SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Sorry but this will be long. I have never posted online before but just need to get everything out as I’m being torn apart
Me 48
Husband 50
Married 15 years

History: We met at the end of unhappy 1st marriages, we both divorced, we stayed together got married and had a fantastic 15 years. 2019 I suffered serious illness but got through it. 2020 during COVID we spent 8 months and all our time together and loved it. 2021 we decided to relocate from the uk to Spain. We sold our house etc and moved Jan 2022. As he was not yet old enough he could not retire so we agreed that he would commute between Spain and the UK for work. Time apart varied from 5 days to 2 weeks. We knew it would be tough but he was retiring Nov 22 so there was a date to aim for.

He doesn’t enjoy being on his own a lot so over the months I’ve told him to do something he hasn’t done before, visit museums, new areas, old areas etc.
About 6 weeks ago he told me he had tracked an old school friend down, told me all about her, her life, her family, her marriage breakup early in 2022. At the time he said that it was like 35 years didn’t exist and they hit it off really well. I was so pleased. Pleased he had found something to fill his days, pleased he had reconnected with an old friend. I took no notice of the fact they had been a couple at 14, that was 35 years ago. Over the next few weeks he spent a few days with her and her child and I found myself getting a bit jealous. Why I asked myself, he worships me and the foundation of my world is that I know just how much he loves me. He told me after a while that he really cared about her, shes just like me in many ways, they were great friends blah blah. Again I was pleased for him I never gave it a second thought.

On a recent home visit to me he started talking in his sleep, called me by her name and said some inappropriate things. The following day I tackled him about it and he confessed that he was in love with her and that he was really messed up and he didn’t know how he could be in love with 2 people. They had talked about it and she felt the same. No sex but they could talk about everything and anything and wondered why they’d split up at 15ish. He wanted to be completely honest with so over the last 2 weeks while with me has told me absolutely everything. Obviously in shock I have tried to understand, tried to talk, cried and shouted a bit too. He keeps telling me there are things I want to hear and things I don’t. His emotions have gone from I’m in love with someone else then to I can’t be without you then to I don’t know if we are over and finally to I have to spend the next 6 weeks with OW to fit in a lifetime of friendship before I say goodbye to her (I’m due back to the Uk in 6 weeks). For the 2 weeks he was with me he told me when he was texting her, told me when he was going out to call her insisting that she didn’t know he was telling me his feelings and if she didn’t hear from him she would worry. He has said more things in his sleep that have been heartbreaking.

All this time telling me how I would never know how much he loved me and always would and that he was destroyed. He didn’t want to break 3 peoples hearts and that he would be the biggest loser. I have struggled with how he can break her heart when they have only been in contact 6 weeks. It was possibly the worst 2 weeks I’ve been through, my emotions are shot.

So as it now stands he left me in Spain a week ago. He’s gone to work his head out as only he can do it in his own way but day after he arrived he went straight to her, telling me obviously first. He is "happy" there and doesn’t want to go back to his bed sit and be on his own. He didn’t want things to change between us and for the first few days we exchanged texts and calls but I had to put a stop to it. I’ve told him I have to take a step back, I can’t pretend everything is ok while he thinks about leaving me.

I told him I thought he was having a crisis of some kind. New country, early retirement, his own ill health. I even send him an article on an EA all the way along saying I love him and want to get through this together. I can’t just throw 15 years away without a bloody good fight. He just tells me nothing he reads will help he has to work it out and he’s broken and wants to be better.

I’ve done a week of tears, shouting at myself. How could he do it, what have I done, he’s a complete idiot, she’s as messed up as he is and everything in between. I can’t believe I’m in this situation. In my heart deep down I know I’ve lost him,I just don’t think he has the courage to say it but I am finding it far too difficult to just throw it all away that easily. I’ll do whatever it takes to help him but he’s not open to counselling he just in his own head, living with her and talking to her about everything. What kind of a fool am I to know my husband is with a woman he "loves" while I’m in a different country with few friends on my own and say I need to step back and have no contact. Am I giving him an easy option out? I told him the door wasn’t shut but he needs to sort himself out and I need to process.

