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I am as sorry and disgusted as anyone else that this happened. However, I do not think this should be a topic here.

I am also sorry and disgusted that a Muslim man was Tazed and dragged to his death while defending his family livelehood. He was a middle aged Doordash driver picking up a delivery. The Mayor came out with a message that people should take more care when parking their cars

It was two teenage girls. They were shepherded away and I have not heard that they have had any repercussions. The situation has been quietly forgotten. One of the girls was heard to complain that she needed her cell phone which was in the in the crashed destroyed stolen car.

I write this because awful things are happening all the time. I myself have been maced and robbed. No one was ever found or punished. We could have many posts regarding the current violence being perpetrated but I think that this is not the forum for it.

Cissie - I respectfully disagree.

The poster felt the need to vent by starting this thread. Venting helped her, I'm sure. SI helps people on many issues and many levels. We are a support group.

I am shocked that anyone would say George Floyd was “resting comfortably”. Absolutely shocked.

Jeanie - it's 'him' not 'her'....

But I agree, cissie I posted here in OT when my DS3 was raped. I needed support, as well as suggestions on how to help my DS.

It's a GOOD thing imho that we can let out our reactions to violence and the fucked up ways that people try to justify it.

jmho, ymmv obviously.

My apologies ... to HIM (not her) Darn pronouns!

ZenMum, thank you.

We also must keep in mind there are so many GREAT law officers who do their job well and RESPECT the law and all people, regardless of race. This guy is a BAD APPLE and needs to go to prison but we shouldn't judge all LEO by HIS actions. We are in need of reform to weed out the racists and killers who wear the badge and they DO exist. The last few years show us these bad apples exist and need to go.

We also must keep in mind there are so many GREAT law officers who do their job well and RESPECT the law and all people, regardless of race. This guy is a BAD APPLE and needs to go to prison but we shouldn't judge all LEO by HIS actions. We are in need of reform to weed out the racists and killers who wear the badge and they DO exist. The last few years show us these bad apples exist and need to go.

Undoubtedly. But the wall of silence is powerful in all professions. Unless law enforcement professionals take steps to speak out against those bad apples, I fear more injustices.

I am still traumatized by the image of a policeman murdering Eric Garner years ago. I cannot watch the current trial or the video that is the subject.

I was a teacher for a long time. We (as a profession) also fail to point out those colleagues who are damaging to kids. The dynamics are different in the classroom, but it was rare for anyone to speak up in the faculty lounge if some burnout was trashing a particular kid. Or speak out when the teacher next door showed videos all day.

And ultimately, Mr. Floyd was perhaps guilty of some sort of crime. But to suggest that he (or any of the other poor souls subject to this kind of abuse) deserved to be tortured and DIE from a traffic violation or selling cigarettes, or shoplifting, is just vile.

Regarding the wall of silence.

I think most LEO’s and former LEO’s (like me) that watched the recording of Floyds death were shocked. I think most of us would have recognized the techniques and processes being used by the three officers managing Floyd and we would understand that there are situations where the knee can slip from the head (where it’s supposed to be) to the neck. We would also recall from training; the pressure on the head is to be the minimum required to pin it down and that if the knee slips to the neck you place it on the head ASAP.

My initial reaction was that the officer pressing on the neck was not following procedure. OK – that can happen in the fog of the situation. But what was shocking is that the officer had ample time to readjust and was even warned/questioned by his colleague (a rookie). That relaxed, controlled and nonchalant way he remained on the neck while looking around is what shocked me and IMHO probably most LEO’s (past and present).

The other two officers that are active in the arrest are waiting for a certain reaction that comes when the suspect realizes resistance is futile. Once they have that they can make him more comfortable or adjust him for less discomfort. Had Floyds head been restrained correctly that acceptance would have come in a few minutes. With the pressure on the neck and inability to breath he reacts to save his life rather than to accept being overpowered. The two officers are basically being given the wrong reaction due to their colleague’s actions. The way officers are hunk down over the suspect limits what they can see – there is a lot of trust in each one doing their job properly.

