SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

It has been a looooong time since D-Day, the divorce, rebound flings, 5 years alone, then dating. I'm now amicably getting out of a 12 year marriage. Everything is done except the certificate and the check for my half of the equity in the house.

But I find that one thing still remains: lack of trust. And that has me so very angry right now. Why? Lemme 'splain.

The Cheating Bastard (the CB from here on out) took away my trust in people generally and men specifically. I've tried to get over it. Hell, I even remarried! You're over it, right? But I will NEVER be able to open myself up again like I did before. And trust me, I've tried. Throughout my remarriage and now that I'm out there dating again, I've tried.

So I'm going to be pissed at the CB until I die (or a miracle occurs and I somehow get over it) because he broke me. Irrevocably and permanently, he broke me. And I've done a lot of work to make me into a decent human being. And he came along, earned my trust, lied to me, and broke me.

Maybe it was because I was an active alcoholic when he met me. Then I got sober, and he didn't have anyone to rescue anymore. So he worked really really hard to send me into a tailspin. He did for a while, but I kept at surviving that damn disease, and I have. So far. I'm careful never to assume tomorrow is a given. That's just my disease trying to suck me back in.

But no, wait, the CB was cheating on me BEFORE HE MARRIED ME. Why did he even marry me?!?!?!

I want my f*ing trust back. And he took it from me. That f*ing bastard.

I want to be ecstatically in love and just be able to fall into my partner. To know he'll be there for me. To feel safe. That he has my six. I want to go back to being optimistic and naïve and trusting.

But I find myself always waiting for the other shoe to drop. I just can't do it.

I'm ending a 5-month relationship with a guy that looks great on paper. Good job and just got a big promotion and raise. Owns 2 boats, 2 vehicles, his own house, great dog, very intelligent, and funny as hell. And I am not even close to being able to fall in love with him. I don't trust him and he has never given me any reason not to. If anything, I should trust him more than most because his first marriage ended when his wife left him for another man. But he tells me that he doesn't cheat, and I am like, "Yeah, RIGHT." He uses the words "trust me" and I scoff at him. That's not fair to do to him. So I'm ending it, because as soon as feelings start to develop, I freeze up, panic, and play cool like I don't care what he does. I'm not myself with him. I'm a façade that he thinks is great and chill and it's not in any way a reflection of what I'm really feeling. I'm terrified and running away.

I never used to dump guys. I was a serial monogamist (still am) and would try and try at relationships until they were irrevocably broken. But I always trusted that things could work out. Now, I dump men on the regular. I average less than 2 months. I've dumped 3 men hard in less than a year. One after 2 months, one after 5 weeks, one after 2 weeks. And they were all way into me. And I'm like nope, nope, nope. My best friend says I have high standards and applauds me for ending things as soon as I see red flags. Little does he know, I'm dumping them as soon as I start to have feelings for them. I'm terrified of falling in love.

It's been 18 years, and I'm not over it. To this day, the CB and I meet on a dark road? Bump bump as I run his ass over. Bump bump as I back up over him to make sure he's gone. Bump bump one more time as I drive away laughing like a crazy woman. It's a VERY good thing that I moved over 500 miles away so that won't happen.

And the reason I can't get over it after 18 years is because I can't trust anymore. Love terrifies me. And damn, that pisses me off.

How do I ever trust again?

Your fear of getting hurt again is driving you away from a fulfilling relationship.

Just recently I left my church after 25 years b/c the senior pastor (a woman) betrayed me. Yes she did me wrong.

However that’s in her. I walked away.

I don’t let myself keep dragging the crap with me. Hard? Yes. Worth it? Absolutely.

Just b/c one person cheated doesn’t mean everyone will do the same. I’d give someone a chance until they prove me wrong. Within reason.

First red flag - I’m running. But it has to be something legitimate. Something I saw or heard. Not an innate fear.