Everything happens for a reason I say and usually we never know. This is one I’d really like to understand. How long do I wait for his "decision", I’m scared of prompting it as I think I know what it will be. I miss him so very much, miss out texts or daily numerous chats. I’m trying to be strong and tell myself I’ve done nothing wrong and I’m not a bad person and I will be ok but sometimes I just don’t believe myself. I wish the tears would stop.

First I am so very sorry you are here and I am so sorry that your WS could do this to you. There are MANY more that will come to your aide here and give you more detailed advice. I just wanted to let you know that someone is out there and hears you and KNOWS how absolutely gutted and disoriented and lost you feel.

From personal experience (and from not taking most of the advice I am about to give you when it was given to me, I know what I am about to say is not what you want to hear): Your WS may or may not ever want to come back to you. AND you can't control what he will do or do much of anything to get the outcome you desire from him. You can control YOU.

Is there anyone local, nearby, in real life that you can confide in? When I discovered my WH's A with a friend/co-worker I was working on a temporary 9 month to a year temporary position out of state, about 3 hours away from my WH by plane, and I knew no one there at all. To add to all of the feelings I had from the chaos my life was, I was very very LONELY (hence my username). It was a horribly lonely time. If you don't have anyone there in person that you can confide in, talk to someone in real life on the phone if you can. Someone you can rely on to be there for you. If you don't have anyone like that there are plenty of people on this site you can turn to - we have all been there. My real life friends, and friends I made in real life from this site were my lifeline then - lean on who you need to lean on now.

The fact likely is that you WH is having a great old time running around like a teenager with a new crush. The fact that he is even telling you what he is doing means he thought about you more than my WH did me, but it is likely also his way of absolving himself of his behavior - after all he HAS told you what he is doing so it's not as bad right?!?! You CAN'T COMPETE with this new crush feeling - so telling him you will wait for him is just letting him enjoy this new and exciting feeling. If I were you (and if I had it to do all over again) I would tell him that you are not waiting, and that you want to talk about getting a divorce soon and separating legally now - that you will not wait for him to "decide" - if he is struggling between 6 weeks with someone he knew when he was 14 and 15+ years with you then you don't see the need to wait.

But don't do this as some sort of last ditch ploy - do it because it is the quickest way to remove yourself from ongoing hurt. The one thing I chose by not kicking my WH out/separating immediately that I DO regret was that by staying I subjected myself not only to the hurt from his A, but of more NEW hurts that resulted from trying. And there were a LOT of them.

The thing is my WH decided that he did want to try - but that was only after I finally decided to leave him and move out for good - which was years after d-day1. Years. And by then he had lost his lustre to me - the pedestal I had him on was long gone. All of a sudden he went from saying he was not sure he "wanted to do this with [me] anymore" to "I don't want you to leave. I don't want to lose you..." etc.

This is all fresh to you - look at the healing library on this site - there is tons of great info - and keep posting. Ask questions. Say anything. You are safe here.

And I'm sorry we had to "meet" this way.

[This message edited by ThisIsSoLonely at 5:33 PM, Tuesday, September 27th]

What is love? In your case, consider my signature on what it isn't.

Sorry you have to be here. In your case, he does seem to be more stabbing you in the chest rather than in the back at least. Chances are despite his desire to be "open" about everything he is still probably minimizing and trickle truthing.

Many people don't really have a great idea how an affair forms. They have this concept that devotion automatically comes with love. That cheating is a symptom of unmet needs or an unhappy relationship. The reality is a little simpler. You meet someone you find interesting and attractive. You spend time with them, forming that new relationship bond. The butterflies and ego boost from this new relationship feels really good, and if it feels right how can it be wrong? Boundaries slowly erode, and soon enough the cheater is enjoying the A and the stable life back home. Some are overwhelmed with there own behavior, "I'm confused, I don't know what I want". I mean, they want both, but no one is willing to admit that to themself internally, much less say it out loud.

