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Newest Member: Stillconfused2022

Just Found Out :
Caught wife sitting in co-workers car

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annb ( member #22386) posted at 12:58 PM on Wednesday, November 23rd, 2022

That was utterly stupid! Never do something like that again

^^^Not necessary. mad

He acted like most of us would act trying to get the TRUTH!

posts: 11665   ·   registered: Jan. 10th, 2009   ·   location: Northeast
id 8766417
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Bigger ( Attaché #8354) posted at 1:07 PM on Wednesday, November 23rd, 2022

I’m really glad you checked back in.

In some ways your thread reflected what I think are this site worst characteristics, and sometimes I think those characteristics tend to drive newly betrayed people away.

I am former law-enforcement and have training in investigations and investigative procedures. Although there is a totally different level of procedures, quality of investigation etc for formal, legal investigation compared to personal, there are common traits that IMHO should be respected.
One of my instructors often quoted "When you hear the beating of hooves you think horses, not zebras".

That quote is a lot deeper than it might sound at first glance.
What you shared in your first post was IMHO a definite beating of hooves. What wasn’t clear was what was coming around the corner. Horses? Zebra’s? Asses or donkeys?
Of course, if you live in horse-country the odds are high that it will be horses. This site is definitely horse-country. We don’t get many zebras so nearly all the hoof-beating we hear is horses, but by assuming that based solely on what you had could have been disastrous. As would have been presenting what little you had to others. For all we knew – at that time – the beating you heard could have been rain on a tin roof.

So, when you started to get responses stating it was definitely an affair, they had sex, go directly to divorce and STD test and don’t collect your $200 when you pass GO… To me that’s like if I – as a policeman – were to assume that the young black American male driving an expensive vehicle had stolen it and arrested him solely on that suspicion.

Your second post put more content into the smoke. After that post it was clear that there was some form of infidelity going on. The incriminating factors IMHO was the deletion of content and the lack of indignant reaction when accused of infidelity.
What remained was IMHO to better define what kind. Emotional or had this traversed into physical? We still haven’t IMHO seen what’s rounding the corner – horses or zebra’s – but we definitely know it’s some four-footed mammal. We might even be smelling the manure.

Personally I like to know what I’m dealing with before selecting my tools.

One of the biggest problems with emotional infidelity is that many don’t recognize or understand them. Physical is pretty clear – there is no or very little gray line between sexual and non-sexual actions. EA’s were really only acknowledged as something "real" in the late 1980s and it’s still very common for a spouse to refuse being in an affair because "he/she’s only a friend. There is no touching or anything sexual".
I try my best to avoid assumptions. Like the assumption that because she’s having breakfast with a colleague then she definitely has been having sex with same colleague. Both the morning meeting and the number of calls and texts could have been explained in some connection to their work (which we have very limited info on). However I use deductions a lot. Like deducting that the combination of that meeting, the reaction of OM (driving away rather than saying a "hi" or greeting you in some way), the number of calls and texts would indicate infidelity. Her reaction later made me firmer on those deductions. Still no assumptions though. That extra day and a VAR could have given you so much more info…
However – with the above knowledge – everything you shared in your first 2 posts then what we KNEW was:
>She was meeting a male coworker outside of work.
>There are remarkably many calls between these two.
>A significant number and time were during the commute.
>That she recognized it might not look good, but it wasn’t what you thought [I think that she might be denying its "infidelity" because there hasn’t been anything intimate. They are only "talking about their issues…]
>That she removed all the content that could have proven her innocence – or her guilt…
>That her reaction wasn’t indicative of an innocent person.


Jensen – Your third post gives us more info. That despite the damage its causing her marriage she still goes to see OM and that it’s so directly unrelated to work, the level of distancing she’s doing to you… this makes me see the horses. I now better know what’s approaching, and I don’t see any black-and-white striped animals…

We still don’t know what form or sort of infidelity you are dealing with, but I think it’s very clear that it’s infidelity.

However… In the present situation it’s not relevant. What is relevant is that your wife is in infidelity, and while there your marriage has no ability to be a marriage. In order for that to change three things are needed: she needs to acknowledge and end the affair, you need to want this marriage and she needs to want this marriage.
As is then all we know is the affair isn’t acknowledged and is (probably) ongoing. She might want this marriage, but if she also wants her affair… would that work? Sort of eat the cake but keep it?

What would be your ideal outcome? If she met her two requirements, would you want to reconcile?

You don’t need to decide now. All three requirements need to be in place, and even if you wanted this marriage then while she’s cheating and not being honest then it’s not being offered to you. There really is only one path open and that’s the path of ending this marriage.

