SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Hello SI members,

My husband of 12 years is having an affair for almost 2 years. I was unaware of it for the first 15 months. The rest was all about me trying to make sense of his betrayal, him deceiving me by taking the affair underground and more. I am confused as to what happened to a couple like us. We are still in the same house but I emotionally pulled myself back and do not let him in my bedroom since I found out.

It might be common but he refuses to leave, as they call it he is a “cake eater” even though I do nothing for him anymore. I am unavailable all the time, no calls or texts all day. No romantic talks. I hide my feelings as I know cheaters love attention.

This is like a messy mind game because he is not an arrogant, angry person. I wish he were so that I could throw him out without hesitation. Unfortunately he is quiet, almost everyone considers him kind and lovely. We can still talk like friends, maybe unnecessarily more civilized than expected in such a situation. I give him a perfect separation scenerio, yet he refuses saying that he can’t live without me Yet he is still actively in affair. He minimalizes it and says: I am only seeing her a couple times a week, I am trying to separate, let’s escape and start over somewhere new etc etc, to which I do not respond. Why would one refuses to leave if he has his freedom to do whatever, but instead chooses to sleep on a broken crappy sofa for months? He has his big family house (parents recently passed away), which he can use anytime. I am not even giving him a fraction of attention and love I used to give. Why would anyone not leave under these circumstances? I know I should stop thinking of why he does this or that.

I am fed up with him. I left the town for 4 months and went no contact. I told him that he should get his stuff and leave by the time I am back. I ignored his calls and texts. I texted him once at the end of 4 months to make sure that he is not home anymore. But he was. Never left, never even thought about leaving because he loves me

I know that divorce would be ideal but I need to take one step at a time, and separation would be a great achievement for me for the time being.As I said earlier, he is a good-tempered, hard working guy and I know that these seemingly good qualifications mess up my mind. I need encouragement from you that I can push for separation. Clearly, I don’t know how to do it. Can you help?

[This message edited by Merti at 1:26 AM, February 4th (Thursday)]

Have you talked to a lawyer? That would be a great place to start and learn how separation and divorce work where you live. Every state is different. Remember that knowledge is power.

You deserve better. Keep reading about the 180, start learning and lining up your ducks. You can do this!!

Based solely on what you share and scanning your posts then if you want a manageable relationship with this man then divorce him and then adopt him. Seriously – he’s treating you like a dysfunctional brother might a sister. It’s not a sustainable husband/wife relationship.

The main reason he’s doing this is clear: It’s because he’s able to. The reason he’s able to is because you allow it.

You can demand all you want he leave the house. He won’t, because he knows you won’t make him. He knows you won’t make him AND he knows that while married you CAN’T make him leave. It’s empty threats made at a regular basis to let off steam, and then back to the daily form of “marriage” he’s been able to establish.

He’s OK with not being in your bedroom because he has the OW for all that stuff. He’s fine with the casual friendly conversation because it implies an acceptance with the situation.

You want him out?

File.

It can be preceded with a separation agreement. In fact you can possibly seek prime residence in the family-home for the separation period. That would give you the ability to have him move out. But getting angry and flustered and an occasional hissy fit won’t make him change. He’s fine with how it is now.

The situation you describe is neither healthy or sustainable IMHO.

Here is my advice: watch the movie The Matrix. And, if you haven't seen it before this week/month, then watch it a second time after you watch it the first time. You need to watch it at least twice because, if you are not like me, you don't understand the movie until about half-way through it.

In the movie, our entire existence is a lie. We are not "living" except in our minds (the construct that is "the matrix"). The problem is that most of us (the characters in the movie being the rare exceptions) cannot "see" the matrix. We are not psychologically equipped to comprehend that we are actually living in a cocoon and our entire lives are basically a dream.

In your life, you are living something parallel to The Matrix. You think that you husband is this:

he is quiet, almost everyone considers him kind and lovely. We can still talk like friends, maybe unnecessarily more civilized than expected in such a situation.

This is what you see and this is what you believe.

