@InkHulk: Thanks, good point! I saw your power in asking people to just drop it in your thread, so I will do the same at the end of this post.
@Hellfire: Thanks very much, and especially for the apology. Water off a ducks back for me (and it seems for you as well) and as I have said before I know your heart is in the right place. I know a lot of my story matches others, cheaters handbook and all that, but surely there are little differences between every story that makes them unique in their own way. My issue lately has been when asking "What am I / my wife doing wrong at this point?" the answer (paraphrasing) seems to be "Well you won't tell the OBS therefore you don't have a family unit and your wife doesn't respect you". I would dearly love people to come up with different points of view to this for me to ponder.
I know she has treated me like utter, utter shit. We have stuff we need to work through. But I can only call it like I see it. We have been together 17 years. I only started posting on this website about 2 months into the worst period I (let alone my relationship) have ever experienced. Of course the picture painted on here will be incredibly negative. But I would have thought that is the case in pretty much every new poster here. I have posted about 100 times, if I went back and posted 1700 times about all the good stuff in my relationship before all this began it would paint a different picture, no?
I guess the point I am trying to make is I have had 6 months of things getting progressively worse, before which I had no idea there was even a major issue in my marriage. In hindsight of course I can now see the minor issues which we will work on, but things were pretty bloody good! Now that things are on the upswing (about 2 months in), why is it so hard to fathom that we could be a family unit and things be reasonably good? (Genuine question for you and others)
How is your wife doing when it comes to regaining her love for you? Any head way there?
Yeah, definitely. Random acts of kindness, physical touch, thanking me for the small things, etc. Her enthusiasm about the MC is really heartening as well despite the MC basically telling her that she is a cheater and recommending books about infidelity. I really feel she is owning her shit. I am not jumping ahead though even if this reads like I am. I am taking plenty of time to myself to exercise body and mind and think things through.
For example, it wasn’t that long ago that your wife broke no contact with OM while you were on a family vacation, and an even less time since she spent your last couple’s vacation flirting with your male friends while ignoring you and telling you to "shut the fuck up" when you called her out.
Further to the above, is there a given timeline that needs to go by before changes can be accepted to be happening? I am well aware that these things happened. She was a fucking bitch to me. Maybe I have better capacity to forgive than others? I don't know, I like to think of this as mental strength rather than weakness but I know these are words on a screen to all of you so I can understand how it could come across as weakness. Last week our MC was all about our relationship history (which I obviously won't go into here) and at the end she said "wow", in all my years doing this I don't think I have met another couple who have such a backstory and with so much invested in a relationship. I won't let less than 1 year of her losing her mind completely dictate the rest of our lives. Note this also doesn't mean I will rugsweep.
There really doesn't seem to be any tension in the home anymore. Granted there was, and of course I acknowledge the kids would have sensed some of it, but even in those moments we were operated
quite well as co-parents and room mates
, but I feel like that was us at our worst.
NOT the same as having a healthy and complete marriage based on love and respect because, at the moment, she has neither for you. If there’s anything you need to focus on in MC, it should be that.
This is the kind of thing that I would like further discussion on. Taking away anything about OBS as I won't be responding about that after this, why do you say she has neither for me now? What do you think she should be doing that she isn't? (That question isn't just at you - I feel everyone's brain is clouded by the OBS thing, either that or I can't see the forest for the trees in the responses as that completely took over again)
It’s missing the most critical aspect of respect that is sorely lacking based on what your wife did. She blatantly told you she was going to be cheating whether you liked it or not.
Yeah, again, I know this and it was so fucked up. BUT that was then, this is now. Is it timeframe that means it can't be possible for her to be remorseful for it? Is it not enough therapy yet? I'd like more clarity from some of you why you are so sure there is no respect there now. Am very happy to be hit with 2x4s about this stuff, it will sink in a lot better with the other issue being banished from the conversation.
Your early decisions reeked of being fearful and although it does seem as there has been improvement in this area I am guessing there is a long way to go.
Always respect your opinion, but what I am doing (other than that which we won't speak of) which demonstrates fear? We were about to separate, I was willing to lose my marriage. I told the MC in our first session how I had gotten to the point of indifference and I meant it, the MC could see that and it had my wife in hysterics. I can't see what I am fearful of so am really interested.
Aside from the fact that your WW had fallen out of love with you, wanted to fuck another man, coerced you into letting her do it and then fell in love with him, you were a solid family unit. How you contine to twist everything to fit the narrative you want to believe continues to amaze me.
Weird huh? I was listening to a podcast a while back about couples who divorce but manage to stay amazing friends with each other. It resonated, I think if we were to split we would be able to remain civil with each other (and not just for the kids, because we like each other). As a family, I feel like we have been pretty solid, even at our worst points. Now that we are on the upswing, even better. As I have said a few times, I can only tell things as I see them, I am really not trying to paint a narrative.
So to quote myself from page 1:
Spoiler: I didn't tell (O)BS. If this triggers perhaps stop reading now.
There's really no point in anyone posting about that anymore as it will be ignored. Thanks for all of the other brilliant advice. Have said it before and will say it again - I was an absolute state when I first posted on this website. I have come along so much as a person since then, and have appreciated all of the advice I have received, and the anecdotes / experience from a range of viewpoints and personalities. I feel so much better equipped to deal with whatever is next, no matter the outcome because of it. So thanks, I appreciate it.