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I Can Relate :
Betrayed Menz Thread-Part 33

Topic is Sleeping.
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Candyman66 ( member #52535) posted at 11:51 PM on Friday, September 28th, 2018

no its high school, nobody has gotten political yet. I won't go any farther with this line because I only have 1 mistake left.

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unsure73 ( member #65970) posted at 1:15 AM on Saturday, September 29th, 2018

good man I got no mistakes left!!!

doing so much better I cant even say....thanks to these smart folks here

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Candyman66 ( member #52535) posted at 1:31 AM on Saturday, September 29th, 2018

posts: 1259   ·   registered: Mar. 31st, 2016   ·   location: SoCal
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Notthevictem ( member #44389) posted at 4:37 AM on Saturday, September 29th, 2018

My mistakes smell funny...

BH: Me 37
WW: Her 41
DDAY Mar 2014

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Candyman66 ( member #52535) posted at 8:01 AM on Saturday, September 29th, 2018

Another H.S. football game. Well he apparently is human after all. He ONLY made 130 yards and 3 touchdowns tonight. That's 873 yards and 15 touchdowns in three games. Damn

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Unhinged ( member #47977) posted at 8:57 AM on Saturday, September 29th, 2018

Have you EVER met a man who thinks that?

Yes, I have. I cannot recall ever being in a situation in which I knew that a sexual assault was taking place. However, I have known men like that. Given the simple statistics, the basic facts of life in America (or anywhere else for that matter), I would imagine that you do, too, although you may never know it. You don't have be a news-junkie (like I am) to have heard the stories about Larry Nasser, Harvey Weinstein, Bill Cosby or even Kevin Spacey (who preyed upon young men) to know that men like that are not all low-lifes who skirt the fringes of society. They are not all "Drunk Uncle." They are fathers, brothers and cousins. They are priests and politicians, doctors and lawyers, CEOs and teachers, coaches, cops, and yes... even Ivy League educated judges. They are amongst us, hiding in plain site. When they are discovered, we think to ourselves, no... not that guy! He's this or that, respectable, a pillar of society, above reproach.

And this is why this shit goes on and women are terrified to tell their stories.

I'm sure it's because I'm a man, but I do not see a "rape culture",

How? How do you fail to see what's right in front of you? In the last few days I have witnessed a group of men politely and cordially listen to a very credible woman recall her own personal story of sexual assault and then simply move on as if nothing at all had happened. And that's not a "rape culture?" How would you define a "rape culture?" Would that have to include movies and TV shows glorifying rape? Should there be a magazine or a web-site dedicated to the practice? Should our coaches have taught us how to rape a woman and get away with it?

I don't personally know anyone who has ever told me or been found guilty of sexual assault in a court of law. One of the reasons for that might just very well be that they do NOT advertise or brag about it and that the conviction rate for sexual assault is less than 5%. Still, I bet my left nut that at least one man with whom I've been close friends is guilty of sexual assault, if not more.

And FWIW, I've never wanted to cover my beautiful prick (or myself) in anyone else's shit. I can't say for certain, having never been in the exact situation, but had my FWW told me she'd had anal sex with her AP and it was the greatest, most earth-shattering experience of her life... well, I'd have divorced her.

[This message edited by Unhinged at 3:00 AM, September 29th (Saturday)]

Heading towards divorce
D-Day April, 2015

"The Universe is not short on wake-up calls. We're just quick to hit the snooze button."
-Brene Brown

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Candyman66 ( member #52535) posted at 2:25 PM on Saturday, September 29th, 2018

Unhinged, Nothing to add just want to say great post.

posts: 1259   ·   registered: Mar. 31st, 2016   ·   location: SoCal
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stolenyears ( member #65758) posted at 4:31 PM on Saturday, September 29th, 2018

How? How do you fail to see what's right in front of you? In the last few days I have witnessed a group of men politely and cordially listen to a very credible woman recall her own personal story of sexual assault and then simply move on as if nothing at all had happened. And that's not a "rape culture?"

