SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

My D cost $6,300. It was uncontested, no dependents, ended a partnership, changed land titles to individual names from joint, had clauses that I rent her land for pasture and what happens if she rents to someone else or sells or I do either, etc. There might be a little more to come but not much. Her lawyer cost her about $1,200.

Have no idea what it would have been contested. Had most of the terms worked out before going to the lawyer which took over a year and a few attempts. Just her and I with no mediator or anything else.

Back when I was determined to get a D, I pretty much just told my WH, "this is what's going to happen, and it can be the easy way or the hard way". I didn't have to go into more detail than that, but if I had, I'd have explained to him that 'we can give most of what we have to the attorneys and you can go on the public record as an adulterer, or we can divide what we have up evenly and just be done'.

You guys are in Virginia, if memory serves. You could sue on grounds and because adultery matters, it could be your WW looking for somewhere to live, not to mention having to stand and listen to what a family court judge thinks of her behavior and having it recorded for all time so that her great-great-great grandchildren can look it up.

Your WW doesn't believe you're willing to go to the mat, and of course, it's not your first choice. But I do think you'll get more cooperation if she understands that even though you'd rather do it "the easy way", you're at her disposal if she'd rather make it hard.

She's in a game of chicken with you, and she thinks she's winning. I'd save it for mediation though so a third party can tell her what a divorce on grounds might look like.

[This message edited by ChamomileTea at 6:19 PM, February 20th (Thursday)]

Being a martyr is a bad choice. You matter too

You won’t be much of a father figure if you don’t have a place to live and no money.

I feel like I'm trying to violently shake off something that has it's claws in me. It's claws pierce me and produce an unimaginable pain that I know will ease/heal when I get it off of me. It's like a vampire that at the same time it's draining me it's trying to fuck with my head.

Yup. It is a maelstrom of shit going thru you right now. Not being dismissive, but this is 'normal'. It is part anxiety, part anger, a measure of angst, a spoonful of confusion, and a dusting of (stale) love-remnants.

Little hint to get the vampire off you.... eat some garlic *bit of levity*

You have now decided on a course of action. Keep focused on it. However, do look around you once in a while to see if you need to adjust your course or you might hit something that you want to avoid.

steadychevy

My D cost $6,300. It was uncontested, no dependents, ended a partnership, changed land titles to individual names from joint, had clauses that I rent her land for pasture and what happens if she rents to someone else or sells or I do either, etc. There might be a little more to come but not much. Her lawyer cost her about $1,200.

Have no idea what it would have been contested. Had most of the terms worked out before going to the lawyer which took over a year and a few attempts. Just her and I with no mediator or anything else.

.....

Hm... This is very interesting. Maybe my lawyer was giving worst case? I don't know, it's worth another talk with him.

ChamomileTea

Back when I was determined to get a D, I pretty much just told my WH, "this is what's going to happen, and it can be the easy way or the hard way". I didn't have to go into more detail than that, but if I had, I'd have explained to him that 'we can give most of what we have to the attorneys and you can go on the public record as an adulterer, or we can divide what we have up evenly and just be done'.

I like this - I think I will throw out something like this.

You guys are in Virginia, if memory serves. You could sue on grounds and because adultery matters, it could be your WW looking for somewhere to live, not to mention having to stand and listen to what a family court judge thinks of her behavior and having it recorded for all time so that her great-great-great grandchildren can look it up.

Yes, we're in VA and adultery does matter in terms of finances, not so much custody.

Your WW doesn't believe you're willing to go to the mat, and of course, it's not your first choice. But I do think you'll get more cooperation if she understands that even though you'd rather do it "the easy way", you're at her disposal if she'd rather make it hard.

I think you're correct.

She's in a game of chicken with you, and she thinks she's winning. I'd save it for mediation though so a third party can tell her what a divorce on grounds might look like.

I may or may not. She shits her pants when I go to my lawyer for some reason. Actually I think it's because she can't afford one really - I mean, she could, but she doesn't want to because in doing so she's putting her future at risk.

Marz

Being a martyr is a bad choice. You matter too

You won’t be much of a father figure if you don’t have a place to live and no money.

I agree with you - that's why it's one or the other. Actually the truth is that I could afford a place right now, it's just things will be extremely tight for me and I wouldn't have the emotional support that I think I'll need on the weeks that I won't have the kids (at least the first few).

RocketRaccoon

Yup. It is a maelstrom of shit going thru you right now. Not being dismissive, but this is 'normal'. It is part anxiety, part anger, a measure of angst, a spoonful of confusion, and a dusting of (stale) love-remnants.

No, I hear you - I'm sure it is. I also know that emotions hang on longer than the rational mind. My grandmother had Alzheimer's disease. Occasionally she would get into a mood - she'd be angry about something or afraid about something. A few minutes later she'd still have the emotion but have no idea why she was experiencing it. She'd have the emotion for 1/2 hour or more. Emotions die hard and clog the rational mind. I'm not saying they are bad, necessarily, but they do make hard necessary decisions even harder.

