SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

That is a tough spot you are in. My wife was and is still open to discuss whatever i need to regarding the affair. I stopped asking at some point because i didn’t want anymore pain from trickle truth and i saw how punishing it was for my wife to discuss.

I did yell at my wife early on. I called her a bunch of names. I had a therapist, a few friends in real life who were supporting me. The friends were either WS or BS. I would share with them what was happening. They advised not to yell or get too emotional. This was impossible in the state I was in. It was impossible for me. I was pissed.

My wife was reluctant to continue IC, MC, and Al-Anon after about 6 months. I made those a condition of reconciliation. I was afraid and am afraid if she did not find the root causes of the affair, she might have another affair if similar issues arise. At some point she said she had it pretty much figured out. She continues to be open to questions and discussions. I had freakin doubts and trust issues up to a few weeks ago. They come and go.

I would suggest you find the support you need in real life. Exercise. Continue to read all the great stuff from the healing library, FAQ for BS, etc. Try the best you can to focus on you and your well being. That is easier said then done from my experience. Try and try some more. Taking care of you is the best thing you can do for you, your kids, and your marriage.

The anger definitely spilled over -- a whole bunch early on.

It is well earned anger.

It sounds like your wife isn't ready to help -- sure seems like she is blaming you and the M, either a little or a lot, but it's there if she can't be bothered to read books on recovery or see how other WS are helping their spouses.

As to not feeling enough?

Welcome to the horror show.

I knew I was enough, but man, it took me more than a year before I actually believed me or believed in me.

The one person in the world you thought had your back, steps out of the relationship.

But thing is, it was never on you.

Never.

All relationships have problems, not everyone chooses validation OUTSIDE of the relationship. That's a series of selfish, calculated choices.

That's about their issues.

Infidelity never fixes anything. Again, not on you.

We can't ever R solo, she needs to own HER poor coping methods and horrible choices.

She is saying that just because I read all this on the internet that it will take 2 to 5 years doesn't mean thats us or me. She is saying because i have read that, I'm working to them time lines. I need to stop.

Your WW is actually CORRECT about this. There is zero empirical evidence of this "2 to 5 year" recovery, this "rule of thumb". It is downright unhelpful, yet is frequently bandied about on this site without any supporting evidence whatsoever. Can someone share the "2 to 5 year" distribution curve with outliers/long-tails? What was the sample size? What were the cohorts - across income, location, ethnicity, duration of marriage, duration of affair, gender of partner who strayed, etc. There's none. Yet the resident "experts" will keep repeating this nonsense, as they have been for years.

I'm now at a stage where she is telling me that I need to stop asking her questions. I need to stop talking about the affair. It happened, we cant go back i need to move on and get over it so we can move on as a family. ....I have asked her to read the forums and she wont. She has read one book and wont read anymore. She has said in the past she will go to IC and CC but nothing has been done...She was willing to do the questions time after time and help me heal. But now I feel that she has said no more we need to stop this.

Well, if I understand you correctly:
- Your WW won't answer any more of your questions
- She won't read any forums
- She won't read any more books

How does that make you feel? What are your minimum requirements? Have you communicated that to her clearly?

Can someone share the "2 to 5 year" distribution curve with outliers/long-tails?

Anecdotal. Experiential. That's real evidence too. But feel free to begin the longitudinal study! My guess? Longer than 2 to 5 years many times and rarely shorter. Ugh.

Hi P,

I’m so sorry for what you are going through. Your pain comes through in your post. You are justified in your anger and hurt don’t forget that. I don’t know how long it will take you to be able to move on but the reality is you will never forget and will be triggered the rest of your life in your relationship with her. That’s the reality.

I do believe it is possible to come back from this as maybe she did learn a lesson. She seems from all your post to be at least trying.

The truth is you caught this affair early. She was in the process of transferring her love from you to him. That does not mean she does not love you but she fell into the trap of the new and exciting rush of feelings.

Thats why you are having a hard time because it was going to get worse but you snapped her back to reality quickly. (We would have to discuss the infamous "fog" as it gets misused but I think it’s real). Because you caught it early she realized hunky guy who cheats with a married woman probably was not going to be a good long term partner. Also she had a lot to lose you, kids, family.

You have mentioned this guys looks multiple times because you know the reality that he was good looking. Well you know what you need to do. Start working out. We all know why it is standard advise, looking better and being healthy can do nothing but good. Not for your wife but for yourself. Maybe for a future relationship? who knows but It will make you feel better.

As for your wife you need to try and stop calling her names. She definitely deserves it but no one can take constant abuse, No matter what evil they did. Talk about it but try and stop the name calling.