The reality, however, which your mind cannot comprehend, is this:

My husband of 12 years is having an affair for almost 2 years. I was unaware of it for the first 15 months. The rest was all about me trying to make sense of his betrayal, him deceiving me by taking the affair underground and more.

He is not a good guy. You refuse to believe that he is anything but a good guy. You refuse to see "the real world."

p.s. Think about the scene where Morpheus asks Neo to take either the red pill or the blue pill. You can either take the blue pill and go back to your regular life, or you can take the red pill and see the world for what it truly is. In my experience, everyone says that they want to take the red pill, but the reality is that most of us (especially ME) take the blue one.

I can somewhat understand your situation.

He’s not terrible or angry or really abusive. He’s cheating.

What’s hurtful is how he is okay with living in limbo and dragging you along. He doesn’t care how hurtful and disrespectful his behavior is b/c he’s selfish.

I think you need to enforce a separation. He needs to move out of you need to move out. Tell him with an absolute deadline that your living together is over.

And if it gets close to the date and he’s not packed, dump his stuff in the garage or porch for him. That will send a strong message you mean business.

You left for a few months. How did you feel having no contact? Did it help you mentally or emotionally?

Thank you all. As you suggested he is fine with the situation because he suffered no consequences yet. I am partly to blame for this, as I said I adjusted myself to this unhealthy way of living, even though I emotionally detached myself from him and made myself unavailable to him all the time. It is also true that deep down I might be holding onto my past, good memories of before this horrible experience. I emotionally feel manipulated because he is not a terrible or angry person, just the opposite. On the other hand, what he does threatens my physical and mental health. As The1stWife mentioned he must be extremely selfish for insisting that we can live like this because he “loves” me and he wants to change. But I know he doesn’t want it hard enough. He says it might not be a visible change but infact, in his head many things changed. I think this is simply word salad to keep me numb.

Detachment for several months was wonderful. Mostly because I was in another town and had no sudden triggers and bad memories in the streets I was walking or in the house I was living. I felt fresh and happy. There was constant sadness over me but it diminished overtiime. When I came back I was powerfully detached from him, but I was again dragged into his way of living in limbo without even realizing. I am again back to the old days of confusion.

You want him out?

File.

It can be preceded with a separation agreement. In fact you can possibly seek prime residence in the family-home for the separation period.

Agree with Bigger's advice. You are going to have to force him out. If you get prime residence the police will escort him out if he doesn't leave.

It stops when you say it stops.

Talk to an attorney. Get your ducks in a row. File and request exclusive use of the marital home.

Take control of your life.

I adjusted myself to this unhealthy way of living, even though I emotionally detached myself from him and made myself unavailable to him all the time

You say this but then also say this:

We can still talk like friends, maybe unnecessarily more civilized than expected in such a situation

Can you see that is a direct contradiction?

At this point you should be doing a hard 180, completely separate lives. No cooking, cleaning or anything else for him and discussions only about finances, children (if you have any), and the separation agreement. No friendly discussions. Get your boundaries drawn and stick to them.

Also see a lawyer. You may not be able to get him to leave if you both own the house so find out your rights.

We don’t throw things at each other or I don’t scream at him. These sum pretty much what “being friendly” is. We don’t watch movies together or eat together. I do nothing for him at home, absolutely nothing. As I said I am emotionally disconnected from him. But I don’t make my home a living hell for him. Maybe I should have.

I have seen a lawyer and found out about my rights. I know that he does not want consequences and refuses to leave. His refusal is not because we both own the house. I know it comes down to the fact that I need to be strict or perhaps angry with him so that he can leave. I failed to do it so far.

[This message edited by Merti at 2:16 PM, February 4th (Thursday)]

Merti:

Sorry you are going through this. You are a decent human being dealing with a WH who has no compunction about manipulating and using your good nature to his advantage. Don’t let him. You don’t have to be strict with him or angry at him to solve this. Be yourself. If it were me I would laugh at the idiot. What you need is to value yourself enough and have enough self-respect not to tolerate this treatment. You are the prize. You deserve the best. Not this idiot user.

