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How did the weekend go? Did you make any decisions?

So I've talked to the OW. And still haven't talked to WS because he's currently completely inebriated. (All the acronyms around here make my head spin.)

I came home from the lake late yesterday afternoon because I had professional development most of this week for a new class I'm teaching in the upcoming school year. He wasn't home yet, but I knew he wouldn't be because we've talked like normal over the weekend and I knew he and his friends (the one guy I mentioned in my last post and a couple of fraternity brothers from out of town supposedly). Of course, I don't know anything for sure, but I think she was with him because based on what I can tell from checking the phone bill he hasn't called her at all, so either they broke up - unlikely since they both declared their intention to never be done with each other or some such high school sounding nonsense at various points in the messages I read - or there was no reason to call her because she was right there. Way more likely. Anyway, he got home last night, feigned interest in my weekend with the girls, acted disappointed that they stayed with Mama and Daddy instead of coming home (he does really miss them, I think, I'm just being hateful and bitter) and we had a pretty normal night and I went to bed early.

Today was fairly normal and we grilled and ate supper on the back porch. WS had beer which I made clear I thought was a horrible decision but also that I can't make his decisions for him. He was glued to his phone after dinner but he's in the middle of a huge case so I knew that would be his excuse if I said anything. The beer turned into bourbon which turned into him basically passing out on the couch. Much like last time, his phone was blowing up so this time I answered the "Why so silent sexy?" with a picture of him passed out and "Because he's had about a half a fifth of bourbon. Congrats on your big win."

Her team swept his team in all three games this weekend.

So then there are three dots for forever and then nothing, lol. I knew I shouldn't have said anything to her at all, but in for a penny, you know... I might as well go for it now because he's obviously going to find out I know so why not. I texted her again from his phone and said, "This is ________ and I know what's going on. You should know that for every lie he's told me, he's told you two." The phone rang almost instantly and I talked to her for probably twenty minutes. I'm not sure that I believe anything she said. I told her the truth about everything she asked me about that he was lying to her about - like that we were really just roommates, that I'd had an affair with someone I worked with soon after we married and broken his heart and he'd never gotten over it, about the prenup thing, that I'd confronted him about being in love with someone else and he'd admitted he did love her but I didn't know who she was - all kinds of stuff. I don't know if she believes me and I don't really care.

I thought talking to her would feel different, but really, she just feels kind of insignificant. I mean, who sleeps with a married man? How pathetic and trashy. It's sad, really. She's irrelevant to me in the bigger picture. It's him I have to deal with. That comes tomorrow I suppose. I have no idea what to say or what I want to do. I'm strangely numb. I was just sitting here staring at a book and not reading it so I thought I might as well post what happened here.

I can’t imagine the audacity and the utter lack of shame one must have to ask the wife of the man you’ve been fucking behind her back a ton of questions about their relationship as if you are the one who has been betrayed and to whom an explanation is owed.

I can’t imagine the audacity and the utter lack of shame one must have to ask the wife of the man you’ve been fucking behind her back a ton of questions about their relationship as if you are the one who has been betrayed and to whom an explanation is owed.

Do you have an appointment with with a divorce lawyer yet? No matter how the confrontation goes make/keep that appointment. Find out what divorce will look like. If he wants reconciliation you don’t have to make a decision until you’re ready.

You rock!!!!!!

At least you are not playing his game and you stood up for yourself! You will never regret that.

[This message edited by The1stWife at 12:15 PM, June 8th (Tuesday)]

She's irrelevant to me in the bigger picture. It's him I have to deal with.

Yes. So much yes.

Thinking of you NJ. Remember that this will pass. Either way. That there will come a time when you look back and know that you got you and your girls through all of this obscene ridiculousness.

(His drinking has reached levels that are far beyond occasional. When/how can you further engage his alcoholism support system? Ring an alarm bell? Fire off some kind of flare? Frankly, you have enough to deal with.)

^^ I was going to share the same sentiments that Mizzbak just posted about the OW’s irrelevance and your awareness of that.

Numbness is normal too, you’re likely in shock right now. I’m so sorry this is happening. From my own experience I found that despite everything I knew rationally about how irrelevant the AP was or how this really had nothing to do with me - the feelings of bargaining, rage, depression, etc. were inevitable along with the eventual questioning of whether it really was *me* that may have been the issue somehow (insecurities/low-self worth of my own triggered and eventually reared its ugly head).

