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Divorce/Separation :
XW is still a moron- parenting

Topic is Sleeping.
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 Minnesota (original poster Member #50615) posted at 3:01 PM on Sunday, July 26th, 2020

Sometimes I think she's fine. But I just think she's still an idiot. We can be friendly enough to each other. But I think she's moron.

Big Mister (who is 8 years old now) Facetimes with her every morning and every evening. He FT's with me morning and evening when he's with her.

Big Mister told me a couple days ago that she still wipes his ass.... I laughed because I thought he was kidding. Turns out he wasn't.

I hear them on FT and she love bombs him. "I love you. I miss you. I can't wait for you to be back here."- Like she says it so he will say it back. I'm not kidding.

Everything has to be "fun." Everything. "Did you have fun today? Was it sooo spicy? Have fun today. I hope you have a fun day." That's mostly because she can't stand to be bored. She's good at finding things to do, so it's not like she needs to be entertained. But it's like they ALWAYS have to be doing something "fun."

They are always buying him things.

There is a pretty big age gap. So "When I was a kid" is a real thing. I'll admit it. I tell him to get off the damn phone (video games) and go do something "real." But he can't figure out what to do because his mother plans everything out. She is a helicopter/lawnmower/bulldozer parent. I'm mean at least I try to make him figure things out for himself first. "You try it. See what happens." or "How would you do that?" Like if I do everything for him (like wipe his butt???) he won't figure out how to do things on his own, and he gets the message he's not capable.

Here's the problem from my end- I'm super conflict avoidant. Ask anyone who was around when I was going through the infidelity, the in house separation, the limbo, etc. phase is nodding their head. And anytime I DO say something she get's super defensive. Like when I told her I didn't think a 7 year old boy should get to decide what time he goes to bed and that 10:30 pm every night is probably unhealthy. OHHHHH you would have thought I accused her of beheading the Queen.

Anyway- thanks for letting me vent.

[This message edited by Minnesota at 9:03 AM, July 26th (Sunday)]

Me: BS Upper 40's
Her: XWW younger 30's
Married Sept. 2010
DDay Thanksgiving 2015
Dday2- Jan28ish, 2016 -new affair
One child (Big Mister) born in 2012
Divorced Sept. 2, 2016

posts: 2110   ·   registered: Dec. 1st, 2015   ·   location: Minnesota
id 8566647
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nekonamida ( Member #42956) posted at 3:22 PM on Sunday, July 26th, 2020

I think you're doing a good job of handling this the only way that's available. She's not going to listen if confronted. She never has. It will be more stress than it's worth and the outcome will not change. Parallel parenting like you have been is the way to go.

posts: 4959   ·   registered: Mar. 31st, 2014   ·   location: United States
id 8566650
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barcher144 ( Member #54935) posted at 4:58 PM on Sunday, July 26th, 2020

It sounds like we have similar ex-wives. (well, I'm still legally married to mine, damn you COVID!). My son (age 8) didn't wipe his own butt until last year when I taught him how (my guess is that STBXW is still doing it). He sleeps with his mother most nights too.

Here's what I do... and it seems to be working, although it took a lot of time and effort and control.

I be myself. I make sure that I am consistent. I do not worry what is going on at Mom's house.

I let my kids have their fun, but I set firm boundaries and I explain to them why I am setting those boundaries. It's a little harder to use logic with my 8-year old (my other kids are 13 and 14), but he gets it too.

You keep being the parent Big Mister needs and that will be enough. I bet you a coke/beer/margarita that he starts behaving one way with Mom and one way with you. My daughters (DD13 and DD14) already have reported as much to me about my youngest son (DS8).

Me: BH, age 47
Her: WS, age 44 (multiple EAs and PAs)
D-Day: August 30, 2016

Diagnosed with depression in December 2016, which was primarily caused by my xWW's affair and associated emotional abuse.

posts: 5097   ·   registered: Aug. 31st, 2016
id 8566669
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Chrysalis123 ( Guide #27148) posted at 11:59 PM on Sunday, July 26th, 2020

Hmm. Can you buy him the disposable bum wipes that are like baby wipes so he can clean himself? Let him practice at your house and then let him take a pack with him. Maybe her problem is the skid marks and with the wipes those would be gone.

At any moment he is not going to want his mom seeing his junk...it might have already happened and he doesn't know how to tell her to back off. I cannot imagine my father seeing me on the toilet or in the bath past age 8.

He shouldn't be sleeping with his mom anymore. She is blurring the boundaries between mom and son.

You may need to get a therapist involved and maybe the courts because we all know she won't listen to you.

