SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I got married last summer after being in the relationship for twelve years. The year leading up to that I thought everything was going well.

Ten years ago, I caught him going behind my back and engaging in sexual roleplay with people online after having many conversations where we both agreed that was something that counted as cheating. He even accused me of doing it at times and was very upset at that thought. (I realize now that that was projecting) He did it shortly after a large fight about conversations I had prior to being in the relationship when we had first started getting to know each other as potential partners. He had done it on my computer while I had been sleeping and then saved and sent himself screenshots. I had tried to copy and paste something else and BAM that popped up on my screen instead. I was devastated. I confronted him and he fell apart, about how sorry he was and that it didn’t mean anything I thought he was genuinely emotional/remorseful and everyone I tried talking to about it just shrugged and told me it didn’t really count for much because he wasn’t physically cheating. So, I stayed and tried to work past it, but we never got back to where we were before. Over the years I would sometimes get an off feeling about his behaviors. He’d delete messages from his phone, quickly tab out of anything he was in if he heard me come anywhere close to him. This would then devolve into arguments where he would get upset that he was doing "everything right" and I still wasn’t trusting him. Eventually it got to the point where I just felt there was something wrong with me because that gut feeling accompanied with anxiety and dread would seemingly rise for "no apparent reason." I felt broken because I couldn’t connect with him and had this building resentment that I couldn’t quite identify the source of. Looking back, I see a lot of things he said fed into this belief that the feelings were my fault and that just makes the whole situation more depressing and infuriating.

As time went on, I thought we were rebuilding back to where we were. I started seeing a therapist and untangling an admittedly large tangle of issues that were never addressed from a very unstable dysfunctional childhood. A couple years ago I started catching him in lies. Really stupid benign ones. Like, "I didn’t eat toast today." When I woke up to find the peanut butter jar still open on the counter after he’d left for work. Very annoyed I called him out on this each time. Eventually he had admitted it was a habit from childhood to stay out of trouble. At this point I feel really stupid for not seeing that as a giant red flag, but I suggested therapy to work through it. I tried to be understanding, his family *is* nuts. The first time I visited them I witnessed them all laughing using him as a verbal punching bag and was flabbergasted when he shrugged it off afterwards as, "It’s just how it’s always been." Instead of ever making a move to defend himself. He said, "He didn’t care," that it didn’t bother him.

As preparations for the wedding became more pressing and overwhelming my resentment started growing. I still couldn’t connect with him and his responses towards dredging up "The one time it happened!" were met with accusations of me being unreasonable. His exact words at one point were, "How long are you going to punish me for this!?" I really did feel like it must have been something wrong with me, some developmental deficiency from having really distant parents who evoked feelings of fear more than stability. I caught him looking at porn prior to taking his mother to a wedding dress shopping appointment. Since the beginning of the relationship, he’s been adamant about never looking at porn, "Not his style." That fact always felt off to me because I’ve never mentioned having an issue with porn. He did. He was adamant that such things were beneath him. The lying was a big issue. I should have taken that as some cosmic sign to rethink the wedding, but I didn’t. I thought he was just ashamed, and it had something to do with the whole lying because of childhood issues.

The wedding happened, it was so stressful due to family dynamics on both sides that I just kind of mentally checked out during the whole ceremony and reception. From there the stress didn’t die down. Another family wedding happened that we had to travel for and then a long honeymoon to a place I’ve always wanted to go was tainted with more fights and catching covid halfway through. We talked about getting counseling, I thought things would get better once life slowed down and we could just find a relaxed routine again.

I’m currently in my last year of college for a degree in engineering and I had thought if I crammed my schedule this semester, I would be able to relax and set up a nice job during the next semester. I was only a couple weeks into school directly after the honeymoon and my father suddenly passed away. It had been so sudden there were no plans in place so my siblings and I had to scramble to make arrangements that lead to a whole other host of family drama that could take up its own post somewhere. Stressed and mourning I felt that disconnection between my now husband and I stronger than it had ever been, and the fights got worse. I don’t know why I did it, but when he was out one afternoon I got on his computer and sifted through his emails. Trying to find something, somewhere that would explain why he was feeling so off. I found sexual pictures of him and a couple exes saved in a folder and that was enough to send me over an edge. When confronted he said he had "Forgotten" that they were there. I was on the edge of believing that was an actual possibility and then he used the one line he’s used many many times and I never took him up on before, "You can go through my phone and all my emails, I have nothing to hide." This time, I said fck it, fine. Let’s sit down and go through it together. You could tell he was uneasy with the situation, but he let me. This man had 3 different email accounts. One I had never seen before. My stomach fell and as I started to go through everything, I found pictures of more sexual roleplay. Some as recently as last year. I pointed it out and he balked, "I forgot it was there, that was the one time you caught me!" I pointed to the date and then to the list of at least 10 more emails with screen shots of sexually charged messages. "Okay, but it only happened a couple times BEFORE you caught me." Pointed to the dates again, that’s not possible. "Okay, it happened on and off for a bit after too." Line after line the truth jumped to meet the evidence. I was so enraged by the sheer audacity and stupidity of the situation. "It was never with the same person though! They were all strangers!" Point to evidence to the contrary. I felt so sick and so stupid. How could I not have seen through him? Why did I believe time after time that I was just mentally/emotionally broken and that’s why I couldn’t trust him.?