Little hint to get the vampire off you.... eat some garlic *bit of levity*

Lol, I love garlic...It's not working...

You have now decided on a course of action. Keep focused on it. However, do look around you once in a while to see if you need to adjust your course or you might hit something that you want to avoid.

Will do. I think that I go through bad swings in the mornings and I come here to post - to get them 'out' of my system. You know? Then I feel more hopeful and better.

In other news both my kids are sick. I've had a few exchanges about it with my wife about it. Also, I got an email about an open house for some apartments I'd looked at (and actually lived in, in the past). They are pretty nice, to tell the truth.

Anything new happening, TLOne?

No real updates. The kids were sick this weekend and I had some work to do. My wife and I 'interacted' by talking about the kids and what was going on. My wife was teary a few times, snapped at the kids (they were arguing), and made comments like 'I'm going to need to get a second job' (something like that - it wasn't a topic of conversation, just an off hand comment).

I didn't really engage. I know she went to IC last week. I didn't ask about it. When she snapped at the kids I was working, so I had my laptop. She came in my room saying that she was going to go out for a while because the kids were driving her crazy. She saw me on the computer and said something like 'oh great, I guess you were writing all of that down'...Or something. I said do whatever you want I'm working. She didn't do anything, just went down to her room.

So it's just kind of odd. The new normal of not-quite-room mates. As I said, I didn't really engage her. It's like a waiting game - I have five damned weeks until the next mediation. I'm going to let things marinate for a bit since I have weeks of time.... Maybe a week. If we go to court I have the upper hand. I can afford the lawyers, VA is an at fault state (for financial divorce matters) and I'm thinking that ANY judge we talk to isn't going to like the fact that she's been talking to her child-rapist father, which is a bit of an edge in terms of custody.

I did watch 'Una' this weekend - I like Rooney Mara, something about her...Anyway, PROBABLY not the best movie to watch since it's about a woman who is abused by a pedophile as a child and then seeks him out as an adult. It's thought provoking, but just made me think about my wife's father.

Talked to a bunch of friends. So that was good.

I know you feel alone - but you're not. Stay strong.

and made comments like 'I'm going to need to get a second job'

Bear in mind that my sarcasm is showing today but she can just fuck. right. off. with. that. Just reminds me of an exchange with my xdouche after D was decided on when he told me that I "needed to have respect for just how difficult all of this was going to be for him"... Dafuq? Seriously... WTAF. Things come back to me and I am always stricken anew at the fact that I made it through all that shit and didn't slap or stab or murder anyone not even a little tiny bit.

Don't want that second job cupcake? Maybe shoulda thought about that before having an affair with a jobless douchebag loser.

Stay the course Lost - no matter how rough the road on the way out, believe me it is worth it on the other side of it.

No news is good news sometimes. You've got your ducks kept in their rows, now you just need to white-knuckle that indifference while you wait.

Sounds like your wife may be vaguely aware of SI. Keep an ear out for specific cheater lingo like "op secs" or other of their nonsense. She may be looking around for the info you've been getting in an attempt to get get ahead of you.

And not that I need to say it but just keep focusing on those kids.

[This message edited by Skadu at 9:22 AM, February 25th (Tuesday)]

Don't want that second job cupcake? Maybe shoulda thought about that before having an affair with a jobless douchebag loser.

Ellie, that had me laughing. Oh, the memories!

Robert22205https

I know you feel alone - but you're not. Stay strong.

Thank you - I realized recently that I need to do more than this. I need to actually do some work to heal. I'll explain further below.

EllieKMAS

Bear in mind that my sarcasm is showing today but she can just fuck. right. off. with. that. Just reminds me of an exchange with my xdouche after D was decided on when he told me that I "needed to have respect for just how difficult all of this was going to be for him"... Dafuq? Seriously... WTAF. Things come back to me and I am always stricken anew at the fact that I made it through all that shit and didn't slap or stab or murder anyone not even a little tiny bit.

Don't want that second job cupcake? Maybe shoulda thought about that before having an affair with a jobless douchebag loser.

Stay the course Lost - no matter how rough the road on the way out, believe me it is worth it on the other side of it.

No, I totally get what you are saying and it's true. A second job is not my responsibility. I have to look after myself, I'm not responsible for saving her or anyone other than myself and she got herself into this mess. It's not incumbent on me to make sure she gets out.

Skadu

No news is good news sometimes. You've got your ducks kept in their rows, now you just need to white-knuckle that indifference while you wait.

Sounds like your wife may be vaguely aware of SI. Keep an ear out for specific cheater lingo like "op secs" or other of their nonsense. She may be looking around for the info you've been getting in an attempt to get get ahead of you.