As brutal as the information you WH has given you, it is likely still sanitized.

This is one I’d really like to understand. How long do I wait for his "decision", I’m scared of prompting it as I think I know what it will be.

He isn't going to make a decision. He is going to pick both for as long as you allow both to be an option.

EDIT: Boilerplate advice.

1) Complete electronic transparency is now necessary. A complete written timeline of the A so you know what exactly it is that you are potentially accepting/forgiving/reconciling with, and access to all communication that he hasn't deleted.
2) STD test.
3) Get the books "Not Just Friends" by Shirley Glass, and "How to Help Your Spouse Heal From Your Affair" by Linda MacDonald.
4) No contact (NC) with affair partner (AP). Sending NC communication in front of you, followed by blocking her through every avenue of contact.
5) Find individual therapists (IC), one specializing in betrayal trauma for you.
6) Don't start marriage counseling (MC) until he has shown the A is well and truly over, that he understands what he did was wrong (right now he isn't sure if he is even doing anything wrong!), and that he takes 100% responsibility for it.

[This message edited by This0is0Fine at 6:21 PM, Tuesday, September 27th]

Thank you both for your responses.

I’m lucky that although I’m in a small rural-ish village there is a very good English population. I’ve spent my 7 months here getting our home ready for us to be here together. Up until last week WS was involved in all the decisions, we’ve spent a fortune. I’ve involved him in everything so he didn’t feel left out while in the UK.

At the same time I’ve tried to meet new people, I’m just not too confident at it but I’ve done it. I do have someone here I can talk to and I have unloaded on my best friend in the UK and she is visiting me shortly.

I know I’m not at the point of asking for a divorce. I’m not a stupid woman, I know some of it is down to self preservation but I also don’t want to give him the satisfaction of ending it. I don’t want the narrative to be "she is divorcing me". He has to say it and then I’ll make sure he tells his family the truth too. I won’t let him end this and be seen as a good guy. I know that all sounds mad, childish and that know I’m in denial but right now that’s where I’m at.

I’m trying to keep myself busy, I’m trying to make plans with people. It’s just so hard. I’ve gone from planning the rest of our lives together for the past year to realising that’s he’s probably gone and that’s hard to comprehend.

As he hasn’t spoken to anyone except me and her I’ve decided I’m going to tell his best friend. Yes it’s a desperate measure but again that’s where I’m at and what have I got to lose. Nothing as he’s gone already.

Thanks again.

I'm sorry to jump to the "file for divorce" mantra - I HATED hearing that when I was in your shoes 5 years ago. It pissed me off to no end. That's not what I mean - that you need to go pick up divorce paperwork and start drafting - I mean you need to say it to your WH - that you are separating from him and have determined that divorce is your only option based on his current behavior and let him know that you will NOT tolerate sharing him with some other woman. That isn't marriage, and if that is what he wants to do now then he doesn't want to be married. You need to show him that you are not going to wait idly by until he makes a decision - you are worth more than that (and oh I know it is easier said then done).

EDIT TO ADD: You said this:

I also don’t want to give him the satisfaction of ending it.

Oh I hear you there - that was totally 100% ME. I'm here to tell you later on you will have the satisfaction of knowing you actually ended this LIMBO no matter what the outcome (and again...)

You can ALWAYS change YOUR mind about separation and divorce, but I think you need to break the spell and tell him that you will not sit by waiting for him, hoping he "picks you" - that its degrading and soul sucking and you simply cannot imagine how he can, in good faith, tell you that he loves you and does that to you at the same time. You should remind him that YOU are the prize here - you the faithful spouse - not him.