I moved into the guest room that night, three months ago. I fell apart trying to figure things out. I couldn’t eat or sleep, I would just spend hours going through the email addresses he let me keep access to. Trying to find why I was so stupid or what I did to make someone do that. I stumbled through school, my therapist and close friends suggested I should stick it out because I’m so close and it was the only structure I had left in my life after quitting my job to let him support me while I focused on finishing school. I went no contact as much as I could still living with him and being financially dependent on him. He sought therapy and ended up being diagnosed with a couple personality disorders. I told him I wasn’t going to talk about what happened until after my school semester came to a close because I can’t handle letting him try to walk through "telling me everything." The few times I let him try I would regress into a neurotic mess who couldn’t eat or sleep and I was worried if I pushed my body any further I would end up causing an accident driving to or back from school. "Telling me everything" consisted of circular stories and explanations that wandered off topic into zones of how badly he’s hurt by his own actions. The closest he even got to apologizing unprompted was saying, "I know there is nothing I can say or do to apologize for what I’ve done." He quickly said he was very sorry when I pointed that out.

At the suggestion of someone on reddit’s surviving infidelity sub I got a copy of (no soliciting) and that has opened my eyes to different ways I had successfully been manipulated and helped me get out of a couple self-destructive thought loops trying to figure out how I was to blame for this happening to me.

I agreed to go with him to one of his therapy sessions tomorrow night, though the closer it gets the more I realize I have no idea what I would even say. I feel like I don’t even know who I married. I would breakdown about having a hard time connecting to him after that first DDay and he would just lie to my face about what he was doing, what he did, and was perfectly content to let me take the blame for feeling something was off due to my history. He even admitted that he likely would have not stopped if I hadn’t caught him. He downplays it by saying they weren’t "real people" he was doing things with, just a screen. Even though he knew that the first time I caught him was so hard on me.

I’ve been avoiding him as much as I can. As far as any kind of reconciliation is concerned, I’m not optimistic. If I had any kind of control, I would have moved out even if we did want to try to reconcile just to get some space and not have to live in the same house with him surrounded by wedding décor I kept to give to my sister for her wedding next fall. The amount of disrespect and disregard for the feelings of someone he’s supposedly in love with is soul crushing. I’m not completely dead set against reconciliation, but it would take a miraculous change of character and ringing endorsements from psychological professionals for me to even consider it.

He keeps pointing out that he can’t do anything more than what he’s doing (going to therapy and "Researching" reconciliation after infidelity) but that feels wrong. My gut says he’s just waiting to be told what to do so he can make a big show out of it and convince me to come back and be like we used to be. I’m still hurt and very angry and I have no idea what I’m supposed to say or point out to be helpful in any capacity. At first, I thought, if nothing else, I could get closure. That maybe this professional would be able to translate what I was saying to sink in. Or maybe they would pick up on something that would help on bettering himself. Maybe they would be able to plot on some graph improvements in his thoughts or behaviors. Some concrete explanations beyond the really unhelpful answers I’ve been getting. "I don’t know what’s wrong with me! I shouldn’t have been in a relationship! I couldn’t control it! My needs weren’t being met! I didn’t know how to communicate"

This turned into a more drawn-out rant than I anticipated, but it’s been helpful to put it into words. I guess I’m looking for any kind of advice about the days ahead in handling this therapy meeting and any kind of advice from people who have seen or experienced infidelity of a spouse who has been financially supporting the person they’ve cheated on. I have a close friend who knows everything and would let me couch surf if worse comes to worse, but I’d rather it not come to that if possible. My family lives far away and because it "Wasn’t really cheating", they likely wouldn’t be very understanding of ending of a 6-month-old marriage.

Is there something I could be telling him to do to prove he’s actually changing? Some proof I could look for to show he’s not just a self-centered POS who is only acting in any capacity because he knows how close I am to walking away for good. Are there questions I should ask? Answers or responses to keep a lookout for? Some days I’m much more hopeful, but today I’m just kind of numb and I can’t bring myself to do much. Any help/advice would be appreciated. This person was my world, now any time I look at him I just see this sleazy car salesman type wearing the face of someone I thought really loved and respected me.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 11:43 PM, Wednesday, December 28th]

Hi YellowSnapDragon,

Oh my dear, you have found the right place but I'm so sorry you needed to find us.

