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Newest Member: Bert

Just Found Out :
He told me on Christmas

Topic is Sleeping.
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HouseOfPlane ( member #45739) posted at 11:36 PM on Wednesday, December 29th, 2021

yet knowing with every message I read all of terrible things he said to her -from our own home -every day.

For me, that was the worst of it.

I could get wanting to have something new and exciting in your life, the thrill of the hunt, of being wanted, etc. Sure as hell don’t approve, but based on years of watching weak-willed humans at work, can understand. But leave me the fuck out of it, at least.

Yet there it is, talking about me to the AP. Same for you. I know it feels like a knife shoved deep into your back.

Want to reiterate what someone else said upthread…see a lawyer.

First, knowledge is power, and power is control. Your recovery, with or without him, depends on you taking control.

Second, nothing says "you have to change permanently and forever" like aggressively moving to divorce. You are divorcing who he is today, maybe you could stay married to who he will be, but don’t wait. You drive the schedule. If says he needs time, "fuck that shit" is a valid response. You can turn it off at any time, or get remarried, but giving him time also gives him hope he doesn’t have to make the painful changes required. He does.

It’s likely that he can’t make the change, that he has checked out already, in which case getting the lawyer ASAP is all the better.

You’ve been heard, DND. Stay strong!

DDay 1986: R'd, it was hard, hard work.

“Tell me, what is it you plan to do
with your one wild and precious life?”
― Mary Oliver

posts: 2832   ·   registered: Nov. 25th, 2014
id 8706459
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HellFire ( member #59305) posted at 4:50 AM on Thursday, December 30th, 2021

He needs to get a new job. As long as he works with her, you won't be able to heal

What did her husband say?

posts: 4334   ·   registered: Jun. 20th, 2017   ·   location: The Midwest
id 8706489
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ISurvivedSoFar ( Guide #56915) posted at 12:42 PM on Thursday, December 30th, 2021

I want to reiterate what HouseOfPlane said.

Your recovery, with or without him, depends on you taking control.

This was so very true for me. The more I took back control after having lost my agency, the better I felt and the better I held my boundaries.

It is awful to find out the way you did and on the day you did. Now the question for you is what do you need right now to feel more in control? What you need now may not be what you need later and that is okay. But right now is important.

It could be being clear that you are blameless for his infidelity. Or it could be separating finances. Or...just think about what you need right now.

I also recommend getting into individual therapy to help you cope with the trauma. It would be great to find a therapist who specializes in infidelity trauma for the betrayed.

DDay Nov '16
Me: BS, a.k.a. MommaDom, Him: WS
2 DD's: one adult, one teen,1 DS: adult
Surviving means we promise ourselves we will get to the point where we can receive love and give love again.

posts: 2796   ·   registered: Jan. 15th, 2017
id 8706502
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Ariopolis ( member #75786) posted at 6:51 PM on Thursday, December 30th, 2021

told me he was in love with someone else

He defended it

What? He needs a big dose of reality real fast.

He has to be confronted with two and only two possibilities. Either lose the GF and work on the M together or end the M. There are no acceptable alternatives. He's either in with both feet or he's out.

Which does he prefer? He has two seconds to decide.

posts: 221   ·   registered: Nov. 2nd, 2020
id 8706554
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 DevastatedDnDer (original poster new member #79711) posted at 2:57 AM on Friday, December 31st, 2021

He has to be confronted with two and only two possibilities. Either lose the GF and work on the M together or end the M. There are no acceptable alternatives. He's either in with both feet or he's out.

I might have been a bit of an ass. I didn't just ask if he wanted a divorce but I also laid out to him what a divorce would look like with me having primary custody (due to childcare/work schedules) and him getting to be the "good dad" on the weekends which wouldn't feel that different for him anyway since he's never been good at disappointing people (which made him stay longer at work). I don't regret it though as it seems to have kicked him into starting the process to change. He is terrible with boundaries and saying no to others but he does love our son fiercely.

WH is hoping that he can find a therapist that deals with infidelity who actually has openings for him to be able to go in once a week to deal with his lack of boundaries and some other things that got us here. As of right now, he's acknowledged that he is not allowed to have his phone or computer with him (unless I'm looking at the screens too) and he needs to be mentally present when he's home.

Yet there it is, talking about me to the AP. Same for you. I know it feels like a knife shoved deep into your back.