Do you think this is something you can overcome?

my story: I fell in love with a beautiful, charming, witty, charismatic woman 3.5 years ago. It's been frustrating, confusing, hurtful and not good for me mentally. I can't seem to let go of her and she can't seem to let go of me. She can't love me back. She says she has a deep love for me. Her words do not match her actions. I tried changing her, that failed. The only person I can change is myself. A super good thing has come out of this frustrating relationship, for the first time in my life I am seriously motivated to really change me, I am investing in my self worth. I am slowly becoming the open, honest, vulnerable, secure, person I've always wanted to be. I started attending adult children of alcoholics again. It is part of Al-Anon which is a very good and basically free self-help group. I have connected on a deep vulnerable level with this small group. I have read many books, I listen to lots of podcasts on self-improvement, healing relationships, improving my health and leaning toward a secure attachment style.

20 years ago I had the worst D. I thought it ruined me. Yes, hard to trust for years. I am not going to ruin my life. 11 years ago I discovered these amazing anonymous groups and in in combination with therapy and these groups I am getting better. I rarely think about her anymore and I thank God everyday I am free of that relationship.

"If you change the way you look at things, the things you look at change" - Wayne Dyer

Recently, discovered attachment style theory, never heard of until 2 yrs ago. I read a book "Attached", my jaw hit the floor because the nice lady that I am currently seeing and our current dysfunctional relationship was a total replica of the chapter on "Avoidant Attachment Style". I swear they were spying on us when they wrote this chapter. I did a deep dive analysis of all my previous relationships and discovered they were all avoidant attachment styles, some more than others. My current relationship is extremely avoidant in the areas of intimacy, vulnerability, emotions and co-regulating. Especially intimacy. Rarely shows emotion, rarely vulnerable, has a lot of alone time, very independent. The worst thing, which causes my anxiety to spike, is when she disappears for 1, 2 or 3 weeks at a time with no explanation, and very little communication. I swear I won't take her back, then I cave. This time I'm not sure. This is the 12th time she has "disappeared". Of course, my anxious side is sure she's seeing another guy. She might be, I doubt it because she's so avoidant, I don't see how she could maintain a connection with anyone else, but then I think, she has this dysfunctional connection with me.

Bottom line: yep, it's me, I am the one that attracts this avoidant type. They tend to self sabotage, mis-read my
positive words and actions as negative, disappear, complain about minuscule things and unknowingly, unconsciously, break the relationship. She has told me, to my face, several times, she wants to get married, and I think okay maybe, and then says she is searching for the right man. The NEXT relationship will be Mr. Right. This mystery person has to have a a long list of qualities and accomplishments. Searching for a Unicorn, and how many unicorns have you ever seen? At first, so confusing and hurtful, and triggered my anxious side. Then as I learned more about her and others attachment styles, it makes sense, I don't blame her, not nearly as much, its not her fault, it is how she is wired, although still annoying and sad too. She will be the last one standing, alone on the dance floor of life. Maybe that is what she wants?

Lately, in the last 2 months, she admits she is avoidant. A huge step to forming a secure relationship style and I applaud her for that. She says she will go to therapy, but doesn't, says she will really work hard on herself, wants to read self-help books together, but doesn't. Says she will attend group meetings, doesn't. Says she will communicate more, doesn't. Minimal effort into change. I can't really blame her, she has spent decades developing her coping mechanisms, as have I, she to distance herself from relationships, commitment and love, and I, on the other hand, spent my whole life developing an over-the-top nearly smothering connection style. Both practicing these coping dynamics every day for decades and decades. So, yes, hard to change, and yes there is a price, and yes the reward is soooo good.

My focus now is for me to "earn" thru hard work, a secure attachment style. Focusing on myself. My style is anxious pre-occupied, which is so freaking torturous. My mind is always pre-occupied with her. That is my style. I'm working hard on this and getting BETTER. The first step was peeling back protective layers of myself and discovering where my triggers are and what I do in relationship to cause issues like being anxious. Cleaning up my side of the street. So lately when she's avoidant I do my own thing, not think about her not being there for me. In my heart I know I need to move on and let go. I'm going to hint that I'd like to go to therapy. If she goes I'll give her more time. I don't think she knows our relationship is close to falling off a rocky cliff right now.

