SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I have no idea if my wife is cheating on me. I hope you will listen to my story anyway.

My wife and I had been suffering from a semi-dead bedroom for a long time. When we had sex, it was ok. But then we would go weeks without sex. Often it was only 1 or 2 times a month. I would get turned down often. We had many, many talks...some of them very emotional about it. She would promise to change, and things would get better for awhile, but then things would go right back to where they were.

But it wasn't just sex that was missing. It was intimacy. I distinctly remember getting a haircut in Japan, and the woman did a quick scalp massage afterwards. I remember being surprised by how nice it felt to be touched like that. Then I realized that I hadn't been touched like that by my wife in a long time. She always said it was because she was just so stressed out all the time between working and the kids. So I tried to take as much off her plate as I could. I started doing all the dinners and grocery shopping. I became the primary driver of the kids to sports, etc. Nothing changed.

Then I started seeing the signs:
- She was distant
- low affection
- peck kisses
- low interest in family
- more interest in how she looked, putting on make-up more
- working late (she is a teacher)
- suddenly stopped wanting to receive oral sex

Then I noticed weird signs. She changed the passcode on her phone. I discovered it when I picked it up for something random. We share everything, so it wasn't unusual to use each other's phones. She gave me the password right away, and said she changed it because the kids figured it out. But it was just weird, you know? And she didn't enable her car to read her texts outloud...which is something she always liked about my car before she got the new one.

But what really bothered me was her absolute lack of effort for big events. Mother's Days were elaborate. Homemade poached eggs and strawberry waffles in bed. Picnics to every botanical garden withing 100 miles of our home. Father's days were meh. On our 20th anniversary, I surprised her with a trip to Paris and a diamond necklace. I started planning and saving for it the day after our 10th anniversary. I worked with her boss to schedule her time off and ensure she had a substitute. A week before our 20th, she said she still didn't know what she was going to get me...ugh. She did almost nothing for my retirement after 25 years in the military.

I became convinced she was cheating on me. And once I got that in my head, it just wouldn't leave. I kept it to myself, but I was slowly dying inside. One day she had to work on Saturday (new parent's). She got all made up. Then, she called me from work and told me she was going to meet an old girl friend for lunch afterwards. I drove to the restaurant and camped out...and then she came out...with the girl friend. She didn't see me, but I was ashamed for having doubted her. But I still felt like something wasn't right.

I got to go to Hawaii for a work trip and we decided to make a mini-vacation out of it. I figured that this was our chance to reconnect. Away from the stress of our daily lives. After the second time she turned me down for sex, I finally lost my temper. I blurted out, "Are you having an affair?" She appeared shocked, then she cried. But she swore up and down no.

When we got back, she went to IC. (I thought that was weird, since I finally agreed to MC, but she said that she needed IC first). Almost immediately, everything changed. She became crazy intimate and crazy sexual. And it didn't seem forced. She touched my arm at dinner one night, and I was amazed at how nonchalantly flirty it was. I was like, where has this been for the last 10 years? I thought it may be the zoloft she had started taking, but it turns out that zoloft actually reduces libido. It honestly felt like she was love-bombing. It felt like to me that she had been caught and was trying to fix things.

She has continued to swear up and down that there has never been anyone else. She even had me go to a session with her therapist so that I could maybe understand why she had been so closed off. And I have found NOTHING. I consider myself pretty tech savvy, but I have found nothing suspicious. No text messages, no weird phone records, no emails, no weird locations...nothing. But she is a pretty smart girl too, so I'm unsure what this proves.

The fact remains that I FEEL like she cheated on me. I feel it in my core, and it is killing me. The attention now is great, but I am so resentful...and it is growing. We attended my buddy's military retirement last week, and his wife did so much for him. It really triggered all those negative feelings I had from before. I'm just so hurt and angry, and I can't come to grips with the fact that I won't ever really know for sure. To be honest, she told me that she feels like she is suffering from having to regain my trust, even though she never cheated.

Currently, she has been on a work retreat since Thursday night. It's a all female group, and most of them are pretty old, so I shouldn't have doubts. But I'm having nightmares. And she has sent me maybe 4 texts all weekend.