My WH told me that speaking like this about each other's spouses is apparently semi-normalized at their workplace. Sadly, knowing many of the people he works with (and hearing some of the conversations myself when I'd been able to visit pre-covid) he isn't wrong. It makes me wonder what all of their spouses would think knowing that this is just a thing there.

As long as he works with her, you won't be able to heal

What did her husband say?

At this point we're fairly stuck with him in this job. He has taken himself off some projects they worked on together though so that part is good. There are still some projects he has to work with her on because of deadlines and I'm very nervous about that. In checking his phone/emails/messaging systems I found that I've already read the most offensive (to me) of the messages. I've spent the past few days pointing out specific things and asking "how would you like me saying X to Y?" I never got a response from OW's husband and from what I've been told by others it might not be an issue for him/her as they are not strictly monogamous.

I also recommend getting into individual therapy to help you cope with the trauma. It would be great to find a therapist who specializes in infidelity trauma for the betrayed.

I'm definitely thinking about it and looking into who is in the area. The shock/fight or flight I've been dealing with the past few days seems to have subsided a bit. I still have times I feel numb, angry, and sad about what he did. Making "ice plates" to throw/destroy in the driveway by freezing water on plastic plates has been very helpful for me. (thank you to whoever posted that on this site.) I still can't look at Christmas stuff without getting upset though, and can't stand hearing the OW's name spoken. I figure that will be the norm for me for a while though.

Me: BWHim: WHBeen together for 17 years, married 8 by time of DDAY which was Christmas night 2021.

posts: 13   ·   registered: Dec. 27th, 2021   ·   location: USA
id 8706642
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annb ( member #22386) posted at 2:18 PM on Sunday, January 2nd, 2022

Devastated, I don't think you will ever heal as long as he works with her. Can he switch departments or locations?

My WH affair partner lived across the country and worked at another site, and there was no way in hell I would allow ANY communication.

My WH started looking immediately after D-Day, took about six months, but he found one....a better job.

During this time the OW sent him two business-related emails, and WH cut her off at the pass, any communication from her went straight to his admin who handled the issue.

At minimum, I'd require your husband to start looking.

posts: 11507   ·   registered: Jan. 10th, 2009   ·   location: Northeast
id 8706999
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 DevastatedDnDer (original poster new member #79711) posted at 3:09 PM on Monday, January 3rd, 2022

Today is his first day back at work. He told me two days ago he was upset he told me he was in love with his coworker at all since it has made things very awkard with him/our other childhood friend. My WH discussed what boundaries he needs to have in place at home in not contacting the OW, but told me that he had to keep the work friendship going with her otherwise it would be "awkward." I told him many times I am not comfortable with that. With how adament he was about it I kind of...gave up I guess? I don't have the rage anymore so I don't have the energy to really fight him on this right now. He keeps reassuring me that he'll have boundaries at work with OW, that I'll be able to monitor it all on the messaging platform. I don't want to feel like I have to check up on them.

I feel like so much of my energy is being taken up by trying to balance protecting my child from a pandemic while giving him a safe/nurturing environment, trying to care for elderly parents -one of which just caught covid, and so much else that I just don't have the mental space to try and force the issue of my comfort with how he interacts with OW at work. After a week of fighting over it, seeing the beginnings of some change/him understanding how his actions affected me, and then this pushback...I'm just too tired and numb.

Me: BWHim: WHBeen together for 17 years, married 8 by time of DDAY which was Christmas night 2021.

posts: 13   ·   registered: Dec. 27th, 2021   ·   location: USA
id 8707131
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grubs ( member #77165) posted at 3:43 PM on Monday, January 3rd, 2022

I received the ILYBNILWU chat on my birthday and wasted another six months trying to fix things. If you think about it, what he did and my ex did, was almost designed to inflict the most pain possible. I'm pretty sure my ex did it so I would be the bad guy and end the marriage. A few months later she remarked on how I really stepped it up. Not three months after that she told me she was leaving. Things I learned is it wasn't my fault and one person isn't enough to make a marriage survive.

My WH discussed what boundaries he needs to have in place at home in not contacting the OW, but told me that he had to keep the work friendship going with her otherwise it would be "awkward." I told him many times I am not comfortable with that. With how adament he was about it I kind of...gave up I guess?


