SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

My update….today is our wedding anniversary, I sent her a card which also included a letter. I explained that we needed to talk, I needed answers but also what she means to mean and the way I feel about her. I also told her about the pain it had caused and apologised for anything I had fine to hurt her. I asked her to meet me at 10:00 outside the venue where we were married. She didn’t confirm she would come, as she’s still got me blocked from any firm if contact. Anyway, she did not turn up!!!

This last week has been the most painful of my life, completely horrendous, struggling to get through the days. Doctor increased my meds and now have depression to go with anxiety brought on by all of this. She has broken me.

I have decided today is the day I move on. No point in chasing ghosts who won’t speak to me as she obviously doesn’t love or care about my feelings. It’s going to be hard but today my mindset changes and I am determined, rather than sitting about feeling sorry for myself. She has messed me about for too long and like an idiot, because I loved her, I couldn’t see it. Never again will I allow her to mess me about or have that power over my mindset.

Today guys, is the change and I’m going to get through this. Thanks everyone for your concern and comments, they certainly helped in various ways

Brother, you've been doing the pick me dance with that letter and trying to have a romantic meet up. I am pleased today that you have said that you are going to hang up the dancing shoes and put on the ass kicking shoes to get yourself out of this mess. The reality is that you cannot win your wife back with romantic gestures or pleading with her to talk or be honest with you. In fact, the reality is that all of those actions, seen through her eyes are weakness and in her eyes actually push her further away from you as she loses some respect for you. I know it is fucked up to hear, but it is true. The reality is that a wayward only responds to strength. Hence why you hang up those dancing shoes and put on the ass kicking boots.

Get tough with her and be firm. Block her and lose all contact with her. Go find yourself a divorce attorney and get your divorce paperwork written up and have her ass served. She is now your mortal enemy, hence why having her blocked and being NC with her will work to your benefit. She left the marriage a long time ago and is way ahead of you in all this. The reality is that you loved her and you were not wrong to do so. This is going to hurt, but you have to find a way to stop giving her power in your life. You may already know, but the opposite of love is not hate, it is total indifference. Your goal should be to detach to a point from her that you care no more about her than the random stranger you ran into at the grocery store last week.

Also, just a thought to keep in mind, as this has happened here on SI through the years, once faced with the reality of divorce papers and sitting with her own counsel to understand what a divorced future looks like, a wayward will come slinking back to their betrayed spouse and trying to weasel there way back in. It seems quite unlikely with your WW, but you should prepare yourself for that possible scenario so that you know how you are going to act. You gotta remember, your WW is not the prize, you are, and she discarded you for someone else and she's made her choice. You are under no obligation to give her a second chance, because quite frankly your WW is not deserving of anything else. The reality is that not every WS is willing to crawl on their hands and knees across hot coals and broken glass to get back to their BS and to repair all the damage that they've done.

For your mental and physical health, it seems quite clear that you need to start taking some of these actions to get yourself out of this situation ASAP. I know that where you sit today, contemplating your marriage being over and an imminent divorce is not what you had in mind for 2023...as unfortunate as all that is, it is your reality. If it helps, I can tell you this, given enough time, you can heal from this trauma and in a couple of years you can look back on these current events and see how far you will have come on your own healing journey. The only thing that it takes is you taking it a day at a time and making sure that you show yourself love and care along the way.

Today you move on but what if she contacts you tomorrow?

It still feels like you"ll ask how high, if she calls you know and asks you to jump.

Personally think what she is doing is cruel and callous, but she's detached and she's gone hard no contact.

Let her not showing up for the meeting be your closure. Work on yourself and your codependancy and detach. You don't need someone yo explain why they fucked you over, now it's time to find happiness for yourself, forgive yourself and live your life.

Good luck to you.

Both still married. Neither formal separation or divorce started. Both have admitted to having sex outside the marriage. That is the definition of a Mad Hatter,

So, saying "I’m Divorcing, move on." Isn’t separating?

Using that "logic", would swingers be considered madhatters then too?

The relevant factor for me, Gunnut, is that OP had NOT moved on. He still hoped his W would come back. That's my personal opinion, and it makes me vote for putting OP under the madhatter rules.

Remember, the madhatter is entitled to and needs support in both BS and WS roles. There are limits on the posting ability, but the madhatter also has privileges that the plain BS does not.