As for the fight you mentioned where you grabbed her wrist. Getting physical with her is a big no no. Leave the room and cool off if it goes there again. She got angry back as that was probably scary for her and can be interpreted as a step toward physical violence. It’s hard to judge each fight individually but it sounds like this one got extremely heated so she lashed out in anger too so I don’t know if what she said is permanent or was just said in the heat of the moment.

Maybe cheating was a deal breaker for you? Maybe you cannot get past it? I have no idea and it seems like you don’t know either. You need to work through that with your counselor. With that said…

I believe you are at the point you need marriage counseling. You need help guiding your conversations with each other. You both have decided to try and make this work so get some help.

Your wife is right about some things. All day everyday can’t be about the affair if your trying to rebuild. You need to try and have some good times together. Go out on dates and just have fun together. Even if you both have to fake it till you make it at first.

I believe the advise about having set times to discuss the affair so the rest of the time can be normal. you are not leaving immediately so you can shop around for a good counselor.

There is a reason people recommend Gottman institute counselors besides being the #1 largest collection of experience and science about relationships they have a good philosophy. 1 - should you be married? Because maybe you should not be? 2 - discussing the affair comes first as until you examine it throughly you can’t move on. 3- the relationship.

Google a Gottman counselor. You’ll very likely find one in your area. Also if you want some reading try his book "how to make love last" it walks through their philosophy. It even has practice examples of their quizzes they give to couples to test if they should be married. See if it sounds right for you. If not shop around. Start a separate thread here asking about counseling as a lot of people here have a great deal of experience with it and can help you know what to look for.

One thing I also believe that we men are bad at. The thing about us watching videos, listening to pod cast and reading books and articles and becoming super experts and then flooding the women with them because we want them to think like us. The 2 mandatory readings she needs to do are how to help your spouse heal from an affair by Linda McDonald and not just friends (the Gottman institute will make her read it) so there’s no getting out of it.

I don’t really have a great answer for you. Try to not get abusive and get some outside help. Use this place to vent as there are some real sharp people here. Work on yourself… It can’t hurt.

I am pulling for you and wish you the best of luck.

I can tell you this - I spent years sobbing at various levels of intensity of not being enough.

I'm almost 5 years out from DDay, 4 years from DDays 2-3 and just over 1 year out from when we had to send LTAP a Cease and Desist for CyberStaling/creating fake profiles trying to reach out.

Realize - I'm a BASGU [Bad Ass Sparkly Goddess Unicorn] and I spent a long time feeling not enough.

Recently - I had an epiphany of sorts. It came to me in a lightening bolt type way and changed my outlook.

It wasn't ME that wasn't enough for HIM. It was HIM feeling he was not enough for ME and choosing very poor coping skills.

I can't tell you how liberating and freeing that realization is.

You have mentioned this guys looks multiple times because you know the reality that he was good looking. Well you know what you need to do. Start working out. We all know why it is standard advise, looking better and being healthy can do nothing but good. Not for your wife but for yourself. Maybe for a future relationship? who knows but It will make you feel better.

THIS!!!

Man, the title of this post stopped me in my tracks. I feel like that every day since the 1st Dday. The voice in my head screams "if he lied for years about the affairs he had, why should you believe anything else he says? Why should you believe him when he tells you he loves you and that you're the only one for him? He obviously didn't feel that way before. He only feels that way now because he got caught." My heart screams "I want to believe him so badly!"

It's really hard to reconcile.

I'm sorry that I can't offer you advice. But I'm following this thread to see what the brilliant people of SI have to say. I have learned so much from people I don't even know on this site.

I wish you all the best and I hope you find peace in your heart.

Looking back I see how helpful it was that we had structured "affair talk" time. We started off doing the FANOS check-in almost daily. It was torture for her due to the shame, not sure it was the appropriate tool for affair aftermath, but it was a tool, gave us a blue print and a designated time. She could emotionally prepare. We eventually backed off to a couple times a week, then once a week, today as needed. I'm sure a wayward could speak to this better, she would struggle immensely with feelings of hopelessness when we'd discuss the affair with little reprieve. She'd voice depression in that this is how it's going to be for the rest of marriage. I can only imagine what that amount of shame is like.
I also found it crucial to acknowledge our progress. Still have to today.

Respecting our affair talk time forced me to work on myself. You mention struggling about being enough.. strikes at the core of us betrayed. I believe those answers have to come from within. I already made the mistake of giving her, and frankly everyone, too much power in how I felt about myself. It's my wife that kicked herself off the pedestal. Not the other way around.
Also isn't asking if they're thinking about the AP a catch 22? Hang in there. The first year really sucks.

