Newest Member: Strugglinglady

Just Found Out :
Is reconciliation possible after really long term affair?

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PSTI ( member #53103) posted at 4:58 PM on Thursday, October 7th, 2021

9 years, mind blowing. In a way you've been in a polyamorous marriage. You're the first wife, he's had a 2nd and a 3rd wife.

SnowToArmPits- this is in NO way shape or form a polyamorous marriage. Cheating is not polyamory. Polyamory requires informed consent.

OP's husband is a cheater, plain and simple. Zeta did not agree to her husband fucking several one night stands nor to him having long term affairs!!!

[This message edited by PSTI at 11:06 AM, October 7th (Thursday)]

Me: BW, my xH left me & DS after a 14 year marriage for the AP in 2014.

Happily remarried and in an open/polyamorous relationship. DH (married 3 years) & DBF (dating 2 years). Cohabitating happily all together!! <3

posts: 715   ·   registered: May. 6th, 2016
id 8691987
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 ZetaCephei (original poster new member #79378) posted at 10:32 AM on Tuesday, October 12th, 2021

Just a short update. Not much has happened in the last week. I still live day by day, some days are OK, others not so much. I even started studying.

My WH started IC two weeks ago. He chose a therapist who is supposed to be specialized in infidelity and betrayal. He said the first session was good, except for a strange comment from the C, when he told him, that he has disclosed all of his affairs and details to me. Supposedly, WH shouldn't have told me about ONSs or about the details, because this only hurts me and was of no real importance to him. And telling me just unburdened WH and caused me additional pain. So in a way he supports, not directly lying, but lying by omission. Other than that, he had some good suggestions on how to proceed and how to support me, but this was a huge red flag.

Last week we went there together, not for MC, just for me to check him out and for the possibility for me having IC with him as well. I had some hope that WH somehow misunderstood him. But it was a disaster. First, the C tried to persuade me, that there was something wrong in my marriage besides the cheating, that I must have missed something else and we had other problems prior to the cheating. And as I kept telling, I was happy before the affairs and I had no problems, not related to the betrayal, the therapist outwardly told me, he didn't belive me. Why would I be lying about that in counselling? I was actually happy before WH started the first LTA and for some time after, when I was still more or less clueless. Things were bad in the last few years, but they were bad because of the cheating and not some other underlying problems. I can accept that WH was cheating because he had issues, either with himself or our relationship, but why insisting I was missing something in our marriage as well?

Then I told the therapist, I disagree with him about omitting the details of the infidelity and that I believe I have the right to know everything I feel I need to. He actually said, that the details were not my business, they were my husband's and his APs and I have no right to ask for them. mad Even my WH doesn't agree with this. I should not dwell on the past, but concentrate on our marriage in the future. And when I said I need to know who I am staying with if I decide to stay, the answer was, we should then talk about my husband and his feelings and not in detail about his past actions. WTF?

Next, he told me the MOW didn' do anything to me, so I shouldn't feel anger, hate or resentment towards her and telling her husband about the affair is none of my business. She fucked my husband for 9 years, tried to break us apart, even though she is married too, just to have him all for herself, she drove across the town to his second job to fuck him after he broke it off with her after D-day, just to change his mind. They never did it in his office before, she is too classy for that, but I guess desperate times called for desperate measures. And after he finally got his head out of his behind and told her they were really over and refused more makeup sex, she was still coming back to him complaining about how she was treated and how ugly the breakup was and how he ruined her vacation. But no, she didn't do anything to me. And yes, I know WH is mostly to blame, but she played her part and I will hate her as much as I want to and no therapist will tell me otherwise.

And in the end,when I said no decent person does things like that to another human being, the answer was, that my standards about this and about lying were too high and very little people could measure up. And that WH tried to, but couldn't follow up in the end.

Needless to say, I am not going back and I don't think WH is either. It is his decision, but even he found the counsellor's views very strange. Not that the C was wrong about everything, he made some good comments, he said some things that made sense and made me and WH think and we did and will again discuss them at home. But the above I cannot accept.

To make my day perfect, the second LTAP contacted WH via e-mail. He ended things with her in July after Dday, just by a short text and then met with her in person a month ago to tell her there can't be anything between them any more. This was before I knew she even existed. Obviously, he wasn't convincing enough, so she contacted him last week, he sent a NC message and she begged him again to meet her in person. He sent another NC, telling her I know everything and if she contacts him again, the replay will come from me. I hope she gets it this time.

Is is a good thing that he told me about her messages? I know every instinct told him not to, but he says he is done hiding anything from me. I don't belive him yet, but maybe it is a good sign?