Is it not possible to see things differently? I don't see what is supposed to be 'right in front of me either'. And I don't know anyone personally that would say that abuse of any kind is acceptable. Maybe it is who I have chosen to be friend with or the family I have been blessed to grow up with, but that is my perspective and it looks different.

Me: BH
Her: fWW
Married: 30 years, kids 26, 23 and 16
DDay: 5-24-17, multiple APs
Current status: In Recovery

posts: 165   ·   registered: Aug. 8th, 2018
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Candyman66 ( member #52535) posted at 6:01 PM on Saturday, September 29th, 2018

the really sad part is for all the sexual destruction this causes for the women in these cases for the men it REALLY isn't about the sex at all. It is about the ability to misuse what ever power they have. This is all about POWER and who has it and who doesn't.

To destroy someone else's life to just show what kind of power they think they have. That just sick and these men should be confined to a F'ing mental institution!!! Or jail, jail will work I think but then I would be putting my values as a man instead of listening to what the wounded women think.

Lady's I am so sorry that there are so many sick men in positions of power (no matter how little) and Yes I will listen to what you need and I WILL be a warrior on YOUR side of this fight!! And fight it will be. Why? Because WE (I almost said you but then that it INCLUDES ME) and every other male that is alive and breathing. WE are all in this fight either on the side of womanhood (however that is described) or on the side of hate and oppression.

The fight is on, there are NO SIDELINES, If you are alive YOU are in this fight just make sure you can live with the side you chose.

JMO and I'm really sorry for whoever doesn't chose the side of the Lady's because that would mean that YOU would be OK with it if you saw it being done to YOUR Mom!

posts: 1259   ·   registered: Mar. 31st, 2016   ·   location: SoCal
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stayedforthekids ( member #45706) posted at 7:28 PM on Saturday, September 29th, 2018

Jesus, you fuckers act like you've never heard a woman lie before. Women never lie to protect their reputation or to exert some vengeance for being scorned.

I think our society has lost its fucking mind. Any woman can accuse any man of some inappropriate behavior or comment, at any time in her history, and the man is immediately guilty. His career and reputation is in the shitter. No due process, no presumption of innocence, no evidence needed, no criminal investigation, just her "word" some shit went down and she's a "victim".

We have laws and processes in place to protect the accused and the victim. #metoo should not get to circumvent those laws.

Madhatter

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Unhinged ( member #47977) posted at 9:08 PM on Saturday, September 29th, 2018

stayed, you're absolutely right about one thing: women are capable of lying. The rest is too cynical to even consider.

Heading towards divorce
D-Day April, 2015

"The Universe is not short on wake-up calls. We're just quick to hit the snooze button."
-Brene Brown

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WornDown ( member #37977) posted at 9:38 PM on Saturday, September 29th, 2018

Unhinged -

Google Emilly Joff e of The Atlantic and read her reporting about campus rape from last year.

Yes, the current movement group of feminists positions is the accusations should be believed full stop. No cross-examination of the accuser, heck the accuser doesn't even need to be identified. No counsel for the accused. The charges in some cases aren't even disclosed to the accused until trial. The level of evidence needed? More than likely, not beyond a reasonable doubt

Oh and the men are booted off campus immediately, even before trial.

So yes, due process and the presumption of innocence is very much in question when it comes to these charges.

(Edited: stupid spell check amaze it illedgible)

[This message edited by WornDown at 10:48 PM, September 29th (Saturday)]

Me: BH (49)exW (49): Way too many guys to countThree kids (D22, D21, S18)Together 25 years, married 18Divorced (July 2015)

I divorced a narc. Separate everything. NC as much as humanly possible and absolutely no phone calls. - Ch

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stolenyears ( member #65758) posted at 10:29 PM on Saturday, September 29th, 2018

The rest is too cynical to even consider.

