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Newest Member: FallingApartAtTheSeams

I Can Relate :
Betrayed Womenz Thread - Part 4

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gmc94 ( Guide #62810) posted at 12:51 AM on Saturday, August 28th, 2021

I think if I spend too much time thinking about his horrible behavior every day that I am just wallowing in the pain and not moving forward. I know I have read a lot of article, blogs comments etc that say that is never a good way to recover from this.

Yeah, it SUCKS. And.... describing it as "wallowing" may not, IMHO, be compassionate to YOURSELF. So, maybe you are "wallowing" or maybe you are "processing", the point is that it takes time and a lot of hard effing work to heal & recover from infidelity. I'm 'only' 18 months further in this journey and I still think of my WH's cheating all the time (and I also get nauseous at the thought). I'm told there may come a day when I don't think about it... but that's not happened yet and I'm not banking on it.
For me, getting myself out of a victim mentality helped, along with a lot of trauma work, meditation, finding and incorporating joy (outside of my M) as much as I can, and really not giving a damn about my WH has helped (FWIW, my WH hasn't done jack to change himself, is not R material, and I'm really just taking my time to get the D ducks in a row).

I'd say it took at least two full years of grieving the M I thought I had (my WH's cheating, whether EA or PA, our entire M) and the chasm between who I thought my WH was and who he really is. Now that I really SEE him and his selfishness and emotional cowardice, I guess it kind of shifted. Today, I see MY value and the ways in which I am the "prize" here. And I suppose coming to that place changed my perspective - why should I be sad about losing a M that did not include the basics of respect and honesty? Or losing a spouse that never (and to this day) really trusted ME with his inner thoughts? (which is really rich given that HE's the one that cheated and since dday has not shown himself to be trustworthy).

You've talked about your WH making changes with things like acts of service (which my WH is an Olympic level champion at), what is he doing WRT helping heal this grief?

And OutofLove? I'd go with the "universe is showing me something" line of thought. I find it comforting to think that the pain I'm experiencing today is paving the way for something amazing in the future. Ain't easy (no one says it is), and working THROUGH it all feels pretty effing good on the other side.

Hugs to you both.

M >25yrs/grown kids
DD1 1994 ONS prostitute
DD2 2018 exGF1 10+yrEA & 10yrPA... + exGF2 EA forever & "made out" 2017
9/18 WH hung himself- died but revived

It's rude to say "I love you" with a mouthful of lies

posts: 3826   ·   registered: Feb. 22nd, 2018
id 8685914
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LadyG ( member #74337) posted at 2:55 AM on Thursday, September 9th, 2021

Hi ladies,

It’s been a while.

I survived August. It was hard but I feel like I have made a breakthrough. September is another challenging month.

The narcissist never changes though.

We sold a property at the end of August and in true Narc fashion all Stbxwh can think of is his share of the money.
When I remind him that I put in like 70% to purchase the property some 10 years ago, he gets nasty, even though I am splitting the profits with him 50/50.

I think I mentioned earlier that he admitted that he hid 300k from me, only coming clean due to his illness. Not that it matters, but WH is slowly improving. Still has treatment but is on the mend.

We are still in Covid lockdown and will be till December.

I get vaccinated tomorrow, finally!

Hope you are doing well despite everything.

Hugs to you all.

LadyG

September 26 1987 I married a monster. Slowly healing from Complex PTSD. I Need Peace. Fiat Lux. Buddha’s Love Saves Me 🙏🏼

posts: 953   ·   registered: Apr. 29th, 2020   ·   location: Australia
id 8687645
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20yrsagoBS ( member #55272) posted at 2:55 AM on Friday, September 10th, 2021

Hi Goddesses!

I’m still here

Pretty much recovered from surgery, just working a lot.

I need to set aside time and write out a long post about life with someone who seems so narcissistic

BW, 54 WH 53 When you lie down with dogs, you wake up with fleas

posts: 2193   ·   registered: Sep. 21st, 2016   ·   location: Tampa Bay Area, Florida
id 8687826
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Hedwig ( member #74175) posted at 8:25 PM on Saturday, September 11th, 2021

@gmc94: I got my hands on a digital copy of 'my body keeps the score' and just about to read further in it. Last time I read was a month ago. IIRC, you were very enthusiastic about it and since your recommendation of ' from abandonment to healing', I trust your opinion.