[This message edited by ZetaCephei at 10:54 AM, Tuesday, October 12th]

posts: 11   ·   registered: Sep. 8th, 2021
id 8692756
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Cooley2here ( member #62939) posted at 11:53 AM on Tuesday, October 12th, 2021

This so called therapist sounds very dangerous. He sounds like he is pro husband and anti-wife. You need to get your husband out of there ASAP. Your marriage is hanging on by a thread and this guy is going to take a pair of scissors and cut it. There are no excuses for your husband’s behavior, that’s the first thing, and the second thing is you have the right to know everything that was done to your marriage by your husband. Please please don’t go back to this man. If your husband does then It seems to me that he could care less about your happiness. I question why you stay in this marriage. Still, it’s up to you whether you reconcile or divorce, but demand any therapist be healthy. Believe it or not there are some dangerous people claiming to be counselors. Be on your guard.

[This message edited by Cooley2here at 11:55 AM, Tuesday, October 12th]

To thine own self be true. Shakespeare

posts: 2954   ·   registered: Mar. 5th, 2018   ·   location: US
id 8692757
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Walkthestorm ( new member #72157) posted at 12:09 PM on Tuesday, October 12th, 2021

Stay away from this therapist. He will cause you more traumma. His approach is damaging not just for you but for your WS as well.

Next time you choose a MC or IC for that matter, before signing up, ask them about their approach/method of helping their clients with issues surrounding infidelity (as if they are treating WS or BS or rebuilding M). Set it up as an interview of sorts.

posts: 42   ·   registered: Nov. 26th, 2019
id 8692758
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Walkthestorm ( new member #72157) posted at 12:12 PM on Tuesday, October 12th, 2021

It is a good sign you WS told you about the second OW reaching out. Discuss with him how to respond next time this happends be it OW1 or OW2.

Does OW1 H know about the affair?

posts: 42   ·   registered: Nov. 26th, 2019
id 8692759
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 ZetaCephei (original poster new member #79378) posted at 12:48 PM on Tuesday, October 12th, 2021

I definitely will not be going back to this therapist and my husband says he won't either. To be fair, the therapist did say the affair was 100% WH's fault, but then at the end made that comment about my too high moral standards. Luckily these two sessions were just us checking him out and we haven't signed up for anything more. Anyway is it OK to have the same IC or not? I have nothing to hide and have no problem with this and my H says the same. I can see some advantages to therapist knowing both sides, but are there downsides as well?

It is a good sign you WS told you about the second OW reaching out. Discuss with him how to respond next time this happends be it OW1 or OW2.

Does OW1 H know about the affair?

We did talk about it and I told him I expect him to tell me about any contact with any of them, even if my reaction is not positive. It is positive that he is finally trying to be honest, but them reaching out bothers me. And I want that we deal with any contact together. He claims he intends to do so, but time will tell. He also told me about the last couple of times OW1 reached out to him and what she said, before he shut her down and told her he can't be talking with her any more. The last time she was really pissed, because their boss came to her and told her WH asked not to be assigned to any projects with her because of personal reasons. Of course I can't be sure he is telling the truth and isn't talking, texting or doing anything else behind my back.

And the OW1 an OW2 don't know about each other.

[This message edited by ZetaCephei at 1:05 PM, Tuesday, October 12th]

posts: 11   ·   registered: Sep. 8th, 2021
id 8692766
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Babette2008 ( member #69126) posted at 2:46 PM on Tuesday, October 12th, 2021

It’s definitely a good thing that your H is letting you know when he is being contacted by the OW. Its important because keeping secrets and avoiding hard conversations with you are habits that he will have to break for your marriage to have any chance.

posts: 230   ·   registered: Dec. 14th, 2018
id 8692782
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sisoon ( Guide #31240) posted at 3:42 PM on Tuesday, October 12th, 2021

In general, it's not a good idea to use the same therapist as your partner does, because if a conflict of interest arises, it's generally impossible for the IC to serve both of you simultaneously. With infidelity, a conflict of interest is part of the mix from the start, so it's generally a terrible idea.

Some therapists actually can serve both at the same time, but those therapists are rare.

I read you to say neither of you will use this idiot. That's a great decision. Don't second-guess yourself.

[This message edited by sisoon at 3:43 PM, Tuesday, October 12th]

fBH (me) - on d-day: 66, Married 43, together 45, same sex ap
DDay - 12/22/2010
Recover'd and R'ed
You don't have to like your boundaries. You just have to set and enforce them.

posts: 26159   ·   registered: Feb. 18th, 2011   ·   location: Illinois
id 8692793
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BluerThanBlue ( member #74855) posted at 3:53 PM on Tuesday, October 12th, 2021

Edit1: Kudos to you for taking this counselor to task. I think it would also great that your husband witnessed your willingness to advocate for yourself and your zero tolerance for bullshit, even from a so-called professional.