Be kind to yourself along this path. Trust your own instincts and be there for yourself as much as you can. Allow yourself to go through the emotions as they come and get support from safe people. ((((NDJC))))

I can’t imagine the audacity and the utter lack of shame one must have to ask the wife of the man you’ve been fucking behind her back a ton of questions about their relationship as if you are the one who has been betrayed and to whom an explanation is owed.

seriously. Smdh.

NJ, it sounds like you might be over it. Just all of it. I want to acknowledge that while his drinking is part of the equation (perhaps especially why you seem just kinda done), please do not let him deflect this all to his drinking. I am an alcoholic and while I have had some slips, I've never slipped onto someone's junk.....

In addition to talking to a lawyer and an IC, maybe try and hit up an Al Anon meeting? Loads of support to find there, too.

Hang in there, peace and power to you.

I can’t imagine the audacity and the utter lack of shame one must have to ask the wife of the man you’ve been fucking behind her back a ton of questions about their relationship as if you are the one who has been betrayed and to whom an explanation is owed.

Yes, I have to agree. Having a rather bold personality as well, I was almost impressed in spite of myself. I felt kind of like one of the Real Housewives after it was all over. Maybe I'll start wearing cocktail dresses in the middle of the day and throwing martinis on people who annoy me.

WS didn't make it in to the office today. We had quite the talk. He says this all started in early December when she tagged him in a Facebook post after her mom found some high school memorabilia in a closet or something like that. I went back and looked and sure enough, there it was. I've never been the jealous type so I don't pay attention to who posts what on social media or who he's friends with or anything like that. He said they started messaging and reminiscing about when they dated as freshman and sophomores and "then things just started." I asked him who was the first one to move the conversation from "Hey, remember when we went to Homecoming in 1994?" to "Hey - let's screw in the lobby bathroom" and he said he didn't remember but that things did get very intense very fast.

Obviously.

On December 28 he took a screenshot of a contract and there was a text notification across the top of the screen. It was from her and it said, "I thought I was your future." So "intense" seems to be an apt description. He told me he didn't mean any of the "I love yous" and the promises he made about being with her and about leaving me. He said that often he'd be drinking at night and have no idea what he'd said to her the next morning and have to carry on conversations blind the whole next day.

Um, I'm sorry? I'm not sure what I was supposed to say there.

When I pointed out that based on what I read he said a lot of that same kind of thing sober unless he was also hammered at work, he said he was just telling her what she wanted to hear because he felt bad and she might really be in love with him. She believes they are going to be together sometime in the near future. They've been together and having sex a couple of times a week pretty regularly almost since they started talking on Facebook. It was a lot.

So basically the only way I knew to respond was to tell him he is definitely a liar and possibly a psychopath. He's been selfish and shallow and lied to me and to our kids. He's betrayed us in unimaginable ways. I have no idea if I believe a thing he told me about her and how he feels about her or not. I told him as far as that goes, he's either completely lying to my face yet again, or he's confessing to playing with someone's life and feelings for what reason - just because he could? To spend the afternoon getting blow jobs in Hampton Inn Jacuzzi suites? Ugh. So gross. Ego and selfishness. I don't need a long explanation. That's exactly what it was.

Anyway, there's no need to go into the drawn out details. Suffice it to say he swears it's over (hmmm, doubtful) and deleted her number from his phone while I watched as if that proves anything. Then he unfriended her on FB and unfollowed her on IG. He swore repeatedly that he loves me, he's always loved me, he never wants to be without me and the girls, he knows what a mistake he made, he's so glad it's all out now and it's over.

What utter BS. None of this would be over if I hadn't found out about it! I don't believe for one second it is over. They just spent and entire weekend together. I swear I'm as mad that he thinks I'm a complete idiot as I am about anything else. He's saying he wants to go to rehab. He needs help. None of this would have happened if he hadn't started drinking again. He's been so overwhelmed with work, blah, blah, blah. I'm sure he does want to go to rehab. How convenient to disappear for 30, 60, 90 days, lol. Bless his heart.

I told him in no uncertain terms that he gets one shot to fix this. One. He's got to get his shit together and I'm not even sure what that looks like right now. I finally got an appointment with a really good attorney next Tuesday. He argued and finally got angry and pushed back, but he eventually realized I was serious and packed enough stuff for what looked like several nights. I have no idea where he went. I doubt he went to his mom and stepdad's. I haven't heard from him since he left earlier this afternoon. I guess we'll see what happens next. I think I have to tell the girls something, but I'm not sure what. That's the next decision I have to make. And I need to find an IC.