I am just a little hesitant because the writer was fired over allegedly traumatizing his staff? please tell me the book is still worth reading!

@Lady G: the audacity of your WH to ask for 50/50 while you put in 70 for the property. and hiding 300K from you as well.
How did you vaccination go? Is your arm sore/any other side-effects?

@20yrsagoBS: glad you pretty much recovered from surgery, is work still as crazy as ever?

Hey y'all! I contracted covid, after succesfully dodging it for a year and a half. I'm okay, I was fully vaccinated before so 3 days of snottering and sneezing. I did lose my smell and taste, which sucks! I am also quarantined until I stop coughing. So, bored in the house now and thought I'd do some trauma work, lol.

Dday - 10/2018
Caught them, EMDR helped
Ended the relationship after false R for 1,5 years

posts: 271   ·   registered: Apr. 8th, 2020
id 8688087
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gmc94 ( Guide #62810) posted at 9:24 PM on Saturday, September 11th, 2021

Hedwig - yes, I'd still read TBKTS.
I don't know about the allegations v VanDerKolk. Worst case scenario is the allegations are all true.... AND that would still not, at least not IMHO, diminish his work.

I guess one of the many lessons I've learned from infidelity is that our human foibles, harmful and traumatic as they may be to others, do not wipe away our (also human) virtues. Early after my DDay, I had to attend an event basically worshipping my WH's work in our community. As you can imagine, it was an extremely difficult thing for me to do. I remember posting about it here on SI, basically wondering out loud "what if WH had cured cancer?" Would his lying to me and cheating forever wipe away his curing cancer? And I had to come to terms with the answer being "no, it would not".

I think the same applies to VdK... he may have been an arse to his colleagues, which sucks. AND, his being an arse in that respect does not, for me, mean his research and insight into trauma is somehow nullified (or, as the politics of the day like to bandy about: cancelled).

M >25yrs/grown kids
DD1 1994 ONS prostitute
DD2 2018 exGF1 10+yrEA & 10yrPA... + exGF2 EA forever & "made out" 2017
9/18 WH hung himself- died but revived

It's rude to say "I love you" with a mouthful of lies

posts: 3826   ·   registered: Feb. 22nd, 2018
id 8688099
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Hedwig ( member #74175) posted at 2:24 AM on Sunday, September 12th, 2021

You're completely right and thank you for replying! I have picked it up this afternoon again and do enjoy it.

That must have been a really hard day for you!
Also, how is the new job so far? I think it's been more than 6 months now?

Dday - 10/2018
Caught them, EMDR helped
Ended the relationship after false R for 1,5 years

posts: 271   ·   registered: Apr. 8th, 2020
id 8688120
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20yrsagoBS ( member #55272) posted at 2:37 AM on Tuesday, September 14th, 2021

I might be the only dissenter here, but I DO believe being a WH poisons anything good they may accomplish.

Yes, it’s throwing the baby out with the bath water

I think Waywards are more likely to steal, to extort, to manipulate, and lie about everything. I don’t think the blackness of their souls is strictly about infidelity.

Mine texts me when he arrives at the parking lot of his office, including a Google Maps link

He doesn’t grasp the concept that him cheating is so not something that I care about anymore.

He did that too many times to make it something novel

It’s the lying part that I still take issue with

BW, 54 WH 53 When you lie down with dogs, you wake up with fleas

posts: 2193   ·   registered: Sep. 21st, 2016   ·   location: Tampa Bay Area, Florida
id 8688377
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LadyG ( member #74337) posted at 7:01 AM on Sunday, September 26th, 2021

How did you vaccination go? Is your arm sore/any other side-effects?

I don’t want to scare anyone off getting vaccinated but my arm hurt the next day and I was hit hard by side effects. Annoying but painful for the 2 weeks following. 2nd dose is 4 weeks away and not looking forward to it again.