Another epiphany, just discovered. I have very little self trust. I thought I did. I lie to myself, every day I make promises I easily justify and break. I am not a good friend to myself. I am not accountable to me. I am to others, but not to me. I don't trust me. For instance, I promise myself I'll work out, I don't. If I promise myself I won't eat that cookie. I eat it. So, I set super small easy goals. I told myself I would ride my bike only five minutes a day. I've almost done that every day for a week. I told myself I would exercise 5 minutes a day, that was easy, I did that. I told myself only one bite of a cookie and I have done that. Building trust in myself first, otherwise how can I trust others? Next week no bites of cookies, and exercise 15 minutes a day !! I can do this.

One tidbit of advice I've gleaned from this journey to divorce is:

I cannot control what happens, that includes the behavior of others. I can only control my reaction.

And one thing that stood out in your post is if some dude is saying they are so into you at 2 weeks, or even 2 months, that is way too fast. Baby step into these things. Slow is good, slow is healthy. Communicate clearly if something comes up that bothers you and make the appropriate decision based on that convo.

It would be a damn tragedy if CB ruins relationships for you forever. Please don't let that happen.

Update: Well, I dumped Mr. Good on Paper. It was pretty mutual. Both of us have trust issues, so it was more or less doomed from the start.

I am a big believer in 12 step programs. They don't work for the majority of people, but one saved my life, and I know what it's like to be facing death and unable to even care what happens to you. I was so desperate that I was willing to try anything. And a miracle occurred, and I'm still here. My life is so much better than it was before recovery. And the only thing that changed was ME. My life didn't get better. It got different, to be sure. But I got better at handling it.

Anyway, back to the trust issue. I have had a few (3) first dates. Meh. I know it's a lot of trial and error, but I've had as much error as I have trial. My best friend and I have both started to dive into some research about dating and psychology.

I think I am going to work on being mindfully vulnerable. Come to think of it, I had one relationship, short and very intense, and an odd thing happened that may be telling.

My dad died last year. So when this relationship started, he had only been gone like 6 months. I woke up at 2:00 in the morning in tears. I never do that. And it was one of those dreams when you wake up and it's like you're still in the dream. Of course, I was having a dream about my dad. I couldn't shake it. So I texted Mr. Short and Very Intense, telling him about what was happening to me at that moment. (I knew he worked second shift, and was wide awake.) He called me and talked to me until I calmed down. It was an extremely vulnerable moment for me that had nothing to do with this man. And like a week later, he's in love with me.

I'm not usually a very vulnerable person. I'm a capable person. I'm the one that fixes things. From boo-boos to technical issues, I'm your go-to person on the team. Vulnerable is not my thing.

But I think I need to work on that. Not at work. But in my personal life, I need to work on that. I just need to figure out how to do it. Without becoming a damsel in distress, or crossing emotional or physical boundaries too quickly.

The Cheating Bastard (the CB from here on out) took away my trust in people generally and men specifically.

Your XWH certainly earned your having zero trust in him.

Your lack of trust in people generally and men specifically (other than your XWH) is not justified at all.

My XWW’s betrayal was spectacularly despicable in that she used my unquestioned trust in her as a tool and the very means by which she was able to conduct and maintain her fantasy-land affair behind mine and my childrens backs.

It was really disgusting and the worst of human behavior.

That said, I didn’t use her steaming shit behavior and example to paint the entire population of people and women as not trustable.

Fact is, some you can trust and some you can not trust.

I have absolute zero trust in my XWW.

I have the same ability to trust as I did before her but I now do have the experience of being able to see some red flags that will help me be able to exclude those who exhibit behaviors similar to my XWW.

Your lack of trust should be isolated to your XWH - not everyone else.

Well golly, who knew it was just that easy!

And Baby Albert was only ever scared of that one, white lab rat.