One of the things my WH said to me about a year ago, after his A was over, that FLOORED me was this - he said in relation to the shit show he put us through and that now he is trying to prove to me that he wants me back: "TISL, you won. She is gone and I want only you." I just about lost it, and responded: "Seriously?!?!?! You've got to be kidding me!!! You think I won???? This shows me how little you grasp what happened. I didn't win. YOU won because I still talk to you. Wake the f___ up!"

Your WH thinks HE is the PRIZE - he has two women vying for him and he must be pretty freaking spectacular as one of them wants him after 35 years and the other is willing to wait for him hoping he comes back to her even while she knows he is breaking his marital vows with another. I mean clearly he's the prize right? I mean just because he is putting you through emotional hell, breaking his marriage vows, telling the OW god knows what (it's not all true - what he's saying - despite what he's telling you she also is getting some salted up watered down version of his life)...this person he is right now is NO prize.

Prepare yourself for him to tell you that he wasn't all that happy in your marriage but he just didn't realize it until magical AP/EX GF from his EARLY teenaged days came back into his life - but now he knows how much he was lacking with you (you know - spontaneity, complete detachment from the everyday living hassles, living in the absolute moment). All this is la la land. Yes, its true, some people end up marrying their AP and staying with them until the end (my mother and step-father for example) - it's possible surely. It's also possible he leaves you, shacks up with her for a few months, and realizes day to day with her is terrible (maybe she is bad with money, jealous, has an addiction problem, is a thoughtless ass, farts in her sleep after eating potato mash to the point he needs to wear a gas mask, likes horrible cheezy films he finds stupid and juvenile, maybe she finds someone else...) The possibilities are endless AND YOU HAVE NO CONTROL OVER ANYTHING THAT HAPPENS TO HIM aside from your part in it. Nothing.

It sucks. It's also empowering.

Don't forget - The prize here is YOU - and you need to believe that. Own it. It's true.

[This message edited by ThisIsSoLonely at 7:38 PM, Tuesday, September 27th]

TISL is right!

He's in Lala Land right now with OW. He's not worried about what you're going through because he thinks that if things don't work out, you will still be sitting there waiting for him. You don't have to run out and file for a divorce today but it would seriously help you to know where he stands by saying you will divorce if he doesn't cut her off and come back to you.

Are you close to anyone in his family? Why not tell them next and get ahead of him on the narrative? It will put more pressure on him to choose. Affairs thrive in secrecy and darkness. Shine a big light on it by telling friends and family and watch how quickly his attitude changes.

If I hadn't made my WH's choices pretty damned stark seven years ago, he'd still be messing around on me today. What's the incentive to stop? Should he stop because he's hurting you? He KNOWS he's hurting you. He moves his mouth and sounds come out, but he's NOT sorry enough to stop, is he?

We met at the end of unhappy 1st marriages, we both divorced...

Does this mean your relationship began as an affair, or was it similar to what your WH is doing now? He appears to be absolving himself of feelings of wrongdoing by announcing his betrayal as he goes along. That doesn't mean he's not cheating. He made a commitment to you and that commitment didn't include dating others in the guise of friendship. His lack of boundaries is apparent in everything he did to get him to the point he's at right now, and if your relationship began devoid of meaningful boundaries, that would indicate that this isn't an exception, it's the rule.

Affairs and illicit behavior create a potent biochemical cocktail to the brain, so this isn't even necessarily all about feelings. Limerence is kind of addictive in that way. The brain releases dopamine, adrenaline, oxytocin, etc. into the system and it's a bit like cocaine, really. Nothing in cocaine is inherently addictive. It's the biochemicals it causes your body to produce that causes the rush. It might look like "love", but it's limerence at this stage, infatuation, a seed of love perhaps.

The bottom line though is that this guy isn't a teenager. He's a grown man who ought to know how to comport himself. Announcing his transgressions like a sportscaster doesn't mean he's not wrong. If he picks up a baseball bat and smashes you with it, he's not absolved of his crime by announcing himself as he goes along. All your understanding and good will on his behalf is just permission at this point. You're just signalling that occasional beatings and casual betrayal aren't a problem.

