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Betrayed Womenz Thread

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Chaos posted 8/13/2019 09:41 AM

I hear you. And agree on many levels.

At the end of the day - to me - it fell under the category of my IC said try it - and I did so I can't say I didn't try it. I also said I drew the line at being a parent or teacher figure with it. I'll appreciate the effort but I'm not giving a sticker or a participation trophy. If any of that makes sense. I liken it to any compliment. Like if he comes home one day and says "hey - I see you shampooed the carpet - it looks really good" or "ooohhhh it smells all lemony fresh in here" when I clean the bathroom or "hey - thanks for getting my favorite chips & salsa at the store" when I go grocery shopping.
I feel my efforts at normally thankless things were noticed and appreciated.

My IC explained it like if I wanted to attempt R or figure out if I wanted to attempt R - I couldn't shut him down or shut out any attempt at progress. If I did that I might as well save everyone the time/effort/energy and throw him out. End result will be the same.

So I figure it out. I promised him the chance of letting the intensive IC commitment work and I'll watch and wait. Knowing all the while I can change my mind at any step along the way.

TX1995 posted 8/13/2019 10:07 AM

My IC explained it like if I wanted to attempt R or figure out if I wanted to attempt R - I couldn't shut him down or shut out any attempt at progress. If I did that I might as well save everyone the time/effort/energy and throw him out. End result will be the same.

See this is where I feel like I am. I was much like you after DDay 1, Chaos. I was a participant in the ways you listed.

After DDay 2 and realizing that the entire 2 years of R was built on lies, I just stopped participating. The emotion and drive I had after the first DDay to resurrect my marriage, is dead. I'm stuck in this weird, numb, emotionless limbo. My WH would like to "date" again, is doing all the things (journaling, IC, listening to books and podcasts, sharing his feelings) and I feel blah. I want him to be here physically, but I don't like looking at him or touching him. I feel like he doesn't deserve me anymore. And that he's not "mine" anymore. Talk about special being gone. We started dating at 19. I was his first girlfriend, first everything. And he threw it all away for someone who isn't pretty, is obnoxious, fake and came on so strong that she was desperate. I would have been embarrassed being her. My value to him was not as a person, wife, mother, human. It was was I could give him. And when he perceived my attention being gone, he took what was thrown at him without a thought. Do I think he'll cheat again? No. I really don't. But I don't think he deserves me. And I am really afraid that I will wind up like those people in that 10 year thread. Never feeling truly happy again. But I wonder if that's what will happen either way. D or R. It's heartbreaking to think of him not in my life and it's heartbreaking to remember what he is capable of. A big old mind fuck. And as to the thread in WS about how great R is? Of COURSE the WS thinks that. They got to fuck around, get forgiven, improve their lives and value. WE as BSes get stuck with the shit end of that deal. My WH would be thrilled if R was successful. Yes, he has to live with what he's done. But the every day consequences? He doesn't have any if he is forgiven. If I were to be "good", then things would be pretty ok for him. Not perfect, but pretty darn good. It's me that deals with triggers and anxiety and loss. And I fear that the dread inside of me will just stay there forever...

Chaos posted 8/13/2019 10:19 AM

TX1995 I also had false R. Not quite as long as yours but almost 1.5 years. It is a mind fuck like none other.

The fact that I have a teen at home [the one who discovered his A and is already troubled] greatly impacts my decision. I feel the attempt is for the greater good.

Now that he is sticking with IC and going regularly and I can see a difference - I will continue the attempt.

When I look at myself in the mirror - that is the decision I still come up with. That this is [currently] the right thing to do. He gets this last chance. For the greater good.

If that changes - I'll do what has to be done. Mourn. And plan for my beach retirement solo.

crazyblindsided posted 8/13/2019 11:10 AM

After DDay 2 and realizing that the entire 2 years of R was built on lies, I just stopped participating. The emotion and drive I had after the first DDay to resurrect my marriage, is dead. I'm stuck in this weird, numb, emotionless limbo.

This was the same for me. After False R something died... it was instant and it hasn't come back.

My WS still has not done the work, he thinks he has and has told himself that he has and now is trying to claim I couldn't get over the A so he has given up. We are BOTH in limbo and I know my only way out of this mess is D unfortunately.

