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I Can Relate :
BS Questions for WS's - Part 13

Topic is Sleeping.
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Mickie500 ( Member #74292) posted at 10:27 PM on Sunday, May 24th, 2020

When did you know you were completely over with the A and the AP and how long after that did your BS actually start trusting you again?

My husband has honored NC and says he doesn’t even think about the AP until I bring her up. However, from this thread breaking NC could come at anytime- I want to believe in his actions and give him hope but whenever I do I start panicking like it’s too soon to give him a little more trust.

He’s really putting in the actions but my brain says it’s too early and my heart says I’m afraid to break anymore and I’m stuck in limbo.

posts: 350   ·   registered: Apr. 23rd, 2020   ·   location: Chicago
id 8545466
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Westway ( Member #71747) posted at 10:32 PM on Tuesday, May 26th, 2020

I have a question. I recently learned that my STBXWW is engaging in severely promiscuous and dangerous sexual practices. I know that the brakes are off now that I am out of her life, but it is as if she just doesn't care about her health anymore. If my daughters get wind of her behavior it will completely destroy her relationship with them. And frankly, I don't want her to end up dead in a few years, or facing death from HIV.

As her future ex-husband, am I within my rights as the father of her kids to demand she get help for what I believe is a longstanding sex addiction? Are there any former waywards here who went through these behaviors? I could sure use the advice.

Me: 52;

XWW: 50 y.o. serial cheater

Married 22 years, Together 24
2 Daughters: aged 16 and 20
DDay: 9/20/19
Divorced 12/03/20.

posts: 1366   ·   registered: Oct. 3rd, 2019   ·   location: USA
id 8545959
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Doesitstop11 ( Member #49432) posted at 1:05 PM on Wednesday, May 27th, 2020

I'm sure this has been asked before. How did it feel to lie to your BS's face everyday particularly those in LTA's?

posts: 170   ·   registered: Sep. 1st, 2015
id 8546076
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TheLostOne2020 ( Member #72463) posted at 4:21 PM on Wednesday, May 27th, 2020

Doesitstop11

I'm sure this has been asked before. How did it feel to lie to your BS's face everyday particularly those in LTA's?

I'm kind of curious about this too. Actually, I'm wondering how the WW can say they care about their BS after all the lies and betrayal. What does it even mean for them to say they care?

D-Day 1: New Year's Day 2020
D-Day 2: Jan 21 2020
There was no D-Day 3.

6/12/2020: Moved out.

3/02/2021: Officially divorced.

I'm 42 and just starting to have the answers to the universe...

posts: 892   ·   registered: Jan. 3rd, 2020   ·   location: NoVa
id 8546124
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ff4152 ( Member #55404) posted at 4:45 PM on Wednesday, May 27th, 2020

Westway

Thankfully, while I have not through that nightmare, I wanted to offer you some thoughts on this subject.

I’ve often read here that once your WS has had an A, they’ve fired you from the job as their spouse. You shouldn’t worry or try to control what they do, especially if you’re on the D path. Great in principle, oftentimes not applicable IRL, especially if children are involved.

My guess is she feels that her world has fallen apart. From the sound of it, it doesn’t appear that she has much of a support system in place through friends or family. She could be of the mindset “What have I got to lose?”

Obviously you still care about her at some level, if for no other reason than she is the mother of your children. Although this might go against the grain here or even your own inclinations, have you tried to talk to her about it?

I’m not a lawyer, nor do I play one on TV but I suspect there isn’t much you can do about it from a legal standpoint. If your children are minors and she is bringing strange men home, perhaps. Otherwise, you’re going to have to stand on the sidelines and pray she gets her life in order. Other than showing her the empathy she never offered you, just be there for your children.

Me -FWS

posts: 1856   ·   registered: Sep. 30th, 2016
id 8546135
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ff4152 ( Member #55404) posted at 4:53 PM on Wednesday, May 27th, 2020

DoesItStop/TheLostOne

Simply put, I really didn’t care all that much. TBH, any WS who says differently is full of it. I cared insofar as to not getting caught, but how I felt was certainly my top priority.

This is where compartmentalization comes into play. I was able to rationalize what I was doing. As a result, I was able to stuff any feelings of guilt way down deep.

It’s really hard to put into words how skillful WS are at justifying our behavior to ourselves. Normal people would care about betraying the folks we profess to love. Normal people would care about exposing our spouses to STD’s. Normal people would care about the destruction an A brings.

We do not

In the end, it was all about filling our cup. If we had to use yours to do it, so be it.