And not that I need to say it but just keep focusing on those kids.

True. There is a bit of news, and it's made me realize that I need to spend some time on healing myself. More below.

Basically we had a bad argument/fight the other night. I was in a bad mood when I came home and she pressed me for what was the matter. So that opened the flood gates. She still thinks that Marriage Counseling will help fix things. I told her that there was no trust and I couldn't see a way for it to be restored. At this point we were both angry. She said that this was something I had to work on and I think I said that there is no working on it, it's not coming back. The argument was all over the place and I brought up her father. She called her Godmother for support and her Godmother essentially took my side, saying it's a bad idea to Face Time or introduce the kids to the father. Which it is. This set her off and she went out. She was gone for a while. Later she told me that she was essentially suicidal, but determined not to do anything. Instead she bought a fish.

The next day we talked - I had been childish in my responses to her, and at one point laughed at her. I did not like my behavior at all. So I apologized for it. This opened her up and she was really upset saying she finally had no hope left. That we should tell the kids Friday. We talked some more - but the kids pretty much already know. My daughter said something kind of cryptic along the lines of it will be better in the future no matter what and she talked about having two bedrooms.

ANYWAY, I picked up the book Living & Loving after Betrayal. I've read some of it - I realized that what I experienced was this: I was angry - angry provides chemicals that make you feel 'better' than numb or depression or whatever. It gives you energy and all that. Once the anger recedes you are 'lower' than you were before. So I came home angry that day, a fight ensued, and then the next day I felt really low and apologized for my behavior. I need to stop that - this is all difficult.

So I'm going to focus on doing the exercises in the book and reading the book, among other things.

Lost, is your STBX seriously trying to introduce your children to a known pedophile? Her father or not, that's disgusting that she would put her own kids in danger like that.

There's two ways you can protect your kids. One is legal. If her father has been charged or done time for anything, your lawyer needs to know immediately that she's trying to facilitate a relationship between him and the kids. If he doesn't, you may not have any legal recourse about keeping him away until he does something wrong. But what you can do now is sit your children down without your STBX and tell them exactly who her father is and what he has done. Make sure they understand that they are always safe to tell you anything. Chances are, your older kids will not want to meet him when they know. They can refuse to go see him. If you have younger kids, you may have to have a separate age appropriate talk about inappropriate touching with them. They may be forced to meet him but some truth and awareness will always be better than none.

nekonamida

Lost, is your STBX seriously trying to introduce your children to a known pedophile? Her father or not, that's disgusting that she would put her own kids in danger like that.

I agree. She says that was not her intention, that she was just talking to him, like 5 times a year. I have no way to ascertain whether this is true or not.

There's two ways you can protect your kids. One is legal. If her father has been charged or done time for anything, your lawyer needs to know immediately that she's trying to facilitate a relationship between him and the kids.

He has, both lawyers know (mediator and my own). Mediator has written it up already.

If he doesn't, you may not have any legal recourse about keeping him away until he does something wrong. But what you can do now is sit your children down without your STBX and tell them exactly who her father is and what he has done. Make sure they understand that they are always safe to tell you anything. Chances are, your older kids will not want to meet him when they know. They can refuse to go see him. If you have younger kids, you may have to have a separate age appropriate talk about inappropriate touching with them. They may be forced to meet him but some truth and awareness will always be better than none.

I've already done this. I've also told them if she takes them or anything to tell me ASAP.

My STBX doesn't understand the seriousness of this. I think it's above the wrong that she's caused me. Her Godmother does as well. My STBX doesn't seem to understand that her decision making is not rational. I mean, I guess she wouldn't, but still.

LO

Does she talk about the AP anymore? Does she acknowledge at all the pain her affair caused you? Any signs that she has an inkling of what it’s going to take to rebuild a relationship she has destroyed?

You mentioned she thinks MC is going to fix everything. I am assuming (hopefully) that you are not doing MC. That is something only for when you have a truly remorseful WS and she has completed 6-12 months of good IC work on herself and ensures the BS will feel safe trying again with her.

You are light years away from that point. I know you know that. But your mention of it scared me.

Stevesn

LO

Does she talk about the AP anymore?

She says no, but how do I really know?

Does she acknowledge at all the pain her affair caused you?

She acknowledges it, but I have my doubts if she really understands.

Any signs that she has an inkling of what it’s going to take to rebuild a relationship she has destroyed?

I think she thinks that MC can accomplish this. Yesterday she said that it was hopeless that she doesn't think that there IS a way to rebuild it. That's why she was contemplating her life.

You mentioned she thinks MC is going to fix everything. I am assuming (hopefully) that you are not doing MC. That is something only for when you have a truly remorseful WS and she has completed 6-12 months of good IC work on herself and ensures the BS will feel safe trying again with her.