I know it's really scary to draw a line. On dday seven years ago, I was just done. We'd been married over thirty years and I didn't even have the half of it yet as to what all he'd been up to, but I swung for the fence on divorce and it was everything he could do to get another chance. That wasn't some kind of tactic either, I meant it at the time. In hindsight and after seeing so many other people's stories pan out, I think the best response is to value yourself enough to set limits. There's no magic wand which will fix this guy. He's the only one who can do that. Right now, he's 50 a year-old man mooning over a teenage romance. That's not acceptable.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 7:54 PM, Tuesday, September 27th]

CT is on it per usual...

I totally washed over the end of your prior marriages.

if your relationship began devoid of meaningful boundaries, that would indicate that this isn't an exception, it's the rule.

It would be interesting to know (and more interesting for you to think about what was going on in his prior marriage when you met - was it something like this - if so then you definitely have a pattern to look at).

Announcing his transgressions like a sportscaster doesn't mean he's not wrong. If he picks up a baseball bat and smashes you with it, he's not absolved of his crime by announcing himself as he goes along. All your understanding and good will on his behalf is just permission at this point. You're just signalling that occasional beatings and casual betrayal aren't a problem.

I know it's really scary to draw a line....In hindsight and after seeing so many other people's stories pan out, I think the best response is to value yourself enough to set limits. There's no magic wand which will fix this guy. He's the only one who can do that. Right now, he's 50 a year-old man mooning over a teenage romance. That's not acceptable.

This. All of this gets to the heart of my very long winded post. The faster you put up the stop sign - the no new hurts stop sign - the faster the hurt gets pushed in his direction. Will it stop your hurting? Not initially, but it will do all of these things FASTER: stop the hurt faster; bring you clarity faster; break the rose coloured glasses faster; give your own life focus faster. There is literally NOTHING TO GAIN by sitting idly by waiting for him to "decide" - nothing - and so much to lose that you can't get back.

I will tell you this - I felt like crying reading your post as I know how hopeless it all feels. I will also tell you that I firmly regret allowing my WH to continue to abuse me and mistreat me with his lies and total lack of consideration for my feelings after I knew of his A. Before, I cannot fully blame him for not comprehending how totally gutting the knowledge of his affair was to me, as I myself did not comprehend that until it happened to me personally - but after!!! I don't know why, but I somehow believed that he would see my pain, and at least stop perpetrating more hurt, and come clean. I KNOW he wanted me to leave at some point, and was too cowardly to say so - and yes I did think that at the time - but I stayed. Why??? Why would I stay when I thought it felt like he wanted me gone? To make him miserable and to make him suffer? Well, suffer he did but at the expense of my own sanity. For every moment our remaining together after the A was discovered that he suffered, my suffering was tenfold. You see, I like you, had all of the misery but none of the unicorn-land "fun" on the side.

My WH and I separated and legally terminated our relationship. I left him in the end and moved out of state. He pursued me, and pursues me still - in a healthy way - not in a "you are the most important thing in the world and I'll die without you in my life way." (As an aside, I think that's what I wanted back them - for him to have that moment of I'll die without you and come running back to me - but I know now that is just as unhealthy and fantasy as his A was - and I have zero interest in that.) We "date" now. And it's better - for me anyway. My "ending" (or the stage I'm at now) is less orthodox than most, but it's healthy for me and I am OUT of LIMBO. I am where we are in this relationship because it's where I am okay being.

I want everyone to get to this point of okay - and you do that by taking control of what you can - which is YOU - and stop allowing him to dictate what he gets to do and what he doesn't. You don't come cheap, and that's perfectly okay.

