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Just Found Out :
What do I do now?

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CincyKid ( member #57948) posted at 8:14 PM on Wednesday, September 27th, 2017

She tells me she has remorse but no empathy for me.

That tells me she doesn't understand the definition of either of those words.

Also, are you still planning on divorcing her? If so then I wouldn't help her do shit. Her needs are no longer your problem.

Betrayed, life over...
Life goes on...
Met sunshine girl, fell in love...
Reconnected with wonderful DD...
Married sunshine girl, happy as can be!!!

posts: 1497   ·   registered: Mar. 22nd, 2017   ·   location: Murfreesboro, TN
id 7984252
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badmemory ( member #58358) posted at 8:21 PM on Wednesday, September 27th, 2017

She tells me she has remorse but no empathy for me. Is that even possible?

You can't have one without the other. She has neither.

posts: 423   ·   registered: Apr. 20th, 2017   ·   location: Alabama
id 7984259
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findingjoy ( member #46546) posted at 8:33 PM on Wednesday, September 27th, 2017

She needs help to remove porn from her phone? I'm not sure what games she is playing with you, but she certainly has some sort of agenda. Anyone knows how to delete stuff from their phone. (SMH)

And NO, you cannot have remorse without empathy. She's just sorry she got caught - exactly as she first told you. BTW, a person without empathy IS a narcissist.

She should be the one on the couch, not you.

Finally, without remorse, and with her blaming YOU for not trusting HER, there is no reason for you to engage with her. She is not emotionally healthy or safe for you or anyone. While mind movies are normal, continuing to sleep with an unremorseful WS isn't where you should be at anyway.

You're getting a lot of responses on your thread just because your WW is a complete piece of work and people are understandably passionate about helping you get OUT of infidelity.

Walk away.

Please walk away.

No pm's with male members.
Me: 50
Him: FWH 61
2 previous Ms: 2 adult DD's
Together 11 yrs, M 9 yrs. Dday 01/20/15
2 PA's (one was a 2 yr LTA) Reconciled.

posts: 1913   ·   registered: Jan. 28th, 2015
id 7984272
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changeneeded ( member #51851) posted at 8:37 PM on Wednesday, September 27th, 2017

Re: the removal of porn from her phone, that doesn't smell right. I'd stay away from her phone, don't touch, don't look. Weird.

posts: 614   ·   registered: Feb. 16th, 2016
id 7984275
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twisted ( member #8873) posted at 9:04 PM on Wednesday, September 27th, 2017

changeneeded: the removal of porn from her phone, that doesn't smell right. I'd stay away from her phone, don't touch, don't look. Weird.

Maybe she wants you to see some of her homemade porn just to mess with you some more. Yeah, just tell her to figure it out for herself.

I probably need to take a break from JFO forum, shit like this just really pisses me off.

"Hey, does this rag smell like chloroform to you?

posts: 4023   ·   registered: Nov. 18th, 2005   ·   location: Oklahoma
id 7984309
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M1965 ( member #57009) posted at 9:17 PM on Wednesday, September 27th, 2017

36YG,

The more I read of your thread, the more it looks like you are in a state of shock. That is perfectly natural, and perfectly understandable after being with someone for more than three decades and then having them turn into someone you do not know.

I have to be honest, I would really struggle to reconcile with someone who has done the things you wife has done, and which she continues to do. Elements of it seem almost deliberately cruel. For example, bringing the OM home and trying to turn you into the chauffeur for the evening. Seriously, that's like some bizarre mind game.

When the evening ended I told her I would sleep on the couch. She invited me into OUR bedroom and said we can sleep side-by-side without doing anything.

36, why are you on the couch? She should be there, or at least in a different room. I am a bit lost with where you are in this relationship, because one day you are talking about cutting ties with her because you have had enough, and the following day she is manipulating you by inviting you into bed, and then trying to have sex with you, after everything she has done.

What I'm wondering is this: why did you go with her? Given the stage you are at, could you not have just said, "No thanks, I'm fine on the couch"? Your wife is playing manipulative mind games with you, and it has had a huge impact on you, and she has no qualms about doing it. The way it reads, she knows exactly what she is doing, which seems to be a series of exercises designed to progressively break your spirit.

What is she trying to turn you into? Some broken shell of a man who is happy to drive her and her lover around town so they can have fun? That's what she tried to do when she brought the OM home. You say you found out later that the OM wanted a threesome with you and your wife, but are you sure the two of them were not lining up an evening where they had sex and made you watch?

