SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I think stepping up to help just until the FIL has passed or making behind the scenes agreements with the STBX which he's not told about would qualify as subterfuge, and yes.. I have seen those things suggested. If the intent is only to help out until the funeral, FIL should be told exactly that. There should be nothing kept secret from him because he needs to make end of life plans. Any data provided to him needs to reflect the REAL situation. It's not just a matter of comforting a dying man. There's financial, medical, and legacy planning he needs to accomplish before he goes.

Oh, I think I'm being talked about.

His FIL wants him to postpone, not give up on what he will do. So, I assume he won't consider MrFlibble in the picture while making after death arrangements. If the request to postpone means to stay married for lifelong, of course it should be said that this can't happen.

I think MrFlibble will give the necessary support anyway. He doesn't hate them all. But this doesn't mean that the scheduled poly test should be canceled. Or, if there is a hearing in the court or some other legal procedures, they don't need to be canceled, and the FIL doesn't have to be aware of them. These are not subterfuge, and don't harm any reality.

My father got pancreatic cancer about 1.5 years ago. My aunt (his younger sister) visited him every day. She went on a pre-planned vacation for a few days and suffered a stroke there. We never told my father about my aunt's illness. And yes, we lied to him that the phone was not receiving well where my aunt went, we talked her and she said hello to him, etc. My father died a month later and we never told this to my aunt who died two months ago.

I don't think we did anything bad.

I don't understand why the TRUTH, here of all places, should be the least bit controversial. There may be a difference in bequests if the FIL knows that his daughter is on her own. He might feel the need to leave her additional financial protections if he knows she's going forward as a single mom without the security of marriage. It's not fair to him if he doesn't have a realistic picture of what's going on. If my daughter were in this position and I was dying, I'd make sure she had what she needs before I go. That might mean co-signing a home loan or leaving her property or additional monies. Who knows? I can tell you this though, not everyone wants or needs fluffy comforting, particularly if it comes instead of the facts.

My point isn't that the OP should change anything he's doing. He's made up his mind. My only point is that he should be super honest with his FIL so the man can do his end of life planning.

I feel like this is a terribly unfair thing your FIL is asking of you. You are going through a horrible betrayal and he’s asking you to take care of the one who destroyed your marriage.

Your wife can get professional counseling to get her through. You need to take care of yourself first.

This man is going to die and that is the only truth here. As a man, he reached out to you and asked a favor. Your divorce will happen, but starting Sunday it will take a back seat to his impending death.

If you can not honor his wishes then say so. The why's mean nothing to a dying man.

It is only my opinion, but you must consider it. That as a hard ask, buy he had to do ask YOU. It is the same as a hand shake on a deal. Some have no idea what that means.

There are times when we MUST do the unpleasant or necessary and this is one of them.

You are divorcing your wife for disrespect and honor. Use those same principles when you decide what to do in the next few months.

Everything should take a back seat when you are watching your father die.

Mr. F:

This is the 38th page of your thread. I've read it from the beginning and this will be my first post on it. You have a good head on your shoulders and you WILL end up OK. In fact you are pretty damn close already which is great.

The news about you FIL is a big deal. It was your WW's actions that make this such a hard call. Your FIL has had to digest the news about his daughter as well as the most devastating news any of us will probably ever have to face.

Was it fair of him to ask you to delay things? No - not really. Would you be acting as a moral human being if you turn him down? - yes. It is your WW that is responsible for this mess.

But the question at hand is what SHOULD you do? Probably the majority of the posters on the thread will say - treat him as respectfully as you can but turn down his request. A minority see enough strength in you to say - yes, this wasn't a fair ask but you're are strong enough to do it and overall doing so will be better for the in-laws, your soon to be ex and your kids.

I'd ask myself, 5 years down the road, how will I feel if I turn him down and how would I feel if I volunteered to take on more pain and did what he asked? From reading your comments here it is obvious that you are strong enough and wise enough to handle either scenario. You'll make the right choice for you. Sorry that all of this drama continues. Good luck to you.

It's not fair to him if he doesn't have a realistic picture of what's going on.

ChamomileTea

What is the relevance between the points you said and the things suggested here? Nobody, including me, suggested covering up the realistic picture.

Does he really need to know every detail? Even before this illness was known, I don't think he was fully informed about what his daughter has done. So why should he know now?

To be super honest with his FIL...

Do you think he should talk to him about the car rides, the two house visits, the burner phone, the endless TT, etc? What good does it do for whom?

He probably only knows now that his daughter has cheated on her husband. And it is enough to know for him that divorce will inevitably happen in the future. He doesn't need to know about the poly test or legal procedures, and there is no reason for these to be postponed.

I don't insist on doing this. I'm just saying it's a good way to both not waste time and prevent a dying man from spending his last days in discomfort. If MrFlibble says he can wait or doesn't accept his wish, I can't say anything.

