key-issue you should be dealing with, because a year from now you will still be dealing with YOU and probably your wife.
IMHO that’s best done with clear and frank communications, and it does sound like you two already have done a lot of that. Honestly – to me it sounds like your wife had no active part in encouraging or condoning or supporting this affair. I do however think this is a good moment for you two to talk about how and when you two should share when you are confronted with a situation like this.
--
The other issue is how to support your friend.

IMHO there is no honesty in infidelity… Your wife shared that her friend had said she was only waiting for the end of school before going "out" with OM. Wow… How naïve… the very wording and the alleged "no sex", "going out" and holding hands and all that… It’s so High School… does she think the good doctor will propose at the Prom?

I think there is no obligation whatsoever for you to keep that confidence and you should share it with the BH. That his wife is having an affair and plans to move out at the end of school.
Other than that… this is his battle to fight, and all you can do is sit in his corner and offer some guidance. Some suggestions – maybe even before your next conversation with him:

You know this can only end in one of two ways: Divorce or reconciliation. For divorce all that is needed is that one of the two don’t want the marriage or the infidelity. For reconciliation both need to want it, and the affair to be over.
You can do some research for him. In your state, does infidelity affect divorce? Can it impact alimony, division of assets or anything of that nature?
If yes – then the next logical step is to get legal advice on how best to prove infidelity. That might (and probably will) require a PI to get the required level of acceptable proof. Realistically – if OM and WW are having an affair then allowing it to carry on for a week or two to get proof shouldn’t be hard. Your friend can have an "unexpected" business-trip and have to leave for the weekend or whatever.
IF infidelity impacts divorce then he should wait with confrontation until he has that proof. How he uses that proof in the future is up to him, but its like having an ace-card that can get him out of a tough situation.

If infidelity doesn’t have any impact then IMHO your friend should confront right away. You could help him prepare, but I wont bother suggesting how I would confront until you (or he) shares that he’s going to do so.

"If, therefore, any be unhappy, let him remember that he is unhappy by reason of himself alone." Epictetus

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id 8822120
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bob7777 ( member #79867) posted at 4:58 PM on Tuesday, January 23rd, 2024

Idk, I'm gonna be brutally honest. Whatever the issues are with your friend and his wife, I believe your own wife is acting suspiciously, I can be wrong but your story gives me reason to believe so. Your friend H came to you with the suspicion, that the affair of his wife and the surgeon is going back a long time. So you engage your wife and suddenly your wife opens up but only with information you have. It must be a real coincidence that N opened up to your wife around the same time your friend told his story to you, isn't it? And when you talked to your wife about it, she asked you first what you know and what this was about. For me it's really comical. Maybe I'm reading too much into it.

Apparently N reached out to my wife around the same time as H and I were chatting. N told my wife that she has fallen in love with a dashing older man and realized that she never loved H. She said that her AP is single, successful, a true gentleman and will be a wonderful stepdad for her children. Wife said N was in a daze, calling the AP her soul mate / kindred spirit etc. Wife said N didn't confess to having sex with AP but did they they held hands, kissed etc.


You see the contradictions yourself? So, your friend told you about occasions in the past where he suspects your wife giving alibis for his wife. Those occasions happened way before your friend approached you to talk about it or his wife confessed to your wife. That means she was aware of this situation way before your friend talked to you but she chose not to inform you. She only 'came clean' when you started the dialogue. Maybe I got it wrong, but from what I read in your story, your wife is in on it and given your history with her it's not a good sign.

posts: 106   ·   registered: Feb. 1st, 2022
id 8822162
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HellFire ( member #59305) posted at 6:21 PM on Tuesday, January 23rd, 2024

I would be very worried about your wife's behavior.

She was asked to be an alibi for a cheater. She didn't say she would..but she didn't vehemently say no. She also didn't tell her to tell her husband.

She also didn't tell you..until you brought it up.

I believe she posts here? I recommend she post all of this on the ws forum. She has a lot of work to do on herself.

Let the husband know about SI.

If this cheating friend isn't going to end the affair, and isn't remorseful, she's not the kind of influence you want around your wife.

Also..this??

