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She wanted to introduce herself over the phone and asked me some questions about him. She also has some type of investigator that she wants to call me and talk with me about my son as well.

She told me several very disturbing things.

She said that it was very complicated with him because he has state charges as well as the federal charges. She said that he was not earning any time right now, because he had not been sentenced yet… His case had not been resolved.

She said that after his federal case is resolved, they will send him back here to do his time on state charges before he even got to start his federal charges. We were under the impression that federal time would be done first, and that state charges could be served concurrently. Evidently that is not the case.

From some research that I have done, from some inmates who had at least similar experiences that my son has spoken to, we were under the impression that the first time, non-violent offense of this nature would be 3 to 5 years, but probably the short end of that time. She told me today that she hoped it would not be longer than five years. But that he would serve all the time for state charges first, before he was even allowed to start serving his federal time.

It sounds like it could be more like 10 years instead of the three years that we were praying for.

I know that my husband will not survive that long. I’m very concerned about my son meeting his defender this Thursday morning and her telling him all of this information. She told me today she would try to break it to him gently. But I’m afraid it’s all going to come crashing in on him.

I know that he made his choices, and there is a price to be paid.

… So now he has to be in jail much longer than we thought probably.

… It is entirely possible that neither my husband or even I will live to see him to get out.

… I wonder if his lady will be able to wait this kind of time for him.

…His son will be 12-13 yrs old when he gets out.

He is already very worried about his dad. We are just finishing up another Zosyn infusion through a picc line the hospital sent him home with. Our son calls every other day to check on his dad. H has stopped eating any more than once a day. He just sleeps all the time.

I’m scared on so many fronts.

I’m afraid that this will break him.

[This message edited by WhatsRight at 12:18 AM, Wednesday, October 12th]

(((WR))). Try to focus on the things you can control. Because you cannot control the courts or the legal system or your husband or your son. Just you. So make sure you are getting time away, getting enough sleep, taking the pups for long walks…
What will happen will happen. You can’t control it, at least not much.

I know this is not good news. And I am so sorry.

I am so sorry for you. Both of these are devastating situations.

Focus on your H. He needs you most now.

I’m so sorry you have to navigate all of this. Big hugs.

Whatsright, try to establish a good relationship with his federal public defender. She IS his lifeline and don't hesitate to share with her your home circumstances - about his Dad. If this is any comfort, federal public defenders are usually very good and will work hard for their clients. When he gets transferred back for the state charges, the state might actually cut his time with them down some, knowing the federal system is going to have him in custody. I've seen that happen. Right now states are up against financial restraints and do not want to foot the bill any longer than they have to - to house/feed prisoners. That is in every state. I hope you will be able to visit him at both places as that will help him do 'good' time.

Not to give you false hopes but I don't see him having to serve more than 5 years, total - since he isn't a violent offender.

Keep your chin up and keep sending him cards and talking to him as often as possible. Encourage him to keep enrolling in EVERY program they offer - either on state or the federal level.

First of all: As a rule an attorney never gives hope. I think it’s trained into them to clearly outline the worst scenario simply to prevent any possible false hope. I personally would avoid an attorney that promised me a bright result, and opt for one that was more realistic about what could happen.

IMHO the key here is your son’s behavior and actions NOW. If he appears before court with no major lifestyle change the whole system will be ruled by a level of prejudice that simply expects him to progress to worse crime, more time and so on. A judge might be thinking "I might as well give this punk the max because otherwise I will have him in court again in three years".
If your son is clean, sober, keeps his nose clean in the prison, goes to AA, IC, group-therapy… WHATEVER options he might have… it will IMHO impact the sentencing seriously. Equally important it can impact what sort of facility he does his time in.

Bigger, you are right. I never give clients false hope and usually do paint the worst possible outcome for them so they will be prepared, just in case. I'm assuming Whatsright's son has a federal public defender and it's difficult to change attorneys through that system. An attorney can opt out of a case but it's hard for the client to get yet another 'free attorney" after one has been assigned. At least that is the case where I practice. Unless there were weapons or violence involved with what he's convicted of - if he keeps his nose clean and partakes of all programs offered, I would think he might get a couple of breaks. In the federal system he should also have access to counseling to deal with his absence during his father's illness - and missing his child.

Whatsright, all federal public defenders have access to investigators to work on your son's case. I have several friends who do that work and they are very valuable to his defense.

Just encourage him all you can.

((((WR))))

Sending lots of strength, love and MOJO to you and DS. I hope things work out on the better side rather than the worse side.

((((WR))))

Sorry… this is a double post.

[This message edited by WhatsRight at 3:39 AM, Thursday, October 13th]

Is there any information that I could tell the public defender and or the investigator that would be detrimental to my son? Like the fact that he has stolen from us, for example???