I'd suggest you move further down the plan B path. From your words so far since disclosure he's shown far more concern about his AP and her feelings than his family. It's probably time to consider seeking employment for yourself and seeking legal advice about your specific situation. R is hard work for both even when you are both in. He isn't at this point or he'd be treating her like she has the plague as any relationship with her is toxic to his family.

posts: 1130   ·   registered: Jan. 21st, 2021
id 8707135
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annb ( member #22386) posted at 9:30 PM on Monday, January 3rd, 2022

Unfortunately your husband does not understand the damage he has done.

Actions have consequences, he had an affair with a co-worker, he cannot ever be friends with her. Ever again. That friendship has to cease immediately, there's no negotiating. At all. I'm sorry. He also needs to find another job. Do you have access to his work emails? My WH gave me access to everything, his work emails, his work voicemails, and even when he left the company that OW worked for, he gave me access at his new place of employment.

Have him read Not Just Friends and How to Help Your Spouse Heal from an Affair.

He's more concerned about the AP than he is about his wife.

You may not have the energy to check up on him, but that may be the only way to stay vigilant and be certain his actions match his words.

I'll repeat myself, he cannot ever be friends with OW if he wants to save his marriage.

Your husband hasn't had any consequences for his betrayal. Stand firm in how you want to proceed going forward. He cannot continue as if nothing happened.

The old saying, don't sh*t where you eat bc you may put your job in jeopardy. He did exactly that and now he has to live with feeling awkward. Too freaking bad. He feels awkward? You feel decimated.

Please find the courage to insist on boundaries even though you have a lot on your plate right now.

BTW, is the OW married?

[This message edited by annb at 9:31 PM, Monday, January 3rd]

posts: 11507   ·   registered: Jan. 10th, 2009   ·   location: Northeast
id 8707184
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ChamomileTea ( Guide #53574) posted at 10:22 PM on Monday, January 3rd, 2022

I asked him what he was thinking would happen when he told me. He apparently thought we would sit down and have a rational discussion about his "discovering he has feelings for someone else" and would figure out ways for him to "fix it," and "fix us." Since I obviously didn't follow the narrative and immediately broke down that did not happen.

He told me two days ago he was upset he told me he was in love with his coworker at all since it has made things very awkard with him/our other childhood friend. My WH discussed what boundaries he needs to have in place at home in not contacting the OW, but told me that he had to keep the work friendship going with her otherwise it would be "awkward."

I feel like so much of my energy is being taken up by trying to balance protecting my child from a pandemic while giving him a safe/nurturing environment...

You know, I honestly think your WH is really very selfish and that he's got narcissistic tendencies if not full-blown narcissism. He apparently thought he'd lob this grenade at you, blow your life to smithereens, and then you'd wrap him up in gauze, pat him on the back, do your best pick-me polka, and make his life dreamy. rolleyes
You're exhausted and falling right into HIS disrespectful expectations. It's not okay that your HUSBAND is in love with a co-worker he sees every day. He's trying to NORMALIZE that shitty behavior, but in reality, that's something that people routinely lawyer up and curb their unremorseful, cheating spouse over. This isn't something that just happens. You have to ignore your boundaries and allow yourself to perceive that person as a romantic/sexual possibility.

In the "articles" section of The Healing Library, you'll find information on "the 180". I think at this point, I would see an attorney, find out what a divorce might look like and what I'd need to do to be prepared for one, then I'd do the 180 while getting my ducks in a row. The 180 will help you to emotionally detach and break through your current enmeshment. That doesn't mean you have to file. It just means that you're stepping back and keeping your options open. There's no point in working on R while your WS is actively involved with his love interest. Right now, you've got a husband with a girlfriend, and that's NOT what you signed on for. He can twist it however he likes, but the bottom line is that if he's still seeing her and having interactions with her, he's still involved.

This is your real life. He doesn't get to waste your years in ambivalence and disrespect. You can do better than that. Hell, alone is better than that. At least you don't have to share the remote and can make whatever you like for dinner. You have options. He seems to have forgotten that you're not chained up in the basement.

((hugs))

BW: 2004(online EAs),
2014 (multiple PAs)
Married 38 years;
in R with fWH for 7

No one can make you into a liar but you.

posts: 5431   ·   registered: Jun. 8th, 2016   ·   location: U.S.
id 8707205
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pureheartkit ( member #62345) posted at 4:58 AM on Tuesday, January 4th, 2022

Do not be soft on the talking to OW. They chose to lie and cheat and these are the consequences. I was soft and three years later they were STILL talking. Too bad there are feelings to be dealt with. He was disrespecting you and ignoring you. Acting like you weren't even there. I lived through that and it hurts. That lovey dovey stuff fades away but the damage it caused takes years to fix. If you let this linger on, it will eat at you and wreck any feelings you still have toward him. Too bad lovebirds, the limerence party is over.

