SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

1- I agree with many here; the affair is an affair. Wh was with an old girlfriend turned friend and still runs in some of the same social circles. THAT part is hard. Seeing her and her normalcy in public. It’s better now, but at first, seeing her anywhere was just torture. (And she held her head up high- maybe there is no shame in being 50% of the biggest mistake a person has made in their life)

2- I’ve never thought about a rA, so I don’t know. I couldn’t do it. I couldn’t live with myself.

"A revenge affair is a manifestation of pain and anger designed to exact vengeance. The original affair was done just for fun and out of selfishness and entitlement."

so revenge is more understandable and better than fun and entitlement?

For me, I think it may have been better that I knew the ap. I can’t really know for sure though as I do know her

The reason I think it’s easier is because I know how horrible of a person she is and I know how unattractive she has always been. So I didn’t have to imagine one way or the other. I already k ew the type of person I was dealing with

I dont consider ra’s worse. I consider them the same.

I understand that the bs knows the pain that it causes but the was knew it would cause pain or they wouldn’t have kept it a secret. I think it’s the same. I know from experience the massive pull for revenge and I also know from experience how fucked up your mind is after dday so I get how easy it would be to do. I also understand the feeling to even the score.

I just don’t see how causing the ws pain will help the m at all

It doesn't matter. I could not do enough damage to combat a 10 year LTA. Revenge could not top it.

TiredSoul:

Yes, it matters.

1.But in your example, both are equally bad for me. It would matter that the AP is someone that either of us could run into during our normal daily life. If it is a coworker then the WS has to change jobs. In our case, it was a woman that lived 2 miles from us and was part of the same 12 step community. We moved out of state.

Once the affair has happened; that person will never be nameless or faceless but it is better if they are far away; much worse is a friend.

2. All affairs are equally hideous and destructive. You don't get a pass for a revenge affair. You get the chance to leave the marriage with honor and dignity or reduce yourself to the low class, slimy behavior that caused all this pain.

"A revenge affair is a manifestation of pain and anger designed to exact vengeance. The original affair was done just for fun and out of selfishness and entitlement."

I don't think all "RAs" are about revenge - one reason why I don't like that term. I can see for a man it is about feeling like a stud again (for a lack of better words) after finding out some other man was having his way with your wife. Nothing about getting back at WW...

So I guess in order to judge the RA fully, you have to know the intention...

[This message edited by redhorse at 9:33 AM, January 20th (Saturday)]

1. Does it matter who the WS cheated with? Hell yes, it mattered to the WS didn't it? In that it involves telling the BS the truth, it absolutely matters. I really read this question as an attempt to skirt full disclosure and truthfulness by the WS - for the sake of the WS and their consequence avoidance - so, yup, you need to disclose truthfully name, address, email and workplace of your AP - no exceptions.

2.

To me, the original affair is a relationship ending event. Calling it a revenge affair just never really fit with me.

^This is where I fall on this topic. The relationship is already dead, trust is dead, innocence is dead. What happens next happens. No debt of loyalty, fidelity, honesty exists once the union is unilaterally shattered by the WS actions. (ETA - By honesty, here, I mean being an open book to your (former, now wayward) spouse. I believe lying is never ok, however, you can tell someone who has no right to know the gory details of your life that you are not going to tell them about that).

[This message edited by JustWow at 9:44 AM, January 20th (Saturday)]

I'm stuck on how a GROWN ASS adult doesn't know screwing someone else/getting emotionally involved isn't hurtful to the BS.

They absolutely know....just don't care. Just like a RA. The BS knows it will hurt....they just don't care.

When I hear that the BS has a RA knowing how hurtful it is...I view it as blame shifting. Of course the WS knew it be hurtful...that's why they lie.

In my situation, it made it worse that I knew the AP (not a friend - just through church ). She lives in our town and now I have to be looking over my shoulder until one of us moves. The only thing that helps is that she is not well respected or liked and I'm more attractive by everyone's standards both inside and out. I also think it is hard to know that many people in our small town know about it although I've gotten tons of support.