This is how voices get silenced. I don’t think it is cynical at all having seen it happen in multiple cases with a vindictive wife caught in an affair. The prevailing societal view of MAN BAD...WOMAN GOOD leaves no room for us as BHs. I mean, how could we possibly be here when our wives are the good ones and we are allegedly the pigs? But yet, we are here on our own little thread because our wives, who are GOOD according to our society for the simple fact of their gender, they chose to fuck someone other than us while we are married. Cynical? No. Realist based on experience? Yes.

Me: BH
Her: fWW
Married: 30 years, kids 26, 23 and 16
DDay: 5-24-17, multiple APs
Current status: In Recovery

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ramius ( member #44750) posted at 11:46 PM on Saturday, September 29th, 2018

We have laws and processes in place to protect the accused and the victim. #metoo should not get to circumvent those laws.

That would seem reasonable to most people. At least it used to. But as Nina Simone would say.....It’s a new dawn, it’s a new day.

Recently it seems like due process, in certain contexts, is now considered optional. Or worse, irrelevant. One person said it so we must treat it as completely valid. It matters not if a single other person on earth backs up the statement. It matters not if a single fact can be verified. That's how this works. Enjoy the new world. These are the rules now.

For those embracing this, they might want to ask Sabrina Erdely over at Rolling Stone magazine where this logic takes you.

How many scars have you rationalized because you loved the person who was holding the knife?

Their actions reveal their intentions. Their words conceal them.

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sisoon ( Guide #31240) posted at 12:04 AM on Sunday, September 30th, 2018

I was horrified 20 years ago when the daughter of a friend was taught in college that she had to keep her hand over her drinks to prevent someone dumping a roofy in there.

It ain't women using roofies. And it ain't men getting castrated or even going on trial, much less getting convicted, for using roofies. Roofy victims, I guess, get our thoughts and prayers - but it's not rape.

In my day, candy was thought to be dandy, but liquor quicker. That wasn't rape, either.

See - no rape culture. QED.

fBH (me) - on d-day: 66, Married 43, together 45, same sex ap
DDay - 12/22/2010
Recover'd and R'ed
You don't have to like your boundaries. You just have to set and enforce them.

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Rideitout ( member #58849) posted at 12:29 AM on Sunday, September 30th, 2018

How would you define a "rape culture?"

OK, I'll take a run at it. You want to know what a rape culture looks like; take a look at men's prison. "Don't drop the soap".. We all laugh. Except do you know what that means? Let me promise you, as someone who's seen it with my own eyes, it's not pretty. It's a man with teeth missing, beaten beyond recognition with his ass bleeding and a bunch of guards standing there laughing. That's a rape culture, where it's a joke, trivialized and used as punishment for "offenders". And accepted as "just" by society, nobody gives a single shit about the men being raped over and over again in prison, even when there's goddamn video of it, dozens of witnesses including sworn officers and enough physical evidence to fill the courtroom with documents.

Still, I bet my left nut that at least one man with whom I've been close friends is guilty of sexual assault, if not more.

If you're defining it as it's currently defined, I agree with you. I'm guilty of it, I've had sex with drunk women before, likely who were too drunk to affirmatively consent. Now, let's be clear, they said yes and enthusiastically participated, but, because they were likely too drunk, that was rape. In fact, in several instances, I'm pretty sure I was both the perp and victim at the same time, because I had sex when I was too drunk to consent.

If you're defining it as a man using force to overpower a woman and forcibly having sex with her, I doubt you know anyone. I don't. And if I did, I'd immediately remove them from my circle of friends because that's so "no cool" that if I thought I could get it to stick, I'd report it to police and have him charged.

I was horrified 20 years ago when the daughter of a friend was taught in college that she had to keep her hand over her drinks to prevent someone dumping a roofy in there.

It ain't women using roofies. And it ain't men getting castrated or even going on trial, much less getting convicted, for using roofies. Roofy victims, I guess, get our thoughts and prayers - but it's not rape. In my day, candy was thought to be dandy, but liquor quicker. That wasn't rape, either.