My initial reaction was that this was extremely wrong and downright intentional. This view was then solidified when I heard from the testimony of the law enforcement specialists that the prosecutor called on. The indignation and shock they expressed – the colleagues, supervisors, policy-makers of the same department as the officer in question – is what I think will be the key-factor for a conviction. I do not see a blue cover-up or silence in this situation.

Although I always miss the sense of service being a cop gave me I am so glad I left that career! I would never want to be a cop in the present environment.

Thank you very much for this perspective Bigger.

Yep, Bigger. We can always count on you to have pertinent information. Thanks.

..first....I wish to thank our gracious host, MangledHeart, for allowing my post to receive some feedback discussion despite the sensitive nature of the topic.

..second,... readers should know that my own brother (passed away) and my nephew were/are in law enforcement.

I have the greatest respect for all the men and women who choose to enter this field of employment, not an easy profession to fill, especially in these troubled times we are witnessing.

No-one can argue that 'Bad Apples' will show up in any job/profession; teachers, doctors, tow truck drivers..those in whom we place our trust and security, can let us down in some horrible and unforeseen ways.

At this point in time, should we expect anything better? I think not!

Is life always fair?.. I think not!

Is Si the greatest?? ABSOLUTELY!!!

smy

Verdict is in... will be read within the next few minutes.

I needed to run to the post office today, and I bolted out the door to run the errand, so I'd be back home after it was read. I don't want to get caught up in any violence today, no matter which side it's from.

number4

Do you think there will be violence no matter what the verdict is? Is there alot of tension there about it?

..his girlfriend said "it's about LOVE and coming together."

Let's hope so!

smy

Verdict is in 'Guilty, guilty, guilty

[This message edited by somanyyears at 4:08 PM, April 20th (Tuesday)]

Is there alot of tension there about it?

I don't think I've felt this amount of tension in waiting for a verdict since OJ Simpson (probably way before you were old enough to be aware of it). That was just excruciating. I remember going over to a neighbor's house and actually holding her hand as we waited. And such disbelief. Thankfully the disbelief isn't there today.

So far things are appearing peaceful. I suspect there will be protests somewhere. It's what happens when there's some sort of resolution to an issue so charged. I hope I'm wrong.

Who ya gonna believe, me or your lying eyes? (said no one related to this incident)

Justice has been served.

Would be nice if he would be sentenced to the maximum for each count to be served consecutively. Won't happen but would definitely be a good step toward what justice can come from this.

Does anyone think that the policies around restraint will be changed now? No more knee on body?

Does anyone think that the policies around restraint will be changed now? No more knee on body?

Honestly, I hope not.

I remember stopping a guy for DUI. Big muscular guy high on speed and steroids. He jumped me when I asked him to do a sobriety test and we ended up grappling by the side of the road. I was petrified for my life and the fight was simply one of survival. Eventually I got a choke-hold and applied pressure until he passed out. I cuffed him and revived only for him to continue resisting despite the cuffs. I managed to call for backup and had him in a judo-lock when help arrived. The fight left me battered and bruised with finger marks around my neck and a bloodshot eye.

In NY police are explicitly banned from using choke-holds and can be charged if they do. This was passed after Eric Garner died in a choke-hold. Seeing recordings of that event there was IMHO no need for the hold since there were enough officers there to detain Garner without it. In my instance… well… my only other option might have been to try to escape, get a couple of yards and shoot him.

LEO’s have a right to an expectancy of coming home safe. We ask that they tend to situations that can be dangerous and risky. Allow them to use the tools and tricks of their trade but ask that they a) always use the least force necessary b) work within the law c) err to the side of caution and d) are accountable for their actions.

Its over 30 years since that fight. If that guy is still alive I guess he will have forgotten it by now. Had I shot him and he lived I’m not so sure. If he’d survived the shooting.