There is a wealth of support and experience here. Welcome.

After reading the details of your story, I would advice you to separate to get your feet under you. You have been through so, so much and you've just plugged along and not let yourself really feel and cope with a lot of it because of your life and your course load. But it's time to get some distance and some time to youself to just get your bearings.

Get to a place where you can focus on you for a while and really take care of you.

Let him decide what he's willing to face and willing to do.

You can encourage individual counseling for him, but he really needs to take the reigns here. You should NOT be directing his work. If he doesn't direct his own work, it won't change him anyway.

Instead, take care of you for a while and surround yourself with friends who support you.

Get some distance. Get some peace. Get some healing with your own individual counseling.

Then make decisions.

My support is with you!

Betrayal hurts so bad. You have found a great place with great input. As you navigate your way through, you will encounter a lot of people here with great advice. Take what works for you and leave what doesn't.

You have made a good start by moving into another room, but no contact is extremely difficult to do while you are still together. While being in separate residents would be ideal, if that is not possible, read in the forum how to do No Contact. I really recommend you attend individual counseling (IC). IC will help you navigate this. Going to his therapy session will not be good for you. At this point he needs to figure out what is wrong with him and how to fix it.

You cannot tell him how to fix this. He has to figure out how to repair the relationship. He has to determine what is wrong, how to work towards reconciliation. What does remorse look like to him? What should it look like to you.

For you, you need to get tested for sexual diseases that he may have passed on. Do not believe it is only online stuff. You mentioned that things have felt off for years. Your gut knew something was up. You need to focus on taking care of you. The IC can be helpful for you to figure out how best to care for you.

Keep posting here, there will be others that come along.

Dear YellowSnapDragon,

Welcome. I'm sorry you have to be here, but there is a lot of worthwhile support and advice here that is worth the read. I'm not really able to give much advice, I'm more of a patient here myself than a doctor, but I will offer what I can. And by all means do as I say, not do as I do. I'm trying to wade through my own mess. I will be making tons of mistakes on this road.

First, emotional cheating is still cheating. He knows this hurts you, and he still does it; that's not good. (My wife keeps apologizing for hurting me and then keeps right on hurting me, so I'm in the same boat as you on this one.)

Second, I might try to figure out if he WON'T change or if he CAN'T change. If he won't change, then he will continue doing this. It will be almost impossible to stop the bleeding. You might have to make a hard decision about staying or going. If he can't change, then he needs professional help to figure out why he's doing this. Whether you recognize the source of his problem is beside the point. He is the one who needs to do this work with a therapist. Even if he tries to change, you may still have to make a hard decision about staying or going.

Third, you get to say what will convince you that he is changing his ways, not him. He's the one who has stepped over the line, not you. The burden is on him to meet your requirements if he wants to begin working towards reconciliation. Again, be prepared to make a hard decision if he won't give you what you need.

Fourth, trust your instincts. I ignored mine for a long time. I just thought we were going through a rough patch (you go through a lot of rough patches in forty years). I dismissed my worries about another man as foolish. They weren't foolish. I can't describe the pain, but you know what it feels like.

Fifth, you don't need to think about reconciliation at this point. It's too far down the road. No one can tell you what you must do. You are in complete control of what you believe is best for you. Having said that, my inclination is to take things day by day. If you can get up in the morning and remember why you once loved him, maybe that will give both of you enough time for him to try for a miracle save. Meanwhile, get tested and talk to a divorce lawyer. The saddest truth in my life is that you need to protect yourself, even from your spouse.

Gently, this guy has been lying to you for a decade. IMO he's not willing to change.

Your gut has been screaming for years. Trust it! He has shown you repeatedly who he is, I'm glad you are starting to believe him.

So sorry you are now a member of the best club no one wants to join.

[This message edited by annb at 12:13 PM, Thursday, December 29th]

I agree with AnnB. He has been lying and cheating for decades. Not a good sign. At this point it could be an addiction for him. I’m not a professional but his shady behavior may be very difficult for him to stop.

If nothing else, finish up your degree. That is your first priority right now.

If I can suggest — please do not "tell him" how to fix this mess or what he needs to do. He needs to figure that out in his own and actually do it. If he’s "capable of figuring out how to cheat" (😡) then he has enough brain power to figure out how to make amends and fix this situation.

Or he can be lazy and stupid (😡) and do nothing. If he does nothing, please take that as a sign that he is NOT going to man up and make amends, heal the trauma he caused you or put you and the marriage first.

He’s not a child. You don’t need to "help" him fix this mess. IMO that is a huge mistake.

Your smart move is doing the 180 and moving into a different bedroom. And seeing him in a new perspective.