What you control is the pace and how you go about it.
If you don’t want this marriage – if what you know already is a dealbreaker – then simply follow your attorney’s advice and go through the process of divorce. Remember it’s not a process of revenge.

If you want to reconcile you can stall the formal process. The initial part is filing, but that’s a relatively simple document (in most cases). Just a letter of intent if you will. But it sets the tone and creates an initial date that can have significance on the marriage and its commitments.

What I suggest you do is carry on along the same lines you have been doing.
Since you have talked to an attorney then ask how far and what steps you can take to prevent your wife from being in the home. You want to be very careful not to refuse her entry if she has a legal right to be there and that could be considered domestic abuse (name on lease or deed is not the key-issue here, but legal residence).

Expose the affair. Expose based on what you know. Like don’t tell your sons "Your mom is screwing around with Bob" but rather something along the lines of "your mom is interacting with Bob more than can be considered "normal" or "healthy" in a marriage. I don’t know if it’s physical, but there is definitely an emotional affair going on. While she isn’t willing to acknowledge or explain what’s going on there isn’t any way we can remain married".

Prepare what you would need if you were to entertain reconciling. I would suggest you need: a) the complete truth as to the timeframe and extend of the affair b) some knowledge of what was in the texts c) total accountable NC with OM – probably including one or the other change jobs.


And no – I don’t think what you did is stupid. It’s risky, and you were fortunate to get cops that listened but IMHO you were never in danger of being arrested or charged. Knocking at people’s door isn’t illegal, and there was no pattern of harassment.

"If, therefore, any be unhappy, let him remember that he is unhappy by reason of himself alone." Epictetus

posts: 11130   ·   registered: Sep. 29th, 2005
id 8766419
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HellFire ( member #59305) posted at 1:23 PM on Wednesday, November 23rd, 2022

That was utterly stupid!

He accomplished his goal. He told OBS.

Your comment was wrong,insensitive, and..dare I say it? Utterly stupid.

Jensen..you've been advised to carry a var on you when you see her. This is extremely important. Many WW try to bring false DV charges. All this talk of you being a stalker,and she's scared,makes you a prime target. Never be alone with her. If that does happen,turn the VAR on as soon as you lay eyes on her.

You can bet he isn't leaving his wife. And,now that she knows, it will make it very difficult for the affair to continue. Your wife will blame you for this. She's livid. Protect yourself.

Also..I don't think it was your wife who called the police to his house. She didn't know you would figure out where he lived. It was OM. He thought he'd get away with the road rage BS. He's a coward. And,in the end, he lied to the police, and could have been arrested. What a fool!

[This message edited by HellFire at 1:24 PM, Wednesday, November 23rd]

posts: 4848   ·   registered: Jun. 20th, 2017   ·   location: The Midwest
id 8766423
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bob7777 ( new member #79867) posted at 1:28 PM on Wednesday, November 23rd, 2022

That was utterly stupid!

It wasn't meant that he shouldn't tell OBS, on the contrary, but that whole scenario could have went south. Particularly when police got involved.

[This message edited by bob7777 at 1:28 PM, Wednesday, November 23rd]

posts: 19   ·   registered: Feb. 1st, 2022
id 8766424
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DragnHeart ( member #32122) posted at 1:57 PM on Wednesday, November 23rd, 2022

but that whole scenario could have went south. Particularly when police got involved.

I agree. It could have gone a totally different way however you could have just said that.

There was no need to call him stupid thats all I'm saying.

Not going to t/j anymore

I am very relieved the police were understanding and things went as well as they did. I'm glad OBS was informed.

I'm also happy for the update.

Me: BS 46 WH: 37 (BrokenHeart911)Four little dragons. Met 2006. Married 2008. Dday of LTPA with co worker October 19th 2010. Knew about EA with ow1 before that. Now up to PA #5. Serial fucking Cheater.

posts: 25032   ·   registered: May. 10th, 2011   ·   location: Canada
id 8766428
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Trdd ( member #65989) posted at 2:11 PM on Wednesday, November 23rd, 2022

We have to be really cautious interacting with the posom because if you are like me, you will have a wave of fight or flight mode hit you and push you straight into fight. Sometimes that goes well, other times you get arrested. So although it is something many men might want to do, it is best to avoid situations where it might happen. And I think you may be prone to fight mode just based on the actions you took to wait for the guy and follow him.

What you did is not illegal and it turned out well. I love the fact that the police facilitated the conversation for you. It's awesome actually, lol. At the same time, it's probably best to avoid posom now for the reasons I stated and additionally because the police already have seen you there at the house once. But I'm sure you already know this and it's just a reminder.