[This message edited by ThisIsSoLonely at 9:02 PM, Tuesday, September 27th]

Scattercushion:

So sorry you find yourself here. Strength to you. You are getting great advice from very insightful posters who have been there. Read, and re-read this advice that will put you in control. Always value yourself. You are not an option. You are the prize. Good luck.

[This message edited by fareast at 3:57 PM, September 27th (Tuesday)]

I just saw this:

He has to say it and then I’ll make sure he tells his family the truth too. I won’t let him end this and be seen as a good guy. I know that all sounds mad, childish and that know I’m in denial but right now that’s where I’m at.

I wouldn't let him control the narrative at all. This is something I can say I did. My WH does not really care what his immediate family thinks, and as they are so dysfunctional (and almost robotically uncaring/un-empathetic) and I said nothing to them as it was pointless, but I had no qualms in telling his best friend and a few other friends of ours. I did not give him the chance to spin lies about what was happening and I even showed a few of them a few few select texts from him to me which established the truth of what I had said. The point was not to get people against him but to not allow him to paint a certain picture (none of them were having it from him anyway as I later found out).

That being said, you sound sooooo much like I was - caught up in the fairness game. The fairness game goes something like this: WS cheated on me, destroyed my reality/my world, and it is unfair that I am left here with nothing while he runs around having a grand ole time with his AP in fantasy land. It's not fair that he has a fantasy land or that he gets to cause all this hurt and run off scot-free. It's not fair that I am left holding the bag in the new place we were supposed to be together, that we planned for, that he has now left me here alone. It's not fair that he gets to feel desired and sexy and happy and I feel so devastated and worthless.... And because of the unfairness, I am going to make it fair by not letting him get off so easily. I am going to sacrifice myself and force him to talk to me about this, to share in the misery. To cry and to break down. If I must suffer it is only fair that he does too. Otherwise, I am getting the short end of the stick in perpetuity and he is getting cake....

Life is not fair. It's not This is one of the lessons I have learned the hard way via infidelity. I knew it to be so before, but nothing has reminded me of this fact like the A and the false-r aftermath. Still. To this day, my WH has NOT suffered like I did AND he got blowjobs and handjobs and endless "I love yous" perpetual hard-ons and phone sex and excitement and I got...excrement. By the boatload. Not even after my WH's entire world blew up and his job is a disaster and he's stuck in a job where everyone knows he had a long term A, leading to the divorce of one of his former best friends - where he is known as the guy you don't invite to parties cause he might try to fuck your wife...not even then it is remotely fair. My suffering was worse because I didn't bring it on myself...

Except I did. I stuck around and did not draw a line in the sand and say you can't be in my space any more unless you meet my terms. There will be no bargaining. Every moment that I played the pick me dance, every moment that I played the "maybe if I better myself he will come back," every day I made excuses for him, my suffering was WORSE, by my own choice to stay in the game without laying down absolute immovable boundaries, for real.

It takes all of us a different amount of time to come to the conclusion that we are worth it, and for our own self preservation we must set boundaries or risk being left behind battered and broken, or worse - having our feelings/our hurt rug swept.

I'm glad you have a friend coming to be with you. I hope you find strength from them and that you allow them to bring you some comfort. You definitely deserve it.

It’s not just a pattern it’s a 15 year old, 6 week repeat, I just hadn’t realised history was repeating itself. How stupid am I?

I have a huge amount to digest and think about but I know

I am worth so much more
I am a bloody good prize
I will be ok
I will speak to him very soon but need to get my head slightly straighter first. Perhaps I’ll go back to the UK and do it face to face or perhaps I’ll save myself more heartache and do it over the phone. Tonight I just don’t know.
I was proud of myself for telling him no more contact, even if my thought process was skewed
He’s been gone a week, I’m still here, albeit very tired, looking a bit rough and 12lb lighter (but I’ve started eating again)

Each morning I get up have a shout and then say

Come on scattercushion, you can and will get through this.
I have also written a big note I’ve stuck to my fireplace saying

"Massively disrespected in so many ways" as a prompt to remember I deserve so much better.