But the big thing is: madhatters need support and they need to heal both as BS and WS. It's a calassification on SI. It's not an administrative judgment.

Individuals may make moral judgments, but SI doesn't.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 3:50 PM, Wednesday, August 16th]

Gunnit,
I have already stated that the arguments of the label needed to stop, yet you ignored that.

Again, what we know based on the OP’s telling:
1. Wife started looking for a place of her own and said she was done.
2. OP tried to save M but after rejection of those efforts, slept with someone else.
3. Wife upset with him sleeping with someone and went out and did the same after the OP did.
4. Wife continues to reject OPs attempts to save M.

The only rule that OP has is that he cannot post in JFO.

Again, I urge members to provide this member support to heal from this rather thN get caught up in whether he is a Madhatter or not. That is not helpful to the OP. It is only an attempt to cause disruption and argue with staff.

If you have concerns or require clarification from us, please contact us directly.

Sisoon

I did try to move on when she told me she wanted a divorce and herself told me to move on. Then and only then I gave up trying and hope and met another woman. I’ve said previously that the label means nothing to me as I still have the same pain but with all the comments, I do think it’s unfair for me to be labelled a MH. I could be waiting 2 years before divorce is finalised, would I have to wait that long before being labelled a MH?

The way you have suggested is we both as bad as each other and frankly, that’s just not fair. I was faithful until the point she said there was no chance and wanted a divorce. This doesn’t stop the hurt I felt when I found out she had slept with someone else. Most comments have been helped but a few, including yours seem to indicate I’m a cheat. Several saying I should have made better decisions !!! Look I’m not sure what decision I got wrong, I tried everything to make it work then decided to try and move on. Once I found out about what she done, it opened everything back up again and ended up in more pain than I was at the beginning.

I also think there has been more concern by some about which label I should be

I also think there has been more concern by some about which label I should be

You are going to get a lot of comments and feedback, almost all of it is well intentioned, but there is an oft repeated phrase we have when it comes to advice, "take what you need and leave the rest." I concur that your label is completely irrelevant and in no way does your label define your pain and struggles with this very difficult situation you find yourself in.

Worry less about labels and more about what you are going to do today, tomorrow, the next day and the day after that to get yourself out of infidelity and to work on healing yourself and becoming the best version of yourself that you can be.

Bor9455 - thank you and agree

I do appreciate all the advice and support, you can tell some people genuinely care and I thank them for that.

Well today, I do feel a lot better. As you say one day at a time

Thanks to all for advice, please keep them up as they really do help

Hi northern,

Again I’m so sorry.

Your whole world has been destroyed.

Your behaviors are totally understandable. You are suffering an honest actual trauma.

That is not a joke. You are traumatized.

Don’t get hung up on labels. You are a mad hatter according to this sites guidelines.

This site is the best of them all so forget about the arguments about labels and focus on what is in front of you.

Your wife has been cheating on you and she moved out to explore her lover.

We do not know that for sure. That is true.

Let’s just call it an educated guess. A very educated guess. Like Stephen Hawkins, Isaac newton, Albert Einstein level educated guess.

You would know if there was arguing and fighting. She did not leave a stable good home with kids to be single and by herself.

You need to understand that if she was cheating (99.9% probability) she would never be able to return to the marriage until she came clean.

There is a book called "not just friends" that uses a concept called "walls and windows". Open windows between spouses and walls between threats to the marriage. Meaning other partners.

Let’s say she came back to make it work and she was holding on to secrets she would never be able to establish true intimacy with you so the marriage would be doomed long term.

Once again I would bring it up to her if you have therapy. Watch her reaction.

Also the therapist does not have to take your side but if they completely ignore it then you do not have a good therapist.

Not just friends also talks about how therapist need to stop being so trusting as betrayed tend to have a sharp radar.

Again does not have to completely take your side but they should at least question her.

If she says she is really alone. Not much you can do now but hire a PI. If you did you would find a boyfriend.

Except for business I would not talk to her about anything and just say again and again I know you were cheating on me.

Get mad, in a controlled way. Lie to her " I posted on Reddit and got 176 responses that all said you have been cheating and lying".

It’s ok to move forward from that position as you don’t want to stay married to someone who lies, abuses and cheats on you.

But in some ways doesn’t really matter now. She would just lie and say she started it after she moved out.