Imo, you have all the data you need to see that your WW is having an affair. There is a chance it isn't physical but that chance is pretty low. Who drives to a park after work just to talk when they could have talked at work?

And your WW is clearly very enamored of him. Sadly, she is taking his side against you. Calling you a stalker, calling the police on you? I guess it might have been him that called but she said she was going to do it. Wow, that's infuriating and so dissappointing. But know that many waywards go to great lengths to protect themselves and their affairs while they are caught up in fantasy and limerance. Your WW is not the first and will not be the last. But it is still hugely dissappointing.

Maybe you want a D, maybe not. Either way you need to continue to be firm, resolute that you are not going to share your wife and you are getting out of infidelity. If you want to consider R, you still need to be firm, expose, confront and shake her out of her fantasy. The good thing is you are off to a really great start in that department.

posts: 696   ·   registered: Aug. 27th, 2018   ·   location: US
id 8766431
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Tanner ( member #72235) posted at 2:58 PM on Wednesday, November 23rd, 2022

I’m glad you notified OBS and things will likely turn bad for her. Her little fantasy is about the be blown apart. What you did is completely legal, as long as you keep your cool and stay within the law.


It wasn't meant that he shouldn't tell OBS, on the contrary, but that whole scenario could have went south. Particularly when police got involved.

Bob7777

People come here hurting and feeling all kind of emotions, including shame and embarrassment. If you feel he hasn’t done something incorrectly tell him without calling names.

Dday Sept 7 2019 doing well in R
BH M 31 years

posts: 1989   ·   registered: Dec. 5th, 2019   ·   location: Texas DFW
id 8766445
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HalfTime2017 ( member #64366) posted at 4:21 PM on Wednesday, November 23rd, 2022

Jensen, sorry you're having to go through all of this. As someone who has been in your very same shoes, I understand and know why you did what you did. You just had to know and you wanted to confront them both, and that is absolutely understandable. I'm sure many on here would have done something very similar. Now that you know without a doubt she is not only cheating, but she is also protecting the other man, you have no other choice, so I'm glad you reached out to an attorney.

Pay close attention to what others are saying. Your WW is now going to be going after blood with you. YOU just ruined her fantasy and blew up her affair. There is a very very high likelihood that the AP will quickly dump your WW to save his own ass, and that in turn will piss off your WW b/c she will get dumped. You will bear the brunt of it now.

Best thing for you to do is to not engage her in private. Carry the VAR like suggested and initiate a no contact letter with her except for children stuff. Make sure she can not get you charged with a DV, b'c she will use that example of you stalking her at the park and following the AP to his house to ruin your reputation.

Listen, you have all you need to D. No need to push your WW, the AP or the BS any longer. You now need to work to protect yourself and your kids. That means, amicable discussions only via text and in person, and know that what you put in writing can be used by your WW in the divorce. Keep everything clean and cordial like a Judge will be reading your every correspondence.

Anything you share with your MIL will also be shared with your WW, so I would also cease most of that communication as well. MIL will mostly be lied to by your WW, and she will take her daughters side unfortunately. Stay safe Jensen. Sorry you're dealing with this mess, but at least now you know.

posts: 1377   ·   registered: Jul. 5th, 2018   ·   location: Cali
id 8766464
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bob7777 ( new member #79867) posted at 5:53 PM on Wednesday, November 23rd, 2022

Tanner

People come here hurting and feeling all kind of emotions, including shame and embarrassment. If you feel he hasn’t done something incorrectly tell him without calling names.


I agree, though I didn't call him names, it's different if I called you stupid or if I called your acting stupid. Yes I should have written, that his actions were rash and reckless, and that he got lucky with the reaction of police enforcement. He got very lucky.

posts: 19   ·   registered: Feb. 1st, 2022
id 8766475
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survrus ( member #67698) posted at 7:05 PM on Wednesday, November 23rd, 2022

It went better I would speculate than it did for most of us.

His biggest error was not parking his vehicle out of sight and going in on foot with cell phone recording video while they were in the car together.

Rationality and making the best choice is not easy under the circumstances however.

posts: 1232   ·   registered: Nov. 1st, 2018   ·   location: USA
id 8766480
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WontBeFooledAgai ( member #72671) posted at 7:19 PM on Wednesday, November 23rd, 2022

You have all you need to D, OP. There does not even need to be evidence that it is a PA. Flat out, your WW violated her vows by putting another man before you.

