SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

7 years together, 2 young children, DDay and separation 2 years ago with a month of pick me dance then hard 180 for 1.5 years and went through courts for custody/divorce. Since that ended and that huge stress was over we slowly started talking more and spending some time together with the children. She was opening up some, doing actions to show she cared for me again, saying some right things. But at the same time was saying she wasn't ready for anything serious and needed time. I knew she hadn't been with the AP for months and she seemed uninterested but they were still communicating some. I was wary and taking things slow but have been starved for love, affection, communication and let things rush quickly and we had sex one night.

I felt good that things were going a few steps forward but was well aware that this isn't serious reconciliation cause there are many key pieces missing such as NC and full commitment from her. I kept going with the flow and recently she started becoming more distant. My intuition the last weekend told me something was wrong, giving me the same kind of feeling I had at DDay. I confronted her and asked what's going on, but to save it cause I already know. She deflected and I started feeling the trauma of DDay again. I don't know for a fact but have a strong feeling they saw each other again. I am hurt but not surprised. Within a couple days I was calmer and had clarity that I've gained going through this before.

And there is a compassion I feel. I saw my WW trying to do right, but is stuck in the crossroads of an addiction as strong as heroin, and relapsing. I feel the love to support her in this time of sickness. My WW was faithful 7 years. The affair hurts but I have love for her like God does for us. I had my share of porn addiction at the beginning of our marriage, which is unfaithful too in ways, not near as damaging but I am just saying I wasn't perfect either and we all deserve a chance. Humans are prone to make mistakes in this world so full of evil. I know she is in some of the greatest pain of her life no matter how much she is trying to hide it and paint a facade.

I love my SO with all my heart. Going through all we've been and how much love I have for her still shows how much she means to me. All I ever wanted was our family to be happy and healthy. She made a terrible mistake with cheating and has the demon to face. Instead of shutting her out, I sent her a pdf letter explaining my feelings with a detailed explanation of the suffering I've felt for years from betrayal, where we began, where we are now, and that I still love her and will support her through healing her addiction but she must stop contact, and we will not be spending time together until she is healed from it.

Yes I am hurt but am also happy that the just going with the flow (rug sweeping) ended quickly so it can become serious. I have no idea what the future holds but I have faith as big as mountains and always have in us. Either way I will take care of me and okay waiting longer to see what happens. Out of all the things worth fighting for in this world, love is at the top.

I'd love to hear any stories of compassion from BS to WS in situations like this. Thanks for reading.

Hi, welcome to SI.

Gently, you love the person you thought she was.

She is not that person.

If she's still communicating with or seeing AP, she's using you as a backup plan B in case Plan A doesn't work out.

Are you in IC to figure out why you would tolerate her abuse?

Cheating is not a mistake, it's a choice. Your wife is making these destructive choices over and over again.

I sent her a pdf letter explaining my feelings with a detailed explanation of the suffering I've felt for years from betrayal, where we began, where we are now, and that I still love her and will support her through healing her addiction but she must stop contact, and we will not be spending time together until she is healed from it.

^^^Gently, your wife should already understand the devastation she has caused, and I highly doubt you pouring your heart out in a letter will make her change her behavior.

Weekends are a bit slow, hang in there, other members will be here to support you.

The best thing you can do now is get yourself into IC and focus your energies on you and your children. They need one stable parent, and right now you're it.

BTW, is this guy married?

She's done absolutely nothing to become a better partner. She's done none of the work to become a safe partner.

You are projecting how YOU would feel in her shoes.

She's a fully grown woman. She is not a victim. She didn't make a mistake. She's made bad choices.

You say she's trying to hide her pain. Maybe not. Maybe she just doesn't want you to know he's still in her life, because she doesn't want the consequences.

You've picked up your dancing shoes again.

A mistake is forgetting to grab a gallon of milk at the store. An A is thousands of conscious decisions to betray your marriage.

Please feel free to check out the Healing Library. It has a lot of great information, including a list of the acronyms we use.

With her being distant, is it possible she has a boyfriend? Not the AP but somebody else?