I don't think MC would help. I don't think it's a magical cure all.

You are light years away from that point. I know you know that. But your mention of it scared me.

I hear you. It's what she said. I think she understands the general magnitude of what's happened, but I think she was living under the idea that MC was the only thing that could fix things. I think she's beginning to realize that's not the case.

My lawyer told me that the costs to get divorced would be something like 20-80k.

Mine cost me around $3500. Uncontested and had every document filled out and agreed upon. Probably different here in Florida. It took less than a month from when it was file to when it was final.

Your WW is doing everything to drag this out because she knows she has no leg to stand on. She wants to keep you on the hook but she doesn't want to be your wife. Not much to work with.

Like yours, my XWW could not afford an attorney. I used that to my advantage and could dictate the terms of the D. I wasn't trying to screw my XWW over. But I wasn't going to acquiesce to her unfair tactics like going after inheritance or finances that she weren't considered conjugal assets.

Lean in hard with "we can either be civil and cooperative or we can go on the record that you're an adulteress and sabotaged the marriage". It worked for me. Might work for you.

She knows that not only will she lose her comfy way of life, but that she'll also lose her social status as a good wife and mother. She's only trying to save her ass.

Stay in your lane and focus on the D process. Only talk to her about the kids and the D. If she starts talking about marriage and MC just walk away. She's trying to get in your head to gauge how she can control the situation. Don't let her in.

Is the 'victim' (your WW) trying to extort sympathy by inferring that she's suicidal? There are those that truly have issues with depression but she sounds more like she's using it for manipulation.

squid

Mine cost me around $3500. Uncontested and had every document filled out and agreed upon. Probably different here in Florida. It took less than a month from when it was file to when it was final.

What does it take to contest something? Would she have to file something?

Your WW is doing everything to drag this out because she knows she has no leg to stand on. She wants to keep you on the hook but she doesn't want to be your wife. Not much to work with.

I roughly think this. I think she wants the status quo and I think she has no idea what she's doing.

Like yours, my XWW could not afford an attorney. I used that to my advantage and could dictate the terms of the D. I wasn't trying to screw my XWW over. But I wasn't going to acquiesce to her unfair tactics like going after inheritance or finances that she weren't considered conjugal assets.

Lean in hard with "we can either be civil and cooperative or we can go on the record that you're an adulteress and sabotaged the marriage". It worked for me. Might work for you.

Actually that was part of the argument. I think I was a bit uncivil - I was pointing out that I had all the leverage, both from a financial point of view and from a custody point of view. I think I backed her into a corner. That's when she called her Godmother and things exploded.

She knows that not only will she lose her comfy way of life, but that she'll also lose her social status as a good wife and mother. She's only trying to save her ass.

Yes, essentially.

Stay in your lane and focus on the D process. Only talk to her about the kids and the D. If she starts talking about marriage and MC just walk away. She's trying to get in your head to gauge how she can control the situation. Don't let her in.

I do think this is all about control.

Dismayed2012

Is the 'victim' (your WW) trying to extort sympathy by inferring that she's suicidal? There are those that truly have issues with depression but she sounds more like she's using it for manipulation.

Yes I think so - but it was an offhanded comment. She didn't dwell on it as I thought she would if she was going to use it for manipulation. It was more of a statement of facts, I went here, thought about this, decided against it, thought I'd do something constructive, bought a fish. Now that doesn't mean that she wasn't using it for manipulation. She does have issues with depression - but she hasn't been suicidal. So I think she thought about it but I think she was telling me more for emphasis as opposed to the manipulation that some people do when they say such things. In my youth, my mother attempted suicide more times than I can count and the way she does it was a lot different than this.

I hear you. It's what she said. I think she understands the general magnitude of what's happened, but I think she was living under the idea that MC was the only thing that could fix things. I think she's beginning to realize that's not the case.

There is nothing to be fixed. She was banging another man every chance she got long term, got caught, REFUSED multiple times to stop seeing him or talking to him, and has told you not too long ago she could not stop, which has been backed by her actions. I hope you have not forgot all that shit.

There is only ONE thing that has caused any change in her behavior and its called SELFISH. now that YOU have taken control and it effects her, shes all sad.

And you are supposed to learn to trust her with an OM less than an hour away who she is talking to daily ( and I'd bet my ass a polygraph would tell you that) who has the balls to send her flowers to YOUR home, which she just called "stupid" because your child saw the flowers. my bet is if she was alone you would have never known he sent them.

You need to buckle your seat belt because this attempt at manipulation is just beginning. Next she will be wanting to climb in bed with you or she will offer to let you see or hear a NC communication, which after all the lying will mean nothing. Way too late.

Lost, you have driven the entire length of the field through a lot of pain. You are in the "red zone" if you follow football. DON'T FUMBLE THE BALL NOW.