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Newest Member: Stark

Just Found Out :
Just a kiss... or 2?

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straightup ( member #78778) posted at 11:49 PM on Friday, August 26th, 2022

The polygraph, or the intimation that there will be one, is sometimes used to confirm data points of her detailed written timeline. It can be used to establish with some confidence that you are as close to truth as you are likely to get, and to build a relationship Mark II from that place.

Full disclosure - I did not require a polygraph from my WW, but I have been reading about that whole dance on sites like this for over a year, and I am persuaded they can be useful.

In your case, if what your wife has told you is approximately correct, we are talking one affair over a short period.

I am a litigator by trade ((raised by a Psychiatrist and one time hostage negotiator (and flagrant cheat)) and know something about chronologies.

I suggest this is a case where your wife should put down every tiny detail, thought and rationalization in her written chronology. I’m talking every detail, down to which way the sun was slanting as it came through the window, and how the angle changed minute by minute, so to speak. The chronology should span pages.

The facts in this case can be worked out, as opposed to many other types of case, where you know from the start that it will always be a ‘he said, she said’ case.

The detail, her reading out the chronology to you, and responding freely to probing and requests for clarification, will help you determine if you have the truth. It might also give you what you need to reconcile if you want that.

If you are honest and sincere people may deceive you. Be honest and sincere anyway.
What you spend years creating, others could destroy overnight. Create anyway.
Mother Teresa

posts: 169   ·   registered: May. 11th, 2021   ·   location: Australia
id 8752476
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Unsure2019 ( member #71350) posted at 12:24 AM on Saturday, August 27th, 2022

PFB84 ,
It looks like you may have a substantial portion of the truth. However, it’s HIGHLY unlikely that she stopped the BJ right in the middle of it. I would at the very least tell her you are scheduling a polygraph and that is definitely going to be one of the questions. I’m betting her story will change, and not for the better. As tempting as it is, do not rug sweep this.

posts: 223   ·   registered: Aug. 21st, 2019   ·   location: California
id 8752480
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Stevesn ( member #58312) posted at 3:58 AM on Saturday, August 27th, 2022

I just wanted to add, if it were me, I’d call the owner of the company and tell him that you are contemplating legal action against his company because of what his sales person did and that he will be hearing from your lawyer. I would add that this is not a person he should have representing his company.

The asshole should be out on his ass by the beginning of the week.

fBBF. Just before proposing, broke it off after her 2nd confirmed PA in 2 yrs. 9 mo later I met the wonderful woman I have spent the next 30 years with.

posts: 3454   ·   registered: Apr. 17th, 2017
id 8752503
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QuitePossible ( member #80726) posted at 5:23 AM on Saturday, August 27th, 2022

Please follow the playbook. It will put you in control. This means have her write out the timeline and take a poly.

There is a very large chance that you will receive a parking lot confession.

If she refuses the poly, then you know something is not right.

No poly equals 1 separation agreement.

posts: 52   ·   registered: Aug. 26th, 2022   ·   location: East Coast
id 8752508
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jb3199 ( member #27673) posted at 11:54 AM on Saturday, August 27th, 2022

If I were you I want to know to the absolute best of my ability if she had sex with this guy or not, actually stopped in the middle of oral sex or not, and if this was the only cheating in your relationship. Because if you don't do everything you can to answer those questions you will be losing precious finite time for the rest of your life thinking about them

i.e.---you want the truth. No matter how painful, your imagination of the unknown will multiply this to the nth degree.

Look, you are only a week out. You're still reeling. But once you do find a little stability, one of the easiest next steps is to get a thoroughly written timeline from her. Tell her to make it as detailed as possible--when they first met; alone chats; inappropriate chats(in detail); ANY activity(especially the bad ones)....right up until the present. The main reason for this is it is now written, and unchangeable, meaning that she can't change/evolve her story. If it is thorough, and accurate, it can really help as a starting point to rebuild trust. A long time member here often states that learning the hard truth now will usually be less damaging than a small lie down the road. For example, if you learned that she gave oral three times in her timeline, but six months from now, you learned that she kissed him on the cheek one day, it not only sets you back to zero in the recovery, but often times it is even worse. If there is one thing that needs to be at the forefront for a chance of success, it is total honesty. Any lie, no matter how large or small, will be so damaging, it makes any chance to rebuild trust impossible.

So there is a simple next step to take. It might not be so simple for her, but if she is serious in what she says, she will do it without hesitation.

BH-50s
WW-50s
2 boys
Married almost 30yrs.

All work and no play has just cost me my wife--Gary Puckett
D-Day(s): Enough
Accepting that I can/may end this marriage 7/2/14

posts: 4093   ·   registered: Feb. 21st, 2010   ·   location: northeast
id 8752515
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The1stWife ( member #58832) posted at 12:34 PM on Saturday, August 27th, 2022

just wanted to add, if it were me, I’d call the owner of the company and tell him that you are contemplating legal action against his company because of what his sales person did and that he will be hearing from your lawyer.

