Newest Member: Armyman9196

Divorce/Separation :
I am divorced!

default

 barcher144 (original poster member #54935) posted at 7:06 PM on Wednesday, February 3rd, 2021

But in my situation, I decided it wasn't worth it. I had just started a new job and wanted to focus my efforts on succeeding in my career and on my future, not mired in legal stuff from my past. For me, it was 100% the right decision. I can always make more money, but I can't make more time, and time stuck in the past was not going to help me.

Your circumstances may be different, but just because something seems to make sense mathematically doesn't necessarily mean it's the path you should take. Listen to your gut on this one, whatever it may tell you.

Thank you phmh for this.

I really value your perspective and it is helpful. My appeal will not be going to the Supreme Court or anything like that. The appeal is super straight-forward -- the judge made a ruling that is in error under the law. Still, your comment about having plenty of money and not wanting to waste time is an excellent way to summarize my situation.

I am going to be paying XW (without the STB! Woo hoo!) about $2350 for the next few years, with reductions along the way as my kids emancipate). Alimony was awarded for only 7 years... so not too bad. I would have accepted this amount two years ago at mediation and a year ago following the custody evaluation and I would have been happy with it.

That said, I did some additional analysis yesterday and the judge's order violate the case law/statutes in two ways.

First, to qualify for alimony, she needs to demonstrate that she does not have enough money to meet her reasonable budget. The judge rules on our incomes and our budgets, so after that... it's just math to compute available monthly income after taxes. Her income already exceeds her budget by at least $500 per month, so she really doesn't qualify for alimony.

Second, according to my attorney, case law for my state says that the obligee of spousal maintenance can only receive a maximum of 51% of our combined income. I did this calculation yesterday and the judge's decision exceeds this value by about $225 per month.

My attorney emailed me yesterday and she is STRONGLY recommending that I pursue an appeal. She won't say guaranteed, but she said it was the strongest case for appeal in her 20 years as a divorce attorney.

Option#1 would be to retain an attorney as a 'ghost writer' to help me write the documents that I need to submit to the court, but technically I would be pro se (cost = $10K). Option#2 would be to hire an attorney, which triggers a pretty aggressive process that includes an appellate mediator who apparently has a lot of power to suggest settlements. In this option, I'd quit if I didn't get a settlement at mediation (cost = I haven't asked yet). Option#3 would be the full monty (cost = $20K). Apparently, appellate mediation occurs only if you have an attorney, so that won't happen unless I retain an attorney.

Right now, I am leaning towards option#2. I might also try and negotiate with XW directly, but I don't think that she will engage. Part of this is my personality, which is very mathematical and by the book. The math is clear but the judge doesn't understand math... so I don't understand him.

Me: BH, age 48
Her: WS, age 45 (multiple EAs and PAs)
D-Day: August 30, 2016

Diagnosed with depression in December 2016, which was primarily caused by my xWW's affair and associated emotional abuse.

posts: 5120   ·   registered: Aug. 31st, 2016
id 8630269
default

ZenMumWalking ( member #25341) posted at 7:28 AM on Thursday, February 4th, 2021

What a relief!!!!

And also remember - even if you do decide to start the appeal process you can pull the plug at any time.

I'm so happy for you barcher, you have deserved this for such a long time!!

Me (BS), Him (WH): late-50's
3 DS: 26, 25, 22
M: 30+ (19 1/2 at Dday)
Dday: Dec 2008
Wanted R, not gonna happen
Used to be DeadMumWalking, doing better now

posts: 8408   ·   registered: Aug. 28th, 2009   ·   location: EU
id 8630426
default

DanielJK ( member #75654) posted at 3:40 PM on Thursday, February 4th, 2021

And you can update your signature line now.

Depression was almost certainly caused by my STBXWW's affair and associated emotion

Just XWW.

BH 51
STBXWW 53
2 daughters, 14 and 16
Filed for divorce 12/23/2020

After a year of hell I finally moved out (5/26/2021).
Divorce still pending.

posts: 455   ·   registered: Oct. 13th, 2020   ·   location: CT
id 8630503
default

farsidejunky ( member #49392) posted at 5:09 PM on Thursday, February 4th, 2021

When you consider the time value of money, combined with the fact that you are effectively free from her, the appeal may be far from worth it.

If it were me, I would walk away with a smile on my face.

“Never make someone a priority when all you are to them is an option.”

