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I wouldn't bother with getting a receipt. He's already set his cover story up by saying they might have charged him for things he didn't buy.

I'd schedule a polygraph.

And fire the MC. They're doing far more harm to your marriage.

It sounds like you may have been working on R..but he hasn't been

WH here. One of my biggest focuses is earning my wife's trust back. DDay was 10 months ago for me, and I do everything in my power to make my wife feel safe. If she ever questions anything I go above and beyond to give her peace. We obviously didn't have a perfect marriage, but I was the one that broke our vows. I will continue to do anything I can to earn her heart back. Best of luck to you!

This type of WS behavior always grinds me the wrong way. He cheated. Says he wants to R. Will do anything. Wouldn't you think he would be salivating to find ways to show you he can be trusted. Checking in on his own to ease your mind. Not making you do it. Not whining about being checked on. Not lying about his whereabouts. He is too defensive to be truly remorseful. He needs some humility. Get the receipt.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 8:26 PM, Wednesday, October 13th]

The anger when you are asking questions is manipulation. It is to condition you out of questioning him. The fact that you know asking him about or questioning him on something that is not adding up is going to cause him to start a fight is very telling. You know what is going to happen because that is what has been happening. The reason your spidey senses are going off is because this is all very fucky. He is being cagey and uses anger to discourage you from questioning him. You go get that damn receipt yourself, just for your own edification. But please understand, he has been working on a story about what you may find since he realized you didn't buy his bullshit.

[This message edited by BigMammaJamma at 3:19 PM, October 13th (Wednesday)]

^ Well said.

OP - I assume lying is a boundary for you. Have you considered what the consequence of crossing this line will be?

He already has his story prepared for when you’ll get the receipt and things don’t add up: he picked someone else’s tab.

A WS pointed the process above, if the cheater wants to R he understands that monitoring his whereabouts isn’t about him being controlled, it’s about the BS feeling safe and dealing with the PTSD reactions inflicted on them by all the lying and gaslighting an affair comes with, in other words a WS who truly wants to R would first think of doing everything in their power to prove their innocence in an instance such as yours because their first thought is about the BS’ safety rather than feeling they’re "on a leash".

I’ll go a step further: if your WS really worked on R and understood the pain he inflicted on you, he would have informed you the plans have changed and he’s stopping for a (really expensive) chicken sandwich before even doing so.

One thing the affair, or rather the aftermath of it, taught me is that when your partner is getting angry when challenged is because something is actually fishy. Sorry OP, I hope you find some peace.

Find their site online. There might be costs posted but I doubt it. Call, tell them you are thinking of taking a friend to dinner and need prices for various items. If they want your business they will tell you. Also, you could just leave him with the baby, go to the restaurant and order a chicken sandwich. Bingo. You will have your answer

Just wanna say I'm sorry this happened. I feel ya. BTDT got the Tshirt.

I agree about getting the receipt.
Echoing other posts, it is up to the WAYWARD spouse to rebuild trust. The best analogy I've read is the "trust jar" example, in which honesty and accountability puts bank into that trust jar. As it builds up/grows, the BS tends (not always) to SLOWLY begin to trust again. One lie - even something small - can bring even the fullest jar of trust back to empty. Here, it's a double whammy of (a) lying about where he was, and (b) clearly lying about what he did/ordered and if he was with someone else, and (c) already creating an alibi of paying a bill even when he doesn't know it's accurate. NONE of these things would be OK with me - even before dday!

And.... it still comes back to you. What are your boundaries? Consequences for the CLEAR lies he still tells - bc no matter what that receipt shows, he lied about where he was, which is NOT ok after a dday. IIRC, How to Help Your Spouse Heal has rule #1 of NO MORE LIES -EVER, ABOUT ANYTHING.

It may be time to SERIOUSLY evaluate this MC. Yes, the BS does need to work on trust. AND, that does not happen in a vacuum an it does not fall solely on the BS' shoulders and it doesn't even BEGIN to happen until that trust jar is building consistently without eff ups. What you describe coming from your WS is a load of malarkey (and a big one at that). Every time you ask or check or whatever it IS an OPPORTUNITY to try and restore what he broke. Instead, he's behaving like a child. As long as his perspective comes from feeling "controlled", he is not a safe partner and R is not really w/in the realm of viability (rugsweeping is, but not R). A WS who is fully committed to R, will "get" it from an opportunity perspective.