Your traumatic episode with the mind movies is sadly a very well known phenomenon. It happens to loads of victims of infidelity, and the power with which they struck you is an indicator of how much this is affecting you. I am sorry if this sounds melodramatic, but her actions seem designed to wear you down so that you will meekly accept whatever she does, and in some cases they sound like she gets off on humiliating you. Unless that is a game that you have both agreed to, that is extremely cruel.

All she does is attack and criticise you, when she ought to be apologising and promising to change her ways. Instead, she seems to be forcing one unpleasantness after another onto you.

A prime example is the porn on her phone issue. Think about it; she has a gaggle of friends who support her affair because she has belittled you to them, but she comes to you to tell you her phone is loaded with porn. Couldn't any of her delightful friends show her how to delete a porn clip from her phone? It isn't rocket science, and her friends don't sound like they would be the types to be shocked by it. Yet your wife chose to let you know that her phone was full of porn, under the pretext of getting you to delete it. Why? That was a deliberate act; one more unpleasantness to make you endure and accept. Any number of people know how to delete stuff from phones, she didn't have to ask you. But she did. And as others here have said, you should stay well away from it, because for all you know it may not be clips of commercial stuff from the internet, but movies of her in action. You really don't need to see that.

Seriously, 36, I sense an unhealthy vibe in what she is doing to you here. It's like she wants you to just give up and accept the debauched new life she has chosen for herself, with a total disregard for your mental and emotional well-being. I really hate deliberate cruelty, which is why I am writing this post, because it can have a devastating impact on the victim. And you have been, and continue to be, a victim of abuse. You need tender loving care, not the mind games and continued verbal attacks she is subjecting you to.

And you yourself are starting to realise it:

Who the hell is this woman?...I feel like she is screwing with my mind, but I don't know if it's intentional or not.

36, I am sorry to say this, but it is totally and utterly intentional and deliberate. Nobody could do the things she has been doing to you without knowing the effect they would have on a person who is already struggling to get over the shock of infidelity.

Oh, and one more thing, forgive me if I mentioned this previously, my mind is in a fog: She tells me she has remorse but no empathy for me. Is that even possible?

Now why would one human being who has badly hurt another human being say something as ugly and ridiculous as that? I agree completely that she has no empathy for you, that is glaringly obvious, but she has shown absolutely no sign of anything that is within ten miles of remorse. She sounds pleased and proud of what she has done, and it really seems like she enjoys what that does to you.

Please, 36, distance yourself from her immediately. Read up on the 180 in the Healing Library here. The things she is doing to you are active threats to your mental and emotional well-being. Although you are starting to sense that, you are struggling to accept it, because you want her to be who she was in the past. That is not who she is now, and you need to accept it, as awful as that is. She doesn't want to change; she loves her new life. What she wants is to make you give up and just accept it.

Reconciliation with her will not bring a return to the old days, it will mean you being a spectator and bystander as she pursues her new lifestyle. Is that really something you want for yourself?

She's not the sweet, innocent girl I met 38 years ago.

No, she isn't, and at the moment, she is a clear and present danger to your well-being. You need to start acting accordingly.

[This message edited by M1965 at 3:21 PM, September 27th (Wednesday)]

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id 7984326
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saudades ( new member #60727) posted at 9:19 PM on Wednesday, September 27th, 2017

I just found out too that my husband of 31 years has been having an emotional affair with a friend. I am beyond hurt with grief. We have been going to therapy and trying to repair the damage. I can forgive but will never forget. You my friend need to continue therapy and taking care of yourself. Talk to a minister, make new friends and hopefully you will get the strength to make the right choice. Keep the faith.

Duarte dos Santos

posts: 1   ·   registered: Sep. 21st, 2017
id 7984328
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Greeneyesbluezy ( member #58158) posted at 10:49 PM on Wednesday, September 27th, 2017

36,

So you went to your wife's boss and her boss said what exactly? How did she explain to you that she (the boss) was also sleeping with this man??

Stop right there, I already don't give a fuck.

posts: 1248   ·   registered: Apr. 5th, 2017
id 7984430
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Used2bhappy10 ( member #59324) posted at 10:50 PM on Wednesday, September 27th, 2017

Change the will and 401k beneficiary so she gets nothing until after D what the courts order.

Pack your bags and get the hell out of there tonight.

Get with your lawyer tomorrow.

Get an individual counselor STAT.