Today is hard. 34 years ago I married a monster. And no, the Narc never changes.

Stbxwh has again asked about reconciliation. I have stood my ground and refuse. He tells me that I am living in the past. I can’t see how miraculously we are going to forgive and forget, move forward and live happily ever after.

He asked why? I couldn’t see a future with him. Is he really that vague?

He gets nasty and tells me that I am mentally ill and I did it all to myself.

I reminded him that Complex Ptsd is not a mental illness. It’s a brain injury. Like other brain injuries it’s extremely difficult to treat and heal from.

Yes, he blames me for injuring my own brain. The times that he punched me in the head, leaving me with concussion is totally fine with him. He didn’t hit me that hard. That’s what he believes.

His Counsellor also blamed me for his violent behaviour towards me.

I don’t know where he found this Counsellor?

September 26 1987 I married a monster. Slowly healing from Complex PTSD. I Need Peace. Fiat Lux. Buddha’s Love Saves Me 🙏🏼

posts: 953   ·   registered: Apr. 29th, 2020   ·   location: Australia
id 8690271
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leafields ( member #63517) posted at 2:17 PM on Sunday, September 26th, 2021

I got my first shot in my non-dominant left arm and was sore for awhile. Got my second shot in my right arm and didn't have the same soreness problem. I felt really cold and spent time curled up under a comforter. Planned ahead for the second dose and had a casserole in the fridge so I didn't have to cook for a few days and got my dose on Friday so I could stay low for a couple of days.

Yes, he really is that vague. He already has you trained and doesn't want to go find another source of supply. As narcs age, it gets tougher so getting you back is easier for him.

Narcs are something else. The counselor probably said something neutral and he took it to mean approval or he twisted the words to fit his purpose. I'm guessing it's the latter. He can't be the bad guy or the one at fault, so it has to be you.

BW M 34years, Dday 1: March 2018, Dday 2: August 2019, D final 2/25/21

posts: 1496   ·   registered: Apr. 21st, 2018   ·   location: Washington State
id 8690288
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IceThee ( member #53715) posted at 5:42 PM on Monday, September 27th, 2021

I’m not sure how to say what I want to say but I’ll try.

I realized something a couple days ago. I have really good reflexes and have generally been somewhat decent at sports -like volleyball, soccer, and so on- that require a quick reaction.

Ever since final Dday and being away (thankfully!) from Xwh, I’ve not been the same. Whenever something happens, my instincts seem to go the opposite than what they would have in the past. Examples: when someone/something startled me, usually I would be calm and not even react physically —— but now I jump. Or when I’m watching my friends play volleyball, unless the ball is hit directly AT me, I don’t even move or flinch...

Both those reactions are opposite to what they have been in the past, and what (my) instincts would generally be.

I’ve been mulling over this off and on for the past 2-3 years. It wasn’t super obvious, and has taken me time to come to this place of understanding. But a couple of days ago, something triggered me -and I don’t even remember what it was- but I suddenly was able to understand that in the marriage, I had trained myself to react opposite to my instincts. In order to survive.

I don’t know how to explain this further right now. But it shook me.

I am still trying to process and understand.

I’m so thankful for triggers, they help me see something and address it.

I’m doing okay. Still processing and working to understand. But I’m okay.

"It's ok to not be ok"

Me: BS Him: xH (still cheating I'm sure)
Dday 1: November 2012 (didn’t realize it was a Dday until April 2018)
Dday 2: April 2016 Dday 3: July 2017
D final July 2018

"He who is without sin, cast

posts: 663   ·   registered: Jun. 18th, 2016   ·   location: 🌏
id 8690453
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20yrsagoBS ( member #55272) posted at 6:54 PM on Monday, September 27th, 2021

IceTher

That hyper reflex can be a sign of PTSD

I’m the same way

BW, 54 WH 53 When you lie down with dogs, you wake up with fleas

posts: 2193   ·   registered: Sep. 21st, 2016   ·   location: Tampa Bay Area, Florida
id 8690468
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gmc94 ( Guide #62810) posted at 7:27 PM on Monday, September 27th, 2021

I second what 20yrs says - it's a sign of PTSD.