Thank you everyone for your wisdom and healing.

posts: 2325   ·   registered: Jan. 19th, 2018
id 8707281
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Ariopolis ( member #75786) posted at 6:35 AM on Tuesday, January 4th, 2022

My WH discussed what boundaries he needs to have in place at home in not contacting the OW, but...

May I ask what boundaries did he came up with?

posts: 221   ·   registered: Nov. 2nd, 2020
id 8707289
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The1stWife ( member #58832) posted at 11:04 AM on Tuesday, January 4th, 2022

I received the ILYBNILWU chat on my birthday and wasted another six months trying to fix things. If you think about it, what he did and my ex did, was almost designed to inflict the most pain possible. I'm pretty sure my ex did it so I would be the bad guy and end the marriage. A few months later she remarked on how I really stepped it up. Not three months after that she told me she was leaving. Things I learned is it wasn't my fault and one person isn't enough to make a marriage survive.

Grubs and I had the same exact experience.

If your CH (cheating Husband) still insists "he needs to maintain a friendship with the OW b/c otherwise it will be awkward at work" then he doesn’t get it. He’s basically asking for your permission to continuing to cheat and have contact with the OW.

You are not reconciling. You are in LIMBO waiting for your H to stop his affair.

Dday1 my H would do anything to keep in touch with the OW. Including starting the affair up again while letting me believe we were reconciling.

When I found out on dday2 the affair had not stopped, I told him I was D him snd to get out. Right before that he ended the affair figuring I would never find out. But I did. The next few times the OW contacted him he showed me the email immediately and was shaking (visibly) b/c he knew I could possibly end the marriage.

He finally got it. Even though she no longer worked for him or with him it was clearly over.

Your recovery will not start until he leaves that job or she goes. Pick one. He has 20 seconds to decide. Period.

[This message edited by The1stWife at 11:06 AM, Tuesday, January 4th]

Survived two affairs and brink of Divorce. Happily reconciled.

posts: 11867   ·   registered: May. 19th, 2017
id 8707298
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 DevastatedDnDer (original poster new member #79711) posted at 5:29 PM on Wednesday, January 5th, 2022

May I ask what boundaries did he came up with?

No technology at home - which was the primary way he was having the affair. He was always on a particular messaging service with her (that I now get to check regularly), and would be messaging her from early morning to late at night. He began communicating with me more throughout the day while he is at work - so less of a cut off between work and home life. I also pointed out how many things he spoke/did with her were things he was supposed to do with a wife and not just a "good friend." He's now trying to change his habits to do those things with me again as those were things he slowly stopped doing in our marriage due to his own anxiety/stupidity.

Some of these things could be really simple like not wanting to talk to me about something as he didn't want me to react badly/get even the slightest bit angry because he was traumatized by his parent's anger reactions. Still not sure how he used to be OK talking with me about those kind of things for our first 15 years together, then somehow find me a threat, then goes to talk with someone else -like he used to with me -who has a similar trauma history to him. Yes, he's been to counseling for this before but seems to have backslid into letting his anxiety/issues rule him.

What did her husband say?

Other than showing her the messages I sent I don't think it really affected them. Most I heard was from her saying she was upset she would be losing her best friend. She says she is OK with the boundaries WH is putting up and such. They still have their work friendship as my WH didn't want to punish her for their lack of boundaries as it was "all his fault" and he knew she did not have a filter(yes, the new messages I'm seeing now are all just work related).


I'm still looking into what options there are and what I want to move forward with. I have access to all forms of communication they used. WH is seeing repercussions in the way another of our long term friends - his best guy friend - interacts with him (obviously angry/upset at my WH).

Me: BWHim: WHBeen together for 17 years, married 8 by time of DDAY which was Christmas night 2021.

posts: 13   ·   registered: Dec. 27th, 2021   ·   location: USA
id 8707678
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HellFire ( member #59305) posted at 5:57 PM on Wednesday, January 5th, 2022

It doesn't matter what you have access to. He works with her. They don't have to communicate through the apps,texts,etc, that you know about. They can talk at work.