I have no idea where he went

He most likely went to her. You're right, it's not over. And he didn't make "a mistake," he made decisions that were harmful to your marriage. He's glad it's out? If he really wanted to make amends he wouldn't have waited to get caught to be remorseful. He told her he loved her because he felt sorry for her? How sweet of him. Know that his choices were NOT your fault. I'm sorry.

You are doing very well. Keep it up and make him accountable for his deliberate actions. These are choices he made, not mistakes.

Do what feels right to you not him.

One day at a time.

She's irrelevant to me in the bigger picture. It's him I have to deal with

.

Hello NDJC! You're doing great! I agree that she isn't the priority. What YOU want going forward is the focus. BUT... I hate to do this, but maybe we should focus on OW for a minute. My alarm bells are ringing because things progressed from 0-60 MPH so quickly - she was focused on contracts (the future) way back in December ALMOST IMMEDIATELY after the "relationship" started if your WH's timeline is to be believed. She's in the midst of a divorce from her current husband as far as we know. Not sure how much of HER BS shared with your WH can be believed, BTW. She brazenly called you and grilled you as if she were the BS owed an explanation! Maybe we're on the edge of bunny boiler behavior here? Sorry, but something doesn't feel right.

Are you planning on contacting her supposedly soon to be ex to out the affair? What are your spider senses telling you about her?

Yeah he probably went to her. My WS went straight to AP right after I found out. She didn’t think I was serious about giving her the boot at the time. And this: “None of this would have happened if he hadn't started drinking again.”

Totally saw that statement coming…lord forbid he takes accountability for the many purposeful choices he made over all this time. It’s all the alcohol’s fault! Yeah…right.

It’s annoying that you’re the one who’s been betrayed and who’s reality is unraveling but he gets to stomp off and be upset when you express methods you’re looking into to protect yourself…poor thing

He’s really taking his one chance seriously right now by packing up and running off right? Literally so selfish, couldn’t care less how this may be impacting you or the girls emotionally…

One other thing I remember I was concerned about during those days was my money and how much access WS had to completely ruin my financial security so I made it a point to remove her name or move my money if necessary…I was fair but didn’t want her to have that power. Not sure if that’s an issue for you. My friend is also experiencing an issue where her STBX didn’t allow for her to grab the cable boxes and canceled the cable in her name (while keeping the boxes and getting a restraining order so she can’t come to their home) and after racking up $700…if you have anything in your name that could effect you personally that he has access to maybe look into removing him just in case he gets vindictive in any way.

[This message edited by maise at 9:01 PM, June 8th (Tuesday)]

He most likely went to her. You're right, it's not over. And he didn't make "a mistake," he made decisions that were harmful to your marriage. He's glad it's out? If he really wanted to make amends he wouldn't have waited to get caught to be remorseful. He told her he loved her because he felt sorry for her? How sweet of him. Know that his choices were NOT your fault. I'm sorry.

Yep. That's exactly where he is. About thirty minutes ago I started getting texts from him that are definitely not from him. I'm 99.9% sure they're from her fishing for information about what he's told me about her or about them together. I'm absolutely not giving her the satisfaction of a reply. I am a 43 year old woman. I am the mother of a 15 year old and a 13 year old. He is a 47 year old man and the father of those children. I played sorority girl games when I was a sorority girl. This is not a game. There are actual lives and people involved here. This isn't life and death of course, and I know that my girls and I are extraordinarily fortunate that we don't have to be concerned for our safety or have any immediate financial problems like many people do, but this is still a potentially a life-altering and emotionally traumatic situation. This ridiculous woman running around town pretending to be my equally ridiculous husband's wife at doctors appointments has two teenage children of her own. I honestly feel terrible for them too. Who knows what kind of bullshit the two of them are exposing those kids to. I would contact her H but I think she's going through a divorce and her ex isn't very stable himself. I may do some subtle research through my MIL and see what she knows about the family. I'm getting ready to come clean with the whole story to her anyway. She's going to be LIVID with WS about both the drinking and the bathroom fornicating.