Have you ever thought that your WW is 'just not that into you'?

All that you have posted on what she has done, is the bare minimum (changing numbers, quitting social media, and all the low hanging fruit). The harder stuff of delving deeper into the issues is avoided by your WW (yes, she is still in wayward thinking).

Your WW has been trying to make you forget, which is something that you will never be able to do. What can be done is that the memories fade, but will never go away. That is how we as a species, learn. Once we forget, we are liable to make the same errors again.

The avoidance of IC by your WW indicates that she is not willing to sort herself out for YOU. To make herself safe for YOU. She is still protecting herself by not facing her demons, wanting to sweep it all under the rug.

If your WW were truly 'into you', she would be moving heaven and earth to make herself safe for you, so that you can heal.

So, is she really committed to you and the M, or is she committed to hiding and avoiding?

ETA:
Possibly why you are feeling 'not good enough', is that your WW is not doing what she needs to be doing to make you feel otherwise. She is still trying to control the outcome, and not wholeheartedly cede control over to you.

She cedes control over the small things (low hanging fruit), but not the big things.

[This message edited by RocketRaccoon at 5:03 AM, Wednesday, May 18th]

I've been in a similar place, 1 year 1 month since dday, I decided to separate from my ww. It woke her up, she agreed go counselling and it has helped, were apart but spending time together to R. As she says its very hard to face whst she did, but by doing the 180 and offering her to never see her again I'm getting more appreciation/empathy feeling better of myself and shes not able to rug sweep if she wants us to work. Its still hard to work on myself and have my heart occupied wuth my love of 14 years, but its working so I would advise you be very strong and make her choose what she wants by leaving no choice other than actions, her actions will show you she wants you in the end.with looks well you can't take away a feeling thst she felt when she met you it just faded but was still more real and the affair probably faded alot quicker once the fog cleared up.

Hope this helps just another man dealing with the aftermath

"Acceptance asks only that you embrace what's true. Strange as it sounds, I don't think you've done that yet.... You're so outraged and surprised this shitty thing happened to you that there's a piece of you that isn't yet convinced it did. You're looking for the explanation, the loophole, the bright twist in the dark tale that reverses its course. Anyone would be. It's the reason I've had to narrate my own stories of injustice about seven thousand times, as if by raging about it once more the story will change and by the end of it I won't still be the woman hanging on the end of the line."― Cheryl Strayed, Tiny Beautiful Things: Advice on Love and Life from Dear Sugar

Acceptance asks only that you embrace what's true. The truth is that your wife committed adultery.

You do not need to confuse the truth by burdening yourself with thoughts of inadequancy: nor will doing so change the outcome.

You can choose to recover your marriage in a healthy, positive manner; however, it may take the courage to reach-out to a therapist/marriage counselor.

Rooting for you and your marriage! Sundance

Your WW can help you heal as the book suggests but only you can heal yourself.

You need to regain your self respect. You need to empower yourself. Start working out, get a hobby or reach out to old friends.

Acceptance is knowing you will be ok with or without your wife. This is not about her not going anywhere this needs to be whether or not you choose to go somewhere.

Also it is critical that you control you emotions. Walk away rather than show this anger.

Just my .02 as someone much further into this journey.

You can't have an R based on ultimatums and threats. Your wife appears to think a year is enough.

Healing is different for everyone and each R, M, or D look different.

I think you both need IC to work through things. I think learning a bit about trauma might do your wife some good.

I will have to say for me, like a lot of others, year 2 was worse. We both felt confident enough in our M to stand up for ourselves. It was during year 2 I almost got Divorced. A bad MC basically started to tell me to accept blame for the A and my wife took that as gospel . . .

Anyway I think IC for each of you is the right next step. You both have to heal more before you can come together.

If I had to guess I would say your wife is resentful of what she has done and it shows her remorse isn't as firm as you both might think. IC would help her figure out what she really wants and can help her understand her behavior warranted a D. Anything offered short of that is grace.

I, too, am interested in this post and all its replies - thanks for the wisdom to all.

I've wondered the same, believe me - and its a real ego downer - but I've come to the conclusion that in one way I am NOT enough, but this is his problem: I'm not new, not another woman, not someone to be conquered, not a stranger. His AP's were varied: big, skinny, fit, etc, but all were new to him. So, what's "enough" even mean?

Whatever the answer is that question, you've got to set an intension every day to be the person you want to be, mentally and physically, and do something to make that happen. Kindness, fitness, self-restraint come from within and can be learned and internalized, becoming habits for a better life with or without your WS.

Best to you.