That's not the way human psychology works. Classical Conditioning - look it up.

I am a big believer in 12 step programs. They don't work for the majority of people, but one saved my life, and I know what it's like to be facing death and unable to even care what happens to you. I was so desperate that I was willing to try anything. And a miracle occurred, and I'm still here. My life is so much better than it was before recovery. And the only thing that changed was ME. My life didn't get better. It got different, to be sure. But I got better at handling it.

I was wondering if you were in the program. Congrats on your sobriety - that is huge and you should be VERY proud of yourself!!

On that - my mom just got her 9 years this past January, so I have watched her relationship with AA evolve a lot in those years. She has gone back through the steps over and over and over again with different sponsors, including one who is a man (not sure about where you're at, but here it's generally not done for people to sponsor/sponsee with members of the opposite sex). Every time she has gone through the steps again, she has learned more about her disease, about herself, about her coping mechanisms, and about her relationships with everyone. Going through the steps with different people helps her to gain new perspectives and to discover new things. She is very firm in her sobriety and puts that absolutely first in her life. Maybe it's time for you to find a new sponsor and go through those 12 steps again? Maybe you'll make some new discoveries about you too.

So I'm going to be pissed at the CB until I die (or a miracle occurs and I somehow get over it) because he broke me. Irrevocably and permanently, he broke me.

Maybe you are broken. Maybe you aren't. But point me to one person that isn't damaged by their life to some extent. You can't because the truth is that we are ALL screwed up to some degree - you can't get to adulthood without some baggage. What I DO know for sure is that our brains are really powerful. The messages we tell ourselves have a way of manifesting in our lives - so if you keep telling yourself you're broken, then that is what you'll be. Maybe it's time to try a new tape - you are resilient. You are a survivor. You are a decent person despite being dealt some really shitty cards. Maybe, just maybe, your 'broken' parts have helped to make you a more compassionate and emotionally aware human being.

I get being pissed, I really do. I'm only 3.5 years out and I am still pissed as fuck at mine too. It's a process. But I do know that someday I am gonna have to let that shit go. Because he truth of it is that HIS emotional fuckwittage doesn't have one damn thing to do with ME. And I will NOT allow it to color the rest of MY life or spill into a new relationship when I get to that point. That's allowing him to win and the fuck with that shit. But that means I have to work on me - and it sucks and it isn't fucking fair, but no one ever said life would be.

I want to be ecstatically in love and just be able to fall into my partner. To know he'll be there for me. To feel safe. That he has my six. I want to go back to being optimistic and naïve and trusting.

I don't know about you, but even though HOW I got there, I don't ever actually want to blindly trust again. Blind trust has fucked me up. I want to be able to trust a partner in a way that is healthy for ME. That means that trust is extended... until I have reason not to. And maybe I never have a reason not to, but if something should happen, I know with certainty that I will get through it and that I won't hesitate to make the decisions that are in my best interests.

Also for me, going through the grinder of infidelity helped me to remove a lot of bullshit from my life. I found out who my true friends were and THOSE are the ones that I know have got my back. So I care less about finding that sort of feeling with an SO because I already have people in my life that serve in that capacity. If I find a great SO/partner down the road that would be awesome, but I won't ever settle for less again. Those are hard lessons, but I'm glad I learned them.

So all of that to say - how do you trust again? You trust YOU first and foremost. You trust that you can make the hard calls. You trust that you will get through tough times. And you trust that if you stick to your boundaries and stand up for yourself that you will land where you're supposed to eventually.

I too have no more ability to trust and I'm not sure I want to be vulnerable in trusting another again. If most humans weren't so messed up this probably would be a little easier. I have dabbled in some OLD and am currently in a 6 month (I don't even know what it is seems like FWB and he throws out ILU's once in a while ). So I don't have much advice except that I'm cynical AF and have every reason to be after the relationships I've chosen in my life (all were abusive in some way).