[This message edited by fareast at 6:29 PM, February 4th (Thursday)]

He’s not terrible or angry or really abusive. He’s cheating.

I disagree. He is being very emotionally abusive because he's keeping Merti walking on eggshells and feeling uncertain and doubtful of herself on a daily basis and within the marital home. He's maliciously putting her in a position that we all know is painful and deeply harmful. Yes, these actions are childish and immature but they're not being perpetuated by a child. They're being done intentionally by an adult man with the intent to bully her into accepting an unacceptable situation. And all talk of love when he happily accepts a contentious roommate relationship from her is pure manipulation.

Merti, there will be no separation until a higher authority forces him out. There is no good reason to spring for separation over D at this point. See a lawyer and get the ball rolling.

Merti, don't you miss having someone special in your life?.. someone who loves you and who you are free to be yourself with? Wouldn't it be nice to come home to a warm embrace, maybe some romance? This guy is IN YOUR WAY at this point. He's STOPPING you from having that life. You didn't sign on for "you're such a great friend". You committed to someone you thought would reciprocate your love and devotion. But he's not. He's just too comfortable to leave.

Instead of thinking of him as someone you can tolerate, maybe start viewing him as an IMPEDIMENT to your future happiness. He's not keeping you from being alone. He's keeping you from meeting your forever man. File for divorce and tell him to leave. You might not be able to make him go right now, but your attorney will help you navigate those waters when the time comes. Look him right in the eye and tell him that you DESERVE a man who loves you, who is devoted to you, and who will never betray you. Then tell him he's obviously NOT that guy and to kindly vacate your home and your life in order to make room for someone who is.

He's not your husband. He's not your friend. He's an IMPEDIMENT to what can become a wonderful life. But you've got to want that life in order to make it happen. Visualize it. Commit your energy to it. When you start moving forward, really moving forward to better things, this guy is going to steadily disappear in your rear view.

Thank you all. I read your comments at least twice, they help me so much. I agree that it is an abuse and I know he is abusing my good nature. I was out with a friend yesterday, and when I came home I found him sitting in the livingroom alone. He never comes home that early. I felt some kind of a sadness to see him all by himself. It took me a few seconds to pull myself together. He left me alone, confused and scared for over a year when he was hiding the affair from me. Never felt any pain about my sadness. Now, he looks numb, emotionless, depressed. He used to be a lively person. If the affair was so great, why does he say that he lost his joy in life, and does nothing to change it?

ChamomileTea, I shed a few tears after reading your post. I miss those feelings you describe. To feel safe and not alone. When I look at my pictures from a few years ago, I see a person who is childishly happy. Whereas now there is constant sadness in my eyes and I don’t allow anyone to take my picture anymore.

He can’t be my friend after so much damage. You are right, he is an impediment. He told me a few times that I will have someone special in my life and he will forever regret losing me. I think he loves himself more than anything in the world. I will save your message and keep reading it to gain strength and to stop this treatment.

[This message edited by Merti at 2:35 AM, February 5th (Friday)]

Merti – why is it he has to leave the house? Why not you?

Is it solely in your name? Is it separate property or marital property?

Is there some sentimental value that exceeds the real financial value?

The reason I’m asking is this:

There are things we can control, and things that we can’t control. I’m thinking that without external pressure such as a court-order or legal documentation there is no way you can really control if your husband can come and go into his home. It’s something you can’t control.

What you can control is where you live.

DO NOT DO THIS WITHOUT CONSULTING WITH AN ATTORNEY

But… if this is marital property and if leaving does not in any way or form impact your ownership or the value of the home then consider these two options:

You move out. Go rent a small apartment for now and until the future of your marriage is determined.

Look into selling the house. Place it on the market, get a good offer and then make it clear to H that he’s definitely moving, but not to where you are going.

If he’s a co-owner and refuses to sell then ask him to buy you out. Only be careful that the money he pays – or the debt he get’s into to buy you out – is definitely not marital asset/debt.

But I don’t make my home a living hell for him. Maybe I should have.