There is no "legal" action that can be undertaken b/c the affair or encounters were between two consenting adults.

The wife was not forced into the affair by the OM. While this OM may be a predator and do this often, it’s not illegal. I agree the company owner should know, but that’s it.

Survived two affairs and brink of Divorce. Happily reconciled.

posts: 12542   ·   registered: May. 19th, 2017
id 8752516
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straightup ( member #78778) posted at 1:12 PM on Saturday, August 27th, 2022

Perhaps, but an insinuated, but not acted out, threat of a social media assault may have the desired effect on the company owners. "Potential customers, do not let this company’s representatives into your home."

If you are honest and sincere people may deceive you. Be honest and sincere anyway.
What you spend years creating, others could destroy overnight. Create anyway.
Mother Teresa

posts: 169   ·   registered: May. 11th, 2021   ·   location: Australia
id 8752517
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 PFB84 (original poster member #80715) posted at 1:28 PM on Saturday, August 27th, 2022

I did tell the owners immediately, they apologized and said he would be spoken to. Of course, in my mind its more likely he's getting pats on the back and they're all laughing at me.

We had some very long and open conversations. I do think i have most of the timeline and the thought process. But i do have more questions and will take the advice and bring up a poly. It is pretty crazy how speaking openly about such unthinkable things does make it easier to process, rather than filling in the blanks with my imagination.

Thanks as always for the input

posts: 57   ·   registered: Aug. 25th, 2022
id 8752519
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Stevesn ( member #58312) posted at 1:38 PM on Saturday, August 27th, 2022

A man comes into my house for the purpose of business and physically interacts with my wife. I would be threatening lawsuit. The goal is not to get Into a court battle. The goal is to get this man fired. I would at least talk to a lawyer about sending a letter to the firm that an Investigation. Will be conducted and that the end result could be legal action.

I’d want to make this man’s life as miserable as possible. Do you have a case, probs not. That is not the goal. But I want more than "he will be talked to". Perhaps a financial settlement could be the end result. As others have said, social media in some form could be used if necessary to warn others off.

It’s all on the table if it were me. I’d not simply shy away from making this firm squirm.

fBBF. Just before proposing, broke it off after her 2nd confirmed PA in 2 yrs. 9 mo later I met the wonderful woman I have spent the next 30 years with.

posts: 3454   ·   registered: Apr. 17th, 2017
id 8752520
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QuitePossible ( member #80726) posted at 12:15 AM on Sunday, August 28th, 2022

One more thing….I strongly advise telling APs girlfriend.

Do some internet sleuthing, you can find her.

If not, hire a PI.

Telling her puts consequences on AP and probably gets him dumped. If not, she will at least be vigilant.

Once you find her, Invite her to confront your wife.

posts: 52   ·   registered: Aug. 26th, 2022   ·   location: East Coast
id 8752603
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 PFB84 (original poster member #80715) posted at 1:01 PM on Sunday, August 28th, 2022

I did find the girlfriends contact info. Messaged and texted her this morning. Will follow up if i dont hear back in case he is intercepting.

I feel like i have the timeline of the physical interactions down and i believe them. The communication in between though is something she is downplaying.

posts: 57   ·   registered: Aug. 25th, 2022
id 8752645
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The1stWife ( member #58832) posted at 1:16 PM on Sunday, August 28th, 2022

That’s a good plan.

Survived two affairs and brink of Divorce. Happily reconciled.

posts: 12542   ·   registered: May. 19th, 2017
id 8752646
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Trdd ( member #65989) posted at 2:03 PM on Sunday, August 28th, 2022

Good work contacting the GF of posom.

Is your WW still saying she stopped in the middle of sex? After looking to meet him again, setting it up, etc? If so, what about her story makes you think that is the full truth?

posts: 650   ·   registered: Aug. 27th, 2018   ·   location: US
id 8752651
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QuitePossible ( member #80726) posted at 3:00 PM on Sunday, August 28th, 2022

Good news. Stay strong! Keep pushing, don’t let it drop.

I just saw a quote in the "quotes forum".

"What is the strongest thing in the A?"
Answer: "YOU ARE!"

posts: 52   ·   registered: Aug. 26th, 2022   ·   location: East Coast
id 8752655
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Unhinged ( member #47977) posted at 5:26 PM on Sunday, August 28th, 2022

...I have so much trouble knowing how to act around her.

Brother, I think we all go through the same shit in those early days (weeks or months) after d-day. To say that discovery is disorienting is damned good example of an understatement. In precise clinical terms, it's a mind-fuck of epic proportions. I didn't know how to act around my XWW, either, or anyone else for that matter. Hell, I didn't even know how to act around myself.

Be authentic. That's the best advice I have when to comes to "acting" around a WS. It's good advice in general.

...in my mind its more likely he's getting pats on the back and they're all laughing at me.

While that's entirely possible, I doubt it's the truth. Personally, if I was the owner of the company, I'd be livid at the guy for jeopardizing the company's reputation and then question whether or not the guy was trustworthy enough to remain an employee. I think his associates might also feel the same way. There are always a few twisted folks out there who find infidelity amusing, but the vast majority of us don't find it funny at all.