My trauma-trained IC suggested I read Complex PTSD by Pete Walker. I read the first several chapters and - gotta be honest - I then stopped and have been working through some fiction (I can get overwhelmed by too much self help - KWIM?)
Anhyow, what I did read was pretty on target for me.

And - of course - there is The Body Keeps the Score, which IMHO, is the "bible" of trauma.

M >25yrs/grown kids
DD1 1994 ONS prostitute
DD2 2018 exGF1 10+yrEA & 10yrPA... + exGF2 EA forever & "made out" 2017
9/18 WH hung himself- died but revived

It's rude to say "I love you" with a mouthful of lies

posts: 3826   ·   registered: Feb. 22nd, 2018
id 8690473
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IceThee ( member #53715) posted at 8:38 PM on Monday, September 27th, 2021

@20yrs & @gmc

Wow... that actually never crossed my mind that it could be ptsd- really interesting. I’ll have to do some research on that. Can it still be ptsd with lots of healing and so on? Not questioning it, rather wanting to understand it.

Thank you both for your replies. Any other thoughts are super helpful and welcome. :)

I’m sorry you both understand this! Also thank you for letting me know I am not alone and that you do understand! crying

"It's ok to not be ok"

Me: BS Him: xH (still cheating I'm sure)
Dday 1: November 2012 (didn’t realize it was a Dday until April 2018)
Dday 2: April 2016 Dday 3: July 2017
D final July 2018

"He who is without sin, cast

posts: 663   ·   registered: Jun. 18th, 2016   ·   location: 🌏
id 8690492
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IceThee ( member #53715) posted at 8:40 PM on Monday, September 27th, 2021

@gmc yes I have to sometimes take things in small sections to not be overwhelmed. Other times I can research for days lol

"It's ok to not be ok"

Me: BS Him: xH (still cheating I'm sure)
Dday 1: November 2012 (didn’t realize it was a Dday until April 2018)
Dday 2: April 2016 Dday 3: July 2017
D final July 2018

"He who is without sin, cast

posts: 663   ·   registered: Jun. 18th, 2016   ·   location: 🌏
id 8690493
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gmc94 ( Guide #62810) posted at 9:50 PM on Monday, September 27th, 2021

Can it still be ptsd with lots of healing and so on? Not questioning it, rather wanting to understand it.

I'd start with the body keeps the score, by Bassel Van der Kolk. I can't read on paper like I did (voraciously) before dday, so got this on audiobook. It's LONG (16 hrs?) but VERY informative. It's like the encyclopedia of PTSD.

If you prefer to start in smaller increments, there is a 2-part interview of Marnie Breecker on Duane Osterlind's "The addicted mind" podcast. That's all about relational betrayal trauma & resulting PTSD. Brecker & Osterlind went on to do their own "Helping Couples Heal" podcast that also has several episodes about the TRAUMA of infidelity.

IMHO, the breecker/osterlind (and Dr Omar Minwalla's interviews on HCH) podcasts are smaller "chunks" but some pretty "heavy" material WRT infidelity.

The Body Keeps the Score is chock full of info about PTSD, how it is/isn't (or C-PTSD isn't) in the DSM, issues about diagnosing the manifestation or symptoms of PTSD (eg depression, anxiety, ADD/ADHD, CoD, etc) and trying to treat them, but w/o addressing the underlying traumatic cause, folks are seen as "chronic" instead of delving into healing the TRAUMA. I read it late into year 1 (pretty sure it was after WH's suicide attempt) and it was a total game changer for me. I've bought copies for a bunch of friends/family (even folks who know nothing about WH's infidelity) bc it's such a good resource and so validating

Another super important (IMO) thing is that PTSD (and esp C-PTSD) changes the brain on a CELLULAR LEVEL. It kind of blew my mind, but also helps me realize that re-wiring all the crap that got discombubulated (technical term laugh ) between FOO and WH is hard work and takes time for patterns to set in. Helps me have some self-compassion (may not be my fault my wiring has suffer some traumatic shit, but I'm still responsible for my actions).