I just can't go on like this. I feel like I deserve better. I had made up my mind to leave after the Hawaii incident, but didn't tell her. Seeing the work she has put in made me stay. But now I don't know if its enough. Or maybe its too little, too late. But it would also be ridiculous for me to split up our family over something she might not have even done.

I'm sorry for the long message. And I'm sorry for equating my pain with some of you who have definitely experienced infidelity. I'm just so hurt and sad. I just wish I knew for sure, either way.

Mindracing, sorry you find yourself here with the many concerns you have.

If your gut tells you something's wrong, it is wise to believe it. You are correct to follow up with checking on her. While you haven't found any evidence of infidelity, it may be well hidden. My XWW was amazing at covering her tracks.

It's always possible your wife is dealing with personal struggles and handling her feelings and behavior in a way that leads you to believe she's cheating. However, I recommend you stay vigilant. You can seek assistance from a private detective, though it's not cheap.

Please make sure you are taking care of yourself (most of us here have dealt with the consequences of extreme stress on one's body).

I wish you the best of luck as you process it all and seek the truth.

Dear Mindracing,

Where there's smoke,

There's fire.

Trust your gut, because in times like this, in situations like this , your gut is much much smarter than your head.

Oh, and in defiance of a distinct clique here, Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get you.

I think there are two issues here.

Has your wife cheated on you is one issue.

The second is your lack of intimacy and attention from your wife (includes lack of sex).

The lack of intimacy may or may not have anything to do with cheating. It could just be your wife. As the saying goes "she’s just not that into you".

Then there is the issue of cheating — is it linked to the lack of intimacy or is it just something that you Suspect?

In either case, if you are unhappy with the M, You can D her. That is your choice to make.

You are not going to file for D without addressing this in IC first, are you?

ALWAYS trust your GUT!! My H had his A while working alone overseas. We were an ocean apart...yet my GUT was screaming at me that something was OFF . My H was gaslighting me...manipulating me...making me think I was CRAZY for feeling that way. It wasn't until he had come back home...TWO DAYS LATER...that he confessed to what my GUT had been telling me was right all along. It HURT...but there was also a sense of RELIEF in knowing that I was not going crazy at all.

There are a lot of same sex A's that happen...so MAYBE...the old girlfriend could be her adultery co-conspirator? Maybe NOT. But you feel something is OFF...and you should keep pursuing it. There are several people on here who have asked for their spouse to take a polygraph...and end up getting a parking lot confession. Yep...the Wayward will wait until the very last minute before coming clean at times . Maybe by just asking if she would be willing to do a polygraph to ease YOUR mind...it will be very telling for you. Like Dr. Phil says...People who have nothing to hide...hide nothing. I know I wouldn't have any issue taking a polygraph if it would ease my H's mind.

This is extraordinarily difficult.

What you have clear evidence of is a great deal of distance in your relationship for a long time. That has to be faced and discussed. The current shift (or love bombing) isn't the resolution; it's a bandaid.

How long has the distance and lack of intimacy been going on?

What has she said about that? In just a few lines, you have provided many clear examples to us about the distance and lack of care.

What is difficult is the cheating and whether or not that's what's happened. Yes, a lot of your examples of distance are also classic signs of an affair. I'm also a believer in "trust your gut"...that instinct has served many of us here.

Yet there is also a psychological effect called confirmation bias--once we get an idea or belief in our heads, we seek evidence to confirm it. So our perception becomes a bit skewed.

Yet, you seem to present a balanced view of various incidents: she changed her password (weird), yet she seemed willing to provide you with the new password when asked.

I wouldn't lay your spidey senses down. I would pursue avenues maybe you haven't yet. Phone records? Her location history? Has she changed her password again or do you still know it? What are her mosted used apps? Does she have apps you don't know about...especially messaging apps?

About the lunch with a girlfriend. I truly hate to send you down a different spiral, but it isn't outside the realm of possibility that an affair partner is same sex. Could her girlfriend be a girlfriend?

I don't mean to make your situation worse. I may be biased about the distance as proof, since the distance and lack of care in our relationship grew when my fWH was having his affairs. His energy and focus were elsewhere and his needs were being fulfilled elsewhere.

You seem to have your head on straight. I'm so sorry you are living in limbo about this. It is a difficult position to be in.

[This message edited by BreakingBad at 3:11 PM, Sunday, October 2nd]

I suggest you see a doctor for assistance with sleep and controlling your mood.

