SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Good point Sunspot.

Be ready and accept if your WW is surprised or denies having intentionally turned off location services. The issue then becomes what she does next.

I’m all about the WS offering and suggesting what they can do for us. Rather than tell her to activate location services and phoning in every hour on the hour then let her suggest what she can do to give you assurances. For example: if she’s on a business trip can she share her agenda so you know where she’s supposed to be at what time? That plus the location info might be assuring.

Once you start paying attention you will find alcohol Is in many stories here on SI. Where I live we are covered up with meth but the arrest reports still show DUIs. Meth addicts drive themselves over a cliff so fast that theirs is a different issue. Drinking starts out as a way to relax with people. Over time it can be the main focus of parties. It’s the reason cheating happens among friends. It the reason you said no. You recognized what would happen.....it always does. Everyone gives themselves permission to get drunk because one person has agreed to be an adult. I recommend losing the alcohol.

Please to be aware that this view is the infidelity mindset. I am not saying she is cheating. But the frame of mind that she embraced that let her cheat is exactly this frame of mind. It is the core thinking that allows many supposedly fWS's to continue to heap infidelity trauma on their BS, even if no cheating is taking place. It does not "seem" self-centered, it is her still very real self-centerdness. It is not is seems. Empathy is incompatible with both her suggestion and how she reacted to your reaction. R is not possible without empathy from the cheater.

This. 1000 times this.

R is not possible without empathy.

And your description of her recent behavior is not showing empathy.

I am so cynical that I an Adulteress woman commits to her husband fully ever again and I am even more suspicious when Betrayad husband takes her in his arm and makes love to her after knowing that she allowed herself to be so utterly defiled by another man.

I became a tainted man in July of 1997. That love you had is dead and your attempt to blast passed all of it is of as much use as dancing on a corpse (sometimes when drunk you might think you are topping Micheal Jackson, while in the merely soiling you shoes with detritus.

Neither of you had done anywhere enough IC and rug-sweeping just sweeps this hideous carcass under the mat where it will rot and gather strength from your life-force, until It's time for the putrid carcass to rise again, Uncover itself from under the rug to rip this fragile fantasy apart.

freefaller, she is not safe, not by a long-shot. Beware the Ides of March or any day ending in -day. There are quite a few bombs of truth to be dropped on you.

Personally, but I'm as stone-hearted as they come, I will not even consider R with an adulteress woman. Should I truly entertain the thought for more than a fleeting moment, the contents of my stomach evacuates itself in a bilious mess or at the very least I dry-heave.

Do not get caught in a Purgatory, give yourself a deadline, a hard-line when you commit to D or R. Being stuck with a lying cheating Adulteress by your own choice comes with consequences, unacceptable to myself. Never even a first chance, PA means hit the road.

But now that you chose to stay with the enemy, Cover you 6, because I am wholly unimpressed by her effort and self-awareness so far.

Then again, different strokes for different folk.

Strength to you!

[This message edited by DictumVeritas at 9:47 PM, September 24th (Thursday)]

Housekeeping: Not sure if I need to move to another forum? Does this thread get moved or should I just start a new one

somewhere else?

You're not required to move your thread, but if you want to avoid some of the ugly diatribes you're currently hearing, you might do well to open a new thread in Reconciliation. There, you can still get advice while being clear with where you are in your healing journey. That's not to say you won't get any poo-flingers, but if so, you can report their antics as unwanted.

In regards to turning off location, is it something like the mute switch where you can accidentally turn it off and not know it or is it like airplane mode where you need to make an effort to turn it off or on.

If she had to go two or three menus in then there's a problem...45 minute drive is nothing for a bootycall.

I can only go by what you post so I may not be getting an accurate idea of what is going on between you and your wife. My comments are based on what I have read. I would not trust your wife at all. She should be begging for forgiveness and working hard to get the marriage back on track. She doesn't seem to be doing that from what I have read. She should have immediately jettisoned C. Going drinking and getting totally hammered with her friends while you basically had to watch on a night you guys were to be alone is another red flag. Finally, I just reread your story and saw that she was on Tinder. Aside from the affair, she was hot to trot with someone. Giant red flag regardless of whether she met someone. I wish you the best. You have a tough road ahead of you. But I would not give your wife any quarter. She has to be 100 percent behind R if and when you decide to go that route. I would keep D front and center and make sure she knows it. It's all up to her. If she substantially waivers, pull the plug. Be careful, don't be a fool like me, and throw years down the drain with an unworthy partner. Two last thoughts. No MC at all until R has been fully established. Consider a P.I. and/or polygraph down the road when the time is right. The 45-minute silence on the tracker is disturbing.