Me -FWS

posts: 1856   ·   registered: Sep. 30th, 2016
id 8546138
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BraveSirRobin ( Member #69242) posted at 5:55 PM on Wednesday, May 27th, 2020

Am I within my rights as the father of her kids to demand she get help for what I believe is a longstanding sex addiction?

Well, you can try, but you can expect her to use it as a bargaining chip -- "I'll get help if you call off the divorce." And then when you refuse, as you absolutely should, she has her scapegoat. "Everything would have been different if he had given me another chance, but he didn't care enough about me to try." That's the wayward mindset, believing that our failings are someone else's job to fix.

Your concern speaks well of you, Westway, but you have neither rights not responsibilities where she's concerned anymore, and that's good, because your daughters will need you to be a safe space that's uninvolved in her shitshow. Someone else in her life is going to have to step up to this particular plate -- hopefully a friend that she can't turn the blame onto, so she has to face it for herself. Unfortunately, that requires authenticity, and from what you describe of her, that probably isn't a characteristic she values in choosing her friends. Maybe one of them will surprise you and be made of better stuff. Hoping for that is all you can do.

[This message edited by BraveSirRobin at 11:56 AM, May 27th (Wednesday)]

WW/BW 51 (Me)
BH/WH 51 (TimeSpiral)

posts: 2038   ·   registered: Dec. 27th, 2018
id 8546165
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AFL1000 ( Member #66483) posted at 1:24 AM on Thursday, May 28th, 2020

Westway

I am sorry that your almost ex continues to engage in high risk sexual activities. Knowing you from your posts I am sure you have validated the facts about her current activities and they are not just rumour and innuendo.

While I agree with BSR that you have no rights or responsibilities over the escalation of her sexual activities, the greater concern at present would be her exposure to COVID-19. The more partners the higher the risk level of her contracting the virus.

Even if she does not become ill, she can spread the virus to others. How much contact does she have with your daughters?

As a parent you have a duty of care. You have the evidence that she is clearly not practising social distancing!!!!, for your daughters' protection I would confront her, not for her sexual activity but for the simple fact that she is placing your daughters at a higher risk of catching the virus ...from their own Mom!

Sorry this is yet another shitshow you are are forced to endure by your almost ex's irresponsible behaviour.

posts: 247   ·   registered: Oct. 12th, 2018   ·   location: Victoria Australia
id 8546310
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Lucky77 ( Member #61337) posted at 12:12 PM on Thursday, May 28th, 2020

Doesitstop11,

ff4152 said it well.

To layer onto that I would add that I was so smug and so cocky that I was carrying on my life with my side piece unknown to all. My W might actually have believed that I was outwardly very kind to her in my smugness. I had this notion that I was living some weird dream life with the great W at home and the side piece.

WS
1 year PA/ 2 Yr EA
Oh the depths of the betrayal

posts: 331   ·   registered: Nov. 7th, 2017
id 8546392
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Westway ( Member #71747) posted at 4:43 PM on Thursday, May 28th, 2020

Thank you all for your answers. It's all very helpful.

Me: 52;

XWW: 50 y.o. serial cheater

Married 22 years, Together 24
2 Daughters: aged 16 and 20
DDay: 9/20/19
Divorced 12/03/20.

posts: 1366   ·   registered: Oct. 3rd, 2019   ·   location: USA
id 8546462
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AFL1000 ( Member #66483) posted at 12:15 AM on Friday, May 29th, 2020

Westway

For all of us who have followed your journey on SI, how impressively you dealt with your STBX's cheating and your decisive actions to divorce, I am sure with respect to this current issue you will make the best decision for you and your daughters.

posts: 247   ·   registered: Oct. 12th, 2018   ·   location: Victoria Australia
id 8546612
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WalkinOnEggshelz ( Moderator #29447) posted at 10:25 PM on Friday, May 29th, 2020

AFL1000 you have a pm.

Me: WS late 40’s
Him: BH (HoldingTogether)
D Day: 7/24/2010
If you keep asking people to give you the benefit of the doubt, they will eventually start to doubt your benefit.

posts: 14271   ·   registered: Aug. 27th, 2010   ·   location: Texas
id 8546931
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Mickie500 ( Member #74292) posted at 4:23 PM on Monday, June 1st, 2020

For WS who have reconciled or who wanted reconciliation but got discouraged:

What does the BS do that makes you want to try more for reconciliation? Try less? Give up?

The other confusion thing is my FWH says he knew lhe was never going to leave me And that she didn’t compare to me but he didn’t end it. He said it was about the boost to the ego.

How important was the ego kibbles for you?

posts: 350   ·   registered: Apr. 23rd, 2020   ·   location: Chicago
id 8547490
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JBWD ( Member #70276) posted at 1:23 AM on Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020

Mickie-

It's not your job to convince him to R. I knew it was what I wanted to do, but I wasn't self-aware enough to know exactly how to do it. If he tells you things he needs, take that with a massive grain of salt, because generally a CS's needs at this time focus on "cutting me a break"...