-Maya Angelou

posts: 587   ·   registered: Aug. 30th, 2015   ·   location: Tennessee
id 8630532
default

tikismom ( member #60546) posted at 6:44 PM on Thursday, February 4th, 2021

I have followed your story for a long time, not sure if I ever posted on anything before. I just wanted to say congrats! This chapter is over. Onward!

Me: 39
Him: 43 (NPD)
DDay #1: Sept 2017; Lots of TT & DDays since. EA & PA with an EX. Last known contact with OW: end of December 2017.
Married 10 years, together 15 at time of dday. 2 very young children.
Status: Working daily toward R.

posts: 466   ·   registered: Sep. 8th, 2017
id 8630546
default

 barcher144 (original poster member #54935) posted at 7:00 PM on Thursday, February 4th, 2021

When you consider the time value of money, combined with the fact that you are effectively free from her, the appeal may be far from worth it.

This is definitely something that I am considering. My lawyer, though, is aggressively pushing the appeal. And she is doing this knowing that she will not be the attorney.

My biggest question for the appeal is not how much it will cost financially, but rather how much it will cost me as far as time. I don't think that I (or xWW) will have any opportunity to present new evidence, so it might not cost me much time to do an appeal.

I think it comes down to the fact that it bugs my attorney that the judge literally did not follow the law.

One thing that is clear... a couple of days after reading the ruling... is that the judge did absolutely everything that he possibly could do under the law to help my xWW out. I won on 80% of the arguments that she and I had because my position was "the law says this" and her side was "but I want everything."

Reviewing the history of the case, I know for a fact that xWW's attorney was ecstatic that we were assigned this particular judge. Also, the paralegal for Attorney#2 audibly groaned when I told her the name of the judge. When I asked Attorney#2 about this, I was told that the paralegal thinks that my judge is stupid.

Me: BH, age 48
Her: WS, age 45 (multiple EAs and PAs)
D-Day: August 30, 2016

Diagnosed with depression in December 2016, which was primarily caused by my xWW's affair and associated emotional abuse.

posts: 5120   ·   registered: Aug. 31st, 2016
id 8630550
default

Bigger ( Guide #8354) posted at 12:49 PM on Friday, February 5th, 2021

You do have one more option IMHO, one that maybe your present lawyer could manage for you:

If the appeal is so iron-cast and your attorney 80% certain it will go though then offer your ex a choice (BTW – attorneys NEVER give guarantees because they KNOW so many factors can impact a case. If she gives you a 80% success rate I’m seeing that as more-or-less money in the bank):

For clarity let’s assume you are paying 2000 per month and your fair calculations say it should be 1500. Lets also assume that her attorney knows how lucky they were to get this judge and is capable of doing the math himself.

Threaten to take her to court and go for a decrease of 600 (down to 1400) but offer to settle for 1500 if the deal is made in the next days and with minimal legal cost. Have a base-line you are willing to accept, like maybe 1650. Her attorney will hopefully point out that if you appeal she’s facing some legal expenses and a 80% chance of going down to 1500. If she settles you might be saving yourself 350-450 per month at the legal cost of 1000, versus 500 per month at the cost of 10-20k.

"If, therefore, any be unhappy, let him remember that he is unhappy by reason of himself alone." Epictetus

posts: 9933   ·   registered: Sep. 29th, 2005
id 8630719
default

 barcher144 (original poster member #54935) posted at 2:12 PM on Friday, February 5th, 2021

And you can update your signature line now.

Fixed. Thank you.

Me: BH, age 48
Her: WS, age 45 (multiple EAs and PAs)
D-Day: August 30, 2016

Diagnosed with depression in December 2016, which was primarily caused by my xWW's affair and associated emotional abuse.

posts: 5120   ·   registered: Aug. 31st, 2016
id 8630731
default

squid ( member #57624) posted at 1:10 AM on Saturday, February 6th, 2021

Congrats, barcher!

It's been a long road. Glad you finally made it to the other side.

BH
D-Day 2.19.17
Divorced 12.10.18

This isn’t what any of us signed up for. But it is the hand that we have been dealt. Thus, we must play it.

posts: 2582   ·   registered: Feb. 26th, 2017   ·   location: Central Florida
id 8630995
default

nutmegkitty ( member #33882) posted at 11:28 PM on Saturday, February 6th, 2021

Woo hoo!

Me - happy!
2 DDs

Very happily divorced from an NPD since 2013.

posts: 4388   ·   registered: Nov. 10th, 2011   ·   location: MA
id 8631218
default

gmc94 ( member #62810) posted at 4:27 AM on Monday, February 8th, 2021

I'm with Bigger - make an offer.