[This message edited by src9043 at 6:37 PM, September 24th (Thursday)]

Freefaller, a word about 'C'.

The Bible is replete with those who cause others to stumble or fall. They are considered worse than those who fall. So long as 'C' is in her life, she is in danger. Along those same lines, there's an old saying- 'show me your friends and I'll show you your future'.

If those two are going to have type of relationship I think I can state there will always be trouble.

I’ve heard about location services accidentally being turned off in iPhone but it’s rare. Not sure about the Android thing. Either way it’s odd and at least from what OP reports his WW did nothing at all to assuage his anxiety other than silently assenting and turning it back on. Shifty behavior if we’re getting the straight dope.

Add to this the weirdness around the friend C - which is really a much bigger red flag and I’m not seeing a WW really working on getting it.

Sorry if that rains on the happy clappy parade.

[This message edited by Thumos at 5:47 PM, September 24th (Thursday)]

If you really wanted to have some fun and screw with your WW a little you could sign up for a Life 360 subscription and ask her to download the app and enable it at all times. No need to constantly be Mr Nice Guy! 😎

[This message edited by Thumos at 6:45 PM, September 24th (Thursday)]

Is this really the life you want???????

Sorry OP but a wrong implementation of 180 results in nome other than a subtle pick me dance. From what you have written, all the effort is still coming from you. I hope you have what it takes to do the real 180 because it is clearly not working.

The steps on an iPhone are go to Settings, click on Privacy, click on Location Services, turn it off for all Location Services or go one more click into Share My Location and turn it off there. Seems hard to do accidentally so if she has an iPhone it was on purpose. I don't know about Android.

If she did it on purpose there is frankly no excuse that makes any sense in your current situation other than she was going to see the AP. I guess conceivably she was just messing with you but in either scenario you shouldn't out up with this treatment.

I think the writing is on the wall with this one! She is not safe at all. There is no real remorse.. just sorry she got caught. Her small lies testify to that and those tiny compromises will eventually turn into a big one after she convinces herself that its a just a little one... or just this one time...

My advise... dont sleep with her, dont touch her. Despite a her good intentions she will eventually betray you again... the signals are a warning to you. Ignore them at your own peril!

[This message edited by VinST at 1:01 PM, September 27th (Sunday)]

Yeah. Yep. This is the path I went down. My WW started off with a full court press towards R but, couldn't sustain the effort. Her patience began to progressively deteriorate about a month or two in. She too would pull totally inconsiderate bonehead moves like yours just did, interrupting an intimate date night that was intended to help you two reconnect, so that she could hang with friends and you watch her have fun. Probably, because she was getting board already with the intimate date night and the whole pain in the ass R thang.

WOW...

She needs to be concentrating on you, and you only. You're in Intensive Care, on full life support, requiring one-on-one nursing care and she's already wanting to go out and party with friends. Lame.

And then she punishes you by sulking all the way home. She's bummed you ruined HER evening. It's all about her. A sense of entitlement?

My WW also had a totally complicit friend. She resented me for imposing NC and this would eventually become the final nail in the coffin.

My WW just didn't get it. Didn't appreciate the enormity of our situation. She didn't realize that her "friend" was really no friend at all. No genuine friend with any kind of integrity would EVER let someone they cared about become an adulteress and destroy their family, damage their career, get an STD, and screw over their husband in the worst possible way. She just didn't get that.

And she never will.

If your WW does not take the initiative and fully, proactively and whole heartedly commit to D and all it's very reasonable, fundamental and universal requirements, R will not work.

How dare she lay a guilt trip on you about C. That is totally unacceptable.

She is not appreciating the very fleeting, precious and fragile gift of R that you are offering her. She does not appreciate the HUGE leap of faith you are making. The sacrifices you are making. The enormous gamble.

My WW constantly, progressively and very insidiously made moves to test the boundaries and conditions and return to normal as quickly as she could get away with. Her end game was to eventually rug sweep the whole thing into oblivion as if it never happened.

If you continue to R, watch her very closely. She should be on her best behavior on and off stage. I caught my supposedly remorseful WW shit talking me and bitching about her situation to her complicit BF multiple times. She's being tested now and you don't want to miss the results and you don't want to taint the results.

