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Hey there I am new also. I have a question for you all.

Last MC...the very last (because I refused to go anymore) we had a heated discussion about lying vs omissions. My WS spouse seems to think that omitting telling me something is not the equivalent of lying.

I strongly disagreed with this. As probably is the case with most BS, the omission of the truth about the affair was huge. Along with the fact my WS omitting telling me a few other lunches, flirting etc. he had with other women beyond his AP. He felt that this was totally acceptable and I didn’t need to know. So why tell me.

What is everyone take on this? Is omitting facts the same as lying?

IMHO--abso-fucking-lutely. Omitting things is keeping/hiding truths or facts. To me that is the same. It is deceitful which might as well be called lying's brother. I suspect some of the same going on with my WS. I think he is telling only the bare minimum of what he thinks he can get away with. Not good enough.

[This message edited by Scubagrl at 10:17 PM, January 16th (Thursday)]

Hi ladies. I think Scuba has it. Forgetting to share something (a lunch with someone random) is one thing. Intentionally omitting because he knows it was questionable and he had bad intentions equals lying, 100%. I mean...you couldn't question it if you didn't know about it, so avoiding the lies (that he would certainly tell you if you knew he went to lunch) is absolutely the same as lying. That's some wayward-mindset bullshit right there.

Unless someone is in a complete psychotic break where they don't know reality, don't know they're married, mental illness is not a reason. I've been depressed almost my entire fucking life! I have never cheated on anyone. It's not fucking depression or ADHD or anxiety. It's weakness, fear, selfishness, self-centeredness, entitlement, lack of empathy and conscience. Those are character flaws, not mental illness.

Yes. All this. WH always got so upset about me making "character judgements." What was he so afraid of me knowing about his character? Why oh why did I not see the red flag? He was WAVING IT.

Coco, I'm sorry you're dealing with this. I don't know at what point we just say, I can't wait any longer to see if he's capable of change. For me it was a similar life situation. Maybe there's hope for true change... But I'm not moving halfway around the world and leaving the life I'm building here to find out. WH was already committed to the move, and had to go. After separation he started talking about coming back. It would not be good for his career, and he would probably have to leave active status. I said, if you can't be away from your children, then great, come back, and I'll help you to be with them. But don't come back for me. I don't want the responsibility for babying him through his resentment for me tanking his (sorry not sorry, just another one of those pesky character judgements).

Everyone knows being a military spouse makes life a lot harder. But in this case I think it forces us to reflect on the kind of life we want. For better or worse, it forces a decision every three years or so (or 1.5... Man that is A ROUGH timeline). There's little time to screw around being in limbo.

I didn't blow up WH's career (or MOW's military career) for the same reason - purely practical. It's becoming hard not to let the cat out of the bag though, because I've finally resolved to contact OBS (also military) and can't find him. I have a billion numbers and emails for OW polluting my contacts list, but zero for OBS. The only thing I can think is to contact other military members in the same circles.

One last military reference: Army values, MY ASS. And fuck you, Petraeus.

[This message edited by CallingSpades at 10:54 PM, January 16th, 2020 (Thursday)]

Fuck it. Just contacted someone who also knows AP, via Facebook. Shit is quite likely to hit the fan.

Hi, scuba and throwaway.

Yes, omitting facts is the same as lying. It's absolutely ridiculous that cheaters get so upset about being called liars. WTF did they think they were doing the whole time they were sneaking around? Dishonest, deceitful, lying!

One last military reference: Army values, MY ASS. And fuck you, Petraeus.

Right?! Marine Corps values my ass! And, they like to think they hold themselves to a higher standard than the other branches. Fuck them!

Hello womenz!

I took a much needed few weeks break from SI. My "resolution" for 2020 is to move on and stop dwelling on the past. Move on (while not forgetting/rugsweeping) and heal. I would check in on OW's facebook and haven't done that in 3 weeks. She's the past, not worth a second of my time and not a part of my future. Staying away from SI has been helping. But I do miss you womenz! I hope to check in once in awhile to see how everyone is doing.

Coco, I am sorry to see that you feel you are done with your fch. Checking in is absolutely common courtesy.