I know I'm probably in the minority, but I think the original A is worse than an RA although neither is excusable. I just think an RA is more understandable. That being said, I couldn't do it to myself or my sons.

Carolina52- I’m right there with you. It would take a decade if my life to be able to match what he did.

That’s a lot of lying and sneaking around. I have no idea why a ws thinks some ego kibbles and orgasms are worth panicking when they forget their phone. Keeping it out of site and locked at all times. Making sure to delete all history of calls and texts. Try to keep up with the lies so as not to appear to be cheating. I think that’s what bothers me the most. A decade of wanting to do the above and drive yourself crazy for it. Only seriously mess snip people would live that way. The memory they need to keep up with their lies for so long and then when caught, all of a sudden they don’t remember the answers to your questions. Probably because they expenses so much energy with the above mental gymnastics.

I dont agree that when there is infidelity that the m is over by I do agree that ws’s actions leave a bs broken and literally out of their minds. I try not to judge people who have done it or are thinking about it because I’m coming up to 4 years out and the thought still has crossed my mind on occasion.

Someone else here has mentioned how their wa was their first and only. Same in my case and it is really difficult to come to terms that your fidelity and the fact that you were their only meant absolutely nothing to them and they just went out and got more while you remained faithful to the only one you ha e ever been with. If you haven’t been in those shoes, it’s a real kick in the face. It’s a horse pill to swallow and it sucks.

There are times when I consider if just because he has no idea what it’s like to have mind movies of me with someone else and those mind movies being the truth.

I agreed to be with him after knowing about his other sexual experiences but I wasn’t given a choice with this.

Some people have a higher sense of justice than otters and I can understand that view point.

Yes D is jusstixe but I understand why some dont want to d but want ws to feel like they do. I think it’s normal to think that way after being hurt so badly.

1) I think it's worse if the ap is someone the BS has t see in normal life after the A.

2) If anything, I think the RA is worse.

ETA to clarify: I think most As are a matter of the WS losing touch with reality. Even though many BSes think the A is a way to show anger at them, it's not. The A is for the WS, not against the BS.

RAs are both for the BS and against the WS.

[This message edited by sisoon at 11:37 AM, January 21st (Sunday)]

1. It does not matter. The hurt is still the same. My WH husband cheated with a neighbor, hookers and his exs.

2. An A and RA are both the same. Both are betrayals. The original WS might sincerely feel remorseful (not in my case) and genuinely works on reconciling only to have any progress achieved be tainted by the BS cheating.

1) AP being even an acquaintance is worse to me than being a perfect stranger.

2) An RA is by far the lesser of the two evils. An RA will never carry the same sense of shock - WS’s almost expect them. An RA (in this instance) would never happen without an A - that’s why they are called RA’s. However, I do believe that when couples become MH’s - it begins a new sordid cycle of abuse where the pain is blurred and everything becomes tainted.

I don’t think here is a level of what’s worse. I do believe that it could be harder to overcome if the AP was or is still in the picture.

The original A or an RA pretty much boils down to justifying your actions because your SO did x y x. I think it might be a little worse for a RA knowing how it causes pain. RA would just be adding fuel to the fire. Becomes a lot messier. “You did it first” fights and probably constantly throwing it each other’s faces. There is never a good reason to cheat. I think overall both are equal because it’s justifying actions.

1. Does it matter who you/your WS cheated on you with. Is it easier if its a nameless faceless person or does that make it harder.

It always matters - be it a family friend or a faceless unknown person, but I only know how much it hurt to have the AP in our world pretend to be a family friend. Dinners together with all the kids, it was unreal that both families got to gather for the benefit of their secret world.

In that sense it didn't help to have two people lying to me with the dreaded 'just friends' crap.

2. Do you believe that if a spouse has an A and then the other spouse has a RA that the original A is worse?

Both are bad. It is not any better for me to be a bad person in response to pain.

I'll never lower my own standards and morals. I would simply leave if there was no way to fix the relationship. And no RA on the planet will ever balance the wrong or the hurt I've suffered.