I had to let go of the rope finally as I had been hanging on too tight. Ever since I let go it's been slowly circling the drain

TX1995 posted 8/13/2019 14:20 PM

Chaos - Yes, the kids make a difference. It's the only reason I'm here post DDay 2 instead of separating while I decide. I didn't remember that your teen was the discoverer. (Mine found out on DDay 2 but only because I went ballistic.) I hope he's doing okay. Mine (14) won't go to therapy but we both try to keep the communication lines open about his feelings. The greater good is the kids for sure.

crazy blindsided - Your WH giving up is proof that he hasn't done the work! Mine says he's continuing with the things to be better for himself, the kids and me and will keep going for the kids and himself even if I'm out. (Which I believe as I've seen the changes in his parenting and work/life balance over the past two years even with the lying about the extent of the A). I'm sorry you are stuck in the same awful place.

Tallgirl posted 8/13/2019 15:44 PM

Tx, it is not important what your WH thinks as much as it is important what you think of yourself. You are smart, strong and beautiful. He however is none of those and must earn you back. And that only works if you want him. If he is safe. And you know what. You do not have to want him. Nothing says you have to. Not even for kids. ( who we love dearly). Again all your decision.

Cheating is soul crushing in so many ways. Reconciling is a pure gift and should only be offered if the BS wants to give it. Nothing should force you. Otherwise it means unhappiness or limbo. If you can’t look at him. Don’t. Look at you. Take care of you. And your kids. He can take care of himself. As far as I am concerned all the care taking we tend for our husbands ended the day they took their penises out for other women.

I stopped cooking, cleaning, etc. When he kept lying, He stopped living in the house, I couldn’t look at him. I am still trying, another try this weekend but truly, I think it is just a Hail Mary.

Chaos posted 8/13/2019 17:00 PM

I feel compelled to add the following nonsense.

I have ordered new sexy undies for the next Womenz Toast.

I now return us to our regularly scheduled program of “Our WS are Fu*king Morons”

Tallgirl posted 8/13/2019 19:47 PM

You and I are the same. Except mine are risqué bloomers.

Tallgirl posted 8/13/2019 19:49 PM

Ladies I had a good day. I Was the emcee for a work conference with about 120 folks. I rocked it.

My first time.

It was so fun.

When I was done I had beer. Radler. Mm mm m

cocoplus5nuts posted 8/13/2019 20:49 PM

Good for you, TG!

Chaos, I will respectfully disagree with your IC. You won't necessarily end up with the same result if you just stop. I think you are more likely to end up with true R.

More often than not, R does not work. Not because the BS is not engaged, but because the CS doesn't do the real work. IMO, which is not professional, R won't work if the BS is too active and engaged in it with the CS. The CS did the damage. The CS needs to clean up the mess and win the BS back. If the CS would stop doing the work to fix the damage he caused if the BS stopped engaging and being appreciative, that CS isn't worth R.

On a completely different subject, I taught a yoga class tonight. It went really well. I felt so good afterward, not like last time when I felt like I hated it. (Maybe that was because the studio owner gave me a critique.) I can see myself doing this when I grow up.

Chaos posted 8/14/2019 06:47 AM

I hear you Coco. I question this myself. And filed it under the category "can't hurt, might help" and then in pensive moments wonder about the same thing you said.

The R statistic - I've heard it, I've read it, I believe it. And it scares me. And makes me wonder what life would be like had I thrown him out on DDay1.

Then - last night - laying awake again. In his arms. Feeling the warmth of his body and realizing I like it. Despite everything I like it. Not just because it is a warm male body - but it is his. And that's what I like. So - he lives another day. And that's it. Day by day. He'll get his shit together or he won't. Teen is getting older. I am gaining clarity. If the stars align for us - that's great. I can't control them. I realize that.

Now - more important topics -

Risque bloomers - Tallgirl get on with your bad ass self!

Yoga - cocoplus5nuts your story made me smile! I've tried yoga. I suck but totally get the relaxation and sense of community. The [few] classes I've taken have been all levels but also all supportive and there was a camaraderie among the attendees. For a while there was a place that offered drop in classes of all ages. My teen and I went with a friend of hers and her mom. They stopped but it was a nice memory. I do more Pi-Yo myself. That and walk and an elliptical. To teach yoga though...that takes lots of dedication and training. Good for you! Namaste my friend.

cocoplus5nuts posted 8/14/2019 14:00 PM

Chaos, no one sucks at yoga. We are all just at different places in the practice. That's one of the amazing things about yoga. What is Pi-Yo? Is that a pilates/yoga combo? I've done pilates a few times. Do not like it. I tried barre, too. Definitely not my things. I like to lift and stretch.