Throwaway, I agree with you. Intentionally omitting something is the same as lying.

As for me, I am doing really well. Last weekend was our little getaway (his Christmas present to me). We had an amazing time. Without a doubt, it was the best weekend I have had in years. We eat and drank all we wanted and spent some much needed quality time, just the two of us. We mentioned that it was really nice being just husband and wife, not mom and dad. We haven't gone more than a night away on vacation (and never flew somewhere) since I was pregnant with my first, 17 years ago. Now that our kids are teenagers, we realize we need to do this more often. It won't be long until they are out of the house and it will be just us. We both agreed that is one of the reasons why our marriage has been suffering so much these past 4-5 years.

Have a kickass weekend, womenz!

Coco - how you doing? You taking good care of yourself and those 5 nuts?

Spades - do share

Daisy - good to hear from you! I'm so glad you enjoyed your get away.

Throwaway - on the 2yr antiversary of dday this week, WH and I got into it about the terms lying and lying by omission. I actually began to draft a post about it on SI, but then got busy and didn't finish it.

IMHO, they are the exact same thing.

For some reason, my WH can't seem to refer to himself as a LIAR or to lying by omission as LYING, despite repeated discussions about it.

Technically, Webster's dictionary defines lying as by commission (ie saying I was at the store when I was really at the whore's). But EVERYTHING I've read ANYWHERE about infidelity says they are the same and should be referred to as LIES. My WH wants to call it "not telling the truth" which is classic passive language to make them feel better about themselves (there are all kinds of studies about the use of passive language and the subconscious implications of it - whether or not infidelity is involved).

Just as Brene Brown tells us we need to NAME it shame, I think a WS must NAME it what it is: LIES AND LYING.

Daisy, I'm glad you're doing well.

Chaos, I'm alright. I only have 3 nuts to take care of. My oldest is an adult and the 5th is my fch.

Fuckwart has been texting me all day. Checking in every time he does anything. I don't fucking care!

Oh for pity sake Coco. He's acting like a teenager that got busted breaking curfew the other night and trying to earn weekend night out privileges.

Look mom- I'm in WalMart

Look mom - I'm in Starbucks

Look mom - I'm at Suzie Q's house

Look mom - I'm taking out the trash

Look mom.....

Overcompensation much Fuckwart?

A-fucking-men chaos.

Fuckwart has been texting me all day. Checking in every time he does anything.

immediately struck me as a child saying "look mom! I heard you this time!"

I suspect this is a common pattern for Coco's WH - like my own. They will "get it" in the immediate aftermath of being called out.... only to somehow lose it once the dust settles.... treating respect and empathy like a kindergartner treats his lunch money.

Just curious who else is still struggling nearly 10 years after finding out about 3 affairs. Sometimes the mind movies are so difficult they just eat me up. It always seems like the elephant in the room. My BH does go to CR (which is a Christian based recovery program for sexual addiction) but to me it's a social club. I tried going once myself but felt so uncomfortable and didn't feel I could share with anyone. I'm no kid and I think that made it more difficult. I thought by this time I would be somewhat healed from it and I beat myself up for not getting counseling when I knew I should have. I never felt like BH told me the whole truth. I always wonder. Thanks for letting me share. God bless all here.

iamsurviving, I think you mean WH, right? It's never to late to go to IC.

I'm 5.5 years out from dday1, a little over 5 years out from dday2. About this time last year, I decided we were reconciled. Now, I feel like I'm done. I don't have mind movies and I don't get A triggers. I feel like I'm healed from the trauma of my H cheating. I'm done because he's still the same asshole he always has been.

Chaos and gmc, you guys are so eight! That's exactly what it feels like. "Oh, shit! I fucked up. Better kiss some ass until this blows over."

I have ignored him all day. Said goodbye and love you to our son when they left this morning. H said he loved me. I didn't say anything to him.

My friends aren't coming anymore. We're supposed to get a winter storm tomorrow morning, right when they were planning on driving. At least I don't have to clean anymore.

At least I don't have to clean anymore.

Well fuckity fucking Friday! I'll drink to that!