You attended a session with her IC to understand why she's been so closed off.

What was the reason(s)????

Same sex affair are so hard to catch. First you can not play cop 24/7. Second girls night out or AP night out? They can get so much time together
My wife did things with her GF that if that was a man you would not allow that.
We were away and she had to call her every day because she was alone didn’t have anybody. We go out to lunch the server asked where your GF today ? She had to go to GF house to go shopping with her

LIke others, I suggest you turn this around.

You're unhappy in your M. Unfortunately, it's up to you to do something about it. My suggestion is to ask for what you want. Give your W a chance to 'yes', 'no', 'here's my problem', or ?

I know it's difficult to ask for what you want. I know it's not intuitive. My experience, though, is that it works.

I feared a lot of 'no' answers, because that would mean I had to seriously consider leaving. But is that so bad? If my partner wouldn't give me what I want, what good is she to me?

Your W is also probably unhappy, and it's up to her to do something about her unhappiness. If she's chosen to cheat, she's made a terrible choice, worse IMO for her than for you. You can leave, after all, and she has to stay with her cheating self.

You mention MC. I urge you to have the MC address your wants and your W's. Maybe you're a good fit for each other; maybe not. If not (or, if you're no longer a fit), then MC can be used to fogure out where to go from here.

I'm very sorry you're going through this. I didn't go through the 'is she cheating or not?' stage for very long, but I remember it was excruciating. I believe you can shorten your uncertainty by asking for what you want and evaluating your W's responses.

Cynthia A. Graham from the University of Southampton, Catherine H. Mercer, Clare Tanton, Kyle G. Jones and Anne M. Johnson from University College London, Kaye Wellings from the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine and Kirstin R Mitchell from the University of Glasgow conducted the study, which found that lack of interest in sex was higher among women who had been in a relationship for more than a year. In fact, women who had been in a relationship between 1 and 5 years were 45% more likely to have lost interest in sex than those who had been in a relationship for less than a year. Those in a relationship between 5 and 15 years were 137% more likely and those in a relationship for over 15 years were 131% more likely.

I hope you will at least entertain the idea that she may have other issues unrelated to cheating. Working through every angle with an IC will help you advocate for yourself in a way that gets your needs met without making assumptions or possibly false accusations that could make the situation worse instead of better. You need help sorting this out and deciding where to go from there.

When you are a hammer, everything is a nail.

[This message edited by OwningItNow at 5:44 PM, Sunday, October 2nd]

I totally understand what you are going through. My W and I went through a similar period. Lots of red flags, my gut was screaming at me and I ignored it.

Stay vigilant and if she is doing something it will be found out.

Red flags? Yes. Could it be an affair? Yes. Former Army here, it happens a lot in the military.

Just realize you have arrived here at the hammer convention and anything sticking up tends to look like a nail to us here. Meaning, SI will help you investigate more thoroughly (several Sherlock Holmes reside here) and it is so helpful if you are in infidelity but it could be a dangerous place if you already believe there was an affair despite having no concrete proof at all. It would be prudent to investigate more but brother, a dead bedroom and dressing up for parent's day is not proof of an affair. Not yet.

Have you checked text, phone call and app history? Purchases? Phone location data? Browser searches?

Everyone, thank you for the nice responses.

In no particular order, here are some responses to the questions you all asked.

-Things have been a lot better. Almost too good in fact. That is leading to some of my fears I think. We had had a lot of emotional conversations over 10-15 years where I explicitly told her what I needed. Nothing ever really changed. Then all of a sudden, it did. She was diagnosed with anxiety, and my wife attributes everything to the zoloft. To the point that she is terrified of missing a dose. But I don't see how anxiety would affect affection and intimacy.

-I'm pretty sure it's not a same-sex affair. At least I'm pretty sure it's not with the girlfriend she went to lunch with. I would honestly say that my wife does get turned on by attractive women. (We went to a strip club once...her idea!). But her friend is not her type?

-I've secretly monitored both her work and personal emails from time to time. Again, not a invasion of privacy since we have given each other permission to go into each other's emails to find tracking numbers, school emails about the kids, reservation numbers, etc. (Well, she probably doesn't know I check her work email from time to time...but she used the same password). I've checked battery usage on her phone, and no weird apps show up. But it's trivial to set up a secret gmail email. And iMessage doesn't appear in text message logs.