R is hard work and if she isn't 100% committed, it's nearly impossible.

In your story, I see two people with unhealthy addiction. One is your wife who is addicted to her affair and her dishonest and deceiving personality. Other is you who is addicted to a fantasy of woman you once married to.

Your have been playing pick me dance since Divorce. And, I have never seen any BS enforcing hard 180 for 1.5 years? Even hard 180 for 1.5 years couldn't change her and bring some remorse in her. She never went NC with her AP. Brother, it's over. You need to wake up. It's time to move on. Both of you are stringing each other along for a fantasy that doesn't exit. Both of you are hurting each other.

Y’all are right. I didn’t want to admit it to myself. I did question whether this was a pick me dance again in disguise. Thanks for the wake up. Time to shut it down.

Did the 180 just now. For me. For my children. Not for her. Feel a thousand times better already. I'll have a new lover in the future that is fully committed and nothing less, when the time is right. Thank you all again and much love.

Hi,

I was a ww, definitely had issues with addiction. Years unwinding the how’s, whys, and coming to terms with myself.

I think you have done the right thing for you, and if it helps you, you did the right thing foruour children and even her too. Both in giving her a letter detailing your hurt and closing the door.

I would recommend thinking about therapy as well, healing these things have big blind spots and it would be good for you to to have someone to bounce the self reflection on.

I think you can have compassion for someone and still not allow them in your life to hurt and disrupt. Compassion can help with co-parenting moving forward.

The only way you could ever move forward as a couple is if she can heal, has clarity over her thoughts and actions. By letting her back in and going with the flow you provided her comfort, a soft place to fall and she exploited that. To ever move forward she is the one who needs to provide comfort, security and be the one who does heavy lifting. She has to want it with all her heart and soul because anything else means she is still using you for comfort. And reconciliation is hard when you do it right.

I am sorry you seem to be a good person who has a big heart. Keep your boundaries and don’t wait on her to move forward with healing and getting on with your life.

annb:

Answering your questions. I'm not in IC or interested in it. I personally like forums like these for support. Why I tolerated her abuse.. After the court divorce, not having a strong boundary of 100% commitment or nothing brought me step by step into tolerating abuse again. It took this second DDay to break me out of it.

Am I married? I did use the term WW hesitantly in my post. Marriage is deep word to me. In the eyes of the legal system we were common law married and now divorced, but that was all a paper formality to me. I've thought for a while that marriage is when two have sex and they are one flesh but your question has me pondering the meaning further of marriage as a God-ordained covenant which is beyond just the physical act of sex.

HellFire:

You are absolutely right, she is not a safe partner. She has done things to improve her health like stop drinking which was happening a lot when she first cheated and more reflection through writing. But as far as stopping the cheating and lying itself, nope. I'd argue that any human that isn't pure evil and acts unfaithfully lives in an internal hell of dissonance and pain.

leafields:

Your intuition is incredible. I can see why you're a guide. She made it pretty clear today without saying it outright that it is a boyfriend and not the AP. Her words "I may have a boyfriend, I may not." This makes sense, from what I pieced together, her interest for AP had gone.

Lurkingsoul12:

That's a great way to see it, that we both have an addiction. And that we are both hurting each other. Very helpful.

hikingout:

Thanks for the encouragement that I did the right thing with both the letter and 180. I agree. And you are right that it helps her too. The compassion is still there. And you are hitting the nail on the head, I let her back in when she wasn't healed. And she has to be the one to want it with all her heart and soul, and provide the comfort and security. It would be plainly obvious if she was serious about reconciling. She was not, and I let her back in. That's the issue.

----

Reflecting, I'm not accepting anything less than full commitment from my lover in the future and whether that's her or someone else, I don't know, and that is okay. I don't need to and will not force someone to love me as that's why I was trying to do and it was killing me. I'm not stuck in the limbo, being abused, anymore. I have the space to heal and be filled with happiness which while being abused was not there.