What would you do in my case? Would you tell someone who had a cerebral hemorrhage that her brother is dead? Moreover, the cause of that cerebral hemorrhage was probably the sadness of her brother's illness.

The FIL has to know Mr. F. Enough to know Mr. F's actions would be in line with the spirit of his request if not the letter. Even without asking. Mr. F.'s just not going to leave WW & MIL hanging when they really need him. That support doesn't require that the divorce and separation not happen on schedule though that's the focus of FILs request.

Regardless of Fibbles decision here the aftermath of FIL passing will test his resolve on being done with R. It's going to be hard to detach and support simultaneously. That's the conflict he is now facing.

MrF,

I didn't see this response, but what would YOU like to do about this situation?

My conclusion, based on 38 pages of posts, is that if the poly comes back clean, Mr. F sees a path to reconciliation post divorce. That being said, if he choses not to support his FIL’s request, R will become virtually impossible. They may eventually reconcile, but the WW’s resentment will eventually implode the entire process.

My recommendation is to continue to proceed with the divorce process without involving the WW whatsoever. Mr F essentially said most of the heaving lifting has already been completed, and all he is waiting for is the date in May to go before the judge. At that time the storm involving the FIL may have subsided. No one knows at this point.

My recommendation is to agree to the FIL’s request in so much that you agree to completely support the WW snd MIL through the difficult process, but don’t put the brakes on the divorce process. Mr F should not advertise this fact. He only has to publicly say that he is here to provide support and say that the FIL’s situation trumps everything else. At the same time, nothing has changed wrt moving forward with the divorce. The only difference, which is the salient point, is that he drops all discussion of the divorce until things come to a head when the May court hearing is imminent. Then, Mr. F can make a decision at that point on how to proceed.

Any other strategy will make Mr. F look like an ogre to his WW, MIL, kids, extended family snd friends. The talking point then will not be that Mr. F’s wife cheated on him but that Mr. F is a total Ahole.

Mr. F

The Golden Rule is not easy. It is simple though.

These are all your choices. Perhaps I could offer the only filter I know to help: Make the choice YOU can live with. Now and in 5 years, 10 years, one you can explain to adult children. One you can relive 30 years from now and know you did the right thing. Whatever that ‘thing’ is.

Once this choice is made, using the Golden Rule, there will be no need to second guess it. These choices always come at a price.

The circumstances suck. Hard choices are never 'clean' or 'easy' or 'made by someone else for you', there is no excuse that will fit, they are indeed hard.

Apparently, the FIL sees you as standup person, a rock perhaps. He may not know all the circumstances, but it seems he knows this.

I only use the 'golden rule' theory because it is easier to convey. I will expand: Honor, integrity, self-worth, discipline, etc all come at price. I am not much on turn the other cheek (which is often mis quoted I believe) but if someone does something despicable this does not give you permission to do the same or similar. The high road, so to speak, does offer value.

That being said, if he choses not to support his FIL’s request, R will become virtually impossible. They may eventually reconcile, but the WW’s resentment will eventually implode the entire process.

His cheating wife will resent him not honoring her fathers request and that will torpedo R?

Can you actually R with someone who doesn't own up to the fact that it was the cheating that made this request necessary from the FIL to begin with? If she's not going to own the responsibility R isn't an option anyway.

My mother was diagnosed with stage 4 lung cancer. There was nothing that could be done,and the doctors told her she had a few mote months left. Maybe. She lived for 4 more years.

People don't have expiration dates. And doctors can't accurately predict the day a person will die.

His wife is a big girl. Many of us betrayed spouses have had to deal with the death of a parent, and the betrayal of our spouses at the same time. And we did it. His wife can deal with the consequences of her actions,and the death of her father,at the same time.

Murkywaters. You are correct. However, the decision can’t be made in a vacuum, unless Mr F.

1. Has no desire to reconcile

2. Wants the conversation for the rest of his life to be about his betrayal and not his WW’s

My prescription is about strategy, not about the black and white that this discussion would not be happening had his wife not cheated.

Mr. Flibble,

You asked about polygraph advice. I have been thinking of your post for days. My WH's affair story is similar to your WF. We are about 4.5 to 5 years out now.

I asked for a polygraph very soon after finding out. I wasn't sure of why I wanted it or how much credibility I gave to the process, but I thought a passed polygraph would ease my mind. My WH took care of every part of choosing the company, scheduling, and attending on his own. I didn't want to spend my time on it. It all happened within a month of D-day.

I was asked for 3 or 4 questions that were yes or no. I choose to focus only on physical events and wanted to word them so they were technically sound. I don't remember the exact wording, but the intent was:

Have you told me the entire extent of this affair physically?

Have you had any contact with the AP that I'm not aware of since the discovery?

Have you have any sexual interaction with anyone else since we've been married ?(engaged/dated? I don't remember what I thought was important.)