I started a Beachbody program Monday. My friend is a "coach," which just means she's a sales rep. I need to do more lift9ng and cardio. Yoga has gotten me stronger and more flexible, but I haven't lost any weight.

I hear you on just liking having your CH around. Nothing wrong with that. Generally, it is healthy and good to appreciate and acknowledge each other's efforts. The balance gets shifted when one partner cheats, though.

Edited because I hit submit too soon.

[This message edited by cocoplus5nuts at 2:02 PM, August 14th (Wednesday)]

TX1995 posted 8/14/2019 14:00 PM

Chaos - I laughed out loud at your undies purchase and ensuing comment about our dumb ass husbands.

Tallgirl - Awesome on the emcee job - and the risqué bloomers!

Coco - Very cool on the yoga instructing! My sister went through training after her infidelity too. Must be a good soul-soother. Plus as a SAHM it's nice to feel some value outside of the family.

I agree that a lot of failures are due to the WS not doing the real work. I know we aren't supposed to talk specifics, but I was listening to a podcast today of a couple that was 11 years post DDay. The woman said it took almost 4 years to start trusting again. And she said the turning point was actually when she knew her husband really was changing and getting it. It was actually heartening to hear - more realistic than a lot of those podcasts/videos/stories of women who are "grateful" for the A. This woman actually said she would NEVER say that. But she seemed to genuinely be happy. And her H was still working his recovery 11 years later (belonged to the same group and everything). He said the key was consistency. Which I personally think might be my only hope. I have to see that my WH doesn't need me to tell him how to be a good husband and man of integrity. He has to do that for himself.

My kids went back to school today. This summer was definitely NOT how I'd envisioned. My DDay 2 happened right after Memorial Day (first week of summer vacation) so my poor kids were in the house while I was drowning. I think we will all be glad for the schedule and distraction. I also signed up for design classes that start in a couple of weeks - back to college for me!

TX1995 posted 8/14/2019 14:04 PM

Oh, and I like my stupid cheater to be around too. I just don't like to look at him or touch him. There is nothing wrong with feeling comfort in being in his arms. I wish I had that back. Take all of the positives you can!

Here's a funny fact. On his work trip last week, we discovered that phone (or really FaceTime) sex is completely doable since it doesn't trigger me to the affair OR involve him touching me. Sad, and won't work forever, but it's working for now!

Chaos posted 8/14/2019 14:11 PM

Pi-Yo is a Pilates Yoga combo. I don't like it but damn it keeps me in those sexy undies.

I like Yoga for the relaxation aspect. But cocoplus5nuts if I can't say I suck can I at least say I'm a Beginner's Beginner

I've done barre and it is OK. I occasionally take a class with a group of friends. More because we get together and laugh while we try to barre. I've done dance [I'm only built like a burlesque dancer not a ballerina]. And I suck. But I love it so I do it.

I also walk - clears the mind. And use an elliptical [catch up on my you tube make up tutorials]

I even have a weighted hula hoop I break out occasionally.

Doing any one of those on a regular basis would bore me to tears. Doing a combination of those and alternating them is a good thing for me.

I couldn't tell you what I weigh - I won't get in an unhealthy competition with a number. I'm 5'8" have a build an hourglass and wear a size 10/12. I've had 2 kids and that fact is obvious in the all-together. But I'm holding my own at middle aged and like what I see in the mirror and know what to wear to flatter my figure.

TX1995 - so glad you found something that works for you. That's empowering!

EllieKMAS posted 8/14/2019 14:24 PM

I'm snorting laughing over here... Thank you!

Yeah, I did a couple 'beginner's yoga' things and a couple of those poses were like... "You want me to put my leg where now?"

Like doing origami with a lawn chair for me...

Tallgirl posted 8/14/2019 17:47 PM

Ladies, ladies, ladies, if you switch to risqué bloomers you can have ICE CREAM.

I have been on a serious fitness push. My ass has hurt for weeks. And I so dream of a size 12, working my way down to a 14. I'm moving slowly in that direction.