And I also understand your attorneys' "push" to appeal, even if she would not be representing you/ getting a financial benefit. It has a high likelihood of saving you $ in the long run, but it also sends a message to the trial judge, which is helpful for future parties in a D and for the attorneys who have to deal with a judge that may have a reputation of sorts.

I'm only familiar with my own area, but I'd be surprised if an appeal would allow for any new evidence. The costs come from getting a transcript of your hearing(s) & the relevant documents filed in your case, and then writing the briefs to the court of appeals explaining how the judge did not follow the law. In my state, there would be a kind of "mediation", but IMO it's really just a conference with one of the judges at the court of appeals who gives his/her opinion of the case to the lawyers before proceeding with the briefs/oral arguments (and the judge that does the "mediation" would not be on the panel of judges hearing/deciding the appeal).

Of course, none of this addresses any potential emotional costs of still being in litigation with your XWW. Again, in my area, the time for the client would be minimal, so while there may be financial benefit to you in the long run, I would be more concerned about the emotional investment vs time or even $$.

M >25yrs/grown kids
DD1 1994 ONS prostitute
DD2 2018 exGF1 10+yrEA & 10yrPA... + exGF2 EA forever & "made out" 2017
9/18 WH hung himself- died but revived

It's rude to say "I love you" with a mouthful of lies

posts: 3441   ·   registered: Feb. 22nd, 2018
id 8631436
default

BigBlueEyes ( member #71441) posted at 1:29 PM on Monday, February 8th, 2021

Yayyyy

many congratulations to you 🎉

Onwards & upwards barcher you deserve it 👏👏👏

Me- BW, 47
Multi Dday's,
DB A's x 2 BFF
Multi ONS's, Online shit.
Serial cheat, Abuser,
D 18.02.20
Stay strong, just because it’s hard today, doesn’t mean that next week it won’t get easier!!

posts: 674   ·   registered: Mar. 11th, 2019   ·   location: A tiny dot in a big 'ol World
id 8631479
default

 barcher144 (original poster member #54935) posted at 1:55 PM on Monday, February 8th, 2021

A brief update...

I sent an email to my attorney last week (Wednesday-ish?) and told her that I would go ahead with the appeal as long as it was not a huge time commitment on my part and that she felt that I had a strong case.

My attorney wrote back around midnight on Friday/Saturday, letting me know that she believes that I have an exceptionally strong case and that she even called opposing counsel to discuss the appeal and a possible settlement.

No surprise, xWW's attorney told my attorney to pound sand.

Then, on Friday, my attorney received a voicemail from xWW's attorney wanting to negotiate a settlement.

I told my attorney to go ahead and to negotiate a settlement using her best judgement. My attorney basically told opposing counsel to make an offer.

Nonetheless, I suggested a settlement offer to my attorney. xWW is to be awarded about $35,000 in alimony for the next 7 years. My attorney estimates a full appeal will cost $20K, maybe $10K if we cut costs here and there. I estimate that xWW will need to spend the same. So, assuming a $20K combined legal cost for both of us (at the low end), I proposed that I give our children the $20K that we would spend on legal fees. I'd pay it in equal amounts each month until the 7 years is up. I keep the remaining $15K.

xWW won't go for this, of course, but it'll give me some satisfaction (schadenfraude is probably a better term) for when she rejects me giving the kids a bunch of money so that she can keep it for herself.

I doubt that my attorney will do make the offer that I suggested anyway. It's too creative, but it does express my increasing concern that my kids should be embarrassed that their parents have spent so much on a divorce.

Thank you, everyone, for your support over the past 4+ years.

Me: BH, age 48
Her: WS, age 45 (multiple EAs and PAs)
D-Day: August 30, 2016

Diagnosed with depression in December 2016, which was primarily caused by my xWW's affair and associated emotional abuse.

posts: 5120   ·   registered: Aug. 31st, 2016
id 8631489
default

Bleu ( member #14243) posted at 1:46 AM on Tuesday, February 9th, 2021

Congratulations!

I commiserate with the outrageous cost of divorce when dealing with a narcissist. I would rather put those funds in a college fund. Hell, even a vacation fund. It's such a waste.

HOWEVER,

I am so happy to hear your attorneys will hopefully and likely save money and time with a settlement in lieu of an appeal. That is amazing news!

BS (Me) - 42
WS (It) - 42

Coupled in 1998
DD#1 - 2002
DD#2 - 2003
Married in 2010
DD#3 - 2012
And many more . . .