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NEVER volunteer anything like this. Deal only with what you perceive to be mental health issues. Definitely share about your H's severe illness. Share about the adoption and the fetal alcohol syndrome.

The investigators are really good. They will use what they find for appeals or a lighter sentence.

It's discouraging that your son will be transferred back to a county jail facility. I loathe those places. They put them there to wait for room in the correctional facility where he will go. County jails are the pits. In my area there are almost as many drugs inside as there are outside. Tell your son to trust NO one in the county jail, don't make friends there. Keep to himself. One of my clients told me everything is available (for a price) in the county jail. He said he could have had drugs and a cell phone for a price -- but ironically no cigarettes or a coke. Can't buy those. I hope he isn't in a county jail for long. His federal public defender and the investigator will keep working on his federal case even though he's been moved since they are aware he will be back in the federal system later. Ask as many questions as you want to ask. Write down your questions when you know you will be having a call from attorney or investigator. Ask about the possibility of the feds negotiating with the state to have both sentences run concurrently. It's been done before. Be sure to let them know about all the programs your son is participating in even though they might already know.

Thank you all for your input.

His public defender told me yesterday on the phone that her investigator will be calling me to get to know him and his circumstances and our circumstances at home better. I’m glad to hear you say that that information will be helpful to my son.

He is taking as many classes as he can take at once where he is now. Once he is sentenced, if I understand correctly, they will send him back here to the county jail. Where there are no classes. He never gets to breathe fresh air, there are no AA meetings, or any of those opportunities. Also, when doing federal time, there is a certain 18 mo drug program that if he this allowed to participate in, it will knock 18 mo off of his time. Not here. If I understand correctly.

I definitely plan to tell the public defender and the investigator any information they ask. I will definitely use my husband‘s illness… Is that wrong?… To help in anyway I can.

Is there any information that I could tell the public defender and or the investigator that would be detrimental to my son? Like the fact that he has stolen from us, for example???

I appreciate the information, that perhaps the public defender has perhaps given me the worst case scenario.

I’m really defeated right now.

My son who just came home a month ago from a voluntary commitment to a psychiatric facility… I found out two days ago that he has not been taking his medicine since he got back home. The wonderful medicine that he loved and said it made him feel the best he has felt in a long time. So, he’s irritated with me, with everyone. Once again.

I pointed out to him that I found the pills and I asked him if he taking them. He said no, that he forgets.

I explained to him that when someone takes a medication to make them feel better, but when they actually do start to feel better, they feel like they don’t need the medicine anymore. But what they need to understand is that is the medicine that is helping him feel better. So they should continue to take it. I even made a "funny" and compared it to birth control pills. You can just take it when you feel like you might need it, it has to stay in your system. He got pissed for talking with me about it at all.

It’s like everything dear to me is in a giant shitstorm.

In 12 hours I will be sitting in the courtroom waiting for him to come in. He will just have heard his defender tell him stuff that he has told himself differently. I’m afraid he will be really down.

Y’all please keep me in your prayers/thoughts. And my family.

I’m finding it hard to see positive around me. I’m just not happy… I don’t see things changing from here on out.

[This message edited by WhatsRight at 12:08 PM, Thursday, October 13th]

Jeanie…

What if the public defender or investigator asks me those questions? Or do they know not to?

((((WR)))

Whatsright, if they ask - then answer truthfully. Never lie to the attorney or investigator. Just don't volunteer what you feel are past crimes on a personal level.

Thinking of you and yours. (((WR)))

I could send Jeaniegirl a PM telling her how appreciative I am for her contributions here on SI but think she deserves acknowledgement. Right now – on this thread – her contributions are priceless and you are so blessed to have her in your corner WhatsRight. Thanks Jeaniegirl!

WhatsRight – do your best to be your best at any court-hearings he has to attend. Seeing that a person has family support always helps the cause.

Yes, Jeaniegirl! Your help is so valuable.

All of you … Thank you!

And you as well, Bigger! When I was speaking with my sons public defender the other day, and I asked her about coming to court today, she said that we were welcome to come, but he probably wouldn’t be there but about 10 minutes. That we would not be able to use speak to him or touch/hug him or anything. Just perhaps a wave. That it wasn’t a court date that anything was going to be done… He just needed to show up I guess to officially hear charges, or something along those lines. She acted like it was no big deal at all. In fact she said that he didn’t really have to be there, and he is coming from an out-of-state facility, but she said that she wanted to speak with him before court, just to get to know him and get a sense of him. I really liked that she thought that was important.

It’s going to be a huge ordeal to get my husband there. It will be a couple of hours drive, getting him into the courthouse, then the trip home. It will mean that he will be up for about five or six hours. And he usually can’t stay up that long. He says he wants to go.