Thanks all

Scattercushion,

So glad to read your last post.

You are valuing yourself now.

You control the choices now. Tits up, you lovely girl!

Some of the players here are incredibly wise. Read their advice lots of times. Over time, it'll sink in how right they are.

I was similarly in a set of circumstances where H and I were seperated geographically (although for much longer) when he had the A. I think these circumstances allow them to create a completely double life.

Similarly, my H also had to continue living in the same country as the AP with me hundreds of miles away after Dday.

My H never said he loved or wanted the AP, he denied he did, but all the same he put me through living hell by repeatedly engaging in contact with her.

That period was worse than the affair itself in terms of the pain and damage to me.

I can offer empathy. You must be in agony. I remember it well. The shock. How surreal it felt.

All I can tell you moving forward is that what he does is his own choice. You can only choose what you do.

My regrets are not having MUCH more stringent boundaries. Not walking away the minute he broke NC.

I was scared and confused and he was begging me and saying he loved me. Underneath he was still wanting his cake and eat it. That's why he struggled to fully give her up.

In hindsight, I betrayed myself by staying. Allowing anyone to treat me that way. I hope you have strength I didn't have and tell him to go to hell.

Not to be indelicate, but you mentioned that you both met at the end of unhappy first marriages. Does that mean that your new relationship overlapped with the old ones, or we you separated. The reason I ask is it may shed light on boundaries and patterns of behavior. That way advice can be more targeted.

Justsomeguy: Does that mean that your new relationship overlapped with the old ones, or we you separated? (Sorry I don’t know how the do the copy thing)

Yes our relationship overlapped the end of our first marriages. I was in the process of leaving my ex when we met, WS was still in his marriage. WS left his wife 6 weeks after meeting me, which at the time I was not prepared for as I had told him I wanted to R with my ex for the sake of the children. I did try to R but my ex admitted at MC that our marriage was dead and he was glad I had the courage to say what he had been feeling for a long time when I had asked for a divorce.

I have been told by WS and his family that his marriage was very unhappy and even his ex father in law told him the family knew he would leave, just not when his son was so young.

I am going to take control of part of the narrative. I shall be telling his 2 best friends. WS has already told me that everyone will hate him, no one will understand and he doesn’t care what other people think. Thinking about it now a bit more clearly by not telling anyone and only talking to me and AP he is getting all the answers he wants to hear. No one is telling him what an idiot he is and to grow up, see and take responsibility for the destruction he is causing.

The life he is choosing is so opposite to the life we could have had, but that is HIS choice and I there is bugger all I can do about it. My life is MY choice and after suffering cardiac arrests I’m so very very lucky I’m here at all. Ironically WS gave me the CPR that saved my life. I’ve done the "why didn’t he just let me die if he was going to throw me away 3 years later" but I know that’s just emotion. He’s told me maybe the reason we got together was so that he could "save me". What a crock of shit. You can’t pick and choose your reasons for things happening to suit your circumstances and to justify being an arsehole.

Yes, I’m too nice for my own good. I know what he’s doing is wrong but at the same time I don’t want to cause him any more pain. I want to believe that he is in turmoil over this too but I know I need to wake up and smell the coffee. He isn’t thinking of me at all. I won’t allow him another 5 weeks to live in La la land having his cake with a woman who is "just like me" and who he thought I could be good friends with!

If I want to stay here and build myself a life, which I already know I do, I have to start getting on with it. Who knows what the next few days/weeks will be like but I’m living "one day at a time".

Emotions are like rollercoasters, one moment I’m feeling empowered, like now. Another moment I’m crying like a baby. I know this is ok and I’m not going to beat myself up about it. I have to think about boundaries and what mine are and tell him. I just also have to build up the courage to do it, it’s hard but I know I will do it.