I am not nearly as flexible as I used to be, and find yoga hard on my wrists, elbows and sometimes knees. I feel like an uncooperative tree branch when I do yoga - bending resistant.

Girls, I'm having trouble coping.

I'm trying a weekend away with WH - this weekend. I'm feeling sick about it. He is excited apparently (so says the MC). I know I don't have to go, but I said I would. I didn't expect these feelings.

I'm a curvy 6 foot proportionate tall woman with a bosom - I have some padding. He has been with 2 younger petite super fit women for the last 10 years. (god, saying that makes me want to puke and makes me question why I haven't shoved our marriage certificate up his ass). He hasn't seen me in any state of undress for years.

Not that I think I can touch him, or want to - I'm generally traumatized. I learned that when he went for erotic massages, they were both totally naked. It disgusts me, as does he when I think about it. I could not look at him for the rest of the night when he told me - literally looked the other way.

I am NOT comparable to the women he literally picked out of a calendar based on his preferences. I hate him for that. Logically, I know I should not feel shame, he should for being an outstanding liar and cheater. But.... I do. I'm ashamed of my size, my tummy... etc.

I have not had any nice feedback about my looks or my shape from him in literally 10 years. I found a notebook of his where he wrote that he was turned off by me. Of course, now he tells me I'm beautiful (he wants to stay married), but nothing out of his mouth feels real - he has lied too much.

( I Know I'm not ugly, hell, I was high school prom queen)

What the fuck was I thinking.

People have suggested that I stop MC, I haven't yet. She told me one-on-one if I don't let my WH come home on weekends, that the M is likely done.

I don't want him back, not yet, if ever. The very idea upsets me. This is pressure.

I yoyo back and forth between a bit of hope/need and anger/disgust.

I am afraid, afraid to stay and afraid to end it, afraid to be wrong, afraid to recommit, afraid of being unhappy for the rest of my life.

This is the very definition of a mindfuck. I want to go back to my objective, data collecting mode, this emotional stuff is too much.

And today 2 people asked me about my husband - I haven't told many people period, less at work. I don't want to be the topic for this months gossip train. Though one, I told without telling - if he was listening he may have figured it out.

Thanks for listening to me.

[This message edited by Tallgirl at 5:59 PM, August 14th (Wednesday)]

EllieKMAS posted 8/14/2019 18:43 PM

Tallgirl you are a gorgeous and fantastic 6 ft tall fucking warrior and don't you ever forget it!

As far as staying or going - don't let the MC pressure you on anything. You will know one way or the other when you know - and when that day comes there will be no doubt in your soul, only peace and calm. There is no rushing that process.

Chin up honey! I don't have to know you to know what an amazing person you are!

Chaos posted 8/14/2019 19:35 PM

6’. Get on with your beautiful bad ass self Tallgirl

Trust me. We got you covered. And we’ll bring bail money and wine.

Your confidence wasn’t his to take. You are an amazing amazon goddess and don’t you forget it. I’m a BASGU and was only in the prom court - not prom queen

I’m sorry your WH is a flaming horses patoot.

cocoplus5nuts posted 8/14/2019 21:15 PM

You all are so awesome!

I have to see that my WH doesn't need me to tell him how to be a good husband and man of integrity. He has to do that for himself.

Exactly. I asked my fch a little while ago how he knows, and how I can be confident, that he won't cheat again. He said he would never do it again because of the pain he caused me and the pain he caused himself. He knows he needs to be a better person for himself.

His MOW was 27 years old. We were both 43-44. My oldest son was 23 at the time. I see the MOW as being around my son's age. It disgusted me that my fch got involved with someone so young. She has a pretty face, but isn't anything special in the looks department.

The yoga teaching was part of my 5 year plan. I got certified in 2016. I didn't teach for 2 years because there weren't any opportunities for me in the desert. Now, I'm in a much more populated place with opportunities everywhere.

TG, I agree that MC may not be a good idea yet. The MC is concerned with saving the M as quickly as she can. She doesn't care, probably doesn't understand, about really dealing with the infidelity. Don't let her put that kind of pressure on you. You have time to figure things out. You don't need to make any final decisions yet. Ypu are taking care of yourself right now, as it should be.

I'm 5' and wear a size 10/12. I used to wear a size 2. Fucking perimenopause is a bitch! I've turned into an apple. I don't allow myself to gate my body, but I would like to change it a little. I'd be happy if I could get to a size 6.

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