Someone I once loved gave me/ a box full of darkness/ It took me years to understand/ That this, too, was a gift. - Mary Oliver

Just for the record darling, not all positive changes feel positive in the beginning -S C Lourie

posts: 6709   ·   registered: Jan. 10th, 2010
id 8566793
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Darkness Falls ( Member #27879) posted at 12:36 AM on Monday, July 27th, 2020

I’m sure she sucks in many ways, but as for wiping him maybe he’s not getting himself clean enough—boys that age aren’t exactly known for their thorough cleanliness, just saying.

WS - remarried to BH but not in R

D-day 2010

posts: 6310   ·   registered: Mar. 8th, 2010   ·   location: USA
id 8566797
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 Minnesota (original poster Member #50615) posted at 1:58 AM on Monday, July 27th, 2020

I bet you a coke/beer/margarita that he starts behaving one way with Mom and one way with you.

I"m not taking that bet. It's already true. He made a box of mac and cheese for dinner tonight.

Can you buy him the disposable bum wipes that are like baby wipes so he can clean himself?

He cleans his butt fine when he's here. (well, mostly- Darkness Falls is right. He's not always the best at it. But I just throw his undies in the laundry. XW throws them away. Well, she used to. I'm not sure if she does or not.

He shouldn't be sleeping with his mom anymore. She is blurring the boundaries between mom and son.

Yeah that doesn't happen. The bedtime thing is that she lets him stay up as long as he wants. I think.

I try not to ask too many questions because I don't want Big Mister to think I'm dissing his mom. I think that would be a lose/lose. As moronic as she is, talking shit about her to Big Mister is bad form.

But I think Barcher is right. Do what I do and just keep doing the stuff we do. Hopefully he'll grow some grit while he's here.

Me: BS Upper 40's
Her: XWW younger 30's
Married Sept. 2010
DDay Thanksgiving 2015
Dday2- Jan28ish, 2016 -new affair
One child (Big Mister) born in 2012
Divorced Sept. 2, 2016

posts: 2110   ·   registered: Dec. 1st, 2015   ·   location: Minnesota
id 8566815
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Phoenix1 ( Moderator #38928) posted at 2:08 AM on Monday, July 27th, 2020

Do what I do and just keep doing the stuff we do. Hopefully he'll grow some grit while he's here.

Yup, this ^^^. She is not doing him any favors by not instilling confidence and self-sufficiency, but the good news is that YOU can do that by doing what you are doing on a consistent basis. These are life lessons that will serve him well as an adult, and he will always know which parent did that, and which didn't.

Stay the course, MN. You're doing great.

fBS - Me
Xhole - Multiple LTAs/2 OCs over 20+yrs
Adult Kids
Happily divorced!

You can't go back and change the beginning, but you can start where you are and change the ending. ~C.S. Lewis~

posts: 8992   ·   registered: Apr. 9th, 2013   ·   location: Land of Indifference
id 8566821
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tushnurse ( Member #21101) posted at 2:00 PM on Monday, July 27th, 2020

MN - man you are doing the best you can that is more than enough. Your son is going to be an awesome person regardless of what Mom does w/ him, I would let him know that it's ok to tell mom "I got this" about the wiping. That's just weird. Sorry. Who wipes his ass at school?

Slight t/j: Barcher - your youngest needs to go to therapy is the cosleeping continues for much longer. That ain't normal stuff. A bad dream, a thunderstorm, being sick, sure, but not "most nights" because he/she both like it.

You both are good no wait, Great Dads. Stand tall support your kids like you have been, and raise them the best you know how when they are with you.

Me: FBS
Him: FWS
Kids: 21 &23
Married for 28 years now, was 16 at the time.
D-Day Sept 26 2008
R'd in about 2 years. Old Vet now.

posts: 18926   ·   registered: Oct. 1st, 2008   ·   location: St. Louis
id 8566913
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JS84 ( Member #48148) posted at 3:12 PM on Monday, July 27th, 2020

I don't think your problem is the conflict avoidance. I think your problem is you don't have much say in the matter. It would be one thing if you were working as a co-parenting team with good communication between the two of you.

But it sounds like you already know how she's going to react if you broach the subject. And say even if you did, she agreed with you and promised to change, do you think she would?

The good thing is it sounds like you see a serious flaw with her parenting and already know how to counter it. It's unfortunate you even have to but in your situation the best thing you can do is try to teach him the right way.

Yea wiping an 8 year old's ass unless he's disabled is bizarre. You better hope she doesn't start trying to breast feed him

posts: 443   ·   registered: Jun. 6th, 2015
id 8566935
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DragnHeart ( Member #32122) posted at 7:42 PM on Monday, July 27th, 2020

Who wipes his ass at school?

I was going to ask this when you first posted. Weird yes definitely.

My SIX year olds know how to wipe for crying out loud! Its just basic self care you teach them then toilet training, no pun intended.lol

The only times I've ever had to help is when they've been sick with diarrhea and vomiting.

Also all of my kids can cook and do their own dishes.