Divorcing

Two gorgeous, funny and fun little kids

posts: 293   ·   registered: Apr. 13th, 2007
id 8631685
default

Bleu ( member #14243) posted at 1:46 AM on Tuesday, February 9th, 2021

Congratulations!

I commiserate with the outrageous cost of divorce when dealing with a narcissist. I would rather put those funds in a college fund. Hell, even a vacation fund. It's such a waste.

HOWEVER,

I am so happy to hear your attorneys will hopefully and likely save money and time with a settlement in lieu of an appeal. That is amazing news!

BS (Me) - 42
WS (It) - 42

Coupled in 1998
DD#1 - 2002
DD#2 - 2003
Married in 2010
DD#3 - 2012
And many more . . .

Divorcing

Two gorgeous, funny and fun little kids

posts: 293   ·   registered: Apr. 13th, 2007
id 8631686
default

Tigersrule77 ( member #47339) posted at 9:05 PM on Tuesday, February 9th, 2021

Hopefully the negotiations go well and you can come to some kind of agreement and avoid the actual appeal. Sounds like your XWW realized it is in her best interest. Good luck!

posts: 1538   ·   registered: Mar. 27th, 2015   ·   location: Maryland
id 8631885
default

crisp ( member #34236) posted at 10:16 PM on Tuesday, February 9th, 2021

If it is such an obvious error, the attorney should file a motion to reconsider. Usually a very short window to file such a motion.

Endeavor to persevere. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=csEzTwKemwY

posts: 654   ·   registered: Dec. 17th, 2011   ·   location: NE US
id 8631914
default

 barcher144 (original poster member #54935) posted at 7:51 PM on Wednesday, February 10th, 2021

So, an update on the negotiations...

Sounds like your XWW realized it is in her best interest.

Using my best Wallace Shawn voice (from The Princess Bride):

You'd like to think that, wouldn't you?

My attorney sent me an email this morning. xWW's attorney offered to "settle" if I pay her $30,000 right now.

Remembering that the total amount of alimony that I will pay over the next 7 years is about $35,000... she basically is asking that I pay her something more than the judge awarded her in error.

My attorney is countering with $10,000 but planning on an appeal. My attorney has convinced her partner (two principal attorneys in her firm, she is one) to allow me to forego an upfront retainer for now too. Apparently, my attorney believes in my honesty and integrity, even if the judge and xWW do not (well, I'd argue that xWW trusts my integrity but she is defaming my integrity for her own personal benefit).

Me: BH, age 48
Her: WS, age 45 (multiple EAs and PAs)
D-Day: August 30, 2016

Diagnosed with depression in December 2016, which was primarily caused by my xWW's affair and associated emotional abuse.

posts: 5120   ·   registered: Aug. 31st, 2016
id 8632192
default

 barcher144 (original poster member #54935) posted at 7:07 PM on Thursday, February 11th, 2021

Another update.

I received a phone call today from a random person, wanting to purchase my house.

Because I don't own a house right now, I asked more questions. Apparently, xWW has put her house on the market. The same house that her attorney claimed was essential for her happiness and the happiness of my kids.

For those of you keeping score at home (and that should be none of you), xWW and her BF have either sold their house or they are planning to sell their house. This makes me think that they might be planning to co-habitate, which would also disqualify her from receiving alimony in my State.

Me: BH, age 48
Her: WS, age 45 (multiple EAs and PAs)
D-Day: August 30, 2016

Diagnosed with depression in December 2016, which was primarily caused by my xWW's affair and associated emotional abuse.

posts: 5120   ·   registered: Aug. 31st, 2016
id 8632451
default

ZenMumWalking ( member #25341) posted at 9:09 PM on Thursday, February 11th, 2021

I'm getting the popcorn......

eta: don't agree to pay her any money yet

[This message edited by ZenMumWalking at 3:11 PM, February 11th (Thursday)]

Me (BS), Him (WH): late-50's
3 DS: 26, 25, 22
M: 30+ (19 1/2 at Dday)
Dday: Dec 2008
Wanted R, not gonna happen
Used to be DeadMumWalking, doing better now

posts: 8408   ·   registered: Aug. 28th, 2009   ·   location: EU
id 8632489
Cookies on SurvivingInfidelity.com®

SurvivingInfidelity.com® uses cookies to enhance your visit to our website. This is a requirement for participants to login, post and use other features. Visitors may opt out, but the website will be less functional for you.

v.1.000.20211022 2002-2021 SurvivingInfidelity.com® All Rights Reserved. • Privacy Policy