So, this is where we get into the gray area. I went to school during that time. And yes, there were roofies. No, I never saw anyone "put something in someone's drink", EVER. If I did, I would have knocked them out. And I think that anyone in my circle would have done the same. What I did see is a bunch of guys and girls taking those pills for fun. And then having sex. Same thing with booze. I never saw a single guy hold a girl down and make her drink. Again, if I had, ass whipping would have ensued. I saw a lot of girls get fall down drunk, hang all over a guy, grab his crotch and ask to go to his room. All the time, like damn near every weekend I saw this happen, and yes, I participated and had it happen to me too.

So, what is it, are we just absolving women of any personal responsibility here? If you get drunk, you make bad decisions, including going to bed with people you don't find attractive. If you take drugs, you also make bad decisions. Is it only men who are responsible for those bad decisions? Can we make DUI a "male only" crime too, because, obviously, women aren't responsible for stupid crap they do after drinking, that's only for men?

I know, this isn't going to be popular, but, I believe very strongly in personal responsibility. I went to bed with some really unattractive women in college that I NEVER would have slept with if I wasn't drunk off my ass. Did they all rape me? Or was I just a drunken asshole who made piss poor decisions under the influence of a drug that I willingly took? And if we're going to call that rape, what if one of those women were now sitting for a high level position and I crawled out and told my story about them getting me drunk and raping me? Would that go over well? Would all you guys support me in that? Because, I can tell you, I've got at least a dozen women I could make this claim legitimately against, I did a lot of drinking and a lot of bad decision making in college.

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Notthevictem ( member #44389) posted at 2:24 AM on Sunday, September 30th, 2018

So... just cause it's all over the news, we're supposed to talk about it?

Man, I gotta get farts in the news somehow...

BH: Me 37
WW: Her 41
DDAY Mar 2014

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id 8257131
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Unhinged ( member #47977) posted at 2:36 AM on Sunday, September 30th, 2018

I spent about an hour writing a reply and when I hit submit I got a nice little message that the site was unavailable. I'll summarize...

We have a great legal system, one that was extraordinarily innovative when it was created. Due process and the presumption of innocence and the 14 Amendment (equal protection) is never something to be take lightly. These are the bedrocks upon which we seek to find justice.

I've listen carefully to these women and the one thing that stands out is that our system is failing them (by the millions). They are too traumatized and terrified to come forward. We are failing them. We are failing when it comes to sexually assaulted women seeking justice.

Yes, there are going to be cases in which a woman lies and FUBARs a man's reputation and life. If recent studies are accurate, it's less than 10%. And while the law often deals with such women, the damage is already done and hard to undue. For the other 90% plus, it's just the opposite. These women are traumatized and terrified.

Until we can find a better way to adjudicate such situations, millions of women are going to be sexually assaulted, few of them will seek justice, and even fewer will find it.

I think we can do better.

Man, I gotta get farts in the news somehow...

I recently read something about... was it Elan Musk?... inventing a condensed fart turret. Genius. Sheer genius.

ETA: There's a very good reason why the majority of BHs on this site recommend to newly arrived BHs that they buy and use a VAR!

[This message edited by Unhinged at 8:43 PM, September 29th (Saturday)]

Heading towards divorce
D-Day April, 2015

"The Universe is not short on wake-up calls. We're just quick to hit the snooze button."
-Brene Brown

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Notthevictem ( member #44389) posted at 4:59 PM on Sunday, September 30th, 2018

I knew they were real!

BH: Me 37
WW: Her 41
DDAY Mar 2014

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sisoon ( Guide #31240) posted at 9:33 PM on Sunday, September 30th, 2018

'Use of force' is too narrow a definition. Consider the many sources of fear that women talk about. It behooves us to listen with empathy and without projecting how we think we'd respond in the same situation.

IDK ... I've heard too many women relate with great credibility how they were violated in ways that were totally unindictable....

fBH (me) - on d-day: 66, Married 43, together 45, same sex ap
DDay - 12/22/2010
Recover'd and R'ed
You don't have to like your boundaries. You just have to set and enforce them.

posts: 26146   ·   registered: Feb. 18th, 2011   ·   location: Illinois
id 8257370
Topic is Sleeping.
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