I'm just so effing sorry. Sending strength and hugs.

Oh I already checked the menu, let's be clear, I know a chicken sandwich isn't $60. There is $45 unaccounted for. He was either drinking a ton or something else.

I know he wasn't sleeping with someone but that's not the point, it's the deceit. I called and am waiting for them to send me the itemized receipt. Anxiously waiting..

In terms of what I'll do, I don't know. A part of me is done. If he can't R the way I need him to, what's the point. If he doesn't get it now and is still being deceitful, I dont know if he'll ever get it. I'll tell him that and say I'm done. Ideally he'd realize his shit and change but I can't count on that.

The other part of me is, ugh he was doing so well. And we have a baby together - people i do not want to start over. It'll be hard, financially and everything else. Another part of me kinda wants to stick it to him, we aren't married yet, he says he wants to marry me. I kind of want to be like ok, let's get married and then I'm entitled to half of everything. He makes a lot more than i do and financially i'd be more secure that way, even if we break up in a year. I know that sounds kinda evil but.. it has crossed my mind.

I dont think he'd screw me over financially with the kid, etc. but we're not married so nothing is guaranteed. Yes i've already spoken to a lawyer.

You don't automatically get to split everything if you've only been married a short period of time. You'd probably have to stick with him 10 years or more to lay claim to anything more than you would get if you split up today. Give or take depending on your state. If he keeps lying and cheating - and taking ANY woman out to dinner without telling you IS at minimum an EA - then he's not worth it. It wouldn't make sense for you to marry and divorce him just to get a better split.

It's common knowledge around here that spouses who cheat before marriage also cheat after marriage. He's already a poor candidate for R. Complaining about being accountable isn't doing well. 6 months isn't a long time when the average time it takes to heal is 2-5 years and he just re-set the clock back to zero with these new lies. The only reason it looked like he was doing well is because he couldn't get around you monitoring him. Not because he's working on himself and changing from cheater to good partner. He's not giving you enough to work with. He might start if you make it clear that you are leaving and if he doesn't, he was never planning on giving you more in the first place.

I’m frustrated for you reading this. I don’t know what the ideal remorseful WS looks like but you’d think that at least they would leave no room for "just" excuses - "she is just a friend", "it was just a work call", "it was just a sandwich", "it was just the wrong charge", "it was just a meetup with a friend because we’re just friends"...

If there is a docket number you can call the restaurant and ask for what it was for because you need an itemisation for business purposes... if they can’t print an itemised one, though it’s doubtful they can’t because they need that information in house for buying stock.

Will you trust it’s innocent or not when you get proof of what you already know, that he lied?

people i do not want to start over. It'll be hard, financially and everything else.

I totally understand that.

But what's better - starting over? Or wasting more months and years you can't get back with someone who actually thinks you're dumb enough to believe in a $60 chicken sandwich (and who believes he's a smooth enough liar to say that with a straight face)? Because if starting over is hard at 39, it will be even more so at 45 or 50.

I feel for you - this is not an easy decision no matter what. But IMHO don't throw good time after bad. You're not married so right now a split would be a relatively easy thing, logistically speaking. Once you're married, it SO isn't.

You're in Texas like me. I'm pretty sure that you'd only get half of the marital assets that were accrued during the marriage. Not worth the money you'd have to spend to retain an attorney, and it's a giant hassle. You'll get child support regardless of whether you marry him or not.

I read the first part of the OP, and was inclined to believe the WH was being truthful and was just hanging out and texting you the whole time.

Then I read the second part.

I don't think you are overreacting. Not in the least.

He's lying -- and it isn't for nothing. Could be unrelated to being a lying cheater, but also could be totally related. You already know he's a liar, and now he just proved it again. It's the deceptive sneaky bullshit that's the issue here.

How exhausting. I'm sorry.

Who needs this shit? Get the f'ing itemized receipt lickety-split because you are NFA.

CT nailed it right here:

Here's the problem he's having... Checking is OPPORTUNITY. It's not a punishment. It's how he proves over the course of time that he can be trusted. His word is NOT good enough. He is, after all, a PROVEN LIAR. So, every time you check and he comes up clean, a little drop of trust is added to your empty trust bucket. The fact that he's feeling frustrated about it tells you that his empathy is with himself and not with you.

Instead, he went in the opposite direction and created a big ol' leak in that trust bucket.