I do see what bob is saying in the sense that your WW will use anything against you. But I would have done the same thing with less composure though.

posts: 428   ·   registered: Jan. 26th, 2020
id 8766484
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Buffer ( member #71664) posted at 8:32 PM on Wednesday, November 23rd, 2022

Hi brother
Well we kind of knew that there was more than a morning meeting at the tire place. Her car at the park confirmed it. Now the gaslighting and blaming commences. It will be all your fault, you you and you. Accept none of that. She organised the meetings, she made the calls and texts, not you.
As she has accused you of stalking take care and carry a VAR at all times.
The normal advice about STD checks, talk through texts, try to exercise for the stress and eat healthy. The number 1 priority is looking after the children and yourself.
Take no bullshit from her and think before speaking. Anything said in the heat of the moment once said can’t be unheard.
Really think about what you need to know. But it is not good.
Take one day at a time.

Buffer

posts: 1249   ·   registered: Sep. 24th, 2019   ·   location: Australia
id 8766491
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justanotherperson ( new member #82218) posted at 8:35 PM on Wednesday, November 23rd, 2022

She called me and accused me of being "crazy" and a "stalker" and that she was calling the police.

You unfortunately do really have everything you need to get you going forward.

The approach with the OM could have gone badly. We never know the "pshyque" on other people's head and their reactions. Guns could have been involved and then shit really hits the fan. That is one of the lousy things about infidelity. We never know with whom our partners are involved with.

Having said that, and going with that quote above. Your wife rather prefers to coddle her boyfriend on a date in a nearby parking lot than respect you. She goes the lenght of getting bothered with you for following her and not letting her eat her cake and threatening to call the cops on you for trying to know what the hell she is doing to you...

Don't take this the wrong way but - the f#&k with her and her behaviour!

She was clearly trying to play you, but it seems you are a man not to be played with. Good for you.

Two things can happen now:

1 - She gets her head completely out of her ass for good and shows you that she really wants to put things right (she is nowhere near thinking about it in this way for now).

2 - She goes play with her boyfriend for as long as she wants - but never again on your "shift"!

Typical cheaters behaviour! It really gets on my nerves that even after completely cought they still try to minimize to the point of continuously mistreating their partners.

Sorry for the harsh words, but I needed to vent after reading your last post.

but I have spoken with her mother a few times and her mom says that my wife is "scared" and thinks that I need help. Im pretty sure her mom isn't buying it.

"You need help". Guess who really needs help?

And don't be so sure her mother understands. She may even understand deep down, but she will stand by her. Your wife is her daughter. She will stand by her no matter what. Ask me how I know...

The best you can do at the moment is taking confort in people in which you trust and that you know for a fact they respect you.

Stay strong. And get out of that mess Jensen4321.

P.S: The police attitude was great. Common sense goes a long way in this world.

P.S2:

I pumped it up this morning before work and directed her to go straight to the tire center before work (opens at 8am) not far from our home.

Typical once again. They want us to do the heavy lifting, always being there for their daily "needs" without us knowing we are helping them get ready to go eat the cake... Pure disrespect. They think they can play us like a fiddle (and many times we are indeed played like that before standing for ourselves).

P.S3:

Her body language was way off and she seemed spooked by the whole thing

Déjà Vu all over again here in my mind. Ty-pi-cal.

Be smart. Be inteligent. Take care of yourself.

[This message edited by justanotherperson at 4:44 AM, Thursday, November 24th]

"It can't rain all the time."

posts: 50   ·   registered: Oct. 23rd, 2022   ·   location: O´Porto
id 8766492
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BreakingBad ( member #75779) posted at 12:05 AM on Thursday, November 24th, 2022

Thanks for the update.

I'm sure this is all whiplash for you.

Less than 2 weeks ago your wife needed some work on tire. Now you've discovered your wife is having, at the bare minimum, an emotional affair but, given their meet ups, possibly also a physical affair. Then total denial by your wife, then the show down at the other man's house, and your wife making you the bad guy is the big finale!

I'm so, so sorry!

We can all relate to the trauma of betrayal, but the speed here and your wife's utter denial is next level (although many can still relate to that too).

I imagine your emotional upheaval is a force to be reckoned with. Stay healthy by making yourself eat, sleep when you can (and see a doctor if needed for sleep aids), hydrate, but avoid alcohol.

My support is with you as you make tough decisions.