Edit2: I know you recognize this but just to reiterate: you should not be in MC right now; it's too soon. The wrong MC (as you just got a sample of) can make your situation 1000 times worse. Also, cheaters frequently use the therapeutic setting of MC as a safe space to lie to and manipulate their BS as well as learn the correct "vocabulary" for conveying remorse without actually changing their ways.

You need an individual counselor who will focus solely on your interests and your mental health, and help you come to a decision about whether you want to even look into the possibility of reconciliation with a man who robbed you of the past 9 years of your life. Edit3: When you interview therapists, clearly state what your goals are, ask them about their methods, and ask for their insights for how they benchmark therapeutic progress and success.

[This message edited by BluerThanBlue at 3:57 PM, Tuesday, October 12th]

BW, age 40
Divorced WH in 2015; now happily remarried to a great guy

I edit my comments a lot for spelling, grammar, typos, etc.

posts: 505   ·   registered: Jul. 13th, 2020
id 8692797
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nekonamida ( member #42956) posted at 4:18 PM on Tuesday, October 12th, 2021

I have to ask - what good could your WH get out of an IC who has completely different views about the root causes of his infidelity? He's not just there to learn how to support you. He's there to address his issues that allowed him to cheat for this long and with this many women. His IC just isn't up to that task if he still believes it has anything to do with the marriage. Unless your WH didn't tell him about OW2, what sense would that make anyways? The marriage is bad so he went to OW1 and that was bad so he went to OW2. That alone should make his IC realize how poor coping mechanisms and wanting more was the likely culprit instead of whatever was going on in the marriage. He can't stick with this IC when it comes to digging deep and fixing himself. And if he doesn't do that, he's at high risk of cheating again once things calm down with you.

posts: 5024   ·   registered: Mar. 31st, 2014   ·   location: United States
id 8692800
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HardKnocks ( member #70957) posted at 4:58 PM on Tuesday, October 12th, 2021

You have the right to interview the therapist about their views regarding the presenting problem prior to scheduling. Exercise that right as many times as is necessary.

Good luck!

ETA: Best to have your own IC who can help you advocate for your own best interests.

[This message edited by HardKnocks at 11:01 AM, October 12th (Tuesday)]

BW 30 year marriage.
DDay2 2/20 5 month EA/PA
Recovering

posts: 322   ·   registered: Jul. 7th, 2019
id 8692812
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gmc94 ( member #62810) posted at 1:01 AM on Thursday, October 14th, 2021

My WH and I shared an IC for awhile. I don't recommend it.

If I had to start from day 1 all over, I would insist on joining my WH to interview any IC he was considering - and afford him the same opportunity to meet with any IC I was considering. My WH's 1st IC's website "professional" photo was of her in some tropical locale, wearing a shirt that showed the same kind of cleavage I'd expect to see in a pop star's poster. I referred to her as "booby shrink". I never met her, but she had similar sentiments of the IC you describe.

I would educate myself on relational betrayal trauma before "interviewing" an IC for myself or my WH. Including the 2-part interview with Marnie Breecker on "The Addicted Mind" podcast, and all the interviews with dr Omar Minwalla, and whatever I had time for on Helping Couples Heal.

I would ask their thoughts on the 'successful rebuilder" list from How to Help Your Spouse Heal. IIRC, that includes answering ALL of the BS' questions... I KNOW it includes "keep no secrets" (I looked in the book- chapter 3 says if the A comes to light via discovery [vs voluntary disclosure], they "willingly tell the truth without their spouses needing to pry it out of them". The books "the List" BEGINS with voluntary disclosure as #1... #2 is willingly telling the truth if the A is discovered via another way).

I would ask if they agree that being a BS is a trauma, and to provide the nature/extent of their training and experience with PTSD.

M >25yrs/grown kids
DD1 1994 ONS prostitute
DD2 2018 exGF1 10+yrEA & 10yrPA... + exGF2 EA forever & "made out" 2017
9/18 WH hung himself- died but revived

It's rude to say "I love you" with a mouthful of lies

posts: 3441   ·   registered: Feb. 22nd, 2018
id 8693066
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cgreene ( member #55644) posted at 11:39 PM on Tuesday, October 19th, 2021

[This message edited by cgreene at 11:50 PM, Tuesday, October 19th]

posts: 59   ·   registered: Oct. 17th, 2016   ·   location: uk
id 8694068
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Trdd ( member #65989) posted at 11:44 PM on Wednesday, October 20th, 2021

Well, I 'd kind of like to slip that therapist a note. I'm not sure which one to give him though:

A) a well laid out argument against his recommendations

Or

B) tell him that he needs a bit of an ass whoopin' and there are plenty of volunteers for the role at SI. The line starts right behind me.

posts: 359   ·   registered: Aug. 27th, 2018   ·   location: US
id 8694256
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