Scattercushions don’t have to be thrown on the ground and kicked around like they are worthless, they enhance an environment. Now that’s a bit profound for me at this early hour

Thank you all for your wisdom

I know time has passed and I know his previous marriage wasn't good; but it isn't really normal to leave a marriage (even a bad one) after six weeks of knowing someone new.

Probably at the time this felt like mad passion, but I think it's more about impulsively, lack of integrity, instant-gratification and so on.

These are all characteristics which mean he might just as easily make life choices on a whim now :( Is he quite childish or selfish in his day to day life?

Years ago I had an ex like this - madly in love with me after two weeks! He fell out of love equally rapidly and inexplicably.

Google affair fog. That will explain where he is.

My normally rational H was going to leave me for someone he knew a few months.

I told him go right ahead. I’m not stopping you. He treated me like a yo-yo for 6 months. He wants a D. I say ok. Next day he changes his mind. I say ok.

Finally he pulled it one too many times. I found out in dday2 he was cheating while I was believing we were reconciling.

I then told him I was D him. I’d had enough. The difference was I was actually doing something about it. Boy did his tune change real fast. And I did the hard 180 immediately.

That infatuation stage he is in is horrible. He (your cheating H) believes it’s "true love". I wish you luck and I hope you can survive this.

[This message edited by The1stWife at 8:17 AM, Thursday, September 29th]

So this isn't new behavior for him, it's his modus operandi to "monkey-branch" into the next relationship. What that means, when we consider it with his current behavior, is that the boundaries we would expect from a guy who makes commitments toward Fidelity are just not there.

Think of it as a core value, something you really believe in and honor. This guy has a "but..." in that core value. ie. "He believes in Fidelity, but... not if he connects with an old girlfriend." You see how bogus that is, right? We don't have an out-clause in our values system. We either believe in what we say or not. When the core value is in place, we organically build a fence around it, our boundary. ie. "I believe in Fidelity, so... I don't put myself in risky situations with the opposite sex." We don't spend a lot of time thinking about it. We don't have to. People protect what they value.

Your WH seems to think his "sportscaster" approach to infidelity means he's not a cheater. But the problem remains.. he promised you fidelity and he's broken that promise. This is standard operating procedure for him. He comes first, other people are second, third, tenth, or what-have-you. He didn't learn anything the first time around. He still just flies by the seat of his pants, serving himself.

So, you begin to see that even if he were to dump his teenage crush, his views on love and marriage have never changed. His character, his integrity, is still such that his emotional entertainment is prioritized over his commitments. His word is NOT his bond. Honesty is a bludgeon for him, not a virtue.

I just don't know that you have much to lose by putting out the ultimatum. Maybe you don't feel ready for that, but the more comfortable he gets on that other branch, the more likely he is to stay there. Sometimes the shock of potential loss will snap a cheater back. That's what happened to my fWH. He realized that he only had one shot at saving his former life with me and snapped back into place like a rubber band. Make no mistake though, I said what I meant and meant what I said when I demanded that he be "all in" or "all out". It wasn't a gambit.

What happens a lot of times is that the BS steps back and tries to show how loving and understanding she is by giving the WS time to work through his emotional drama, but instead of responding with appreciation and attunement, the WS simply eases his way out of the relationship at his own pace and comfort. Meanwhile, your pain and trauma are multiplied and the more you suffer, the less the cheater cares. Of course, the less he cares, the more pain and trauma. You see how that works.

You said you're considering calling or seeing him. Spend some time with the thought you can't lose something that's already gone. The potential of things can drive us mad. You see the potential of R and it seems tantalizingly close. But LOOK at what's really happening right now, at this moment. Where is he? What is he doing? Is it acceptable to you? What are YOUR values today? How are you upholding what YOU believe in?

I know it doesn't feel like it, but you're going to be okay. It sucks and it takes time, but one way or the other, you're going to get through this.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 3:38 PM, Wednesday, September 28th]

  Moving to General

He only loves 1 person: himself.