Oh I'm so mad. I've kept it together pretty well except the one night I went outside and cried but this is just beyond everything. Who on God's green earth does she think she is to pretend to be him and text me? And what is he doing letting her? I don't know if reconciliation is a possibility or not. I don't think I have the patience to work through all of this. I haven't even started to process the messages and pictures I saw initially much less what's happened since and now there's something new every day. I don't know if I'm a massive snob or if I have a massive ego or what it is, but as sad and broken-hearted as I am, what keeps going through my head is, "How dare you think you can treat me that way? What world do you live in that you thought I wouldn't raise nine kinds of holy hell before I would put up with this kind of disrespect and humiliation?"

No. Just no. Absolutely not.

NDJC:

You are doing very well. You obviously have a good head on your shoulders, but still, the emotional trauma is real and it is hard to believe this is happening. IC for you is a great idea. The lies they tell when confronted can be so insulting. Glad you see it. You have accurately identified the “why”. Ego and selfishness. Because he wanted to and he could. Accept no blameshifting. The alcohol did not make him a liar and a cheat. You have laid out your boundaries and he left. Assume he is still in the A. No contact is your friend. Read in the healing library and implement a hard 180. Do not engage him. This will give you a chance to get your bearings. Follow up with the attorney.

To me one of the biggest attributes in being able to R with my fWW, and this goes for any WS, is humility. Your WH has just been exposed as a venal, selfish liar and a cheat just for some cheap sex on the side. Does he have it in him to be completely humbled, and accept what he has become? And even if he is completely remorseful and humble, you are under no obligation to try and R with him. He has made a mess of his life and it is up to him to become a better man no matter whether you R or D.

Always value yourself.

Good luck.

You have a life to live. A professional life and children to consider. Being a child of alcoholic parents myself, I feel for your children. All of this is very unfair to you, but you have been left to help guide your children through his disasters. Strength to you. Be honest with them in an age appropriate manner.

I don't know if reconciliation is a possibility or not.

I wouldn’t focus on this, you’re experiencing a lot of trauma right now and he’s still abandoning, neglecting, disrespecting you and whatever else. You don’t deserve this. One thing I remember doing was not forcing myself to really think about R or D and instead attempting to do what I could to protect myself however I could (externally like finances and such) and then once I got into IC my IC taught me to learn to focus on my own emotional well-being, something I habitually put on the back burner for others regularly. I was very codependent so it took a while for me to really hone in on myself rather than my WS. Don’t pressure yourself for R or D though. As of right now he took off to the AP after knowing he just destroyed the world you and your girls thought you knew. R is not a gift he deserves with the choices he’s making right now.

I don't know if I'm a massive snob or if I have a massive ego or what it is, but as sad and broken-hearted as I am, what keeps going through my head is, "How dare you think you can treat me that way? What world do you live in that you thought I wouldn't raise nine kinds of holy hell before I would put up with this kind of disrespect and humiliation?"

You’re not a snob or filled with unhealthy ego, you know you don’t deserve this. You know you deserve better than what he’s doing to you. And you’re so right, you’re worthy of better than this.

Want to chime in that you are doing great.

As I read the thread, I thought of suggesting the book "How to Help Your Spouse Heal After Your Affair" by Linda MacDonald. IMO, it's a great primer on infidelity. And a short read. I thought it may be helpful bc I believe it has a chapter on confronting (tho I may be confusing it with "Not Just Friends" by Shirley Glass, which is a MUCH more in depth book on infidelity). In any event, both are, IMHO, good books and you may still find them helpful.

As to the "crazy" stuff a BS does after discovering their partner's A, an excellent book that describes that "trauma response" is "Cheating in a Nutshell". HOWEVER - be aware that this book is downright anti-reconciliation IMO. There is a thread about the book in the Book Club Forum on SI, that you can read to see if you think it would be helpful. It was very helpful to me to have the specific reactions to the TRAUMA of infidelity laid out.

Another resource I found helpful was the 2-part interview of Marnie Breecker on Duane Osterlind's "The Addicted Mind" podcast. Although geared to sex addicts, I found nearly all of it 100% spot on for my response to learning of my WH's As. This is more about understanding & validating the bases for why we often behave irrationally in the wake of dday (discovery day). Breecker & Osterlind went on to do their own podcast called "helping couples heal" which I also found VERY helpful. BC your WH is an alcoholic, I suspect much of the SA (sex addiction) stuff may resonate (my WH is what I'd call borderline on both the alcohol and sex addiction issues - but definitely in the conflict avoid + perfection camp).