-I definitely need IC. I'm a little over-extended right now. Work, coaching middle school football, 2 executive boards, 3 kids. I know I need to take care of myself too. I'm just over-committed right now. Something has to give though, and I rather it not be my sanity or my marriage, so I will take care of it.

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One other thing I would like to mention.
One day a couple of years ago, my wife mentions that she rode with a (guy) parent (we'll call him "B") to one of the field trips. She works in a private school, so they rely on parent volunteers for field trips. She talks about how nice the guy is and how she thinks he and I would get along.I tell her that I am uncomfortable with her driving with male parents, and I ask her to avoid doing so if possible. She agreed. One of her co-workers was once really aggressive in trying to have an affair with me, and I built real barriers to limit our interaction. (I would never tell my wife, but I was really tempted by the coworker). My wife felt it was fair for her to do the same thing.

A year later, we are at a school picnic, and she introduces me to this same guy "B" and his wife "S". Over the last year, our daughters had become best friends. But, the energy was just weird. He was really awkward towards me, which I felt was odd since we both had military backgrounds. But he seemed comfortable talking to my wife. And my wife, who is pretty shy, seemed comfortable talking to him. Big red flag for me.

Then I find out he was a firefighter (my wife has a thing for firefighters). Then I find out (from my daughter) that his station is literally within walking distance of my house. Alarms are going off big time. Again, no personal emails. No texts. 1-2 emails about school work. I remain silent but vigilant. One day when S and B's daughter is being dropped off at my house for a playdate, I spy through our ring doorbell the interaction between B and my wife. (How crazy is that?!) I wanted to see how they interacted when I wasn't around. Nothing weird. He actually didn't even get on the porch. (but then again, it's obvious we have a ring...see how my mind is spinning?!)

Then this year, B and S withdraw their daughter from the school. Awesome, I think. Now my wife has absolutely no reason to see him at all. Then my mom asks my wife to start a Girl Scout troop. My wife tells me, she is going to ask S to help since S and B are experienced campers. The thought of B being on a camping trip with my wife is just something I can't stand.

Later, after a good day, and after everything blows up and is getting better, I tell her my concerns and ask her to cut them out of our life. She has asked me to cut out a few ex-girlfriends that I had remained friends with. And I did it willingly. I felt it was fair for me to ask the same thing.

I must say, I was a bit disappointed in her response. She said it felt like I didn't trust her. And she was sad to cut out two of the only parents that supported her in her first year at that school. I guess, I was hoping she would say, "sure honey". A couple of days later, she agreed to do it, but I relented...mostly because I didn't want my daughter to lose her best friend.

My wife now tells me everytime she sees B (due to their son still being at my wife's school, but not in her class). My wife has refused to drop off my daughter at their house and instead sends me. So I guess it's ok. But I still remember the weird energy my wife and B had at that school picnic. And I am resentful that that energy wasn't being directed at me at a time when it was missing in our relationship.

I guess that is a lot of words to say that I need IC. But thank you for letting me get these thoughts out of my head.

You know what you know.

Your wife sounds extremely selfish. Pairing that with the red flags you’ve been noticing, it sounds like her cheating would be the obvious answer.

However, she’s selfish. Glaringly so. You know you cannot control her. Only yourself. If she’s been selfish this long, she won’t change.

Is cheating a dealbreaker for you or is it something you can work through?

Hey OP, I'm going to weigh in. One thing I was taught in the army to spin the map. When I was setting up a defensive position, my instructor told me spin the map and ask myself, how would I attack this position...then defend against that. If you were going to cheat and knew your W had the passwords to your phone, would you use it? Oftentimes we find what we look for, or inversely, we fail to find that which we do not want to find. Is your W cheating? Odds are, she is probably doing shit she should not be doing. Who knows what that is.

But here's the kicker. It sounds like your relationship is suboptimal, and by this I mean pretty shitty. She gets what she wants and you don't. She doesn't have to be cheating for you to pull the plug. Your not bound by an ironclad contract. You know how cheaters often claim they cheated because their needs were not being met? Yeah, well, if your needs are not being met, you can walk. Just do it in an upfront and honest way. Stand up and say this is what I need you provide it. Do you agree? The greatest power you have is to disengage. Find out what's best for YOU and do it. If she is not being an equal partner in the relationship, she has unilaterally rewritten the terms, and that's not fair to anyone.