Wife was like "I was going to talk to you about N" but first wanted to know what prompted my query. I told her what H told me. She sighed and said this is going to be a clusterfvck.

This is the most concerning part of your post. She asked what you already knew, so she didn't give you any more info than you already had. And..it's very important to note that now that the husband knows, it's going to be a clusterfuck.

Um..what? No. The clusterfuck started when the affair started. But..your wife feels its now a problem, only because the husband knows.

[This message edited by HellFire at 6:23 PM, Tuesday, January 23rd]

Our field of dreams,engulfed in fire..and I'll still see it,till the day I die..

posts: 6777   ·   registered: Jun. 20th, 2017   ·   location: The Midwest
id 8822169
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sisoon ( Moderator #31240) posted at 6:46 PM on Tuesday, January 23rd, 2024

I agree with Hellfire.

Your W has said that an EA is going on, and she believes it's a PA.

Your friend is wrong in thinking your W can do much of anything here. The betrayal started sometime in the past and is ongoing. There's no way to make that go away. And if your W does stop supporting the A - if she's supporting the A - N will still find a way to continue the A if she wans to.

What you can do is to let your friend know what your W told you and help him decide what he's going to do, if he wants help. I know you're in a difficult spot, but I think your best bet is to share what your W told you.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 6:47 PM, Tuesday, January 23rd]

fBH (me) - on d-day: 66, Married 43, together 45, same sex ap
DDay - 12/22/2010
Recover'd and R'ed
You don't have to like your boundaries. You just have to set and enforce them.

posts: 30051   ·   registered: Feb. 18th, 2011   ·   location: Illinois
id 8822174
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Legatus ( member #79152) posted at 8:10 PM on Tuesday, January 23rd, 2024

That's a hard one. For me the thing about your post that caught my attention was the part about it triggering your PTSD. I agree with the other comments speculating that your wife knew about the fair much earlier than reported and knows many more details than she's letting on. That's just one mans opinion. Based on the information you've provided I would suggest you consider cutting ties with the other couple as much as you can. After my wife's affair one rule we set was to not have friends who are in affairs. Furthermore, we agreed to not have friends who weren't friends to the marriage.

Did N know about your wife's infidelity? If she did, I think it was really cruddy/selfish of her to involve your wife at all. I don't think N is a friend to your marriage. I would suggest telling H what you know. Right now he's making life decisions based on a lie. N is happy to let him do so because she can selfishly prepare her exit. It's all about her. In not telling him, you're accepting that he's going to be blindsided by this later when she has all her ducks in a row and he will be totally unprepared. I hate to say this, but now that you know, you're part of helping N hide the affair. Based on your past experiences is that what you want? Besides he already knows, he just doesn't have proof.

Having said all that, I'm sorry you're in the spot you're in. I hope you're able to take care of yourself and limit the impacts it's having on you in terms of triggering memories of your past trauma.

posts: 145   ·   registered: Jul. 21st, 2021
id 8822192
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1994 ( member #82615) posted at 10:13 PM on Tuesday, January 23rd, 2024

Just want to pile on to the already sound advice you're getting. Your profile shows you suffered a great deal from your wife's TT. Not to compare the two, but your wife's affair wasn't even an exit affair. This one is. N seems ambivalent to the destruction that this will cause H, and I'm amazed at the absurdly selfish thoughtlessness of this part:

N also said that she feels badly for H but hopes that H will not stand in the way of her true happiness

She wants to take this man's children, his whole life, and give it to this other POS in the pursuit of her "true happiness."

You should look inward and ask how you'd want to be treated if your wife had done what she had done, with the added bonus of leaving you for her POSOM and taking your (now) children because he could provide them a better life.

Also, your wife is pretty suspect right now. Don't coordinate with her. Tell H the truth and let the chips fall where they may.

Stay strong!

[This message edited by 1994 at 10:13 PM, Tuesday, January 23rd]

posts: 166   ·   registered: Dec. 25th, 2022   ·   location: USA
id 8822212
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 Ragn3rK1n (original poster member #84340) posted at 3:11 AM on Wednesday, January 24th, 2024

All

It's been a crazy couple of days. Thank you for all the kind words and thoughtful responses. I didn't expect this many replies and apologize for not acknowledging your posts individually.

