SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Lucky77

Are you divorced or in reconciliation?

I don't know if this helps, but I don't think of the AP this way at all.

I think that there is a difference between regret/guilt versus remorse.

Remorse often is the result of having to distill the details of the affair through your spouses eyes. When you have gone over every detail and have seen the pain in your spouses eye as you have explained it for the 1st, 2nd, 5th time, there is no way for me not to remember that when a detail might be remembered.

I could see how maybe, possibly if you were guilty/regretful you could still harbor those feelings to a certain extent. In many ways, I would think reliving the affair with the same mentality you had it is nothing more than continuing the affair without the presence of the AP. I have often scratched my head at Lucky's replies because we came to this site at almost the exact same time yet what he describes is very different than what I feel about my situation. It could be the difference between genders I suppose, but I think it might be the lack of gravity of not having experienced confessing.

How FF does that, I don't know, but he has maybe been more introspective and maybe spent more time reading the Betrayed side of the forum. I think Lucky's conscience does bother him at times, from what he's relayed but I do get puzzled with the rest. It will be interesting to see what his further responses might explain.

Hiking out

Right. I’m always weighing the male wayward perspective higher then the female wayward’s perspective because women and men cheat for different t reasons right and get different things out of them right?

“How did you end your affair and how long after ending it did you realize it wasn’t true love or your soulmate”

NVM

[This message edited by ff4152 at 4:29 PM, June 22nd (Monday)]

Hi Mickie,

Are you divorced or in reconciliation

As I have not confessed my A to my W I'm in a bit of a different boat.

Hikingout......I'm picturing you (what I can anyway.....just some random association I've made for you) scratching your head at my puzzling behavior, lol.

Well, lucky...what you describe of your affair doesn't puzzle me...it's the other stuff.

But, what kind of social media is letting you know she is looking at your stuff? Linkedin?

And, while I understand you really don't feel positively about the AP herself (you often say she was really crazy) you sound like you romanticize that time of your life? Do you think you still would if you told your wife about it and you saw her reaction or do you think it's a dude thing? I am convinced its the first, and not the latter.

It does puzzle me!

I guess now I'm really confused Lucky77. I'm curious what you are gettig from this site? Are you preparing to tell your W?

I understand where lucky is coming from. My WW cheated roughly 20yrs ago. 6-7mo A with a married coworker. We got some crappy MC that basically facilitated blameshifting the bulk of her A onto me. I worked too much, blah, blah, blah. She ended the A on her own. AP outed her to me after she refused a marriage proposal.

I stewed in rage for about a year and a half. An old newly single FWB, a girl I had been seeing when I met my now wife, emailed me out of the blue with one of those "how's life going" emails. I spilled my guts to her and she suggested we meet for coffee. That started a 18mo A. She and I were never exclusive and I stopped the "benefits" part of the relationship when I met my now wife. I had been 100% faithful to that point.

I had 3 kids 5 and under at the time. I would help prepare and eat dinner with the family. Play with the kids. Help with bathtime and put them to bed. This was typically over and done with by 8-8:30pm, then I would tell my wife I was going out, go see AP and come home at 2-3am. This happened 2-4 times a week. It was a no pressure type relationship that was primarily sex. AP was far more sexually adventurous than my wife ever was and I would be lying if I said I never looked back on that experience fondly. AP ended it for the same reason I did before I was married, she met someone that she thought she could have a future with.

I cheated again several years later with someone I met in grad school. This was a different experience. She was divorced and a BS. I completely fell for her. My wife and I are opposites in many ways, this was great and seemed to be complimentary in many ways but sometimes it made it difficult to communicate with each other. The AP and I were much more similar and had many things in common. I had made plans to leave my wife and be with her. I drug my feet and felt a tremendous amount of guilt for breaking up my family. At 4.5 years into the A, she landed a dream type job 2500 miles away. I just couldn't leave my kids, job, extended family and all of that to follow a woman across the country. She gave me an ultimatum and broke it off when I didn't follow through. The whole thing lasted almost 5 years. I still have feelings for her, in fact that's really why I came to SI. I'm having a hard time posting anything related to her. I feel like I let something great slip through my fingers.

Yes, I am still married to my WW and I did confess a few years ago. I would say we started R and my WW has completely owned what she did originally. So lucky isn't the only guy that feels that way, I was relieved to see his posts. My deal is a bit different, but I know what he means.

[This message edited by Buck at 7:54 PM, June 22nd (Monday)]

This was written by a WW in another thread

The reason I can say now that I love my BH more than ever, or that he is better than AP in every way, is because it is true

When a WS seeks to R with their BS is it only the AP they compare their BS to or is it everyone?

If it is just the AP does that not leave them open to another A in the future when someone they deem better comes along?