If you are having trouble with trauma & trauma response, "The Body Keeps the Score" by Bassel Van der Kolk is kind of the bible on trauma. It's not at all about infidelity, but trauma, C-PTSD, etc. Your posts sound like aren't too far down the rabbit hole, so it may not be as helpful as the infidelity-specific stuff (FWIW, I was an ABSOLUTE wreck for months & months - to the point where I self harmed bc the physical pain of putting out a lit cigarette on my body was BETTER than the emotional pain of learning about my WH's secret life).

Finally, there's a great book called "living & loving after betrayal" by Stosne. This is about YOU and working to find your own value and meaning after infidelity (with or w/o the spouse... IOW, I think it's helpful regardless of whether your WH is able to step up and clean up his mess and make SERIOUS changes so you can attempt to reconcile, or if you decide to walk).

I think all BS struggle significantly with the "why" aspect of it all. For me, it really comes down to they did it because they thought they could get away with it. IMO, even if a WS has a single affair, their internal world is full of all the same bullshit that goes into being an alcoholic or addict.... selfish, entitled, rationalizing like a champ, and the first lie they tell is to themselves.

As hard as all of this is, you really do seem to be handling it like a champ.

And like all things here on SI, take what you need and leave the rest.

Godspeed to you.

ETA (edited to add):

while I have had some slips, I've never slipped onto someone's junk.....

Ain' that the ever loving truth!

And I agree that you may need to look into protecting yourself financially. No matter how well we think we "know" our WS, they can turn ugly and do even more stupid (or evil) crap than we thought. The drinking doesn't help.

How dare you think you can treat me that way? What world do you live in that you thought I wouldn't raise nine kinds of holy hell before I would put up with this kind of disrespect and humiliation?"

A-friggen-men, sister... A-friggen-men.

[This message edited by gmc94 at 9:26 PM, June 8th, 2021 (Tuesday)]

BUT... I hate to do this, but maybe we should focus on OW for a minute. My alarm bells are ringing because things progressed from 0-60 MPH so quickly - she was focused on contracts (the future) way back in December ALMOST IMMEDIATELY after the "relationship" started if your WH's timeline is to be believed. She's in the midst of a divorce from her current husband as far as we know. Not sure how much of HER BS shared with your WH can be believed, BTW. She brazenly called you and grilled you as if she were the BS owed an explanation! Maybe we're on the edge of bunny boiler behavior here? Sorry, but something doesn't feel right.

Are you planning on contacting her supposedly soon to be ex to out the affair? What are your spider senses telling you about her?

Yea, I just posted above that I'm sure she was texting me from WH's phone earlier pretending to be him. I think it's odd too that it went straight to "let's be together forever!" especially because I do believe WH when he says that he was just telling her what she wanted to hear. Not because I'm excusing his behavior or because I believe he's telling me the truth about everything or anything, but because he hates conflict and I'm sure he was having a great time doing what he was doing with her but had absolutely no intention of disrupting his extremely comfortable life here at home. Why would he as long as he could have it both ways?

When I asked him about how they went from FB messenger to "I'm your future," he gave me some bs about how they'd known each other since they were in middle school and when they started talking it was like they were dating again and they'd started joking about it and that's how things got flirty. I went to kindergarten with my eventual high school boyfriend. We're friends on FB and follow each other on IG and Twitter. He has a wife and kids and pets. I haven't seen him in person since we were in grad school. I cannot imagine a few DM's making either of us decide that we're going to throw everything away because we're meant to be together after all these years. The very idea is absurd.

Personally I wish he'd been honest enough to say "It was really hot when she sent me pictures of her tits and she looks great in a thong and you know I'm an ass man." Because that's what I think it's really about for him and I don't know why he won't just tell me that. That I can work with. All the talking in circles just pisses me off.

I have no idea what her deal is. If she is in the middle of an awful divorce maybe she is looking for someone she thinks is stable (so good decision on her part, right?) or maybe it's nostalgia? I'm utterly disgusted and furious with him but he is cute and successful and I can see why she'd be into him. It's his fault for not stopping the whole thing before it even started, of course.

A lot of these hs romances end in two torn up families. Some sort of imprinting. Get ducks in a row. There are several people I know who dumped very nice bs for their hs loves. It’s shitty as hell but please be prepared.

I write this often. Look at what needs to be done next and do that. Once done do the next. Make a list of priorities and concentrate on those. Trying to make future plans in beyond you right now. Just do the next thing