You are doing great and as suggested just do what you're doing. Big Mister will be ok

Me: BS 44 nowWH: 35 almost 36 (BrokenHeart911)Four little dragons.Met 2006. Married 2008. Dday of LTPA with co worker October 19th 2010. Knew about EA with ow1 before that.Full disclosure March 8th 2019 four AP's.

posts: 21874   ·   registered: May. 10th, 2011   ·   location: Canada
id 8567037
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HalfTime2017 ( Member #64366) posted at 8:09 PM on Monday, July 27th, 2020

M - I agree with Nekonamida, parallel parenting is the best. Its what I also do with the exWW.

Look, Big Mister is going to have his experiences at Moms, and he'll have something different from yours. At the very least, look at it from the standpoint that the XW loves your boy. All the things that she is doing, may not be your parenting style, but at the very least, you know he is safe and loved. That is what your focus should be. You can't control the EXWW, but at the very least she loves your son. That's a blessing no? She's in his life.

Maybe talk to your son about the wiping, and show him how to do it on his own again. He'll be proud that he won't need moms help. On the other stuff, I'd just let it go. Gifts and having fun, and loving on your son isn't any sort of threat you should be concerned with.

posts: 1142   ·   registered: Jul. 5th, 2018   ·   location: Cali
id 8567049
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Butforthegrace ( Member #63264) posted at 8:40 PM on Monday, July 27th, 2020

Keep a diary of these data points. The times she has him in bed (every day). The days Big Mister is late with homework on her watch (ever time). Build up your evidence. Then seek a change in custody.

"The wicked man flees when no one chases."

posts: 3771   ·   registered: Mar. 31st, 2018   ·   location: Midwest
id 8567062
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Poppy704 ( Member #62532) posted at 11:58 PM on Monday, July 27th, 2020

Stop watching/listening when your child is communicating with his other parent. Bedtimes? It’s summer and a pandemic to boot, you’re not going to be able to argue that a late bedtime is poor parenting. She buys him “too much”? NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. You simply should not know this much about her home. Focus on your time with your kid. Learn to let go about what happens on her time unless it is legal neglect or abuse.

*edited to add: I say this as a parent that deals with an ex that barely maintains basic hygiene, allows ridiculous bedtime and in generally exhibits shitty parenting, AND as a legal assistant that takes this complains constantly from disgusted clients. You will be happier, your kids will be happier, when you learn to let go and focus on your own parenting and only worry about the ex when it comes to BIG stuff.*

[This message edited by Poppy704 at 6:15 PM, July 27th (Monday)]

posts: 428   ·   registered: Feb. 2nd, 2018
id 8567143
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betrayedafter20 ( Member #72875) posted at 5:47 AM on Tuesday, July 28th, 2020

Sorry do not mean to go down a rabbit hole But Wiping a butt at eight is not a big deal. My young man is on the spectrum and has needed help with this for a long time yes I am an advocate of the wet wipes - he took it over at about 9 1/2. But unless this is coupled with several other things that are inappropriate this should not be hyper focused on. This is a matter of health, i.e., feces on skin causes itchy, smelly, stigma at school of being a smelly kid. My kid never would do number two at school due to shame so “Wiping his butt at school@ didn’t apply. Otherwise dad I thing you are doing great

Me: BW, 52, BC survivor x2
Married 20 yrs, together 25
14 yo boy Autism spectrum
16 yo typical functioning
DD#1 2/6/13 PA, False R 4+ yrs
DD#2 2/20/20 EA(mutual friend) learned of another PA same day - serial
DD#3 2 weeks later W/PA AP
Separated 5/

posts: 293   ·   registered: Feb. 21st, 2020   ·   location: IL
id 8567227
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betrayedafter20 ( Member #72875) posted at 5:54 AM on Tuesday, July 28th, 2020

Sorry do not mean to go down a rabbit hole But Wiping a butt at eight is not a big deal . My young man is on the spectrum and has needed help with this for a long time -yes I am an advocate of the wet wipes - he took it over at about 9 1/2 after the prior 6 months still went in sometimes and coached him on a proper wipe.... Do you want him to grow up and always have skidmarks whenever he is in the presence of anyone?

But unless this is coupled with several other things that are inappropriate this should not be hyper focused on. This is a matter of health, i.e., feces on skin causes itchy, smelly, stigma at school of being a smelly kid. I remember this one kid in my my third grade that always smelled like poo and I will never forget him and everyone else teased him. That is not how I want my boy to remembered. my kid never will never number two at school due to shame so “Wiping his butt at school” didn’t apply. Otherwise dad I think are doing great- sorry just had to chime in on that since it seemed to be a thing for you..