When a WS seeks to R with their BS is it only the AP they compare their BS to or is it everyone?

If it is just the AP does that not leave them open to another A in the future when someone they deem better comes along?

I had forgotten the good qualities my BH possesses and wanted out of my marriage, which is why I pursued my A.

BH showed that he wanted us to be a team again- did the pick me dance, which ironically showed me there was something to be saved. I chose AP not because I particularly liked HIM, I chose him because he was giving me all the attention and praise and positivity that I was lacking in my M. Therefore, once I really began to see again that my BH did care and wanted to make it work in spite of everything, I started seeking to change myself and ended the A.

Looking back, I think I would have ended the A on my own given a bit more time- my AP really was no catch (I affaired down), and I was looking to reassure myself that if/when I D'd my BH I would still be able to be attractive to other men and be lovable. I had a sick definition of love to say the least .

So that said, I might not be able to answer your question in a way relating to your specific situation, but I think I'm less at risk of another A than I was since working to remember what attracted me to my BH in the first place (and his reminders helped). I also know how much damage my affair caused ME, and on a selfish level (which is what all us WS are- selfish), I don't want to do that ever again!

If it is just the AP does that not leave them open to another A in the future when someone they deem better comes along?

Yes.

I don’t know the context of what that WW was talking about, but many BS that I’ve seen here compare themselves to the AP. How many times have we seen posters telling a new BS that it’s not about them and they didn’t do anything and not to think if only they were taller, thinner, prettier, or anything else. But it’s natural for a BS to compare themselves to the AP and ask how do I know that my WS really wants to be with me or really loves me. Was the AP more handsome or better in bed or was she prettier, better body, more adventurous? So this WW could have been addressing that.

However, it doesn’t matter that she says her BH is better than the AP. That’s honestly a little bit of a platitude. My BH was always “better” than the AP and that didn’t stop me from having an affair. So it’s not about the BS vs the AP at all. It’s all about the WS and what she or he has done to work on herself so that this doesn’t happen again regardless of who the BS or other person might be. That’s why I said yes. Because that statement by the WW means nothing. I mean it’s nice and all but it’s also shallow. You can say that and mean that, but if it’s not backed by change in the WS, then you’re open to another A.

I have no idea if that made sense or if I made a mess of what I was trying to say. Lol

Hi Mrs. W,

The context of my A was a great deal of marital stress and anxiety and depression. My husband had stonewalled me for many years as I had raged at him or blamed him for everything or complained about everything.

I was addressing the inherent good qualities that my BH has well above and beyond my AP.

That said, I feel I am less vulnerable. Not impervious- I can't after my A say that it will never happen- like alcoholics, once an alcoholic, always an alcoholic.

I'm working on developing better coping strategies to deal with my stress and learning to accept the things I can't change just yet in my marriage. That is what is making me less vulnerable to an affair. The work I'm putting in on myself- not the superior nature of my BH.

Hi Lucky77...now I see you are telling me what I am thinking . Honestly...what I WANT is authenticity. For many years our M wasn't authentic...and I can definitely tell the difference in what our M is NOW . Most people DO want that...and it is a shame you aren't in an authentic M. It truly is the BEST !

To answer your question...I KNOW my H thinks about his A several times a day. The AT&T commercials have a sweet spokesperson on them that has the same name as his adultery co-conspirator...Lily. Ironically...one of the commercials shows Lily talking to her "friend"...which is a cup she named Nancy. Nancy was the last woman I caught my XWH with !!! I have long gotten over the trigger at Lily's name...but my H will tense up when he sees that commercial. The station we watch shows this commercial several times a day. He has no control over when it plays...and his body language is pretty much the same every time he sees it. It isn't about HER though. It is because it reminds him that he is now a member of the "cheater's club"...and he has to live with that fact. As a Marine...he valued his integrity very much. I used to say he was the most honorable man I met. He lost his integrity when he had his A. He is getting it back...but it is a self inflicted wound that hasn't quite healed yet. Oddly...to ME...he is more honorable than ever...he just needs to see it for himself. I have no doubt he will !

When I was going to counseling after I caught my XWH cheating...I told my counselor how my XWH accused ME of cheating on HIM. My counselor gave a cool analogy when he said that all bank robbers think everyone robs banks. That has helped me more in dealing with my mindset as well as with other people. YOUR experience leads you to think that ALL Waywards probably think about their A's with fondness. Statistics say otherwise. The Waywards that have gotten out of their affair fog on here are proof of that as well.