[This message edited by lineagegold at 2:32 AM, Tuesday, June 20th]

What I don’t see in the original post is love for the children…
Imagine this scenario: Unlike most of your friends then your parents don’t live together, your mom has a new "friend" who is sometimes there when you have your morning cereal and then all of a sudden you are in the park having a picnic with mom and dad who are behaving as if everything was normal and then next day "uncle Bob" is pouring the milk over your cereal again…

Divorce is fine. It’s a great solution and beats raising kids in an abusive household. Be that emotionally stunted, open infidelity, lack of mutual respect between parents or whatever. Uncle Bob can even be a great guy who cares for the kids and is kind and gentle – an ideal step-father. Mom and dad can be the best coparents ever – even do take a day together in the park having a picnic.
But the message needs to be very clear to the kids…

Nothing clarifies what you really want more than losing it. The AP's cake is on the table in front of her, and your cake is on the table. She'd really like to have both, and so far, you've been allowing her to continue to sample from each while she tries to decide which one she wants. IMO, the best way to save your relationship is to take your cake off the table. (Do the 180 and start taking steps to end the relationship.)

Tolerating her continued A is not compassion, it's fear. You're afraid of what will happen if she doesn't choose you.

And you're not going to "nice" her into doing the right thing. Like you said, she's in the throes of addiction, and you've been her enabler. A little bit of contact with the AP is like a little bit of heroin. It's still an active addiction and it's still bad for everyone that it touches. I also understood how hard it was for my husband to instantly detach from his AP, but I didn't waver on my demand that he must stop all contact with her if he wanted any kind of relationship with me, even a post-D friendship.

Good luck. I know it's not easy to take a stand, but you must. For yourself, your children, and for her.

Bigger:

My love for my children is immense. I’ve realized now that from the time divorce, at the end of last year, until this 180, was one drawn out pick me dance and I didn’t realize it enough to stop it. I thought I was doing the right thing. But it was hurting me and in turn I haven’t been the best I could be for the children. This 180 will fix that.

SacredSoulSister:

You laid it all out so very well. The cake eating continued because I allowed it. And I was enabling it. I was not prepared for the subtleties and dangers of post divorce to fall into a spot where I would let myself be abused. Thankfully it only lasted about half a year.

And yes, if I really want the relationship to work I must 180 and not tolerate anything but full commitment. Thanks for the support. I am unwavering in standing up for myself now.

——

Update. She’s already texted this morning asking if I had time to talk today. And texted and even emailed a long message entitled "farewell" but in it takes no responsibility for the destruction she has caused. This is her fear of losing the best man ever in her life but still taking no responsibility, and fishing for me to cave in from her saying a fake farewell.

My god it feels good to be in power again. One where is everything is clear and I have control over my life and am not allowing or enabling abuse. I’m going to reply to the message and cut through the BS like butter.

Update. She’s already texted this morning asking if I had time to talk today. And texted and even emailed a long message entitled "farewell" but in it takes no responsibility for the destruction she has caused. This is her fear of losing the best man ever in her life but still taking no responsibility, and fishing for me to cave in from her saying a fake farewell.

My god it feels good to be in power again. One where is everything is clear and I have control over my life and am not allowing or enabling abuse. I’m going to reply to the message and cut through the BS like butter.

I hope the subject line of your reply is "k,bye" I'm so glad that you can see right through her manipulative nonsense. Good on ya.

Hold onto that power! It's heady stuff and it won't steer you wrong.

Absolutely horrid and damaging situation for your poor kids. Cut off contact with her and focus on your kids. My heart hurts for them, so much yanking back and forth. What an unfair situation for them. So sad.

I believe 180 is not for the person who has divorced their cheating partner. 180 is applied before divorce.

What you need to do is have very minimal contact with your ex. All future interactions should only be concerned to co parenting. The one and only reason behind any interactions with her in future should be your children. Period.

Your goal should be to avoid orbiting around her. Your life should not be centered around her. You need to achieve INDIFFERENCE. That should be your goal. Her presence around you should not influence your life, your emotions, your stability, your decision making, your happines and your parenting more than it should.