Married 2005
D-Day April, 2015
Divorced May, 2022

"The Universe is not short on wake-up calls. We're just quick to hit the snooze button." -Brene Brown

posts: 6592   ·   registered: May. 21st, 2015   ·   location: Colorado
id 8752682
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 PFB84 (original poster member #80715) posted at 5:37 PM on Sunday, August 28th, 2022

Yes her story has stayed the same and i have gotten tons of additional details. She has answered everything, and I believe it. Every time a question pops into my head i write it down and then go through them, and everything has lined up and checked out so far.

I have the details of what lead up to the first kiss, the aftermath,what was going on in her head, all communication in between, and the 2nd encounter.

Have not heard from his GF yet. Any advice on what to say to her is appreciated.

posts: 57   ·   registered: Aug. 25th, 2022
id 8752687
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HellFire ( member #59305) posted at 6:38 PM on Sunday, August 28th, 2022

When you hear from his girlfriend, you tell her who you are, who your wife is, and that your wife had a physical affair with her boyfriend. You tell her info is still coming from your wife, but as of right now *this* is what happened..and tell her the why,and when. Tell her you are ok with keeping the lines of communication open between the two of you,so you can both share new details as they come in.

I understand you think you have all the info, because her story hasn't changed. You are very,very early in. The chances of you having all the info is very slim. After all,she already changed the original story.

A polygraph would serve you well.

Do not tell her you are posting here. Do not share your username.

posts: 4672   ·   registered: Jun. 20th, 2017   ·   location: The Midwest
id 8752691
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Justsomeguy ( member #65583) posted at 7:58 PM on Sunday, August 28th, 2022

Be cautious in your desire to believe your WW. You are only a short time in, a d will need time to process and resolve the woman in front of you and how she differs from who you thought you married. In my desperation to find some meaning in my WW'S A, I initially bought the "I was seduced by the AP" narrative, even though it was total bullshit. How could the woman I held in such regard simply be a shit person? Even now, after many years, she minimizes her behavior calling it her "crazy year" while awkwardly smirking. Yeah, she looks at the destruction of a family with the same seriousness as doing something out of character like getting a tattoo and dying her hair blue.

You may very well have a unicorn on your hands, but the best indication of future behavior is past behavior, and she has already betrayed you repeatedly and then lied to you. But of course, she will swear on her life that you now have the complete truth... until you don't. Then she will claim that she withheld the "next" truth in order to protect you or dome other reason, when in reality, she was trying to control the narrative and outcome. But, she will swear that "now", she has come clean. Wash, rinse, repeat... This is sadly, the norm in dealing with infidelity.

You are still in a state of shock and the trauma is fresh. It will take time to process everything. Give yourself time. Remember,everything she says is suspect and needs to be verified as much as possible. And even if you finally get as much truth as possible, you can still choose to D.

Me:55 STBXWW:55 DD#1: false confession of EA Dec. 2016. False R for a year.DD#2: confessed to year long PA Dec. 2 2017 (was about to be outed)Called it off and filed. Denied having an affair in court papers.

Divorced 2022!!!!

posts: 1319   ·   registered: Jul. 25th, 2018   ·   location: Canada
id 8752699
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Robert22205https ( member #65547) posted at 8:29 PM on Sunday, August 28th, 2022

The timeline she provided should have included all contact, messages, and conversations (including what they talked about) in between their meeting face to face.

posts: 2591   ·   registered: Jul. 22nd, 2018   ·   location: DC
id 8752705
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 PFB84 (original poster member #80715) posted at 10:50 PM on Sunday, August 28th, 2022

As for why I believe the story right now, my wife is the worst liar ive ever met. Obviously her behavior the last couple weeks says otherwise, but its true. She's anxious, over analytical, judgemental of others behavior especially cheaters (so a complete hypocrite now). Never even been drunk in her life. None of that means anything and none of that stopped her clearly, but what im getting at is i still know her better and i know how her mind works, what her tells are, etc.

The BJ stopped because that was the line that was crossed where reality finally set in. She started, compared it to having cold water dumped on her head, felt like she woke up, and said they were not having sex and it went too far. He didnt argue or try to force it. He didn't say he had to finish. I would not remotely consider believing this from anyone else, but with her and the way she is, her overthinking and panicking is not out of the realm of possibility. That combined with her searches about what the difference between 2nd and 3rd base are and other things like that have me leaning towards belief.

That doesnt mean im dropping it. Its early, im still digging and getting more info every day. She has not hesitated answering anything, agreed to restore deleted messages, etc. I am looking for any reason i can find to doubt every answer, and i have plenty of doubt, but all im saying is the timeline and details she has given do make sense so far.

She still had his fingers in her, she still put herself in that situation willingly where intercourse was the next step, im not rug sweeping just putting the puzzle together.

posts: 57   ·   registered: Aug. 25th, 2022
id 8752732
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