As I said the first time she weaponized your sleeping with the other woman to make you the bad guy. But also she was jealous you were able to find someone so quickly.

The main reason I’m doing all this explaining is if you move on with someone else. She may try to come back again.

Don’t let her. Don’t let her suck you back in. It’s her job to save this marriage not yours. No admitting the truth and moving heaven and earth to save this marriage then no talking.

Take care of yourself and your children.

Healthy eating and exorcise. It’s standard advice for a reason.

It’s good you are able to meet someone else. It will help.

But don’t be an asshole and start using and hurting women. Get the divorce rolling and give a new person a chance and you may be happier than you were before.

Unfortunately only time and space will heal.

Couple of other things.

Limit contact with your wife to text. Get that going as soon as possible.

You are actually addicted to her. You can’t get that random hit of wife drug. You need to go as cold turkey as possible.

Stay away from music. Music only make things worse. Stick with podcast for now.

Stay busy. Keep busy. Get a new hobby.

Get all contacts you can that are connected to her off your social media.

That means her friends and family. It has to be that way. That’s just reality. You don’t need updates on her life.

If you did not have kids you would never speak or see each other again.

I wish I had better answers for you.

Unfortunately you just have to move on and take care of your self.

I wish you the best of luck.

Bor9455 - thank you and agree

I do appreciate all the advice and support, you can tell some people genuinely care and I thank them for that.

Well today, I do feel a lot better. As you say one day at a time

Thanks to all for advice, please keep them up as they really do help

You are welcome. Keep moving forward. Have you made an appointment to consult with a divorce attorney? I strongly suggest you take this move as soon as you can. Knowledge is power and having a sense of here is what your post marriage life could look like as far as alimony, child support, custody and any other issues is very powerful. The fear of the unknown of what lies on the other side of divorce can be paralyzing in some ways, at least it was for me. It was the advice here and from a close friend that nudged me to make an appointment with an attorney and I am not overstating it, but that one hour consult was life changing/life altering for me. I look back on it as a inflection point of where my approach and behaviors completely changed.

I mean, almost all of us, as we are in a sprint to the altar are not thinking much about this new marriage ending in divorce and the whole thought of divorce feels so icky and taboo, but sitting down with the attorney with my last couple years income taxes, a recent paystub, and other documentation really opened my eyes and gave me a pretty clear picture of how often I would see my son, how much money of my paycheck would be going towards alimony, child support, etc. Armed with that information, I could make informed choices such as what housing would look like and where the school would be relative to that housing and all those other details.

I also second the recommendation that you pretty much cut off all contact with your wife that isn't strictly about the division of assets and your children. I think you mentioned previously that she kind of cut you off, which is fine, but keep it that way. Stop all pursuit of her. Whatever she does is none of your business and whatever you do is none of hers. She fired you as a husband a long while ago and just never told you. It is time that you fire her from the job of wife. If something happens and you need people to confide in, open this thread and hit post message and tell us here, someone will see your post and help you. You've gotta break the habit of confiding or trying to talk to her, which again I believe has already happened, but those natural instincts or habits don't just go away.

I'll give you a silly example, I've been now looking for a different job since late last year and only in recent months has it really picked up as my job dissatisfaction and general disengagement has gone way up. I had a falling out with the CEO of the company I work at and he has made my life pretty miserable. My direct boss, mentor and friend also had to eat shit from this same guy and is in a similar spot to me mentally, but for him in his late 50s, retirement is within sight so he is just kind of waiting it out at this point. Even though he told me to look for another job and to do what was right for me and my family, it still feels really awful leaving and so I've been taking interviews and calls for new jobs, but having to do it off the radar and the one person who I most want to share with and also get advice from, I cannot tell him, because he is also still my boss where I currently work. I just got a call today that a job I was really excited about has decided to go another direction, a total bummer and the person I wanted to talk to and hear from him that it was going to be okay cannot be looped in. I have a friend network and other mentors who did help me with some advice today as I had to develop those new habits. I have been able to do it, but it has taken a lot of very conscious and deliberate efforts to get here. You will have to find a way to re-wire your thought processes to do the same so that you remove your wife and find another support network. Sure, what I talked about was a silly example, but it is also an example of, you do have to be careful about who you share with and at least I can assure you that sharing, even if it is to just vent here on SI is a much better way for you to grow and heal than trying to go back to the "wife well".