I suspect he's parroting talking points about "ego kibbles" and doesn't really understand exactly HOW deeply he was selfishly motivated, but it can come with time. Think through the statement that he "wouldn't ever leave you" but was happy to accept the ego boost. That truly highlights the selfish crux of betrayal, but there's a long way to go- He can't simply shrug and say "Well it was just selfish ol' me!!!"

I hope this is helpful, you're here a lot and I know it's early for you- I would advocate that for as much as this might explain things, you need to give yourself time to understand YOUR CH, and even more importantly, give yourself time for YOUR healing.

ETA: Has he articulated he’s “discouraged?” If it’s something you’d like to understand I’d ask. My bet is he won’t be able to articulate anything particular, and what is discouraging him is that this doesn’t just go away. But I think a better perspective would be for him to figure himself out- I think it’s going to take him time to truly get the perspective that will be enough for you to understand...

[This message edited by JBWD at 7:57 PM, June 1st (Monday)]

Me: WH
(Multiple OEA/PA, culminating in 4 month
EA/PA. D-Day 20 Oct 2018 41 y/o)
Married 14 years
Her: BS 37 y/o at D-Day
13 y/o son, 10 y/o daughter
6 months HB, broken NC, TT
SUCKED at growth and rebuilding

posts: 907   ·   registered: Apr. 11th, 2019   ·   location: SoCal
id 8547628
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hikingout ( Member #59504) posted at 2:59 PM on Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020

When did you know you were completely over with the A and the AP and how long after that did your BS actually start trusting you again?

To me, this is a complicated question. For me, and some of this is hindsight - I wasn't needing to get over the AP. There was really nothing extraordinary about him (even though I was convinced I was gaga over him at the time). It was the feelings the affair gave me. It was that I had a void inside of myself that I was trying to fill with a fantasy. Most of what I liked about the affair was the way it made me feel like I was special, that I was younger, more desirable, more flawless than I actually am. If it's not clear by what I am saying - the affair was about me, not because of him. Not because of my husband either.

So, to say "over the AP" that sounds more like a break-up and I know BS's usually relate to it that way because that's what you know - everyone has had a break up or someone to get over.

I think a common response in an affair is to built a narrative up in your head that justifies your actions. The AP is your soul mate, or they are perfect for you, or you never felt this way before. This is a way to justify things really. And, you may believe all that for some period of time. At the same time you are likely minimizing your wife or husband with another narrative that makes it seem like "how could this not happen". All of that is bullshit. It's a narrative that fits what you want to selfishly do - which is get high on feelings and imagining yourself in some way flattering light.

But to simplify it, I think I could see that I had done that fairly early on. It was a gradient that probably started a few months after DDAY and then continued for 5 or 6 months. It was more like unraveling a way that I had self-brainwashed, and dispelling my own bullshit. And, to complicate things, addiction is about dopamine hits. When all your happiness is coming from that, there is a withdrawal. I had to find ways to combat that. I used exercise, spending time outdoors, and trying to keep up with self care. I was a complete mess the first six months for sure, but not because the AP was so great, but because I was so fucked up basically.

To me, trust is broader than that. Okay, I had NC with the AP from 2 months before dday clear until today - almost 3 years later. The AP was not in the picture, and actually he was caught before I confessed and he was very committed to NC himself before I got there. But what makes me more trustworthy today is not the absence of him. It's the fact I have gone and found why I had those voids, why I did the things I did, and I have found paths to change ways of thinking, how I commit to my marriage, and ultimately learning to make myself happy. If we can't make ourselves happy, no relationship, no money, no possessions will ever do it. Trustworthy means no other AP's, full commitment to my own healing and growth, transparency, etc. What you should fear is not the AP but whether or not your H is fixing what was broken in him to begin with.

My husband has honored NC and says he doesn’t even think about the AP until I bring her up. However, from this thread breaking NC could come at anytime- I want to believe in his actions and give him hope but whenever I do I start panicking like it’s too soon to give him a little more trust.

He’s really putting in the actions but my brain says it’s too early and my heart says I’m afraid to break anymore and I’m stuck in limbo.

That's okay. He needs to earn back your trust, it takes a long time for us to change. It's hard work. You may be in limbo because he hasn't finished his work yet (I highly suspect that to be true, this shit takes years). It all happens gradually and trying to make yourself feel it all at once is counterproductive.