Get to your doctor ASAP for full STD, AIDS and HEP C tests.

Me: 50+
WH: 50+
M: 30+ years, 2 adult DD
DDay March 2017
Strong into R with a better than ever WH

I saw that.
Signed,
Karma

posts: 261   ·   registered: Jun. 21st, 2017   ·   location: US
id 7984432
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annb ( member #22386) posted at 12:04 AM on Thursday, September 28th, 2017

She's a master manipulator.

"Help me remove porn from my phone."

See what a good wife I am.

posts: 12231   ·   registered: Jan. 10th, 2009   ·   location: Northeast
id 7984494
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Booyah ( member #60124) posted at 12:05 AM on Thursday, September 28th, 2017

"No empathy for you".

Shouldn't surprise you at all given that she wanted you dead.

posts: 1254   ·   registered: Aug. 11th, 2017
id 7984496
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TimelessLoss ( member #55295) posted at 1:39 AM on Thursday, September 28th, 2017

36,

Do not physically touch that phone. You really need to record your conversations with her. Two reasons: one, you are in an understandable fog and need a method of keeping a record/timeline. Two, you need to protect yourself.

Don't physically touch that phone. Not even if she offers to be "transparent" with her texts/emails.

Are you the account holder for the phone? Offer to buy her a new, clean phone. Her response will be telling.

"You've got to learn to leave the table when love is no longer being served"

posts: 1649   ·   registered: Sep. 23rd, 2016
id 7984589
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rambler ( member #43747) posted at 3:38 AM on Thursday, September 28th, 2017

Without empathy r will tend to fail.

Why do you want to live like that

making it through

posts: 1423   ·   registered: Jun. 17th, 2014   ·   location: Chicago
id 7984670
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Everychance ( member #60698) posted at 4:55 AM on Thursday, September 28th, 2017

Come on 36yearsgone you can find the strength to do the right thing for yourself and get some space.

Grab your self respect by the balls - just do it for you!!!

AND REMEMBER - We are all here for you - you can do it!!

Me - BW
Married 26 years
Surviving Infidelity is a journey not a destination.

posts: 119   ·   registered: Sep. 19th, 2017   ·   location: Australia
id 7984716
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Western ( member #46653) posted at 2:36 PM on Thursday, September 28th, 2017

so 36, how did last night go ?

posts: 3608   ·   registered: Feb. 4th, 2015   ·   location: U.S.
id 7984895
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 36yearsgone (original poster member #60774) posted at 3:56 PM on Thursday, September 28th, 2017

I went for a long drive last night to think. I want you to know that both within my profession and my personality I am usually a very logical, concise thinker. One of the many things that troubles me about her A is that I seem to have lost the ability to think clearly, logically and systematically. It seems to be gone.

Shortly before I left work yesterday my employer took me aside an asked me what the hell was wrong with me. They said, "You're walking around like a zombie, you barely come out of your office, you're missing time, your work is not up to standard lately, your usual daily tasks are not being completed correctly and up to standard."

They are correct. Her A has robbed me of me. I don't know who she is and therefore I don't know who I am anymore. I've spent my whole life trying to live up to something that simply wasn't true. I've wasted nearly four decades living with a stranger and now I am suddenly fucked up and all alone.

The drive helped a little, but it's clear that I can't think clearly. I've taken a few drives over the past three weeks, sometimes up to 400-500 miles round trip. I don't stop for anything except gas and a bottle of water. I reach my "destination" and simply turn around and go home. Though "home" has become a funny and ludicrous word.

I thought a lot about my dead son and how unhappy he would be to see this. It makes me sad.

When I got "home" I went out and sat on my balcony and stared at the mountains and the few stars I could see and felt like they were staring back at me. I wondered how much shit they have seen as they look back over the horizon.

Eventually my wife came outside, sat down, and the first words out of her mouth were, "I can't believe you told the counselors that I had sex with someone else while we were engaged. It's not relevant. We weren't even married yet"

I simply replied, "It is very relevant. It's relevant to why I should never have married you. It's relevant to my stupidity for thinking that maybe it was a one-off and would never happen again. It's relevant to something inside of me that has allowed me to become a fool."

She wants us to go back to counseling this Saturday. I just don't know. I feel like I am slipping away into a deep depression, a black hole where I no longer have value as a husband or a human being. I have nightmares constantly, even while awake.

To those husbands or wives thinking of having an affair. Think twice. You will destroy lives and for what? A little bit of excitement? You will destroy lives, and not just the life of your partner.