"I don’t know what’s wrong with me! I shouldn’t have been in a relationship! I couldn’t control it! My needs weren’t being met! I didn’t know how to communicate"

His "needs weren't being met"??? That one always makes me furious. There's a lot more ranting about "unmet needs" in my profile if you're interested. Your WH's claims of confusion aren't believable though. If you had a "need" to masturbate while checking out a stranger's genitals, he wouldn't be the least bit murky about how bogus your "needs" are. This is a blame-shift. What he's saying it that he his integrity is conditional upon YOUR actions. He wants to fuck around with other women online and is claiming that YOU somehow make him do it.

He's been at this for as long as you've known him apparently, and I don't think you should have the least bit of guilt if you decide to file for divorce and leave. He's never given you any reason to believe that he's even capable of recovery.

That said, if you're still willing to let him try, I'd recommend he be evaluated by a CSAT (certified sexual addiction therapist) and go from there. Your run of the mill therapist isn't qualified to diagnose sexual addiction and even if that's not what this is, he'd at least be referred to the right treatment.

This kind of behavior does tend to escalate because it pleasures the reward center of the brain and just like a substance abuse problem, the user becomes accustomed to a certain dosage and then needs more to achieve the same effect. It's not too much different from cocaine use in that it's not the substance itself which creates addiction, it's the way it manipulates the body to release a feel-good biochemical cocktail. As addictions go though, the withdrawal symptoms are comparatively mild. No one gets the DT's from not opening their email. No one pukes their guts out from uninstalling a dating app. It is recoverable, but it requires work and dedication on his part.

Remember that you don't owe him that. He knows fully well that what he's doing IS cheating. The proof is that he hides is from you. And I wouldn't listen to any bullshit from family members who claim that it's not real or not adultery. You don't owe them anything either, particularly not if they lack the empathy to see what's been taken from you.

I HATE __________ cheaters!!! I am so sorry you are here. You have received good advice and in attempt to keep my post short I will address just a few things.

First:

I tried to be understanding, his family *is* nuts. The first time I visited them I witnessed them all laughing using him as a verbal punching bag and was flabbergasted when he shrugged it off afterwards as, "It’s just how it’s always been." Instead of ever making a move to defend himself. He said, "He didn’t care," that it didn’t bother him.

First, don't blame yourself for this mess - you certainly are not to blame for missing/overlooking red flags. I too did the same thing - tried to be understanding about my WH's insanely f-ed family. My WH's mother joked about how she whipped him with a riding crop when he was a child for spilling water on the coffee table. I mean she really was laughing and pointing to the crop (still hanging on the wall - WH is in his 40s and the aforementioned incident occurred when he was 7) and joking about how he would get whipped again if he spilled his glass this time. He looked pale, halfheartedly laughed, and when I was pissed off about it later he also told me it did not bother him, and he was okay with being whipped to the point of not being able to sit down for spilling a glass of water... I could give you a million examples of how screwed up and abusive his family is - but you don't need them as you have tons yourself. I too allowed myself to cut my WH a lot of slack for his own shitty behavior because I knew with his history he HAD to be messed up, and his emotional development was far outpaced by my own - so I allowed him to get away with red-flag behavior from the get go too and just brushed horrible stuff aside. DON'T BEAT YOURSELF UP ABOUT NOT SEEING IT SOONER.

Second, you asked about attending your WH's therapist appointment. You will likely get a lot of "don't go" as you will only be manipulated. Or don't go - there is no benefit to you. I actually did go to a single therapist appointment of my WH, and I will tell you it was odd, uncomfortable, and totally worth it to me. I learned that my WH was not being wholly honest with his therapist, and that despite what he indicated, he and his therapist rarely spoke of his affair and instead my WH really controlled the conversation topics - all he was doing was talking about all the things he didn't like about me and bitching endlessly about them - and trying to weigh out if we should even stay together - like it was all up to him. He was also still carrying on his A for a year until about a month before I attended the session and I learned that my WH had been lying to not only me but his therapist about that too - not confessing the A had started back up until after I caught him again.

Basically, attending the session gave me two things: (1) insight into what my WH thought was the problem was - his dissatisfaction with me, as if somehow that excused all of his bad behaviors, and (2) the opportunity to interject a few of my feelings to a neutral party who I hoped would take what I said as a future discussion topic (I had no interest in marriage counseling but I will admit it felt good to just get a few things out there to a neutral - regardless of whether my WH ever addressed them).

I did not expect some kind of miracle out of attending, nor did I get one. But it did actually help me make my decision to leave as it was so clear he wasn't doing any ascertainable work and was not really taking ownership for what he had done. (Only after I separated from him did he begin doing work in earnest...and it is clear he is different after 3 years of it).

So go if you want. Don't go if you don't feel like it. There is no right or wrong answer. I really wanted to go (I was at the "say my peace" to anyone who would listen stage) but I would say don't go if you are still apprehensive on the day. It's not your appointment so there is no need to do something else you don't want to.