First, I'm sure that my wife is being honest with me on this. I'm not just taking her at her word. Since we R'd 12+ years ago, I've had full access to her phone, laptop, iPad, all her socials etc. We have two young DDs, one in Middle School and one in Elementary who has special needs. Between our jobs and school drop off/pick up, DD1's swim team, DD2's ASD therapy sessions and all their weekend activities, we both need to and do know exactly where the other is at any time (Life 360). I checked wife's phone and there are no calls or texts between her and N other than kids' dance recital and some healthy diet Insta links. There are no deleted texts. I went thru her Facebook and Insta as well and there are no private messages between my and N. Look, my wife hasn't done anything in the last 12+ years and it makes no sense that she'd suddenly decide to covertly help a friend carry on a tawdry affair.

Also, I now have evidence that N and my wife could not have had lunch on either of the dates in question. For the more recent date, I have Ring camera data showing that my wife was home all day. On the older date, my wife had to go and pick up DD1 from her school around 1 PM, because DD was feeling sick and the school nurse called and said she had a fever. Both of us get emergency calls from the school system. I was in the office that day and my wife and I were texting to figure out which of us would go pick up DD1. So yeah N was lying about having lunch with my wife.

Regardless, this has been stressful. I had a big setback at work recently and this shit couldn't be happening at a worse time.

Thankfully, I have beeing talking to a therapist once a month for depression and OCD. He knows my history and trauma from wife's old A. I rarely ask for emergency sessions but did so today. He was able to fit me in via video call. Talked about what specific things could've triggered me. So one of my triggers is if I sense that my wife appears to be abruptly keeping some secrets from me. It was a precursor to her fling. Therapist suggested I talk candidly to my wife about this ASAP and addressing them together. He reminded me that she can't answer questions that I do not ask.

I texted my wife before leaving office saying that we need to clear the air on this N affair mess. My wife knows my "triggered" face. After school, we took the girls on a surprise visit to my in-laws' (they live minutes from our place). While they entertained themselves, my wife and I went for a walk and I share my fears with her. Usually my trigger events are centered around my wife's activities like her going out of town for work or girls night out etc. She didn't realize that a friend's affair could trigger me but does so now. Wife was very apologetic and in tears but was glad that I continued to trust and open up to her. TBH it's been years since I had a trigger event.

So yeah I totally believe my wife when she says she had no freaking clue that N's A until N told her over the phone a few days ago. I think there's a compelling case that N was likely bluffing all along by using my wife as an alibi. She probably thought that she'll never be checked on this and perhaps thinking that she could sweet talk my wife into lying if her H probed further. "Catch up lunch" with my wife is also a plausible ruse because my house is directly on the route from N's place to OM's house.

Also, I'm sure that N doesn't know about my wife past A. The only people alive who know about it are my wife, me, our respective therapists and the POSOM who we don't even know is still alive. The A is a matter of great shame for my wife so there is no way she'd have shared that with anyone, let alone a flighty woman like N.

As to what could have driven N to call and reveal her affair to my wife out of the blue, we can only speculate. I'm sure my wife wasn't sending out secret wayward pheromones. smile Perhaps N realized that H was close to finding out and she needed to spill the beans with my wife in order to get her to lie. It is also quite possible that N has other friend(s) who are facilitating the A and she just assumed that my wife would do so as well. I know N thinks very highly of her persuasion skills and her ability to read people.

As to what to do next, my wife and I agreed that we will talk to H together and tell him that N's alibi is bogus. My wife will also tell H everything that N reveealed about the A, her plans with OM and the end of school year timing, etc. Should it come to lawyers being involved, my wife will be ok with providing an affidavit refuting the alibi.

Neither of us asked to be entangled in this mess but we have no illusions about the fallout. Wife agreed that this is entirely the fault of N and the OM. She wasn't concerned about burning bridges with N other than what we'd tell DD2 should N cutoff her kids' contact with ours. Wife was more angry at and in disbelief that N would risk the well being of her children, her marriage and personal reputation for a bullshit dream. We are also disappointed with Doc's behavior. While we're still indebted to him for helping save DD2's life, but he is terribly wrong for carrying on with another man's wife.