I apologize for rambling. I am feeling very low and worthless this morning, unable to focus. I am ready to quit my job and my life and move somewhere where people won't look at me and say, "There's the guy whose wife cheated on him. It's probably his fault."

But nothing will change.

If you are absent during my struggles, don't expect to be present in my success.

posts: 1710   ·   registered: Sep. 25th, 2017   ·   location: Arizona
id 7984972
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Stevesn ( member #58312) posted at 4:12 PM on Thursday, September 28th, 2017

Please heed the advice given by me and many others here that you should be working with your own individual counselor (IC) who specializes in infidelity and not going to MC with your WW.

You need to work through this pain with a professional. Honestly she should be with her own IC.

MC is for repairing what is wrong within a marriage. That is what you should have been doing before her A.

Now that she has decided she’s someone who can casually put another mans P in her V, there is no M to repair st this moment. Not at least until she works on what is wrong inside of her and you work through the pain.

That could take years, not weeks. Maybe never.

Focus on you. You are what’s most important at this moment.

[This message edited by Stevesn at 10:59 AM, September 28th (Thursday)]

fBBF. Just before proposing, broke it off after her 2nd confirmed PA in 2 yrs. 9 mo later I met the wonderful woman I have spent the next 30 years with.

posts: 3685   ·   registered: Apr. 17th, 2017
id 7984989
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Marriagesucks ( member #46828) posted at 4:25 PM on Thursday, September 28th, 2017

You clearly need to practice on the 180. Start doing things for you for a change. If you got hobbys that you like doing... go for it. Your WW is NOT the woman you thought she was. I would simply tell her that her moral code doesn't match yours and she is free to do as she pleases and you will do what you want from now on.

To those husbands or wives thinking of having an affair. Think twice. You will destroy lives and for what? A little bit of excitement? You will destroy lives, and not just the life of your partner.

That's the million dollar question. That has been posted here almost verbatim many times over. Sometimes I have to take a step back and to just reflect... What in the hell is wrong with people?

The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist.

posts: 2043   ·   registered: Feb. 16th, 2015
id 7985006
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Sharkman ( member #56818) posted at 4:28 PM on Thursday, September 28th, 2017

You need to start throwing haymakers. The reason you are listless is ALL of this shit is out of your control.

I don't care what you need to do other than it needs to be legal, but shut your eyes for 30 seconds, breath deeply, open your eyes back up and be 100% resolute to not let this shit control you for one damn more second.

If she comes onto the deck leave.

If she talks to you about counselling tell her that's nice but you will not be attending.

GO SPEAK TO A LAWYER SO YOU CAN SIMPLY UNDERSTAND YOUR RIGHTS.

YOU ARE BETTER THAN THIS CLUSTERFUCK THAT SHE PUT YOU INTO!!!!

posts: 1788   ·   registered: Jan. 11th, 2017
id 7985011
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M1965 ( member #57009) posted at 4:46 PM on Thursday, September 28th, 2017

36,

I really wish a bunch of us could be with you right now, but the closest we can get to that is this forum. Having read your most recent post, I am saying this with your best interests at heart:

Please go and see your physician and describe to them the symptoms and issues you have written about in your latest post. Your physician will have heard similar cases, and they can help you to combat the things that are affecting you. It is important that you do this as soon as you can. Your physician is there to support you, 36, so please reach out to them.

I want you to know that both within my profession and my personality I am usually a very logical, concise thinker. One of the many things that troubles me about her A is that I seem to have lost the ability to think clearly, logically and systematically. It seems to be gone.

Three things occur to me in relation to that. (1) You are in a delayed form of shock, and possibly elements of depression (2) Your mind is trying to cope with way too much emotive information at one time to be able to make sense of it straight away. (3) Your wife keeps hitting you with fresh revelations, so you go reeling every time, and it's back to square one for you. Of course you can't think straight, look at the amount of stuff you have been hit with, and the decisions you are trying to make based on it.

Shortly before I left work yesterday my employer took me aside an asked me what the hell was wrong with me. They said, "You're walking around like a zombie, you barely come out of your office, you're missing time, your work is not up to standard lately, your usual daily tasks are not being completed correctly and up to standard."

Personally, I think you should explain your situation and what is going on at home to your employer. Unless he is a hard-ass, he will understand, and may - I hope - be supportive. Do not try to hide this, cover it up, or keep it inside you. Specially not when it comes to your job.