I really appreciate all the messages of advice and support I received. Coming back to reread them has stopped me from reaching out to him more than I have. I did end up joining his therapy call and like ThisIsSoLonely's experience it was awkward but I'm glad I did it. There were certainly areas that I felt he had been more vague with his therapist than he made it sound and I was able to bluntly add my two cents.

Unfortunately, due to financial reasons it looks like I'll be needing to stay in the same house for awhile longer. Ideally until I graduate this spring if I can handle it (some days that seems more possible than others). After discussing the situation with my own therapist I've agreed to go to MC. So far each conversation I've tried to have with WH has been unhelpful, frustrating, and just ends up with me spiraling back square one where I can't eat or sleep without aids. Just when I think, "There is nothing more he can do or say to make this worse." It happens and I go back to being stuck in thoughts of "How could he not see how much I suffered after the first DDay to go back and do it again and again?" He said he just thought I was mad, not hurt. When I asked what he thought was happening when I fell into a depression after I caught him the first time and wouldn't leave bed for weeks except for work, he said he thought it was unrelated. How did I not realize he had so little empathy for the "love of his life"? I figured if nothing else MC could at least help us communicate/live together in a way that isn't constantly reopening the wound while I'm still here.

When will I stop being so angry? So many hateful thoughts and feelings rise up every time I see him, I wish I was back to just feeling numb.

It's an emotional roller coaster and the ride lasts longer than you want. You'll go through something like the 5 stages of grief, and anger is one. Working through it is different for everyone. I worked through mine in IC. Plus, I'd go out to the car and scream until I couldn't talk, or sit in the stoop and howl with the dog. (Lived in the country)

In-house separation (IHS) is tough. I treated XWH like a roommate until I could get my own place.

Spring is right around the corner, so stay strong.

It's an emotional roller coaster and the ride lasts longer than you want. You'll go through something like the 5 stages of grief, and anger is one. Working through it is different for everyone. I worked through mine in IC.

It really is a roller coaster! Just when I feel I'm leveling out into an okay place I remember something and can barely move from bed or want to destroy everything with a baseball bat. IC has been very helpful, but much of the time it's pointed out that it's going to take time to process how upended my life feels from his lying to me for So.Many.Years.

Plus, I'd go out to the car and scream until I couldn't talk, or sit in the stoop and howl with the dog. (Lived in the country)

I wish I could just scream more, but I live in the city and have nosy neighbors. I've taken to blasting music in the car and scream singing until my voice kinda gives out, though. It can be really cathartic, but I don't think anything beats a good primal howl.

In-house separation (IHS) is tough. I treated XWH like a roommate until I could get my own place.

There is no word for how stupid and awful the situation feels. I've been trying to act like I would with any other roommate, but it's hard constantly having to put boundaries everywhere. He'll start apologizing and reflecting mid-conversation about finances and I'll do my best to respond to it in a neutral fashion, but I just end up feeling I'm acting really cold and cruel cutting him off to make him stop. Or worse, I end up crying telling him to stop.

I hate that you had to go through this, I wouldn't wish it on an enemy. Any tips or advice on how to stay sane living as roommates with the person who flipped your life upside down?

Avoidance as much as possible.

You are only at your home to eat, sleep, shower and do laundry. Study at school. Go to a friend’s house. Go anywhere you can to avoid conversation w/ him.

If he starts talking say "sorry I have to go to the bathroom". And then go there until he gets the message OR you exit the bathroom and head out the door or go your room or somewhere where there is no conversation.

IMO the less you interact the better you are, both mentally and physically.

Set very clear boundaries with him. Tell him school is a priority and you cannot be pushed to the edge either mentally or emotionally or physically. You cannot discuss the situation with him but you will let him know when you are ready.

And then if he tries you walk away. Until he stops lying to you and trying to manipulate you.

He has so much work to do to get himself to a place where you can have a meaningful conversation about his serial cheater mentality.

As the saying goes where there is one roach there are hundreds more. Unfortunately the same can be said of many cheaters as well.

Avoidance as much as possible.
You are only at your home to eat, sleep, shower and do laundry. Study at school. Go to a friend’s house. Go anywhere you can to avoid conversation w/ him.

You're absolutely right. As a default, I'm an introverted homebody who used to love just hanging out at home. I found a lot of joy in building things for the house and garden but now it feels pointless to continue building things I'll probably have to abandon. It used to be my sanctuary, but now I have no safe place.

I guess I'll just have to make a mission out of finding quiet safe spaces where I can be a sad mess that I won't have to make small talk. Lately, I don't want to see or talk to anyone.

IMO the less you interact the better you are, both mentally and physically.