She send me a message today and insisted she has not been seeing anyone from the start, not even an emotional affair.

She said she has nothing to lose now and would tell me especially as it wasn’t face to face. She insists it was 1 person, 1 night and 1 mistake. Said she had a breakdown after it happened because of the situation she put herself in and regret.

She swears she was not seeing anyone and it was the one occasion only. Not sure I believe her but have no concrete proof. Anyway, I haven’t responded as I’m making no more effort with her.

Just wanted to give an update

She has a lot to lose if she tells you.

She becomes the villain.

She betrays you and is repositories for evil to you and your children.

Don’t just text her. Bring it up face to face.

Don’t let up.

Preferably with the counselor.

Hire a pi. You’ll find a boyfriend.

Especially when the children are with you.

But it is probably pointless at this point.

Begin the moving on process. It’s really all you can do.

If you just contacted her and asked her. You are still heading in the wrong direction.

But like I said it’s completely understandable that you are going to make mistakes.

Stay strong.

She send me a message today and insisted she has not been seeing anyone from the start, not even an emotional affair.

She said she has nothing to lose now and would tell me especially as it wasn’t face to face. She insists it was 1 person, 1 night and 1 mistake. Said she had a breakdown after it happened because of the situation she put herself in and regret.

She swears she was not seeing anyone and it was the one occasion only. Not sure I believe her but have no concrete proof. Anyway, I haven’t responded as I’m making no more effort with her.

Just wanted to give an update

Married women with families don't suddenly up and look for places to live without their family just for the heck of it. Housing is frickin' expensive and most people are not able to afford the cost of a mortgage/rent on their own, so it is just not an activity that married couples do on their own. I mean, I went back to your initial post and you mentioned that you were working some long hours at a job and your wife cited your long hours as one of her issues in your marriage...if she wanted alone time, it seems as though she had plenty of it with you working longer hours (not a shot at you brother).

No...she didn't want alone time...what she wanted was a fuck shack to test out a new boyfriend. The time she said she was at her sister's place but she wasn't, something you know for a fact, so then, where the fuck was she? I can take one guess and I'm willing to bet a years salary I'm right, she was somewhere banging it out with this mystery dude. Keep in mind that she gave you the "not in love with you speech" and then proceeded to move out to her mother's place and then this love shack she found a few weeks later.

You have to keep in mind that affairs are all just a mirage. The BS is the faithful partner who is always present in their lives and the BS is always the boring partner, because with your BS you sit down and do the boring stuff like disciplining your children, paying the bills, deciding on a budget and generally making life decisions. Meanwhile, the AP and WS can run off to have the passionate crazy donkey sex and it is all so exciting and thrilling, but it is not a real relationship or a healthy relationship.

Here is what likely happened, she left you to test out this guy, maybe he even moved in or at least spent a lot of time with her at this place and over time the glimmer and shine of a new lover began to fade as she stopped seeing him as the perfect man but rather began to see him, flaws and/or maybe the same thing happened to this guy, he had a great time with her in the sack but the thought of a serious relationship with your WW was something that he didn't want for whatever reason. Really, either one of them are possible and so is some combination of them both. Affairs are total fantasy and that fantasy really can never be sustained and eventually reality settles in. Living with someone full-time is a whole lot different than a casual sexual affair.

You had made the decision to stop worrying about her and letting her drag you in. Stop doing the pick me dance. Leave her message on read and do not respond. With every ounce of your being, fight to not respond to her. She is manipulating and gaslighting you the way she has this whole time.

This ^^^^.

1 mistake

A mistake is forgetting to grab milk when you're at the store. An A is a bunch of conscious decisions to lie, cheat, betray.

NL,

Bor is spot on. Like I said man, I’m willing to bet she was having an affair long before this. I want to just add on. If (very likely) she is having an affair, she will lie. My WW swore up and down that she wasn’t, and that I was destroying the marriage because of my suspicions. She texted me this from her boyfriends house. This was after she left me too, lied and told me she was going to a girl friends house to get some space.

There’s nothing original with affairs, they all follow almost the same script. Be strong man, don’t let her rewrite the truth you know. And you know it’s true, you just don’t want to believe it.

