SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I want everyone to know that I am taking all the advice and kind words to heart and seriously, well, except for the cheat on your wife bit, but I am listening.

I might seem a bit overconfident, but that's just because I am in front of a keyboard.

I agree about the friend, but I am not going to force it, I will check however. I also agree about counselling for her and me, separately at first. I assume if there is an underlying issue I cannot satisfy in our marriage it is best to get it out and her to realize it before we go another 20 and me also to talk to a professional to help me make sure this is what I really want.

That said, I don't really understand the therapy for the BS. I mean, I didn't do anything wrong, I know that, what else can one give me, except conversation? I am still going to do it though.

I will probably be hyper analyzing everything for signs, so I am not overly worried I will "miss" something and I am certainly not going to sweep anything under the rug or just dismiss anything.

I know everyone here has my back being in the same or similar positions.

I think you're in shock.

True remorse takes time. Regret,and fear is most likely what you are seeing from her. Her tears are also partially for herself. Fear that others will find out, and possibly mourning the OM.

Crying is not a sign of remorse. Actions show remorse. She was able to look you in the eye, for a year, and lie. What work is she doing on herself to become a safe partner?

It's interesting that she hasn't told this friend there will be no more contact. And it's odd that you've been tested,but she hasn't yet. Other than a hurt husband, what consequences has she had?

[This message edited by HellFire at 12:07 PM, May 29th (Friday)]

I am hyperaware, any deviation will end it, she is well aware of this. She can't text or send any messages without me knowing if I choose to look. She's also willing to have these controls on her. Not a peep of resistance to the suggestions.

That's fine for now but somewhere down the line you will grow tired of playing marriage detective. Hopefully by then some measure of trust will have been restored.

That said, being ahead of others at this point is what I am most worried about, it seems I am not in the OMFG stage anymore and I feel I should be? I am a logical person but this is not logical at all.

There is no logic to any of this for a BS. There's no rhyme or reason or an answer to "why?" that will satisfy you. It's a roller coaster ride that none of us asked for. One day you're in the tunnel of love and the next day you're riding through the house of horrors. One day you love her and the next day your rage overtakes you and you want to punch a hole in the wall. Over time it gradually subsides and there will be some sense of normalcy again.

Keep posting and let it all out here on this site no matter where you're at emotionally.

That said, I don't really understand the therapy for the BS. I mean, I didn't do anything wrong, I know that, what else can one give me, except conversation? I am still going to do it though.

My wife's two A's caused the same symptoms in me that those who suffer from PTSD.

Recurrent, unwanted distressing memories of the traumatic event.

Severe emotional distress or physical reactions to something that reminds you of the traumatic event.

Unfortunately during those days we didn't know about this site or others like them and we went to marriage counselors. Big mistake! They made things worse. The marriage wasn't broken, she was.

Your situation sounds more hopeful than most.

Two things I'll warn you about...

1 - there's ALWAYS more. ALWAYS. They never come totally clean initially. Whether it's she brought him to your bed or she kissed you after doing stuffwith him or she did him on your bday....more will be revealed. And it will be the stuff she withheld to supposedly protect you from.

2 - you haven't hit the anger stage yet

Hellfire -

I understand where you are coming from, I am not responding for defense, just what I know.

I think you're in shock.

Most likely.

Fear that others will find out, and possibly mourning the OM.

I mentioned to her that I wanted to tell one of our mutual friends, who happens to be married to the town gossip, he and I are sort of close when we get together and I thought it would help for me to talk to another guy. I have so far refrained from doing it because I know he will not be able to resist telling his wife and she will spread it.

But, she didn't hesitate, she said, "you should talk to him". Mourning the OP... I'd have no idea, but she's definitely focused on me right now.

What work is she doing on herself to become a safe partner?

I don't really know what that means but she is ok with GPS, me checking texts if I want, having her call me wherever she goes. I am not sure what else aside from literally following her. She has taken every suggestion, even some way out there, with nothing less than "ok no problem at all, I'll do anything".

It's interesting that she hasn't told this friend there will be no more contact.

AFAIK, she doesn't know the OM, it doesn't seem like she does, and it's not her best friend, just one she talks with on FB and while the conversations were not pleasant they were not day to day so I don't really think I need her specifically to show me, after all, she doesn't know that I know about those conversations. It would be nice if she just said "don't ever contact me again" though.

what consequences has she had?