So here we are. H is still radio silent, which is a bit concerning. I texted him again saying that my wife isn't covering up for N and both of us are ready to share everything we are aware of. Asked see if can stop by our house after work tomorrow. I pinged him on LinkedIn as well. Keeping my fingers crossed.

Once again, I really appreciate everyone's responses. I'll share updates when I have them.

BH (late 40s), fWW (mid 40s), M ~18 years, T ~22 years
DDay was ~15 years ago.
Informally separated for ~2 years and then reconciled and moved on. Have two amazing kiddos now.

posts: 131   ·   registered: Jan. 8th, 2024   ·   location: USA
id 8822234
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Bigger ( Attaché #8354) posted at 9:55 AM on Wednesday, January 24th, 2024

Ragn3rK1n

Could you clarify one thing:
Is the main goal of this thread to get guidance on YOUR marriage and the effect of this even on it
Or
Is the main goal to get advice on how to help your friend?

If the former – I think you are already on a good trajectory and the main benefit of this event might be to clarify how you both will react to a comparable situation in the future.
If the later – you can do this yourself for your friend: google "does infidelity impact divorce in [put name of your state here]"

"If, therefore, any be unhappy, let him remember that he is unhappy by reason of himself alone." Epictetus

posts: 12484   ·   registered: Sep. 29th, 2005
id 8822245
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Shehawk ( member #68741) posted at 12:58 PM on Wednesday, January 24th, 2024

"After my wife's affair one rule we set was to not have friends who are in affairs. Furthermore, we agreed to not have friends who weren't friends to the marriage."

I hope some of my experiences will be helpful in sorting out what feels right and works for you and your fww.

The above rule is why I am D. EXWH would not agree to this simple sort of marriage protective rule (along with reestablishjng a 1 woman 1 man monogamous marriage but that is the subject of many other of my posts).

The moral of my particular story is that I treat infidelity like a glitter bomb. I stay far and away from people who support it, practice it, or act in ways that promote it or suggest that they do. I don’t want to get glitter on me again. It permeates everything. It’s hard to get off.

I am so sorry you are being affected by the cheater behavior in your social circle. The attention seeking seductive way you describe is a behavior pattern I have learned to recognize. I now avoid people who exhibit that pattern. There are women EXWH and I knew in our social circles who gave me that "vibe". I always felt like he gave them inappropriate amounts and types of attention. Mind you he was a likely an active wayward at the time so no big surprises here. But I should have been very firm in my boundaries regarding his contact with them as (an at that point presumably although likely on a slippery glitter bomb covered slope) at the least) former wayward.

Kudos to you for getting yourself immediate support. This is a lot to sort through and live with. Sometimes people can do good things, but be also be morally questionable Doc helped you. That is hard stuff to process. Also Kudos to your fww for taking time with you, listening and doing the work.

I wish you both well at this time and hope this group can be a source of support, encouragement, hope, and wisdom.

I also hope your friend will get the support he needs. A mistake I made in the demise of my M was that I gave my ExWH too much information and was not strategic. It is not in my nature but I needed to be much more self protective.

Also it is perfectly acceptable in my current relationship for either one of us to know where the other is and to have a say in who is or is not let into our social circle. Some people might judge that. But both of us have experienced infidelity and we are hopefully wiser with each other and honest about what we are and are not comfortable with.

It is my experience that glitter is a group effort. In other words, active waywards tend to want company in their exploits either in terms of support or recruiting or seeking others to join them. For that reason my partner and I don’t let active cheaters or cheating supporters into the "walls" of our relationship.

I am so sorry you are going through this. It sounds like you have a lot on your plate. Sending positive thoughts your way.

"It's a slow fade...when you give yourself away" so don't do it!

posts: 1678   ·   registered: Nov. 5th, 2018   ·   location: US
id 8822250
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bob7777 ( member #79867) posted at 1:23 PM on Wednesday, January 24th, 2024

I wish you the best, help your friend.

posts: 106   ·   registered: Feb. 1st, 2022
id 8822253
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Charity411 ( member #41033) posted at 3:33 PM on Wednesday, January 24th, 2024

I believe your wife. I had virtually the same thing happen to me. I found out my good friend was using me as an alibi to facilitate her affair with a much older man. I was good friends with her husband too. I found out when I went to meet my friend for dinner, my treat, for her birthday, and got her sister instead. Sis informed me that my friend was on a romantic date with her AP for her birthday. Apparently I was doing all sorts of stuff with my friend as she was continually using me as an alibi, and I had no clue.