There really is no mystery to A's. That is why there is a "cheater's handbook" that people reference on here . ALL A's are FAKE...and include 2 people who are selfish and willing to USE other people for their selfish desires. The WHY as to how these adultery co-conspirators got to be that selfish is different for each individual. Some will go looking for it...others just want to stay in their fog...thinking their pleasure from the memories will keep them happy. They don't realize the TRUTH really will set them FREE! My hope is that you and other Waywards who haven't confessed will be able to one day see for yourselves how being authentic is the BEST way to be .

You still haven't answered my questions from my previous post...and I don't want to overstep my bounds on this thread...so I will stop posting now . I appreciate your thoughts though. You are still a work in progress and you seem to have gained some insight from this site. I have no doubt that you will get to authenticity too .

I'm working on developing better coping strategies to deal with my stress and learning to accept the things I can't change just yet in my marriage. That is what is making me less vulnerable to an affair. The work I'm putting in on myself- not the superior nature of my BH.

That’s wonderful. I’m really glad you’re working on that. And thank you for providing context. I didn’t even know it was you who fooled13years was quoting, let alone the context. So I was just looking at that statement on its own. Does believing our BS is better than the AP mean we won’t betray him or her again? And my answer is no. Of course not.

Did your AP, end the A, by giving you the ultimatum of leaving your BS to pursue a true relationship with them.

The AP gave my WH the ultimatum to choose between Me or Her.

My WH claims that he made it clear to her that he was never going to leave me and that he loved me.

The A was to be temporary. She was good with that in the beginning but then started making demands on him.

His attitude towards the AP soon changed to FU, I thought we had an understanding that the A, was going nowhere.

The AP turned quite nasty very quickly.

She went as far as sending him a song titled “You don’t know how to be a man”. Well that pissed my WH right off.

My fear is false reconciliation after reading so many of the stories on here.

To the WH’s were you ever in false reconciliation? When you were in False reconciliation how deep did you go to try to convince everyone that you we’re reconciling?

Seriously, after reading a lot of these stories I am finding it hard to let go of fear.

Hi Mickie500.

I know you asked WH’s and I’m a WW, but I hope it’s okay if I respond. I think having a fear of false R is totally understandable and I know my BH had that fear as well. A WS destroyed the trust that existed in the M and once that’s gone it’s very hard for the BS to trust their husband or wife again. And maybe the WS is just saying whatever they need to because they’re scared of D, losing their family or security or whatever, right? My BH would always say that my words didn’t matter to him. I mean they might have been nice to hear but he didn’t put any faith in them. He would tell me what mattered was my actions and seeing if they were consistent over time. What did I do? How did I live? Was I doing things that showed I had him and our M in mind? That’s what helped him.

So I would say the same thing. False R is a real fear and totally normal. Watch how your WW acts. What is she doing? Forget about what she says or any of the ILY’s. It’s her actions that really matter.

Mrswalloped

He is doing everything he needs to and also saying things and also very consistent—— I do believe though that he doesn’t always give me full details when I ask. I want details but I’ve read the betrayedspouse shouldn’t ask for too many details anyway. When I have too many details it makes me trigger more. The triggers play back in a loop so sometimes I think it’s for the best. Also, I’ve noticed men don’t ask for too many details about their wives’ affair. Maybe I could learn from them. I am a mad hatter and though I did tell him stuff (no kissing or sex happened) there was hand placement that he didn’t take well and kinda freaked out and asked me to stop giving details.

One thing I have kept from him is that I drove the guy in our car. He would hate that- I know he’d really freak out.

Mickie-

If you want details ask for them. You own your recovery and whatever you feel you need should be what you ask for. If you’re afraid that what you learn will make a difference, then just recognize that you are still early in this, and you owe yourself the patience to make your decision WHEN you’re ready. The biggest contributor to false R is the unaddressed assumption that things are going well.

Regarding the MH piece, there needs to be some care to managing the discussion. Your assumptions on what needs to be disclosed and what not should be approached with some method. I say it requires care because I went full idiot when this disclosure happened in my case, and had I recognized my hand in the revenge ONS as opposed to becoming defensive about it, I believe I would be in a much better place right now. You both need to approach any discussions about this with some perspective and empathy, because he now feels entitled to emotional responses and needs to understand how destructive and self-defeating that’s going to turn out for him.

“Helping your spouse heal” has a couple pointers on navigating that, the big takeaway being that talking about both of them may be necessary, but NEVER in the same sitting.

(ETA I re-read your post above and want to caution you about drawing a line from intent to action. What you describe COULD be an EA but if I were to guess I’d surmise you came clean about something that had POTENTIAL to be far worse and WH took advantage of an opportunity to inflate his hurt. That’s a guess but let me know if I’m on the right track...)

Last thing I’ll say is please don’t build the expectation that you’ll ever let go of fear. Fear is natural, especially with the road you’re navigating. Living with it is a far better expectation.

[This message edited by JBWD at 9:21 AM, June 29th (Monday)]