The anger when you are asking questions is manipulation. It is to condition you out of questioning him.

Yep. Do not fall for this gaslighting bullshit. Do not worry about "crossing the line" with him. He lost that privilege. Call the restaurant and get the itemized receipt.

[This message edited by Thumos at 11:00 PM, Wednesday, October 13th]

My maternal grandmother grew up pre WW2 on a cattle property. She was lucky in her choice of husband. One of her sisters less so. To encapsulate the problem with her sister’s husband she explained that he would like to go into town and buy himself a seafood meal at a restaurant on his own. Her sister was rarely so lucky. To encapsulate my father, who was wonderful in some ways, but cheated on her daughter, she told another story. She was a good seamstress. My father opened his first office. My grandmother arranged to go in with my grandfather because she wanted to make a gift by fitting his office for curtains. When she got there he had two takeaway roast meals. She asked how he knew their timing so well. He said he had bought them both for him and offered them. At least in retrospect, her question was, what kind of man feels a need to buy himself two roast dinners for lunch? She had her answer when the affair surfaced, divorce happened and her only daughter never really was the same again. She could have said better and much worse things about my father, but trying not to be too hurtful to me, that was her take on him. I think the Chinese describe family with the expression ‘we all eat from the same rice bowl’. You husband may simply have wanted to kick back and treat himself like a king, maybe alone (or maybe not). At least by my Puritan standards that’s a little off. To lie about it as well makes it a problem. We can all be selfish, but he shouldn’t want to be that guy.

Lying by omission or commission are both lying. He did both. He's lying. Lying is hiding.

If he's trying to R and regain trust he's been given the wrong game plan to achieve either or both. Trust is earned in the first place. Trust after destroying the trust takes a lot more effort.

Actions speak louder than words. The words were untruths and the actions say it even louder.

Doesn't seem to be much to build any hopes on here.

he was doing so well

This isn't true. Sure, he's made a few steps in the right direction. But, 6 months past dday, and drinking with friends,while you are home? Getting frustrated with you. And thinking it's ok for the MC, at this point, to tell you you need to just trust him. No.

Look,he was texting and staying in touch all evening. The ONLY reason you know he was lying,is because he got sloppy,and forgot that receipt. This says he is a very skilled liar. He knows how to make you think all is well. Meanwhile, he's obviously at a lounge with another woman. You do know that,right? If it was a buddy, or he had a few drinks while eating dinner alone, he would have told you. Instead, he lied. He lied until he couldn't lie anymore, because of that receipt.

He's a lying liar, that lies.

He's not been remorseful. He's been compliant.

I see that you are unsure, because you have a baby. That child is a huge reason you need to take decisive action. He is probably having sex. And exposing you to possible deadly stds.

[This message edited by HellFire at 3:06 AM, Thursday, October 14th]

I dont think he'd screw me over financially with the kid, etc. but we're not married so nothing is guaranteed.

Please re-think this statement.

His selfishness, as evidenced by his behavior, will take priority over what is right.

Please do not think he would willingly give you more $ than he has to. In fact he may decide not to support you at all if you split up. Many people choose not to pay alimony or child support, despite the court order etc.

He's lying. You know it. He knows it. We all know it. And he's trying to use anger as a form of manipulation. Then uses the pity card "boo hoo hoo you don't trust me and this is proof of how you making my life miserable with your lack of trust over a chicken sandwich boo hoo hoo". The only chicken in this story is him.

He's lied. He's still lying and he's also most likely gotten his lame ass cover story in place by now and lined up a few buddies who will back him up.

IMHO - keep digging. And keep copies [in a safe place] of everything you find. That way if he destroys it or convinces you to destroy it - you still have it.

Now - the bitch in me says take what you have and the itemization and bring it up in y'all's next counseling session. His reaction in front of the counselor will be interesting. Keep in mind - this is a bold move and he could storm out of the room never to be heard from again.

He could also [now or later] become violent as you keep persisting. If you at any time do not feel safe in his presence - get out. Call 911. Run. Get the counselor to help. Call a hotline. Hint - the National Domestic Violence Hotline is 800.799.SAFE (7233) Keep that number safe. You do not have to take this behavior. NOTE - I'd rather be over dramatic here and have OP have this information than have her caught in a situation where she wishes she did.

See an attorney. You need to know what your life will look like without him in it.
Get tested for STDs. Go for all follow up testing.