I'm pretty sure there is a thread (or 10 :) ) about the body keeps the score in the book forum on SI that may help guide on the reading. I'm not in R, but reading Body Keeps the Score and then Cheating in a Nutshell (which is decidedly anti-R IMO and also has a thread in the book club) seemed to have a pretty amazeballs symmetry about the impact of infidelity, difficulty healing with the WS, difficulty to R, etc. I found it very helpful, but I suspect folks whose R may not feel quite rock solid may have trouble with the Nutshell book.

M >25yrs/grown kids
DD1 1994 ONS prostitute
DD2 2018 exGF1 10+yrEA & 10yrPA... + exGF2 EA forever & "made out" 2017
9/18 WH hung himself- died but revived

It's rude to say "I love you" with a mouthful of lies

posts: 3826   ·   registered: Feb. 22nd, 2018
id 8690507
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IceThee ( member #53715) posted at 5:45 AM on Tuesday, September 28th, 2021

@gmc thank you SO much, a plethora of good info and insights. Discombobulated is definitely a good term haha... I’m not always the best at taking things bit-by-bit, especially healing, so it’s a helpful reminder.

Hoping you are doing okay these days?

"It's ok to not be ok"

Me: BS Him: xH (still cheating I'm sure)
Dday 1: November 2012 (didn’t realize it was a Dday until April 2018)
Dday 2: April 2016 Dday 3: July 2017
D final July 2018

"He who is without sin, cast

posts: 663   ·   registered: Jun. 18th, 2016   ·   location: 🌏
id 8690595
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20yrsagoBS ( member #55272) posted at 4:23 PM on Tuesday, September 28th, 2021

I also attempted to treat my PTSD with a therapist and EMDR.

I spent $160 per month for about 2 years.

Plus the hours invested.

Only to discover WH had still been lying the whole time.

So now my therapist left for a new job.

I treat WH like everything is a lie.

He doesn’t like it

But oh fucking well

BW, 54 WH 53 When you lie down with dogs, you wake up with fleas

posts: 2193   ·   registered: Sep. 21st, 2016   ·   location: Tampa Bay Area, Florida
id 8690641
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IceThee ( member #53715) posted at 5:16 PM on Tuesday, September 28th, 2021

@20yrs I don’t blame you! The lying is absolutely horrific. I still struggle if someone jokes around and isn’t straightforward with me and they’re just friends! The lying is awful. My Xwh lied more than I know. I understand that now. Thankfully I don’t have to deal with him much.

Do you still have a lot of contact with your wh?

"It's ok to not be ok"

Me: BS Him: xH (still cheating I'm sure)
Dday 1: November 2012 (didn’t realize it was a Dday until April 2018)
Dday 2: April 2016 Dday 3: July 2017
D final July 2018

"He who is without sin, cast

posts: 663   ·   registered: Jun. 18th, 2016   ·   location: 🌏
id 8690650
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20yrsagoBS ( member #55272) posted at 6:31 PM on Tuesday, September 28th, 2021

Unfortunately, we’re still legally married

I have withdrawn. Our finances are separate, I frequently make plans and deliberately exclude him.

I plan MY future with the idea that we will live separately

I don’t do it to offend him, but it does

So it’s a bonus!

[This message edited by 20yrsagoBS at 4:09 PM, September 30th (Thursday)]

BW, 54 WH 53 When you lie down with dogs, you wake up with fleas

posts: 2193   ·   registered: Sep. 21st, 2016   ·   location: Tampa Bay Area, Florida
id 8690676
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IceThee ( member #53715) posted at 12:47 AM on Wednesday, September 29th, 2021

(((20yrs)))

I hear the sadness in your post. Wish things were different. I know wishing doesn’t do anything, but I do hope for a brightness in your future to meet you soon.

"It's ok to not be ok"

Me: BS Him: xH (still cheating I'm sure)
Dday 1: November 2012 (didn’t realize it was a Dday until April 2018)
Dday 2: April 2016 Dday 3: July 2017
D final July 2018

"He who is without sin, cast

posts: 663   ·   registered: Jun. 18th, 2016   ·   location: 🌏
id 8690760
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