So I am going to just stick with trusting myself. People have proven to me over and over again they cannot be trusted. I will trust when people have shown me that over and over again over time.

[This message edited by crazyblindsided at 5:52 PM, Thursday, April 28th]

I know I'm a hopeless romantic... but I would say don't let the bastards get you down. That deep trust and vulnerability and connection- it's so worth it.

You don't only hurt yourself by not trusting, but the future people you date. Hurt people hurt people.

You can even look at it like the cheater "wins" if you can't go onto a healthy romantic relationship. Don't let them rob you of that happiness.

Perhaps IC would help?

I trust people until they show me that they don't deserve it. New people haven't done me wrong, and you can push some wonderful people away if you treat them like people who don't deserve trust. I mean don't immediately dive into vulnerability with a new person but over time, it should get easier.

[This message edited by PSTI at 12:38 PM, April 28th (Thursday)]

My biggest breakthrough over the years was reclaiming my ability to trust - my ex and I were married for 9 wonderful years and had 2 children already by the time he feel down the rabbit hole of addiction which culminated in year 16 with him cheating and me finally leaving.

My therapist and I worked on my thinking and self-talk instead of focusing on "getting over" the betrayal from my ex. She would remind me that if I learned to trust myself then I could learn to trust others again. I worked for years on this before dipping my toe into the dating pool. Did I meet some men that made my Red Flag Radar twitch? Sure did. And I had zero regrets walking away the first time that happened. Then I met My Man. The one that has shown me that not all men are my ex. His exwife is a lot like my exhusband, and My Man has also been through tons of therapy to get on better footing emotionally - he did this way before we ever met. Now we are 2 healed people working towards a lovely future together. We've been together almost 2yrs now and I trust him with my whole heart.

If My Man turned out to be like the others, I trust myself enough to know that I will be just fine. Having a wonderful relationship is just a bonus in my now wonderful life. I will never identify by my relationship and I love my life with or without a relationship.

Good luck.

I have walked in similar shoes to yours. My first husband cheated on me with at least 11 women that he told me about before I divorced him. He was physically and emotion and mentally abusive.

I remarried. The second husband cheated on me and the circumstances of that landed him in a situation where I don't have to worry about seeing his face for another 8 years, and then only to keep him where he is currently. I forgive him because it is in my belief system to do so and so that I can move on with my life, but for 17 years now, since we divorced, I have no idea how to trust ANYONE in my life to the point where I think they won't hurt me, won't leave me, won't walk away from me.

Additionally, my health is tanking. I have autoimmune disease, lipedema from hormone imbalance that was caused by a genetic variant that no one bothered to check me for, compounded by another genetic variant that is in multiple other family members and as of late, have lost about 75% of my hair for unknown reasons. My chances of ever finding a Mr. Right have pretty much flown the coop unless GOD decides he will send me a knight in shining armor, but there are so many side issues of the autoimmune disease that my ability to enjoy my husband or even for him to enjoy me in certain ways has been mostly taken from me. And then there is the issue where just about everyone I know has walked away from me because of the 2nd husband, that I had nothing to do with but was unfortunate to have been naive and married him. He betrayed me so very horribly and there is nothing I can do to restore my trust in humanity again.

I have never stooped to drinking or substance use, but I feel like my heart has been shattered in a million pieces and I will end up alone and broken and unwanted by anyone because of my health issues. I sit here and cry as I type this... I know the pain... I am so very sorry for your situation and hope you find resolution. I pray every day that GOD will change my life, heal my body, provide me a husband that won't leave me and won't hurt me.

Thank you all for your perspectives. I have been doing a lot of thinking on this subject.

I never considered the concept of trusting me. I should. After all, I successfully raised two sons, hold down a pretty technical job, care for my aging mother, and run her household for us both. I am not afraid of doing difficult things. Last year, I had a man tell me that I could not take a 15' rental truck on a 10 hour road trip, pack up my house, then come back in 48 hours. I was like, "WATCH ME," and off I went. Telling me I can't do something is a direct challenge to me. BTW, I did it. F that guy!