It mattered to my wife that I cheated with a co-worker that she had met before and during the affair. I guess for her it was an extra punch in the gut by myself and the AP that she smiled to her face and interacted with our children when she was having a relationship with me. I can understand why. In a way it is really kind of a bitchy thing to do. I know my APs got a kick out of it. I would think the big thing is who the AP is and how she/he acts towards the BS. On a personal level as the WS it doesn't matter. Easy is easy. Dime a dozen for cheaters and wayward alike.

I think (even though I have not been cheated on by my wife) that RA are worse depending. If it truly is a vindictive vengeful thing, then it just proves what type of person the BS was to begin with. The strength of their character that always existed till it was tested no differently than the strength of the character of the WS till it was tested. Just is IMO. Don't get me wrong. Using people like objects and taking advantage of them is wrong to begin with. But, a vengeful spiteful character? I think there is an added evilness to it. An added intent of malice. Now, if the RA is done because the BS is trying to compensate for their hurt self confidence caused by the WS-then I don't see it as bad as the original affair. It is just the same reasons as the WS had for having the first one.

Depending upon why the first original affair happened in the first place makes a difference too. Some people are just mean to begin with. My APs were very mean spiteful woman to everyone. I let myself become part of their work clique till I couldn't stomach them anymore. Plenty of BS on here with some serious crazy OW/OM. We may not see them come here very often posting as WS but they exist. Men and woman that have affairs out of spite. Out of narcissism. Out of resentment. Thinking they are going to teach the BS a lesson. Remind them of their value and that they can still turn heads. To remind them that they can lose the WS. Or doing it simply to scare the BS and goad them into changing. Those reasons to have an affair seem pretty evil to me to. But, who am I to judge. I chose to take advantage of my wife's love and used people. Not to mention I had affairs with the type of woman that were the essence this paragraph.

And just to add having a RA with another married person and subjecting another person (new OBS) to the pain you already know about is about as evil as it gets. You want to RA, why make new victims? At least find someone single. Nothing like carrying the crazy torch cycle.

[This message edited by Zugzwang at 4:05 PM, January 20th (Saturday)]

The more I think about this thread the more I see it like comparing different types of cancer. There are varying degrees, levels of pain, treatments and outcomes but they are all bad. They would all eventually kill you or harm you if left untreated. Each person that receives a diagnosis of cancer has their own herd journey. I don't know if it would benefit them to compare their pain to another's. It is their pain alone.

It all matters. What is important is what matters to your BS.

[This message edited by Jesusismyanchor at 4:43 PM, January 20th (Saturday)]

My spouse had an EA with his ex wife’s sil. My husband is an idiot. She is an attention whore, has an emotional affair with another family member as well. My husband loved the ego kibbles she threw him. I would like to take that red headed bitch by the pony tail and throw her in the damn pool, she isn’t attractive just very charismatic. I know she had more emotional affairs. Yes it mattered,

I also have the joy of knowing he cheated with sex workers. So nameless faceless.

Both are equally as painful.

Is a revenge affair worse. No that tells me you didn’t want to reconcile you wanted so you decided to wallow with the pigs. Sorry I am very blunt about cheating. I see no reason for it in day and age cheating can cause death. My close friend died of aids after cheating on his partner and his partner has it.

then I don't see it as bad as the original affair. It is just the same reasons as the WS had for having the first one.

^^They are not the same reasons. The reasons are the original WS had a sexual affair(s). The original WS reasons - who knows...and not as significant...

[This message edited by redhorse at 5:58 PM, January 20th (Saturday)]

^^^ They are. I was a the WH and I did not have a sexual affair. Guess it depends upon the reason for the affair. Which, BTW even if it was sexual it is still feeding an emotional need. I know sex for me feeds my stress release and feeds emotions of being wanted. Being the "man". Being the "stud". So, I call BS if sex doesn't feed some emotional need for people that have sexual affairs. They are just trading words for sex. For myself as a WS I had an affair due to needs that were unrealistic and unhealthy due to low self confidence and esteem. If a BS has a RA due to how they feel about their WS cheating on them and causing them to feel worthless then in some respects they are both having affairs to feed their self esteem and self confidence.

[This message edited by Zugzwang at 7:11 PM, January 20th (Saturday)]