I agree. The times I have tried to talk anything out with him I've ended up back to a sobbing mess.

Until he stops lying to you and trying to manipulate you. He has so much work to do to get himself to a place where you can have a meaningful conversation about his serial cheater mentality.

The thing I'm most worried about is that he won't stop lying. I found two more additional "side" email accounts that he "forgot" about. I've told him I won't discuss anything about what happened or the relationship outside of MC which I'm hoping will limit the amount of times I end up backsliding like last semester.

He was my best friend. We did everything together. People would even marvel that we could spend so much time with each other and not get sick of each other. It really feels like a death. My best friend died and now I'm stuck living with a jerk who just happens to look like him. I really wish I would have given more energy to friendships outside of the relationship.

It is a death - the death of your M.

It's tough because you have to reprocess a lot of things, especially that he isn't who he represented himself to be. It's a good thing you found out now rather than later and facing that is tough.

YellowSnapDragon -

Checking in on you. I’m so sorry for what you’re going through. I was so happy to read you have a therapist, until the part about MC. Gently, I think that’s too soon for you. You’re still too raw, and frankly I think it will become another way for your husband to manipulate you.

My gut says he’s just waiting to be told what to do so he can make a big show out of it and convince me to come back and be like we used to be.

This is exactly what he plans to do, please finally listen to your gut. Your gut instinct is your evolutionary built in alarm that serves to protect you.

You're absolutely right. As a default, I'm an introverted homebody who used to love just hanging out at home. I found a lot of joy in building things for the house and garden but now it feels pointless to continue building things I'll probably have to abandon. It used to be my sanctuary, but now I have no safe place.

I know exactly how this feels. Your home is supposed to be your safe place. Unfortunately your home is one of your biggest triggers. Can you try to find a way to stay out of the home as much as possible e.g. in the library or studying at a Starbucks or an equivalent? Is there a sport or physical activity that you used to do that you enjoyed a lot that you can restart? Meditation can be transformative, highly recommend. Yoga isn’t for everyone but if you haven’t tried before, it may be helpful. Place a lock on your bedroom door. And a nice pair of noise cancelling headphones can be extraordinarily helpful.

When I asked what he thought was happening when I fell into a depression after I caught him the first time and wouldn't leave bed for weeks except for work, he said he thought it was unrelated.

This may mean multiple things, none of them good. It could mean your husband is so disconnected from you he didn’t instinctively feel your anguish. Maybe he’s incapable of empathy. Or he could just be lying, still unwilling to take responsibility for is actions, and more proof, he valued adultery and lying, over your health.

It really feels like a death.

Sadly, this is a common, you aren’t alone in this feeling following the discovery of infidelity. And just like experiencing a loss in death, your emotions may fluctuate, wildly, and it’s a process. That’s why JMHO it’s one of the reasons it’s too early in the process for you to attend MC.

My best friend died and now I'm stuck living with a jerk who just happens to look like him.

Gently, he was never that person. A best friend wouldn’t treat you the way he has. You have put yourself through mental gymnastics over the years to convince yourself he was a version of himself he’s never been, in complete opposition to your gut instinct that was trying to protect you from an abuser. Cheating on you and gaslighting you into believing he wasn’t are all forms of mental & emotional abuse.

I really wish I would have given more energy to friendships outside of the relationship.

It’s not too late. Do you have study groups in graduate school? If so, can you join one or form one? Are your siblings aware of what you’re going through? Is there at least one you can trust to confide in to be a support for you?

You’re blaming yourself a lot for ignoring all the signs. He weaponized your empathy and love for him against you. And ultimately, what’s done is done, we can’t change the past. Bottom line: don’t keep making a mistake because you’ve spent a long time making it.

So sorry... Infidelity is such a devastating thing to go through. I've been cheated on by two husbands, horribly.

Aletheia -

You're so kind to check in. I was able to see and read your reply on a really low day and I'm so grateful for your kindness. I did end up going to one MC meeting with a counselor my therapist suggested. It was a bit raw and I did end up getting emotional, but she was very professional and constantly made a point of letting me feel heard. She even cut him off a few times when he lost the thread. It was the first conversation since DDay with WH where I didn't feel crazy. She was able listen and pick out key issues that have made cohabitation miserable.