I was livid. I had been left for the OW by my husband, and she knew full well the devastation it caused me. To then use me as her alibi to wreck the same havoc was inconceivable to me. I ended our friendship immediately. I loudly and proudly stated why to anyone who would listen.

I think it's a good sign that your wife wants to join you to meet with H. Even if H has gone radio silent, she can still confront N herself. N is the one who involved your wife in the first place. She has no obligation to avoid making N uncomfortable.

posts: 1730   ·   registered: Oct. 18th, 2013   ·   location: Illinois
id 8822268
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Copingmybest ( member #78962) posted at 8:50 PM on Wednesday, January 24th, 2024

Only 2 things I can say here.

1. I'll not lie for anyone, EVER!

2. I'd be concerned that my former WW wife even had a smidgen of an inkling of not screaming STOP at the top of her lungs to her friend and instanly telling you what was going on in full detail. She should know better by now.

posts: 275   ·   registered: Jun. 16th, 2021   ·   location: Midwest
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 Ragn3rK1n (original poster member #84340) posted at 1:23 AM on Thursday, January 25th, 2024

Bigger

I'm more worried about how to help H and the kids. Also want to disentangle myself and my wife from this mess. Infidelity does impact divorce terms in my state and H is aware of this.

Shehawk

Thank you. The glitter metaphor is spot on. Although, I'd go with Poison Ivy myself, because I'm a #GirlDad and glitter, sequins and scrunchies in random places is something I'm used to

Charity411

Thank you! Your friend seems even more diabolical than N because she knew that you were a BW and still used you as an alibi

Copingmybest

Apologies if I wasn't clear, but my wife said she told N to snap out of this fantasy.

BH (late 40s), fWW (mid 40s), M ~18 years, T ~22 years
DDay was ~15 years ago.
Informally separated for ~2 years and then reconciled and moved on. Have two amazing kiddos now.

posts: 131   ·   registered: Jan. 8th, 2024   ·   location: USA
id 8822334
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Bigger ( Attaché #8354) posted at 2:25 PM on Thursday, January 25th, 2024

That’s the answer I was hoping to get…

Always keep in mind that you can guide him, but the decisions and the actions are his. It’s like you are a personal trainer that can give your client a good program and show him how to maximize doing pushups, but his form won’t improve simply by watching you.

OK – Ultra realistic time:
I hope you agree that there are really only two ways forwards for your friend. Well… that is unless hes willing to accept his wife has a lover. This can end in D or R.
To D it’s enough that either of them doesn’t want this marriage or to end the affair.
To R it requires that both commit to the marriage and the affair ends stone-cold dead.
Then let’s look at what his wife is doing and saying: An affluent older man, a doctor, single, good dad-material, and it seems like they have discussed some action at the end of term. This has been going on for some time – like over a year.
Based on that – if we take her at face value – what are your friends options?

D…
Right? Not necessarily by his choice, but by his wife’s decision.

Now – let’s apply the lens of experience to this rosy-tainted infidelity scene. Why wait to end-of-term? I’m willing to place money on that the good doctor is simply buying time. He enjoys being single, has the pick of available women. Having a married woman limits the scope of commitment. He give her hope because he likes the sex. Once push comes to shove… experience shows that its extremely common the stallion moves on to greener pastures. After all – why burden himself with a middle aged woman with kids? Booster seats don’t fit the Ferrari…

But let’s say the doctor is honest in wanting this woman… When it comes to divorce-time your friend will be fighting a stacked deck. Theoretically he has half the marital assets to pay for legal cost, while she has the other half plus the backing of someone that only has to do three surgeries to equal the friends annual salary.

Then there is the other ultra-real fact: If OM has been meeting the wife 30x in the last 2 years then knowing there will be a 31, 32 and even 33 won’t really be the clincher… Your friend can afford a strategical wait.