Yeah. Yep. This is the path I went down. My WW started off with a full court press towards R but, couldn't sustain the effort. Her patience began to progressively deteriorate about a month or two in. She too would pull totally inconsiderate bonehead moves like yours just did, interrupting an intimate date night that was intended to help you two reconnect, so that she could hang with friends and you watch her have fun. Probably, because she was getting board already with the intimate date night and the whole pain in the ass R thang.

This was my identical situation after d-day 2. By month 3 of actual real NC my WH was tired of dealing with the "new me" (the new me being the person who was destroyed by his A) and went back to his AP for the 3rd time. He thought it should go something like this:

Dday 2 (A underground for a year after d-day 1 with only short periods of NC): Him = caught, silent, begging for a chance to undo his "mistake"

Week to 2/3 weeks post dday: Me = allowed to be upset and unhappy when I found out (who wouldn't); Him = happy I am still speaking to him at all, this can be better, we can be better

Week 3 to end of month 2: Me = should be acknowledging his "improvements" and not so sad, as he is back, and I "win" but much to his chagrin I am still upset, asking questions, feeling down; Him = irritated that I look so down, annoyed that I don't trust him or at least seem like I want to, still "trying to be happy" but it seems "pointless" because I am "ruminating" about his A, that I should believe (because he told me) is over and done with

Month 3: Me = trying to get on with my day to day life, but the A still comes on our agreed upon times to talk about it and he is miserable on those days (2 nights a week - was my therapist's suggestion and I'm glad we did it that way as it forced me to choose to stop dealing with it 24/7 which was not healthy for me); Him = this will never end because you want to punish me for my A, and you are taking pleasure or at least feel entitled to harass me forever about this when I have been trying to make this work with you.

Month 4: Me = same place as month 3; Him = fuck it, I (me) will "never get over this" and returns to AP who has made no secret that she is waiting for him with open arms (and legs)

That pattern, or some form of it, is fairly common I think, the only difference being in month 4 some don't return to the AP and instead start their search for greener pastures and want to run from the pasture they burned to the ground because getting it to return to some sort of form it used to be seems impossible/to much work/requires them to actually think about their part in the mess that is the ruins of their marriage/partnership.

[This message edited by ThisIsSoLonely at 9:42 AM, September 28th (Monday)]

Hiya, Freefaller.

Just a point to ponder. Turning location tracking on or off is kind of a pain on my phone. You have to know where to go in settings, what slider to switch on or off and such. Which indicates YOU HAD TO THINK ABOUT IT TO DO IT. As in, she made that conscious decision to make herself untraceable for that trip, at least. She cannot claim this was a "mistake" or a "glitch". I certainly hope you didn't buy that excuse if she tried it. You're too smart for that. I'm not fixating on this deliberately but if I wanted to hunt for red flags, that would be one for me. WHY did she turn it off? If she responded "I felt uncomfortable being tracked".. well, then, why would she? What would make her uncomfortable having her husband know where she was, if she was out of the affair fog? That would give me pause, if I were you.

So you are getting lots of hysterical bonding sex, going out on dates and she seems remorseful. In return for that, just within two weeks, she's pushed back on being transparent, lied about contacting a friend who is no friend of your marriage-- and pushed back against your explicit boundary to not have that person in your life any more, and hidden responses on issues she explicitly agreed to as a boundary line.

How do you feel about progress, so far? Have you asked her if she has had any contact (sending or receiving) with the actual AP yet?

[This message edited by KingofNothing at 11:46 AM, September 28th (Monday)]

The most important thing is don't let her know everything that you do know about her cheating. If you reveal everything she can gaslight you on it. Try not to let her know who the Ap is. This way when she denies everything you can monitor him also to get more evidence on her. Don't let her know that you know about "C" helping her. Tell her the minimum. See how she responds. Your doing good on getting info on her but you will need more. She will be more cautious after you have your talk. Do you think she will fly off the hook at you or try to reassure you she's not doing anything wrong? She has a bad influence helping her "C" Be very cautious if you run into "C" somewhere. don't say a word to her.

Her location services were turned off. This was deliberate. No coincidence her AP was a short drive away.

Obviously she fears no consequences and likely all you really have is a false reconciliation to work with.

How many more chances do you wish to give her?

Were I you, I would get the divorce moving. I wouldn't waste further time or energy on your wayward wife.

Just checking in on you.

How are you doing?