For example, I have been living with a nagging fear that one day he will tell his parents about our situation and they'll charge in and move to try to evict me while he'd just stand there and watch. Throughout our many years together he let them have a say in everything. Me, not so much. I would be told, not asked, when my car was being sold and replaced by his father through him. The new car we got was then put in WH's name, not mine. When WH got more serious with his career, his parents jumped up and offered a house down payment with strings. They were to be involved in the house shopping process. At first, I was leery but hopeful. After being told by his parents that all the places I found to look at weren't good enough, I ended up checking out of the process completely. His and his parents names are on the mortgage, mine is not. I just moved in and felt like I was just renting the place. When I tried expressing how unhappy I was with how controlling/involved his parents got and how he never took my side or let me have the larger say in how we lived -our- lives we started fighting a lot more. Thinking back on it just makes me so angry at myself. I just gave up so much of myself for this relationship and now I'm here. With nothing. Literally nothing is in my name. I don't even have a personal bank account, everything has his name on it. I trusted him. I thought I was safe when I had been repeatedly shown that my needs weren't important. After explaining some of this in MC she was able to direct a conversation with him about it in a way that resulted in him genuinely acknowledging that his parents/his past behavior was toxic and feeling unsafe was a perfectly rational response to my current situation. Whereas previously with just him, he told me I was overreacting and paranoid. I realize he might still be just playing the game of saying/doing the right things to win me over but at this point I'm grateful that the more distressing aspects of living under the same roof are being addressed in ways that make living here while I have to slightly less hellish.

We did schedule another MC session. And while the last one wasn't pleasant, it was validating. She was sympathetic to my position with the amount of major life events happening on top of finding out his lies and it was so nice that she would call him out and not let him spiral into a pity party like he has done every time we've tried to even talk or text one on one. It finally feels like there is an adult in the room, listening to me and understanding what I'm feeling and explicitly saying they are valid and make complete sense for what I'm going through in front of him. I'm glad my therapist, who knows everything about the situation, recommended her and after meeting with her my fears of being manipulated went away. I got to explain, out loud, that at this point it didn't matter what I felt or wanted regarding the relationship/reconciliation because it had been made clear that this relationship was very unsafe and even if by some miracle he turned into a reformed saint overnight I wanted to move out as soon as possible to get distance and start properly healing. That the reason I was coming to MC sessions was to make living together less stressful and reducing the amount of times I spiraled back to square one because my brain so desperately wants to make sense of who this person is and what, if any, parts of the relationship were actually real. That every time I end up trying to talk to him about it one on one I only to find more TT and answers that still don't line up. I really do wish I could just shut down that need to understand.

Sorry, that was a really long rambling way I was trying to say that I'm really touched that you were worried about me, but that with this particular arrangement I feel safe from manipulation. The only things he's being asked to do are things that will help me move out and try to build a life on my own.

I know exactly how this feels. Your home is supposed to be your safe place. Unfortunately your home is one of your biggest triggers. Can you try to find a way to stay out of the home as much as possible e.g. in the library or studying at a Starbucks or an equivalent?

I do have a friend I will be spending this weekend with (maybe longer) while her roommate is out of town. I spent a couple weeks with her a couple months after DDay and it helped a lot. I have been trying to adjust my schedule so I can spend more time in the Campus library, but I've ended up messing up my sleep schedule and just staying in bed until I *have* to leave for class. I've slipped back into a pretty deep depression, but I'm in the process of receiving medications that should help me. I'm just waiting on the Insurance/Pharmacy to get sorted so I can pick them up.

Is there a sport or physical activity that you used to do that you enjoyed a lot that you can restart? Meditation can be transformative, highly recommend. Yoga isn’t for everyone but if you haven’t tried before, it may be helpful. Place a lock on your bedroom door. And a nice pair of noise cancelling headphones can be extraordinarily helpful.

A few friends have suggested I look into kickboxing for anger/stress relief and that does sound like something that I could enjoy and get a lot out of. The campus may even have free classes, if not in kickboxing, at least something to get moving again. I've noticed my body has suffered from bad sleeping and eating on top of being very inactive and I know that's something that could provide a lot of help with feeling so crumby all the time. I've been listening to a lot of audio books on meditation. I've been going through Thich Nhat Hahn's books and meditations and he has a lot of good material on handling suffering and self compassion that I've found helpful. IC meetings have made it very clear that I'm very bad at being kind to myself. I have been shopping around for noise canceling, I think that's a really good idea, thank you.

This may mean multiple things, none of them good. It could mean your husband is so disconnected from you he didn’t instinctively feel your anguish. Maybe he’s incapable of empathy. Or he could just be lying, still unwilling to take responsibility for is actions, and more proof, he valued adultery and lying, over your health.

This is the thing that eats at me the most. He's mentioned multiple times how he didn't understand how bad he was with empathizing with me until after the fact. He's even admitted that he now sees how some of the things he did were abusive. He seemed to be remorseful when he said it, but at this point I'm not buying anything he's selling. He's clearly got a mountain of things to work through. There was always the feeling, even during the good times, that he wasn't letting me in to see the real him. I realize now that he's probably really emotionally stunted and because it was never addressed (apparently he showed some concerning symptoms as a child but they were ignored) it manifested in really toxic ways underneath behaviors that were used to mask the severity. He's told me multiple times now that he sees now that he "wasn't ready to be in a relationship" and is "sorry he didn't recognize that when we got together." Twelve years ago. Punch straight to the heart there.