Fuckwart came home. My 12yo asked why I was in a bad mood. Fuckwart said probably because he didn't say Hi when he came in. Really? My mood doesn't have anything to do with the fact that he didn't contact me at all for 2 days?! Fucking idiot!

I can't even look at him. I certainly don't want to talk to him.

Not revealing the truth is shitty. Omission or speaking a non truth are equally monstrous, Even, sadistic.

Cheaters can go fick themselves!

Hi everyone! Have been overwhelmed with work, so couldn’t pop in

[This message edited by 20yrsagoBS at 2:49 PM, January 19th (Sunday)]

Last night, in bed, he picked up his couples communication book again. This is what he does. I get mad. He starts acting like he's going to do something. It will eventually taper off and no real changes will be made. He knows I'm not talking to him and he hasn't once tried talking to me. Perfect example of how he hasn't changed. Still the same passive aggressive, conflict avoidant, CoD asshole.

The problem isn't communication. The problem is he is a self centered fuckwart!

Welcome back TX, Ellie, missed you 😘

Feels like the gang is back together 🤪

Coco,

have you thought about giving him a KITD? Sounds like he deserves 1!!!!

Daisy, glad you had a great time away.

Welcome to the new kick ass Womenz, it’s a great place to be under such shitty conditions.

So not sure if any of you seen my post the other day after going to a party,

short version...

STBXWH bumped into me on the dance floor, said sorry for multiple things (everything) said he’s doing everything he can to win me back eventually, then kissed me while I stood in shock,

Before friends could react he moved away & left soon after,

My head was in a spin for (ashamed to say) too long afterwards, I’m actually talking days rather than just minutes.

Now I’m getting fucking angry with myself as I wasn’t prepared for it, I should of been, I should of known he would do something. Tbh the only thing we (friends & I) were worried & thought about was my safety, we covered every bloody scenario & had exit plans in place,

however we didn’t cover what he did do, so I’m left feeling very stupid & duh, people that know us but not ‘know’ us thought it was oh sooo sweet how he declared his undeniable love for me...

Thankfully he hasn’t reached out to me since but I’m still left feeling unsettled.

I guess what I’m asking for is some perspective from the womenz, you know my story, you know my situation, what the fuck was he even thinking when he done this & why the hell cant I get my head around it.

My dreams are now filled with him & happy ever afters...WTF!!!!

Also wanted to add, I don’t care if your lying about eating an extra bar of chocolate to anything infidelity related...A LIE IS A LIE,

it’s not to protect, or save anyone’s feelings, apart from themselves, that’s complete BS.

LYING IS LYING

Fuck them & fuck their LIES

BBE, sounds like typical abuser manipulation to me. Bonus for him that he got to do it in public so everyone would see what a good guy he is. This is not a man to be trusted, ever! Someone who tries to kill you isn't going to just change. He is very dangerous. He's trying to get his claws back into so he can control and abuse you more. Stay away from him!

Next time, maybe don't go to the party. It sucks that you may have to miss out on stuff because of him but your safety, your life!, is paramount. Honestly, why is he being welcomed to social events after what he did? Do people not understand how serious it was? I'm shocked that normal people would want an abusive attempted murderer in their midst. What is wrong with those people?!

I can't remember if I told you all that H and I have gone for coffee twice to talk per my therapist's suggestion. My H said yesterday that he wants to go today. I don't really want to, but I'm curious to hear what he has to say. Not because I'm hoping he'll start doing the right thing, just curious. I know I can outsmart him and I'm kind of looking forward to calling him on all his bullshit.

He is now using our children to try to manipulate me. Even I said I wasn't moving to cali in no uncertain terms, he still talked to our 16yo about it to the point that he was looking up info 9n the high school out there. I leaned into my son at dinner and said very clearly and firmly, "I am not going under any circumstances." Now, I'm the bad guy for being willing to split up the family. I said that's one way to look at it. Another way is that dad is willing to split up the family because his job is more important.

H's next tactic was to say that, if he doesn't accept the command, he'll have to retire early. Not true, but whatever. He doesn't say that to me. He says it to our son at dinner. Obvious manipulation tactic. That's so typical of him. Ya know what? I don't care. Poor him for getting to spend 20 years in his dream career while I was left alone over and over and over.