You've come here, so you're open to outside help. I do encourage you to find your own therapist to go over things with.

As others have pointed out, you don't have to stay married if you don't want to. I wonder if you feel you need a "reason" to divorce your wife to alleviate some guilt or societal pressure or something? From the outside, it looks like you are very invested in your wife being a cheater even though all of your digging and surveillance have been fruitless. Instead of being relieved by this, you almost seem . . . annoyed by it? It sounds like you are driving yourself mad because you won't be happy until you prove she is a cheater. But what if she just isn't?

I must say, I was a bit disappointed in her response. She said it felt like I didn't trust her.

This is true. You don't trust her.

I take Zoloft and I have at times suffered from low libido. When I first went on it, I went up to 75 mg and it did kill my libido. I weaned off of it, but then my anxiety came back. I went back on at 50 mg and have had no libido issues. And I'll say that being less anxious certainly helps set the stage for feeling in the mood. I'm just sharing this to say that it's possible that your wife's libido has not been harmed by the Zoloft, and that the Zoloft has helped alleviate whatever outside issues were making it hard for her to focus on her sexuality.

Here's what I've learned after having been cheated on. You can't protect yourself from being hurt in life (loving others means leaving yourself vulnerable to being hurt). You can't surveil or out-maneuver or cajole your partner into being faithful. And this is actually liberating because it means you don't have to drive yourself crazy trying to do the impossible. The person you should trust 100% is yourself . . . if you are being lied to and/or cheated on, you will figure it out sooner or later. No one is smooth enough or tech savvy enough never to get caught. So don't spend precious moments of your life laying traps.

Maybe it's not the trust that has been broken in your marriage. Maybe it's simply the love. Maybe those years of distance and lack of affection were a deal breaker for you. That's OK. You are allowed to walk away over that. You don't need your wife to be a cheater to move on.

But if you are going to stay in the marriage, then really examine what you're doing. You're refusing to take her word for it or the evidence of your own eyes. You are doing things that you probably feel are beneath two healthy partners because you FEEL like she is cheating on you. But trust isn't a feeling. It's a choice. We're able to make that leap of faith because we know that we are strong and we'll be OK even in those times when our trust was misplaced. I encourage you to figure out why you are conflating your valid feelings of having been rejected in the past with a belief that she is cheating now. They are two separate things. One of them is solidly based on her actions in the past. One of them is based entirely on feelings despite your best efforts to find evidence.

^^^^ This is very well said and is what I see. It's as if you prefer her to be a cheater because then you can feel angry, but if she did not love you, you will only feel hurt.

Gently, IC in your sitch looks like it's putting you oxygen mask on first in an airplane. With the stress of not knowing where your M is going weighing on you, I doubt that you're giving your best to any of your commitments.

It might very well be past time for youto resign from one or more of your commitments.

I'm not saying that your activities are causing your W to cheat. I'm saying that your activities may very well be cheating yourself. If that's what is happening, your best bet is to stop doing that and attend to meeting your own real needs.

I appreciate everything. You guys have given me some things to think about.

SWMNBC:
I don't trust her fully. I want to. But I don't get in her way (for example, she was on a retreat all weekend for work). But I'm definitely wary. I think I was looking for reassurance that she put our relationship above everything else. Even if there wasn't any cheating, I definitely felt that it was a potential landmine, and I was hoping to change course before we stepped on it.

I would say that it's more than just feelings that she cheated. There are a lot of yellow flags that in aggregate signal a possibility that she cheated on me. I'm just trying to reconcile the yellow flags with good explanations. Your experience with Zoloft helps me a lot.

OwningItNow:
I'm already angry. At least if she was cheating, I could understand and move on. But I am resentful of the past. Especially since things are so much better now.

Sisoon:
All of the commitments are a very recent thing. Like within the last 2 months. Just realizing now that I'm overextended and will fix it.

Everyone, thank you for the words, truly. It was therapeutic getting this out of my head and down on the proverbial paper. And I'll take your advice to go to IC and figure out what I want. You all make a good point that the presence of cheating (or not) is almost irrelevant.

Take care, community.