I finally had to stop reading the argument about who did what first. Why have none of you really talked about the sneaky, egregious behavior of finding a place to live without even giving your spouse a hint. That smacks of pure evilness to me. Unless you are misleading us, then there’s no reason for her to behave like that unless she’s just not a nice person. If, on the other hand, you were mean or vicious to her and she could not take it anymore then, sneaking away from you might’ve been her only choice. We don’t know that. We only know what you have put here. If you know in your heart of hearts that you have done nothing to cause this and she chose to be this lying sneaking person then you’re gonna have to get over thinking she’s just wonderful and you need her in your life. What you need to do is get yourself healthy. Go to bed on time. Eat good food, get off alcohol. Just do the basics of life. I always say when life is this horrible you just do the next thing. You make a list of the most important ones first, then do that, then check that off and then do the next one. Always just do the next one. One day you will realize that by getting a job, paying your bills, seeing some friends, going to the gym etc have all moved you away from your pain. Then you can find someone to date who has better morals than this.

Do not know why you have been so clueless.

You went to her sisters house and she was not there. Now you know where she was

She was saying all the wrong things about you and marriage some time ago. The affairs was going on and she was rewriting the marital history.

she went to live else where - she was seeing the OM

She was so angry about you seeing another woman - she asked the OM for commitment and he bolted. She came all sad and "devastated" back to plan B, that is you

Unfortunately you complied (may be beyond your WW expectation) and broke the heart of an innocent woman. May be she started her fun with OM again knowing that you are well in tow

It is plain that she has no emotional attachment to you hence the reason she keep everything secret (meaning no remorse)

Even now she barely want to be with you. That is to keep the status core

Unless she changed by 180 show you love and care, your best bet is to go on your own and probably try to get you "stressful" job back

Do you know the next time she would come rushing to you all sad and "devastated". When she get your divorce papers. Most probably you will drop the process and she will keep you guessing and you will fall back to your mental anguish.

Your best response now should be do your other things like the job even better. It also keep your mind from dabbling in negative thoughts. Things happened to people like getting sick. keeping head high in adversity and be productive is attractive and even WSs notice that. Getting depressed and unproductive may even give your WW perverted sense of satisfaction

[This message edited by goalong at 2:07 AM, Thursday, August 17th]

Northern,

Not that this proves or disproves anything, but ponder this scenario that happened to me:

--Wife had an affair in 2009. I was traumatized like any other betrayed spouse here. I probably handled it worse than many.

--Over time, worked on reconciliation, and things were going in the proper direction.

--In 2015, she made an about face on me much like your wife. I could literally see the resentment/anger/disdain in her eyes. Not sure what on Earth I did to have this switch flip in her, but there was NOTHING I was going to do that would warm her up to me again. She wanted a divorce, mostly due to my COUNTLESS faults in her eyes. I finally get my act(and justifiable anger) together, and work on my side of the divorce. This has elapsed over about a 4 month time period.

--She starts to act less cold. She starts to realize that I wasn't this monster that she made up in her mind. She wound up being extremely hormone imbalanced(she had a hysterectomy prior), and as she balanced back out, the 'old' her returned. I was still on the freight train to divorce at this time, due to the extreme injustice of experiencing infidelity and then this horrible treatment out of nowhere. But as some more time, and her old(good) behaviors stayed consistent, I held up on the divorce proceedings.

But here is the thing---there was absolutely, 100% ZERO INFIDELITY at this time. No PA, no EA---not the slightest bit of inappropriateness as it pertains to infidelity. It was totally in her head. I couldn't imagine anyone believing that cheating wasn't going on, but that's the honest truth. My wife will tell me today, as she looks back on that time, she almost felt like she was fracturing from the inside out. Not a mental breakdown as much as an inability to control her emotions....and who/how they were directed.

I'm not saying that your wife hasn't cheated. But I am saying that there are other possibilities for her behavior change. Maybe something you may need to consider if there are any changes in the future.

She didn’t move into her home by herself, she planned on taking both kids but daughter went with her and son chose to stay with me. She lives 2 minutes away and I know she has stayed home each night because she wouldn’t leave daughter, that said she could still of went out to meet someone, just always slept at home with daughter. Both kids are teenagers so are free to go to either house when they wish.

I have not responded to her, no intention of contacting her again, wether it was a full blown affair or a one night stand. She chose to distance herself from me and I’m too angry to want to talk to her