The polygraph company gave feedback on the questions and wording via email before the test. There has been no "parking lot confession" or even changing any substantial details of the affair since the first few days.

After the polygraph, I was given a written report. It had numbers and confidence levels and a written interpretation. The numbers said my WH technically passed 2 of 3 questions and failed for the one of other sexual interaction. In the polygrapher's written interpretation, he said he felt the entire test was inconclusive. He also said that it was his professional opinion that my WH was trying to evade the test, and he didn't believe his story. Similar to your WW, my WH had one physical contact event where he claims he stopped at about the same level of interaction. That's even less believable on SI because he's a man, right?

I didn't really know what to do with that report. It left me feeling that a polygraph is much more interpretational than scientific. I was not ready to leave my marriage over that test and report. I did not feel confident in polygraphs in general.

We continued to try in our marriage with several ICs for us both, MC, even a separation. About 1- 1.5 yr later, we decided to do another polygraph. At this point I was ready to fully leave the marriage if it was false. It was more that I was searching for some peace and some answer than my confidence in polygraphs.

My WH still had the same basic story of his affair since the first few days of discovery. However, he did tell me many painful things about his state of mind and things that were said that I would have no way of finding out otherwise. In terms of other past sexual interactions, there was pushing boundaries in my view and flirting with other women. The most significant was probably a woman jumping on his back for a group picture, and he grabbed her butt.

We jointly chose the polygraph company and person. I felt comfortable with their experience. The questions/intent were the same. The polygrapher spoke to us jointly at first in the exam room. He said he had a policy of confirming results with his partner before releasing a conclusion. I left to a waiting room area while the exam was conducted. At one point, my WH came out of the exam and told me he was having the same feelings as before with the same question. The hair was standing up on the back of his neck, and he had a tingling sensation. WH said there was nothing else he could remember, but he also thought he would fail the test.

It was a long drive home. We both assumed my WH failed, and he understood it was the end for me. WH knew I was planning to move out but offered to leave immediately to a hotel and do whatever was helpful to me for divorce. The polygraph administrator called and said he was confident that my WH passed. The time delay was the review/verification with his partner.

I don't know what to think of polygraphs. In hindsight, I think they are maybe more interpretational than I am comfortable with using as a decision-making devise. Yet, I'm also fairly confident that I now have my WH's full personal truth of events. But that is only as a complete story 4-5 years out from the affair and with new knowledge of my WH and how he thinks and acts. An affair is a wake-up that you don't really know your spouse and your marriage.

Mr. F, I don't know if this helps you or not. I'm really sorry with your situation and what you are going through. I can tell my full story later if it will help you.

It's beyond treatable now and they give him a few months at best.

Mr. Fibble

You can't be sure it's a few months even if he's telling the truth about what the doctor said.

My son's MIL just died two days ago. She was given the same prognosis as your FIL two years ago.

With aggressive treatment a great deal can be done even in advanced cases.

[This message edited by Michigan at 11:30 AM, March 27th (Saturday)]

Yes, the FIL could be lying. Yes, the FIL could live longer. That’s not the point I’m making. The point is that the minute Mr. F says he wants nothing to do with supporting the family, the narrative will shift from his WW being a cheater to Mr. F is a jerk.

My opinion still stands as I said earlier. When the May court date comes around, reassess. In the meantime, from a strategic point of view, which is solely for optics, play the part snd proceed quietly with the divorce process.

Thank you all so much, I am still in a shock honestly. I have not decided what to do yet but I have to, and soon. I don't know if I can do this to her, no matter how much she fucked me up I still care about her.

I spoke with my FIL today on a phone for almost an hour. He's surprisingly calm, he knows what he's asking is a lot and he doesn't want to push me, it's ultimately my decision, but he obviously cares for his daughters and I think he wants to minimalize the impact so to speak. He was actually very task oriented and asked me to help him with everything so I set up a meeting with our lawyer next week. I also asked him about any kind of possible treatment and he told me that he was offered a very harsh and agressive kind of chemo with very slim chance. It would be basically prolonging the inevitable with a very poor quality of life. So he decided against it, which I understand.

Tomorrow's going to be a shitty day.

I don't know that I wouldn't choose to bypass treatment as well if I were in your FIL's shoes. In my father's case, they managed to clear the initial tumor in his lungs with radiation/chemo, but by that time, it had spread to his brain. The tumor in the brain was surgically reduced but couldn't be excised completely due to its location, and then it spread to his liver. It's awful, just horrible to have to watch, and worse to endure.

I'm really sorry, for you, your wife, and her family.

Mr. F, do what you think is right. And just know, if you feel like you need to change your course of action at any time, be kind to yourself and give yourself the freedom to do what is best for you without guilt or judgment. This is an incredibly difficult situation and there is no right or wrong answer - only what is best for you and for as long as it works for you.