Replying to her email is pointless. What is the purpose behind your reply? You expect her to understand what you wrote, and then have a change of heart?? It won't happen. She won't accept the blame. She won't acknowledge your pain to the extent you want her to. She will get defensive and will try to blame you for everything. You will be hurt more. The best response to her email is no response at all. If you are not looking for best response but a better response then just reply "OK. Farewall".

[This message edited by Lurkingsoul12 at 6:42 PM, Monday, June 19th]

Thanks for the encouragement that I did the right thing with both the letter and 180. I agree. And you are right that it helps her too. The compassion is still there. And you are hitting the nail on the head, I let her back in when she wasn't healed. And she has to be the one to want it with all her heart and soul, and provide the comfort and security. It would be plainly obvious if she was serious about reconciling. She was not, and I let her back in. That's the issue.

Give yourself a little grace brother, your feelings for this woman are not like a light switch, they can't be turned on/off in an instant. You were with her for years and raised a family with this woman, you have had many hundreds/thousands of great memories with her over the years and while divorce is a nice legal separation from ties to her, you will always be tied to her through your children and your love for her, while maybe not appearing to be rational is completely understandable, because all of us here have been in your shoes.

You let her back in and you got hurt, it is a really crappy way to see that you made that mistake. However, take comfort that you are a new man today and you are not going to make that mistake again. At this point, your WW is your XWW. Again, this is a tough one to consider, but you are divorced adult and free to pursue any relationships you feel fit into your life. As a thought experiment, if you started seeing a woman, who isn't your XWW, from your community for the last 1.5 years and you found that she had a boyfriend as well you, also the boyfriend, you wouldn't tolerate that and as much as you may feel for that woman, she betrayed you and given what you've gone through, cutting ties with that non-XWW would be easy as pie. So, that is my way of saying that by implementing the 180 and no longer putting up with her manipulative bullshit, you are doing the right thing here.

This woman does not want to be serious about her recovery and fixing her shit. If at some point your XWW gets serious about her issues and fixing her own shit and, I cannot stress this enough, you actually want to pursue something with her, you can consider a situation with her, but you can't throw yourselves into the deep end of the pool immediately, despite your past familiarity. I've gotta tell you, I stayed with my wife and I'm glad I made that decision every day, but I also know that there are "plenty of fish in the sea" if things had gone the other way there. At the end of the day, this is all up to you and your decisions, but it may be a more healthy relationship path for you to meet someone new and great who shares your values and can be a great partner for you and very importantly part of your kids' lives. It is not easy for just any woman to fit into your life as a single father.

I’m going to reply to the message and cut through the BS like butter.

Nope. The best response to such blatant manipulation is no response.

You think that a well worded response will get your point across but you are incorrect. First, she will not truly read or absorb whatever you have crafted. Second, it will keep a ridiculous and non-productive stream of conversation alive.

If you are really feeling empowered, use your most powerful weapon, no contact.

Hi LG, sorry to find you here. What I find helpful in case of infidelity, getting honest with oneself. For that stop making excuses on her behalf. You are still doing the pick me dance.

It hurts like nothing else to love someone who doesn't feel the same way.

You need to detach and move on from your ex ww.

[This message edited by Browsing41 at 6:58 PM, Monday, June 19th]

SacredSoulSister:

I hope the subject line of your reply is "k,bye"

Haha I thought that too. I started it with "farewell" right back.

stubbornft:

Thank you for your empathy. I feel the same way and it is very sad.

Lurkingsoul12:

Avoid orbiting around her is good way to put it. I remember my first 180 or detachment if that's a better term here, got easier to do and more effective over time.

Bor9455:

Thanks man for typing that out. All wise words. Indeed my feelings for her aren't a simple switch. Despite that, I am a new man today and the future bright, whichever way it goes.

self-rescuer:

I felt ok responding to it to that message but will use no contact too on certain messages and not let pointless conversation carry on.

bob7777:

Yup. Won't make excuses anymore.

Browsing41:

Absolutely.