Oddly enough this was the topic last night. She has suffered none at all. It's not that I want her to suffer, and honestly if she truly, truly loves me, she is suffering. If she doesn't, what's the point? Ehen we started talking about it she broke down again with the sorry's and sobbing. I thinkshe gets it.

As far as testing, I did it immediately the next day, she has to work and the office that does it next to her job had been closed for Covid, not an excuse, just wasn't a priority (for me) it is now though.

GoldenR -

Whether it's she brought him to your bed

I wok from home so I do not need to burn the sheets or the house down, but I know what you are saying, I have already connected many of those dots.

It's not that I want her to suffer, and honestly if she truly, truly loves me, she is suffering. If she doesn't, what's the point?

Particle, is love a feeling or a set of verbs to you. What is this thing "love" that you relate to her, you, and your M?

That does "truly loves me" look like in an M?

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[This message edited by DIFM at 12:52 PM, May 29th, 2020 (Friday)]

Particle, is love a feeling or a set of verbs to you. What is this thing "love" that you relate to her, you, and your M?

What does "truly loves me" look like in an M?

I appreciate the help everyone if offering but I am not a child. Please do not treat me like one.

She went to her friends last night for a short time to help her with her kid (who is a mess) and she called me from there, stayed there (I checked) and called me when she got there and before she left, but still she used the same words as before "I am going to Katie's, be back later babe" and as soon as she left, my heart rate skyrocketed. So yeah, there's going to be lots of triggers.

Did she use this friend as cover to meet her boyfriend? Did this friend know about her affair?

toby -

Did she use this friend as cover to meet her boyfriend? Did this friend know about her affair?

No. That was the only true one I can be sure about. The rest are all up for grabs.

I don't really know what that [working on herself] means

Tell her to get a copy of Linda MacDonald's How to Help Your Spouse Heal from Your Affair. How many of the 15 points is she working on?

Calling herself names doesn't mean much at this point given that all this regret didn't come until you discovered her betrayal. She needs to get herself into counseling to deal with her inability/unwillingness to maintain boundaries and step up for her marriage.

NOTE: In addition to cutting all contact with her AP, she should voluntarily drop anyone who knew about her affair and condoned it. Those "friends" are not friends to your marriage and should all be history.

[This message edited by NotInMyLife at 1:11 PM, May 29th (Friday)]

I appreciate the help everyone if offering but I am not a child. Please do not treat me like one.

It was a real question, the topic of which is covered on SI often. Whatever love means is far from a universal concept. For some love is completely defined by observable behaviors. How you define "truly loves me" is important for your assessment of things that have happened and things that will happen, and not a universal concept.

I am not sure what about the question or topic you felt was condescending or child like.

So what does she say about her feelings for you. Does she say she still feels love? How about being in love and desire. What are her reasons for wanting you now when For a year she gave Some of those parts of herself physically and yes somewhat emotionally (even if she claims there was no emotion there was flirting and sexy talk and other intimate moments with him) to another man.

Now you know she is capable of doing that. It will take you a long time to rebuild that trust. It’s possible but takes longer than it took the first time you built that bond.

To me the path to that type of reconciliation is thru Pride you have in the work she does to prove that you are the only man for her, forever. The work she does to prove that to you, and the fact that this type of hard Introspection and completely more open giving of herself to you and self analysis is not something she has done for anyone else but herself and you the man she loves, is something that you can take pride in and use to build a new relationship.

But for right now, at this moment, she has just taken the first steps in that process. And while she has taken some good actions, you still are left with that feeling in the pit of your stomach that the only person you trusted with your heart and your honor and your pride, decided that having tender moments with this other guy were more important to her than protecting those things in which you entrusted to her, which are the same things you have been dutifully protecting for her.

So yes, I’m sure you’ve gotten early answers to some of these things. And as your mind processes them, there will be a rainbow of different emotions headed your way over time. The support of an IC for you can be truly beneficial in order to work thru them.

[This message edited by Stevesn at 1:17 PM, May 29th (Friday)]

DIFM -

I am not sure what about the question or topic you felt was condescending or child like.