Are your siblings aware of what you’re going through? Is there at least one you can trust to confide in to be a support for you?

They are not yet. I've arranged to call the sister I'm closest to to talk about some of it because she wants to come and celebrate me walking across the graduation stage this spring. She's currently in the middle of planning her own wedding so I've been really resistant in telling her. She's already stressed and two of the long term relationships she had before this one ended due to infidelity and I really don't want my situation to be triggering. I'm not really close to the rest of my family and if I could have gotten away with it I wouldn't tell anyone until I had to. They all love him and I don't want to have to listen to them tell me it "wasn't as bad" as I make it sounds. "It's not like he actually physically cheated."

You’re blaming yourself a lot for ignoring all the signs. He weaponized your empathy and love for him against you. And ultimately, what’s done is done, we can’t change the past. Bottom line: don’t keep making a mistake because you’ve spent a long time making it.

Yeah, I agree with you. I trusted him a lot, but you're supposed to trust the person your with. Tearing myself down for allowing myself to be vulnerable in a situation like this isn't constructive. I am trying to work on giving myself the kindness and understanding I need to heal. This situation has led me to a lot of reflecting on ways I was treated as a child that really reinforced the idea that my feelings don't matter and that my worth is entirely dependent on how other's thought of me. I think that played a really large roll in accepting how I was treated and not listening to my gut instinct.

I really do just need to spend a lot of time developing a healthier relationship with myself after this nightmare ends. It's going to be a long time before I feel like I can be in a position to be in a relationship again. And I'm learning to be okay with that. One moment at a time.

I’m going to share a story that happened to a friend of mine. She was married to a man who got wealthy fairly quickly after they married. On top of that he was the golden child of the family and his parents thought he could do no wrong and if anything did go wrong it was her fault. This went on for years until one night at a restaurant with his entire family she got so sick of them all including her husband that she stood up, left the restaurant, got in a car, and drove around this huge city for hours and hours, and scared the hell out of her husband. Not too long after that they separated because when he asked her if she loved him she said no. That was the first time in that entire relationship where she actually stood up for herself. It scared him so badly because he genuinely loved her. They had a lot of counseling before she would even begin to think about reconciliation, and one thing she did was get a very good paying job so that she can always look after herself and her children financially. One thing that I know, and many people on here know, is that the person with the money has the power in a family, and if they mistreat you you are backed into a corner. Do not let this man interfere with your schooling because you need to get out and get a job. You will not believe the power that gives you and you will walk down the road without looking back. You will have a brand new life.

[This message edited by Cooley2here at 1:58 PM, Friday, February 3rd]

YellowSnapDragon -

I’m happy to be wrong! It sounds like the MC is helpful to you. IME most MC’s are not very good so I was worried. And I’m glad to read you have some friends as support, even your sister as a support even though she’s preoccupied, it’s a good feeling to know that you have someone if really needed and aren’t completely alone. I’d bet your sister would want to know what’s going on with you and would feel bad if you held this all in because of a wedding.

With nothing. Literally nothing is in my name. I don't even have a personal bank account, everything has his name on it.

I’m not sure in divorce if it matters that it’s all in his name. You may be completely SOL if it’s in his parent’s name. Once you’re ready, a divorce lawyer will be able to help you navigate that. And you aren’t ending up with absolutely nothing. You have education and you’re likely to come out of this a much more self aware and stronger person. That’s invaluable!

He's told me multiple times now that he sees now that he "wasn't ready to be in a relationship" and is "sorry he didn't recognize that when we got together."

Well gee thanks 12 yrs later LOL. But seriously, as much as this may hurt to hear him say, at least he has glimmers of self introspection and you can walk away 110% knowing you are not at fault. Most BS’s don’t get this kind of admission and reassurance.

I've been listening to a lot of audio books on meditation. I've been going through Thich Nhat Hahn's books and meditations and he has a lot of good material on handling suffering and self compassion that I've found helpful.

This is awesome. And kickboxing is so much fun. There’s hundreds of free videos on the You Tube if money is an issue and you can do it at home. In person is even better punching a glove or bag!

Also, congratulations on your upcoming graduation 🎉🎊

Reading about his parents,and how he's ok with their treatment of you,etc, it's quite obvious THIS is who he is. He is a spoiled,entitled liar and abuser,who gets off on manipulating you. He enjoys watching his parents put you down, abuse, and control you. The man you thought he was,never existed. He has lied about so many things,right from the start.

You sound like a kind,intelligent, accomplished young woman. Staying with him will only impact you negatively. You sound like you're trying to convince yourself to stay, when the healthy thing to do,is leave him.

[This message edited by HellFire at 9:15 PM, Tuesday, February 7th]