Just to see my son… I know it will be very hard. The orange jumpsuit. The shackles. The fact that he will just be able to look at us for a second and then have to leave again. And I dread the ride home.

And I will end up being livid at my husband by the time we get home, because he will not speak of it with me. Thank God for you all, because with the exception of my sister and one friend IRL, there’s no one for me to talk to.

[This message edited by WhatsRight at 12:31 PM, Thursday, October 13th]

Thank you.

Whatsright, I'm glad you can be there. Keep a smile on your face and give your son a thumbs up. It WILL help him tremendously to see you (and hopefully his Dad) .... there.

[This message edited by Jeaniegirl at 8:20 PM, Thursday, October 13th]

Sending you prayers and strength.

Thank y’all.

My husband ended up not going to court yesterday. He is having some bad burning in his bladder I didn’t feel. I could miss it, so I called my sister and she came and sat with him while I was gone. I got Home Health to come and get a urine sample, just in case.

The setting was a little surreal. It looked like something off of law and order, except I was the ONLY person there, except for the court personnel.

They brought him in in shackles of course, hands and feet. The ankle shackles never came off, but they did takeoff those around his wrists For the 10 to 15 minutes he was in court.

It felt like a miracle to get to see him. He has gained about 40 pounds since he has been incarcerated. Not an ounce of fat, but he has been working out, and of course, not using drugs. He did look pale to me, but not from being sick, just because he hadn’t been in the sun. Being biracial, that has always happened to him throughout his life. Becoming so much lighter skinned during winter months. And since he is never in the sun anymore, he really looked pale.

He wouldn’t look at me while they were taking off his handcuffs. I didn’t know if that was because he was not wanting to break the rules about interacting with people in the courtroom, or if he was just embarrassed. But when he called me last night, he did admit that he was too embarrassed to look at me while they were taking off or putting on his handcuffs. Or when he was walking in or walking out.

He finally looked at me, and smiled. I smiled back and gave him a wink. I never took my eyes off of him, but he only looked my way about three times. Once he mouthed "I love you". I flashed him the sign language for "I love you".

He spoke off and on with his public defender. The prosecutor spoke and then the public defender spoke. It turns out that the prosecutor is not going to be the one to actually prosecute the case. He is handing off to someone else because he has some kind of other thing in this timeframe that he hast to do. There was the mention of a video that had not been located, was probably still at the bank. And the mention of DNA. My sons public defender asked for a four month postponement so that there would be time for her to get that information and to process it. The judge asked if she thought four months would be enough, and what did she think she might need six months? And she said probably so. So that scoots out his next appearance until around March.

The judge asked my son if that is what he wanted. He replied, "Well, not really, but I guess I have to." It was in a realistic, personable way. The judge said that he understood, but that it was his job to be certain that my son understood and agreed. My son said,, "Yes sir, I do". (He told me last night that he wanted to come across as a real person.). I told him that he did come across as a real person who didn’t really want to post pone things, but he was very respectful.

Then it was time for it to be over. He smiled at me one more time very briefly, then didn’t look at me again. I stood there watching as it seemed to take forever, like slow motion, for them to put his handcuffs back on. I tried to "will" him to look at me one more time, but he didn’t.

I was about to leave the courtroom because I felt that I was really going to lose it, but his defender motioned toward me for us to speak for a moment. So we talked. She seems nice, and as far as I could tell seemed knowledgeable. She explained that she did not expect there to be a postponement until March in reality. That she expected that there would be a quick resolution… That my son wanted that. She said that federal prosecutors are not so good about giving reduced sentences as state prosecutors. But that the man who is in court was a person she thought she might be able to work with. She also said a lot would depend on the state prosecutor. She told me to contact her anytime I needed to.

Of course I sobbed all the way home. Then I got a call from her investigator, and we made an appointment for 10 o’clock this morning. For me to go to his office for about an hour and a half to… His words… "I want you to tell me about the good, the bad, and the ugly about your son, so I can get a good picture of how he was raised and how he got to where he is."

I’m really nervous about going. He seems very nice over the phone. But for so many reasons that all of you understand, I have lost my basic trust in people. I don’t know why they want to know all of these things. If it is to get an understanding of how he got here, what I’m wondering is, the more they ask me about and if I tell them, about bad things, will this paint a picture for them that he is not worth fighting for so much?

I guess I’ll get more of a feel for it when I get there. I want it to be over. The thought of telling negative things to someone who has at least a semblance of input in my sons future frightens me so badly.

When I talk with him, I don’t want to give the impression that I am making excuses, but I do want to present things as contributions and influences for his decision making. But I know that they must hear mamas pleading for their kids all the time.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.