"Don't you love it, don't you love it?No, I ain't happy yet.But I'm way less sad."[Credit to group AJR]

Me=BW; fWH=online affairs with 3 APs over 2.5-3 yrsBoth in IC & MCMarried 31 yrs now2 kids-both in HSAttempting R

posts: 286   ·   registered: Oct. 31st, 2020
id 8766522
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SI Staff ( Moderator #10) posted at 12:11 AM on Thursday, November 24th, 2022

Let’s stay on topic and get back to supporting the OP. When you feel the need to moderate please contact staff.

posts: 10009   ·   registered: May. 30th, 2002
id 8766523
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rambler ( member #43747) posted at 4:08 AM on Thursday, November 24th, 2022

Bib is 100% correct, you should not have done it the way you did it.

Even though the cops did not take action but could have.

The definition of stalking is engaging in a course of conduct directed at a specific person that would cause a reasonable person to fear for his or her safety or of others or suffer substantial emotional distress.


Your wife is telling ellos she is afraid of you. Even though there is no arrest or charges, there is a police report that can be used to get an order of protection against you.

Please tell your attorney about this. This can really blow up on you.

making it through

posts: 1350   ·   registered: Jun. 17th, 2014   ·   location: Chicago
id 8766540
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Ivory ( new member #52026) posted at 4:58 AM on Thursday, November 24th, 2022

What did they say was wrong with the tire? It might have been the colder weather, but you can call it divine intervention.
Work on you. Stay in your lane. Forget about her. She'd have to metamorphose into a different creature to be any good for you, and that may not be possible, and it won't be possible unless you go on ahead with your own life.
It was my experience, that as soon as I moved on she was right on my coat tails. Too late... I was already moving on.

posts: 13   ·   registered: Feb. 27th, 2016   ·   location: Florida
id 8766542
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lparistotle ( new member #78629) posted at 11:57 AM on Thursday, November 24th, 2022

Now that it is out of the bag. Stop playing her games. She is trying to tell everyone you are a crazy stalker. Inform the mother to tell the wife you are seeking a divorce. You no longer care what she does and go no contact. You have what you need. Proceed ad needed. Do not follow, call, or care what she does. Proceed as though that chapter of you life is closed.
Everyone will see through her games no need to explain yourself.

posts: 17   ·   registered: Apr. 8th, 2021   ·   location: US
id 8766555
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Greenwood ( new member #78486) posted at 9:15 AM on Friday, November 25th, 2022

Jensen, thank you for sharing your story. Both my ex and her AP acted in a very similar way when I discovered their affair. I made no threats of any kind and calmly told the AP to leave our house. My ex denied it and said "you're crazy I'm afraid for my safety", and she said the AP guy "feared for his safety and thought I was going to do something". I immediately filed for divorce but my ex responded by filing a false DV based on her and the AP being "afraid for their safety" this gave her temporary sole custody of our two young daughters.

My ex also often threatened to call the police whenever I tried discuss the situation with my her, and told friends and family that she was afraid for her safety. I was never violent nor ever made any threats to her or the AP. Based on your similar situation and the way your wife and AP reacted, I want to caution you that your ex may be planning to file a false DV to gain custody of your children and you should discuss this possibility with your divorce attorney. I pray that will not be the case but you should prepare for it and seek your attorney's advice. Best of luck to you!

[This message edited by Greenwood at 9:34 AM, Friday, November 25th]

posts: 10   ·   registered: Mar. 10th, 2021
id 8766660
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DobleTraicion ( member #78414) posted at 8:26 PM on Friday, November 25th, 2022

Thanks for taking the time to update. What a pathetic way to end a 22 year marriage.....death by infidelty.

I agree with this:

Now that it is out of the bag. Stop playing her games. She is trying to tell everyone you are a crazy stalker. Inform the mother to tell the wife you are seeking a divorce. You no longer care what she does and go no contact. You have what you need. Proceed as needed. Do not follow, call, or care what she does. Proceed as though that chapter of you life is closed.

Everyone will see through her games no need to explain yourself.

No talking, no discussion, all communication goes through attorneys, divorce her with extreme prejudice. Accusing YOU of being crazy in the face of being caught red handed is brazen gaslighting and wildly aggregious. Try hard to keep from getting hot...work at staying icy cold. Id also carry a VAR on you at all times given her recent accusations.

So, its all about you now. Your health, your healing, your recovery, and that of your kids of course.

Once again, so sorry man. What a damn sad way to spend the holidays.

Strength to you.

[This message edited by DobleTraicion at 8:28 PM, Friday, November 25th]

"You'd figure that in modern times, people wouldn't feel the need to get married if they didn't agree with the agenda"

~ lascarx

posts: 92   ·   registered: Mar. 2nd, 2021   ·   location: South
id 8766728
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