I've taken a few drives over the past three weeks, sometimes up to 400-500 miles round trip. I don't stop for anything except gas and a bottle of water. I reach my "destination" and simply turn around and go home.

The drives might do you some good if you could think straight about a few simple problems, but they are not working, are they? 36, what you need is individual counselling from a professional who knows about infidelity and its impact. Please start checking around to see if you can find one. You have us here on your side, but you can really talk things through with a counsellor, and get their professional advice.

Eventually my wife came outside, sat down, and the first words out of her mouth were, "I can't believe you told the counselors that I had sex with someone else while we were engaged. It's not relevant. We weren't even married yet"

What a lovely woman. You get home, clearly lost in thought, maybe even obviously depressed, and instead of opening with, "How are you? Are you alright?", she hacks straight into you with a criticism, and of all things, about why you should not have mentioned her cheating, as if you should be hiding her infidelity from the counsellors you have gone to because of her infidelity. Seriously, her narcissistic behaviour is staggering. Oh, and that is something you need to do some research on: "Narcissistic Personality Disorder". The more you write about your narcissistic, empathy-lacking wife, the more it looks like she has that disorder.

I simply replied, "It is very relevant. It's relevant to why I should never have married you. It's relevant to my stupidity for thinking that maybe it was a one-off and would never happen again. It's relevant to something inside of me that has allowed me to become a fool."

It is indeed very relevant, which is why she didn't want it out in the open. She would like to pretend to be someone and something that she is not. Just imagine the impact if you made a list of all her actions (OM at the office, bringing OM back for a threesome, porn on her phone, belittling you to her friends, and I hate to think what else), and you read that list out to the counsellors and asked them if that is good or acceptable behaviour. Frankly, 36, I think you should do exactly that; make that list, and insist you get to read it out to the counsellors. Do not warn your wife about it, keep it in your jacket, and just do it. And when it is done, you can say, "And that is what I have had done to me, and what I am supposed to accept as normal behaviour within a marriage". Blow her cover, put her in the spotlight.

She wants us to go back to counseling this Saturday. I just don't know. I feel like I am slipping away into a deep depression, a black hole where I no longer have value as a husband or a human being. I have nightmares constantly, even while awake.

My thought about his is an absolute 100% NO NO NO to another MC session. The last one was a disaster, because neither of you are anywhere near ready for it. It will be a waste of money at this point. The marriage is not a problem, it is your wife and her aberrant, abusive behaviour that is. If any money is to be spent on counselling, it should be individual counselling for you. That will help you to get your thoughts together, and help you with the depression. And that list that I said would make such an impact at an MC session? You take it to your individual counsellor and you work through it with them, so they understand the full extent of the abuse you have suffered, and that you continue to suffer. Tell them about your feeling of sliding into depression; they can help. You need counselling that focuses on you, and you alone.

I apologize for rambling. I am feeling very low and worthless this morning, unable to focus. I am ready to quit my job and my life and move somewhere where people won't look at me and say, "There's the guy whose wife cheated on him. It's probably his fault."

Nothing to apologise for! You are amongst friends, brothers, and sisters in this forum. You have been treated badly by your wife, and you have absorbed that and taken it to mean that you deserved to be treated that way. That is not true! Your wife's shabby and disgusting actions are not a reflection on you, or your worth and value as a human being. They are a reflection on her, and it is no wonder she wants them kept quiet. Please get yourself into counselling, so this can be dealt with. You are a good man who has been abused. You did nothing to deserve it, and you are worth just the same as the rest of here who got badly treated by people who should have known better.

As for people pointing at you and thinking you deserved any of this, there are more than 57,000 of us in this forum who would put our arms round your shoulders and say, "I had it done to me too. I got through it. And you will too, if you open yourself up and get the right support". You are not a pariah, you are a decent, intelligent man. You are the victim of a selfish narcissist who has reduced your sense of self-worth, but we know how you are worth, and if I was there in person I would have quite a lot to say to your wife about how badly she has failed you.

Please, 36, your number one priority must be to get yourself along to your physician, and after that, to get yourself into individual counselling. The physician can help with the physical issues you have noticed, and a counsellor can help you rediscover your belief in yourself.

Sending strength and best wishes to a good and worthy man,

M

[This message edited by M1965 at 1:44 PM, September 28th (Thursday)]

posts: 1277   ·   registered: Jan. 21st, 2017   ·   location: South East of England
id 7985037
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