That’s why I asked about the impact of infidelity…
Your first BIG piece of advice to your friend is to NOT wait until she files.
Infidelity as a factor loses it’s value the minute she files. Once she files, she can be seen around town with Dr Lover with limited consequences – they were just "friends" before she filed and nothing inappropriate happened…

Your friend should get legal advice on a) the impact of infidelity and b) how best to prove it. Then follow that advice to get the evidence he needs.

I want to be clear on a couple of things per the above advice:
I ALWAYS recommend people be fair in divorce. I am not suggesting the friend uses the above info in a court, but it can help him in ensuring a divorce is fair.
I am NOT telling you nor your friend that this will end in divorce.
If your friend wants the marriage then he still has a good shot at it. However… he has to be willing to risk it all.

I ask new BS this all the time and maybe you should:
What is it they fear the most?
If your friend tells you that it’s discovering she’s cheating then tell him directly that he knows that already.
If he says it’s the fear of losing her then let him know that he always has the option of quietly allowing her to have her lover. That the odds of this ending naturally grow the more demanding she is to her lover and the older she gets. If that doesn’t sound so great then press him:
WHAT IS IT YOU FEAR THE MOST!

The answer you want to hear is the fear of her remaining in infidelity. That he thinks it’s over, only to find a strange pen in her car, or him wondering if she really needs to dress that nice to meet the girls for bridge or whatever. The ABSOLUTE worst fear should be to remain in infidelity.

With the correct info he can confront, and that confrontation lead him on the path that will get him out. Be that through reconciling or divorce.

"If, therefore, any be unhappy, let him remember that he is unhappy by reason of himself alone." Epictetus

posts: 12484   ·   registered: Sep. 29th, 2005
id 8822363
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Cooley2here ( member #62939) posted at 3:30 PM on Thursday, January 25th, 2024

Be succinct but tell asap. It is so cruel to let even one day more impact his life. It is as if he is holding a bomb which his wife will blow up when she feels like it.

And the POS she is having the affair with does not care that he is harming a family.

[This message edited by Cooley2here at 3:35 PM, Thursday, January 25th]

When things go wrong, don’t go with them. Elvis

posts: 4277   ·   registered: Mar. 5th, 2018   ·   location: US
id 8822367
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Littlepuppet ( member #83426) posted at 5:49 PM on Thursday, January 25th, 2024

Ragn3rK1n ( new member) posted at 3:11 AM on Wednesday, January 24th, 2024
"...I checked wife's phone and there are no calls or texts between her and N other than kids' dance recital and some healthy diet Insta links. There are no deleted texts. I went thru her Facebook and Insta as well and there are no private messages between my and N...
...So yeah I totally believe my wife when she says she had no freaking clue that N's A until N told her over the phone a few days ago..."
I don´t understand.

posts: 62   ·   registered: Jun. 6th, 2023   ·   location: Madrid
id 8822386
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 Ragn3rK1n (original poster member #84340) posted at 12:02 AM on Friday, January 26th, 2024

Update - H called me when I was at work and said that he's ok. He was sorry for accusing my wife of helping N and said that he will apologize to her in person. I said thanks and asked him how he was holding up. H said he has family coming into town soon to help him and that he will not take any rash actions that might harm the kids. He still hasn't confronted N and has been able to maintain a poker face the best he can. I reminded him that my wife's offer to give him everything that N told her still stands. He said he appreciates it but he has new, more concrete evidence of the A and some of it is very disturbing. H said that he cannot disclose how he knows this but the Doc (OM) is a serial adulterer and has broken up other marriages. He once again expressed regret that me and my wife were pulled into this. I told him we are here to help and are praying for his family.

Bigger - You were prescient about the bolded part. N is going to have a rude awakening if she was expecting the Doc to go legit with her.

BH (late 40s), fWW (mid 40s), M ~18 years, T ~22 years
DDay was ~15 years ago.
Informally separated for ~2 years and then reconciled and moved on. Have two amazing kiddos now.

posts: 131   ·   registered: Jan. 8th, 2024   ·   location: USA
id 8822420
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