[This message edited by betrayedafter20 at 11:57 PM, July 27th (Monday)]

Me: BW, 52, BC survivor x2
Married 20 yrs, together 25
14 yo boy Autism spectrum
16 yo typical functioning
DD#1 2/6/13 PA, False R 4+ yrs
DD#2 2/20/20 EA(mutual friend) learned of another PA same day - serial
DD#3 2 weeks later W/PA AP
Separated 5/

posts: 293   ·   registered: Feb. 21st, 2020   ·   location: IL
id 8567229
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k8la ( Member #38408) posted at 7:16 PM on Tuesday, July 28th, 2020

When my son was about to turn 5, I made it a point to make sure he could wipe his own butt before he started kindergarten just a few weeks after his birthday. I told him he couldn't go to school until he could do that for himself, so he didn't have to take the teacher away from her class to take care of him.

He was so proud that on the night he met his teacher just the week before school started, he loudly and proudly proclaimed he could wipe his own butt so he could go to school now.

posts: 1459   ·   registered: Feb. 9th, 2013
id 8567458
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Chrysalis123 ( Guide #27148) posted at 9:27 PM on Monday, August 3rd, 2020

Minnesota, I got you and Barcher confused...sorry. Both of you dads are amazing.. Keep up the great work.

Keep teaching Big Mister to cook. Let him learn how to make a complete easy meal like tacos or spaghetti. He will be so proud to be able to do this and serve his grown-ups the meal. Let him watch some of the awesome male chefs on tv too. Cooking is great for reading and math too, not to mention all the skills he will learn like shopping, self care, independence etc.

You are right- you can't control mom, but you can control your home and build Big Mister's confidence and independence.

My saying is never do anything for a kid that a kid can do for themself.

[This message edited by Chrysalis123 at 3:31 PM, August 3rd (Monday)]

Someone I once loved gave me/ a box full of darkness/ It took me years to understand/ That this, too, was a gift. - Mary Oliver

Just for the record darling, not all positive changes feel positive in the beginning -S C Lourie

posts: 6709   ·   registered: Jan. 10th, 2010
id 8569744
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tushnurse ( Member #21101) posted at 9:50 PM on Monday, August 3rd, 2020

MN - I have to agree you are doing an amazing job parenting.

Me: FBS
Him: FWS
Kids: 21 &23
Married for 28 years now, was 16 at the time.
D-Day Sept 26 2008
R'd in about 2 years. Old Vet now.

posts: 18926   ·   registered: Oct. 1st, 2008   ·   location: St. Louis
id 8569755
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SuperDaddy1027 ( Member #59344) posted at 9:47 AM on Tuesday, August 4th, 2020

First off Minnesota you are a fantastic Father. You’re doing a great job!

My DS is almost 10 and although I can’t relate to my XWW still wiping his ass I can relate to a similar situation. My DS is almost 10 and is on the chubby side. He always tells me how he always gets dessert, candy, sweets, etc. at Mom’s. I rarely give either of my kids dessert and the only time they have candy is Halloween. I always make sure we have a green veggie for dinner, and even pre-Covid rarely eat out with them. I try to cook healthy...and honestly do for the most part. Their Mom is always running thru the drive thru for dinner, or ordering pizza. I’ve never let my kids even sip soda....but at Mom’s they get soda, sweet tea etc. I have milk or water lol.

But much like your XWW, I can’t really say anything. She’ll accuse me of being controlling, and tell her how to parent and he can eat what he wants etc. I’ve learned my lesson with her. Its just not worth it. She’ll never see my side. Whether its bc she’s stubborn, doesn’t respect me, or is just an asshole in general. Meh...either way less is more when it comes to my XWW. Much like you and many other divorcees, I don’t co-parent with my XWW, I parallel parent.

My kids used to complain about no dessert, but they eventually caught on. When at Dad’s we don’t get dessert.

I guess what I’m trying to say is....just keep doing what you’re doing. Keep your side of the street clean. Big Mister knows how to wipe his ass. But his Mom feels the need to baby him. Nothing you can do about it. You’re a great Father and Big Mister is lucky to have you as a Dad.

PS. I hear the same exact FT conversation when my kids are here and call their Mom. Its so flipping annoying.

[This message edited by SuperDaddy1027 at 3:48 AM, August 4th (Tuesday)]

posts: 854   ·   registered: Jun. 23rd, 2017   ·   location: NC
id 8569940
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HalfTime2017 ( Member #64366) posted at 5:41 PM on Tuesday, August 4th, 2020

On the FT calls, you can solve that by having the kids take the call in their room. We all hang out in the living area or outdoor area when at home, and sometimes my kids will want to FT their mom, not daily though, just about once a week. I ask them to take private calls like that to their room. Theres been no issues. They can have a chat in private and I don't have to see or hear the shitty WW's face/voice and no need to hear what they talk about. Also, my GF is over a lot, so it avoids that drama as well.

posts: 1142   ·   registered: Jul. 5th, 2018   ·   location: Cali
id 8570102
Topic is Sleeping.
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