WW/BW BH/WH Turnthepage My Affair DDAY 9/1/2017- 2 month EA/PAHis Affair DDAY 10/10/2020 - 18 month A - EA?/PA

posts: 5921   ·   registered: Jul. 5th, 2017   ·   location: Arizona
id 8547727
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hikingout ( Member #59504) posted at 5:09 PM on Tuesday, June 2nd, 2020

For WS who have reconciled or who wanted reconciliation but got discouraged:

What does the BS do that makes you want to try more for reconciliation? Try less? Give up?

I don't think the BS should do anything but concentrating on your own healing. What you need, what you want. There are lots of reasons for this.

One, I think reconciliation is really hard and if you are going to go through the steps you should be sure it's what you want. We have damaged you in our affair. You need to be able to know you are fine with us or without us. If you still choose us, then it's because we have shown you that we are worthy, that it's truly what you want, and that you have healed to the extent we can start rebuilding the relationship. Both people have to reach that point, I feel, in order for things to be built on a rock solid foundation. People who know they can be fine with or without each other will get very honest...and it takes a tremendous amount of honesty both with both people and a willingness to build something new. But, just because you are building new, doesn't mean the WS doesn't still have to answer your questions, have hard conversations, or understand when you are hurting about the past.

For me, the decision to reconcile was quite easy after I had realized that most of the things I was not happy about were things I should have worked on changing. Some of them were so easy to work on, and some were not. When I had full accountability, I saw I had either created the problems or greatly contributed to them. I remembered all that I appreciated about my husband and our marriage. I realized I had it in my own power for things to be different. My lack of value that I showed to my husband had nothing to do with him actually lacking value. In fact, my husband is quite a catch and a lot of women would cut off their right arm to find someone like him. Our marriage was one that many people would wish to have. It was me and my problem that I didn't value it anymore..

The other confusion thing is my FWH says he knew lhe was never going to leave me And that she didn’t compare to me but he didn’t end it. He said it was about the boost to the ego.

How important was the ego kibbles for you?

Immensely so. I think I explained that part in my last response to you.

WW/BW BH/WH Turnthepage My Affair DDAY 9/1/2017- 2 month EA/PAHis Affair DDAY 10/10/2020 - 18 month A - EA?/PA

posts: 5921   ·   registered: Jul. 5th, 2017   ·   location: Arizona
id 8547765
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Mickie500 ( Member #74292) posted at 8:40 PM on Wednesday, June 3rd, 2020

I really appreciate you all answering the questions though it is hard to hear.

I guess the whys will never make sense to me and that at some level I have to accept what happened.

I can choose to forgive those actions or not.

posts: 350   ·   registered: Apr. 23rd, 2020   ·   location: Chicago
id 8548131
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MrCleanSlate ( Member #71893) posted at 9:09 PM on Wednesday, June 3rd, 2020

Mickie500,

Maybe the 'whys' don't make sense to you right now, but your WS needs to make sense of their 'whys'.

I needed to learn why I cheated, or risk going there again. In turn my BW was then able to understand as well.

WH 52,my BW is 51
1 year PA, D-Day Oct 2015
Admitted all, but there is no 'clean slate'. In R and working it everyday
“To build may have to be the slow and laborious task of years. To destroy can be the thoughtless act of a single day

posts: 667   ·   registered: Oct. 21st, 2019   ·   location: Canada
id 8548145
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Mickie500 ( Member #74292) posted at 4:43 AM on Thursday, June 4th, 2020

HikingOut,

You just helped me so much with your description. It sounds almost exactly like what my husband says about the AP. He says it wasn’t about her. He says he was running from pain and it wasn’t that she soothes pain but the person he created himself to be in that Relationship fantasy world didn’t have any cares or responsibilities and he was worshipped and he didn’t really have to work for it.

It’s very complicated to grasp for me but the more I learn from WS the better I grasp.

posts: 350   ·   registered: Apr. 23rd, 2020   ·   location: Chicago
id 8548235
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HardKnocks ( Member #70957) posted at 7:05 PM on Wednesday, June 10th, 2020

Dear wonderfully recovered FWSs,

How long did it take you get to the "How"? *How* you allowed yourself to betray someone you loved or claimed to love.

Or, short of that, when did you get to the *real* "whys"--beyond the ususal suspects of "validation" and "ego kibbles" and the rest of the fairly easy (but not trasformative) answers--and begin to identify underlying internal mechanisms that led you to betrayal.

I know everyone is different, but I'm trying to get some real-life perspective on this.

Thank you!

BW 30 year marriage.
DDay2 2/20 5 month PA
My Ducks are Aligned and I'm Good to Go! :)

posts: 307   ·   registered: Jul. 7th, 2019
id 8549803
Topic is Sleeping.
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