And he will be friendly with her, because it was all his fault. Well. How gallant of him to fall on his sword for her. And a big fuck you to you.

Did you actually speak to her husband?

posts: 4334   ·   registered: Jun. 20th, 2017   ·   location: The Midwest
id 8707684
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Riverz ( member #79713) posted at 10:04 PM on Wednesday, January 5th, 2022

I have to agree with HellFire…no way in hell should they have ANY contact whatsoever.

He’s a liar and a cheater…don’t believe one word that comes out of that lying mouth of his!

Sending strength <3

posts: 130   ·   registered: Dec. 27th, 2021   ·   location: Canada
id 8707786
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TruthIsPower ( member #75776) posted at 8:47 PM on Thursday, January 6th, 2022

While I 100% agree with HellFire re NC if your WH decides to stay and work on R,

She says she is OK with the boundaries WH is putting up and such.

DDD, my question to you: from what point does the OW participate in your family's decision-making process? Who gave her the right to be OK or not OK?

You mentioned boundaries at home, what about boundaries at work? (that she apparently could agree or disagree with?)

And as for boundaries at home, why does he still have that messaging app on his device? Is it used for work purposes?

[This message edited by TruthIsPower at 8:54 PM, Thursday, January 6th]

"Stop giving people the reasons to love you. Not all will see the beauty of your soul. Those who know, those who know who you are, will love you with something fierce and never let you go. Those are the ones worth holding out for."

posts: 178   ·   registered: Oct. 30th, 2020   ·   location: US
id 8708014
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Faithfinder ( member #79750) posted at 10:08 PM on Thursday, January 6th, 2022

I am so sorry you are going through this. I found out early October my husband was cheating with a coworker, who is young enough to to be his daughter (24 year difference). I haven’t even served him paper and I just found out he proposed to her on New Years. It’s been less than a year as far as I know. I keep praying it was a midlife crisis. He abandoned me and the kids and funny enough still lives at home - for now. He plans in moving into an apartment with her and one of her roommates. Everyone says it will get better. I know it will but find yourself a good group of friends and a therapist. I have that and a relationship coach who went through the same thing twice. I have good days and some very bad. Just as you will.

Just know there is only one you, you are beautiful and unique. Please keep us posted.

Me: BW- 45
Him: WH - 50
AP -26, coworker
DDay10/3/2021, now engaged to OW 01/01/22
Married 17 years, together 21 years
3 kids
served separation papers 1/22

posts: 56   ·   registered: Jan. 6th, 2022
id 8708033
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Forks027 ( member #59996) posted at 2:24 AM on Friday, January 7th, 2022

They still have their work friendship

Sorry, but as long as this still exists, there's always going to be a likely chance of him backsliding. Do with that what you will.

posts: 382   ·   registered: Aug. 4th, 2017
id 8708097
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 DevastatedDnDer (original poster new member #79711) posted at 3:47 AM on Friday, January 7th, 2022

Who gave her the right to be OK or not OK?

My WH of course. The person who decided that their friendship needed to continue because he would "set boundaries" with her. And yes, the app is for work so he can't drop it.


Sorry, but as long as this still exists, there's always going to be a likely chance of him backsliding. Do with that what you will.

I know this and obviously told him that when he decided he wanted to step back from "no contact" ... Which never even happened or was enforced because he took back that promise after two days.

He's even arguing me on "semantics" saying that he never really betrayed me as he told me he had feelings for her "before it went anywhere" and he still loves me more. He used to agree and said he understood why it was a betrayal of my trust and such. Now I know that was lip service. He told me his therapist said he was "brave for letting his wife know" about his dilemma/change of feelings for his coworker, but he apparently didn't tell her he was having an emotional affair or what he did for the past three months.

Thank you for your kind words Faithfinder and Riverz. I'm finding more bad days as he keeps rationalizing why what he did wasn't so bad. It's really frustrating to feel like "he actually understands" and then go back to "nope, he is only thinking of himself as the victim again."

And he will be friendly with her, because it was all his fault. Well. How gallant of him to fall on his sword for her. And a big fuck you to you.

Did you actually speak to her husband?

I did speak to him. I've had no contact from him since letting him know of the EA. and you're right, very much feels like a big FU to me.

Me: BWHim: WHBeen together for 17 years, married 8 by time of DDAY which was Christmas night 2021.

posts: 13   ·   registered: Dec. 27th, 2021   ·   location: USA
id 8708112
Topic is Sleeping.
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