I do not think that. you should make your home a living hell for him. You should be a grey rock, meaning that you should live your life as if he is not around at all. Speak to him as little as possible. Do what you want, when you want to do it.

I know that he does not want consequences and refuses to leave. His refusal is not because we both own the house. I know it comes down to the fact that I need to be strict or perhaps angry with him so that he can leave. I failed to do it so far.

The laws vary depending on where you are, but unless he is misbehaving (being angry, violent, etc), then you won't have much of a legal case to kick him out of the house. If it is the marital home, then it is his too.

Option#1 is that you move out on your own, as Bigger suggests.

Option#2 is that you make yourself scarce. My xWW and I had kids and we alternated parenting time for about 6 months. On her parenting nights, I stayed at my GF's house. On my parenting nights, she was usually out until after the kids and I went to bed (around 9:30pm). This worked out well for everyone.

You've gotten a lot of good advice and you seem to see how abusive he is to be ignoring your wishes and conducting his affair while living in a shared home. The entitlement is off the charts, no matter how mild-mannered the presentation.

You may need to do something not entirely fair to yourself, like move out again, so that you can gain the clarity, strength and resolve you will need to take the next step. As long as you're sharing a home, there's some degree of comfort in the familiar that it keeps you stuck, but make no mistake, there's also more harm being done to your self-esteem and well-being. And it becomes increasingly hard to make changes the lower we are.

Don't fall for the sad sack moping on the couch routine - he's not too depressed to go hang out with the OW a few times a week, is he?

I'm sorry he's making so difficult for you to go on with your life. The reason he won't leave is that he now has everything he ever wanted - the life you shared and a relationship with the OW. He doesn't want her over you, he wants both - even without all the nice things you did before. He's got it all. It must be nice to be king. I'm sure he realizes appearing depressed plays on your empathy and ensures this situation stays the same.

The entitlement is off the charts, no matter how mild-mannered the presentation.

As long as you're sharing a home, there's some degree of comfort in the familiar that it keeps you stuck, but make no mistake, there's also more harm being done to your self-esteem and well-being

You should be a grey rock, meaning that you should live your life as if he is not around at all. Speak to him as little as possible. Do what you want, when you want to do it.

You move out. Go rent a small apartment for now and until the future of your marriage is determined.

Look into selling the house. Place it on the market, get a good offer and then make it clear to H that he’s definitely moving, but not to where you are going.

Very true. I appreciate everyone’s comments, I will not continue living in the same house. I will let you know the updates. This familiar feeling is harmful. When I left for 4 months, I felt extremely powerful. I began to eat and concentrate, watched movies, read books which I can’t do at the monent. I constantly think about him again, he doesn’t deserve to be the center of my attention.

You are so smothered by pain that you are probably numb to a lot that we see. Do you see how insulting it is that he “only sees her a couple of times a week”? How dare he!!!

Please get away from this quiet, hardworking monster. He’s a vampire slowly sucking the life out of you.

I know that he does not want consequences and refuses to leave. His refusal is not because we both own the house. I know it comes down to the fact that I need to be strict or perhaps angry with him so that he can leave. I failed to do it so far.

Welp, people in hell want ice water too... point being, he can not want consequences all he wants (and honestly who does like dealing with negative consequences of their behavior??), but ALL choices carry consequences with them. There is no escaping that.

As far as 'getting angry'. To quote Nansi - 'Anger gets shit done'. And that is true. Anger can be the kick in the pants we need to shit or get off the pot; it can insulate us from pain while we power through shit.

But some folks just don't have that go-to. And that's perfectly okay! You don't have to get angry or make his life hell (tho he richly deserves both the cheating dickhead). You can carry through with plans to move forward without getting angry about it though. You can decide what direction you want to go and start taking steps to get there. Ultimately, you have to handle things in the way that YOU are okay with.

As I said earlier, he is a good-tempered, hard working guy and I know that these seemingly good qualifications mess up my mind.

I don't give a fuuuuuck how 'good-natured' he is. He is a cake-eating shitbag and you deserve soooooo much more than this. There's no good quialifications that make up for his appalling behavior.