It was a stand alone question with no context. In the context of this thread it seemed like a gotcha toward a negative response. If you didn't mean it that way, great, but I am not asking anyone here to be my psychotherapist today, I am here to get real world experiences and real word advice with an ability to express my rational and irrational feelings and thoughts, not to have someone delve into my psyche or have me do an exercise to determine if I really love my wife or vice versa. That's how it came off to me.

I am still hurting, I am confused and I am also very hopeful. I still very much love this person. This is not the time (for me) to break down how I define love. I am not ready for the crushing reality that love is just a chemical reaction based on a form of selfishness or something something. Nor do I want to hear that she cannot possibly love me because she cheated.

I just hurt right now.

Stevesn -

So what does she say about her feelings for you. Does she say she still feels love? How about being in love and desire. What are her reasons for wanting you now when For a year she gave Some of those parts of herself physically and yes somewhat emotionally (even if she claims there was no emotion there was flirting and sexy talk and other intimate moments with him) to another man.

Everything she says are the right things to say, that's all I can say to this. The words, the actions, are all positive, are all about me or about the regret and her shame.

She has said she realizes how wrong she was, with her reasoning, that she was building things up and not communicating, she hasn't yet giving me an actual reason for the affair itself. We're building to that, mostly because of me and my hesitation.

So yes, I’m sure you’ve gotten early answers to some of these things. And as your mind processes them, there will be a rainbow of different emotions headed your way over time. The support of an IC for you can be truly beneficial in order to work thru them.

I am starting to understand that now.

For a year + she was banging another dude Then coming home & having relations with you. For a year + & she has no real excuse why. I at least hope she used protection for your sake at least. At least keep digging there is always more.

What about exposure to family & friends? Is she just saying things you want to hear & sobbing for sympathy or is she genuine. Remember for a year+ she gaslighted, planned, scheduled, lied and banged another man.

Now you are a marriage policeman who is monitoring all her social media, travel & outings schedules. Is that how you are planning to live the rest of your Marriage? Sounds like fun.

For you to R she needs to have IC & find out why she decided to have sex with another man when she was supposedly receiving all she needed from you. I guess she didn't.

What's to stop her from straying again sometime in the future after you release her from your policeman grip.

[This message edited by notanotherchance at 1:58 PM, May 29th (Friday)]

I think you have a good grasp on the situation and I echo the advice to get IC for the both of you. Infidelity is trauma. You can get PTSD from it. Even if your WW is perfect and invested in R from this point forward, it will STILL take 2-5 years for YOU to heal and move on from it. And that includes having professional help. It's not fair that you have to go to IC but unfortunately that's a consequence on your WW's actions.

I don't see any valid reason for being with me other than it was a huge mistake and she's remorseful and loves me.

It is NOT a mistake. It is THOUSANDS of choices she made to betray you over the course of a year. A mistake is forgetting to buy milk at the store. It is not knowingly talk to, flirting, kissing, and having intercourse with someone outside of your marriage for a year. That's why she's going to need to dig deep to answer why she did it.

I just hurt right now.

I understand. For what it's worth, almost 100% of the people here on SI have struggled through exactly what you are going through. We feel your pain because we live(d) your pain. My question about love was not meant to be ethereal or metaphysical. From my perspective and experiences, love is very much pragmatic and a thing observed. And to know what it means to you will be important, as you struggle through the making sense of things phase(s).

I am sorry you are here and that you are facing this. Take what you can from SI. Know that the pain of the shitstorm of infidelity affects BS's is many different ways and you will get many different perspectives based on the pain each has experienced.

The key is in observing the sincerity of your WW's ownership, honesty, empathy, contrition, remorse, etc. It appears she is trying to convey a message of remorse and ownership. Those are essential to R.

That said, I don't really understand the therapy for the BS. I mean, I didn't do anything wrong, I know that, what else can one give me, except conversation? I am still going to do it though.

Because you are probably dealing with a whirlwind of feelings. They are able to help make sense of the rollercoaster you are on. They can reassure you what you are going through is normal and reasonable. They can help you figure out why you feel once way or another. There is a lot a good counselor will do to help you cope with anxiety and other issues resulting from being hit with infidelity. You no longer have a spouse you can trust and confide in. Your counselor is also going to be one of the best people to talk to about the divorce option (the lawyer will give you the facts, but the counselor can help you with the feelings), because you might not want to explore that scenario seriously with your WW or your friends.

[This message edited by This0is0Fine at 2:54 PM, May 29th (Friday)]