But what I do have is a vicious internal speak that kicks in whenever I get hit with a bout of depression. Man, can I be mean to me! Is that evil voice inside of me what I really believe about me deep down inside? Or is it a horrible liar trying to take me down? I always listened to exes when they told me I was less than. I think I'm going to tell my vicious internal speak to STFU the next time it shows up. Let's see how that goes!

So, to update you on the saga that is me trying to trust more. I met a wonderful man that is the polar opposite of the previous man I dated. With more distance and perspective, I am starting to see that the latest ex did not do much to instill trust. And I bought right into it. Uh, when I see a red flag, I need to cut that shit short. I don't think that my habit of ending things when they don't feel right is as bad a thing as I thought it was. Yes, I'm terrified when I do it. BUT I think I am most terrified of ending up emotionally tied to the wrong man. I get scared when I see that he's not, and end it.

Do I think the perfect guy is out there? I seriously doubt it. But does that mean I have to settle? ABSOLUTELY NOT. I'd rather be alone than settle. And I'm OK alone. I have a small circle of friends to keep me company. And those are the few people that I trust in the world.

But I'm currently all swoony over the new guy. He just texted me that I am the perfect woman. Little does he know! But I know I will soon go into the phase where I find out things that are wrong with him, as he will with me. Then we get to decide if they are things we're willing to accept. I tell him that I don't want to remarry. He says nothing back and does not provide his perspective on the topic. I would like to know if he's in agreement or if he's looking for a wife, but I don't want to push it. He talks about a previous five year relationship. If he wanted to remarry, wouldn't he have proposed to her after a few years?

I mean, I would like us to be headed towards a long-term committed healthy trusting relationship. But do I feel the need to get the legal system involved? Oh hell no. But if anyone could make me change my mind about that, it would be him.

And Codermom, I want you to know especially that I get where you are. I've survived three fatal diseases in my life, and while everything has been crashing around me, I'm silently screaming, "I'm still in here!," as my body betrays me. Trust that YOU, the inner you, the light that you are, will survive all of this crap. Have hope honey, and know that as long as you don't let your spirit die, you still have a chance to recover. It sucks, I know. But stay strong, because really, falling apart is not a viable option. You can do it. (((((Hugs)))))

ETA: Y'all are right. F the CB. He's not going to take away my ability to trust. I just have to find somebody worthy of it, and will resist the urge to bolt.

[This message edited by Solarchick at 1:10 AM, Thursday, May 5th]

Whelp, I just did it again. I set the whole place on fire and burnt down the entire f'ing relationship. But to my defense, there were like five red flags just flapping in the wind. Maybe I'm just a male slut magnet.

Sorry, but I have been cheated on way past my quota in this life, and I'm not going to get within 50 miles of a guy I can't trust.

Here were the red flags:
1. His location on his PoF profile said San Antonio, TX the last time I looked. Guess who's leaving for San Antonio to go see his daughter tomorrow? He bought a 1-way ticket and does not know when he will be back. She'll be home from her internship in July.
2. There was a UPSP box on his kitchen counter last weekend with his address, and some woman's name on it that he had never mentioned.
3. He has 2 deer mounted in his house. One of them has a little brass plate on it. His last name matched, but the first did not. Who the hell is Kevin? He told me his name is Sam.
4. When we discussed his San Antonio trip 3 weeks ago, he asked me to go with him. Then he bought one ticket, and did not even mention it to me before doing so. Sooooo, I guess I'm no longer invited.
5. (This one's for grownups only, so if you don't want to know the details, skip this one) There was a raw spot on his, well, you know. I hadn't been there for a week, so I know I didn't cause it. (Although I did leave him with one the weekend before. Heh heh heh.)

I don't know, y'all tell me. Was I unreasonable to end it? I just did not want to stress out the entire time he was away wondering. Plus, I did not get a great vibe the last time I saw him. Something was off. So I let him go have a VERY good time in San Antonio.