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Probably not a unique story, but it's Mine

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SnowToArmPits ( Member #50943) posted at 8:26 PM on Monday, September 13th, 2021

You've been separated for two years, you have a time limit on this? Other than hopium that she's going to come back and be faithful, sorry but it sounds to me like you have a shit marriage.

Separating two years ago was on her, staying separated two years later is on you.

You've told no one, protecting your wife. Haven't told your adult kids that your wife is a cheater. Tell them, in fact tell them all about it. Grandma is a cheater... sounds weird, it is weird sowing her wild oats. Bad grandma.

In my opinion you're thinking clearly in wanting to end this.

[This message edited by SnowToArmPits at 8:27 PM, Monday, September 13th]

posts: 344   ·   registered: Dec. 25th, 2015   ·   location: Canada
id 8688314
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HalfTime2017 ( Member #64366) posted at 9:23 PM on Monday, September 13th, 2021

NotNaive,

I'm sorry you find yourself here. What makes a person after 42 F--King years do this is beyond me. Does she really think she is going to start over with these other men in her mid 60? Good God, you'd figure she'd be emotionally mature at this age.

I hope you follow the advice of the others here, they know what they are doing, but even more so I hope you're able to find a workable solution for your marriage. What a waste to through 42 yrs away.

And no, it had nothing to do with you working too hard. It has everything to do with your WW's shit for boundaries and wondering ways, and our societies excuses that we accept for this type of shitty behavior. YOur WW is selfish, plain and simple. I bet she hasn't even thought about splitting time with the kids and grandkids should this happen.

And just know that Casanova on the other hand probably has ED. My ex got with a man in his 40s with ED and it still brings a smile to my face.

posts: 1144   ·   registered: Jul. 5th, 2018   ·   location: Cali
id 8688322
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HalfTime2017 ( Member #64366) posted at 9:34 PM on Monday, September 13th, 2021

NotNaive,

I'm sorry you find yourself here. What makes a person after 42 F--King years do this is beyond me. Does she really think she is going to start over with these other men in her mid 60? Good God, you'd figure she'd be emotionally mature at this age.

I hope you follow the advice of the others here, they know what they are doing, but even more so I hope you're able to find a workable solution for your marriage. What a waste to through 42 yrs away.

And no, it had nothing to do with you working too hard. It has everything to do with your WW's shit for boundaries and wondering ways, and our societies excuses that we accept for this type of shitty behavior. YOur WW is selfish, plain and simple. I bet she hasn't even thought about splitting time with the kids and grandkids should this happen.

And just know that Casanova on the other hand probably has ED. My ex got with a man in his 40s with ED and it still brings a smile to my face.

posts: 1144   ·   registered: Jul. 5th, 2018   ·   location: Cali
id 8688323
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Booyah ( Member #60124) posted at 1:18 AM on Tuesday, September 14th, 2021

Sorry you're in this situation especially after 42 years!!

Listen, she left back in Jan of '19 (over 32 months ago).

She was NOT trying to work on herself while separated as you now obviously know.

Now she's pissed that you know the truth of what she's been up to. So much so that she's got passwords and security on everything to make sure you're in the dark of what she intends to continue doing and that's seeing and being with other men (sorry I know this is painful to hear).

Be honest with yourself, is this really how you want your daily existence to be?

Thirty-two months is a long time my friend. You say you love her, and I certainly can appreciate that (we all can).

This wife that you proclaim to love is gone. She died. She's gone and she's not coming back. If she did the life you would be living with her would be total MISERY and you damn well know it.

You would NEVER be at peace and you would ALWAYS be wondering what she was up to when she wasn't around. In no way would you be her husband but rather you'd be playing detective and I don't think that's what you want out of a marriage.

In my humble opinion pull the trigger. Screw giving her an ultimatum. Is that really how you want her to come back to you?

Again it's been over thirty-two months and I would say having to resort to an ultimatum has already passed by.

File. Have her served. Get the process going. Stop going through the motions and move towards starting to live again. If by some crazy chance she wakes up and wants to work on the marriage you can always stop the D if that's what you want to do when/if that day ever comes.

Time is too damn precious to live like this and why in the world would you feel the need to beg and put up with this shit from the woman who's supposed to be your wife.

Nobody says any of this is easy but take back your life!!

posts: 1247   ·   registered: Aug. 11th, 2017
id 8688358
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src9043 ( Member #75367) posted at 1:21 AM on Tuesday, September 14th, 2021

You are only married on paper. You live separately and she is screwing other men. How you can still love this person is baffling. You are not the first BS to still maintain love for their WS even after the WS has done horrendous things to the BS. This forum is full of people like that. I just don't get it. I don't understand bestowing love on someone who does horrible things to you, hurts you, humiliates you, lies to you, and uses you for years. The flip side of love is hate and I suggest you look at the flip side in order to move out of this abusive mindset constructed by your WW.

She is not coming back. Certainly not as a respectful wife who will be monogamous for the rest of your lives. You guys aren't children. No one is going to change. Just tell her that it's time to divorce because the marriage simply doesn't exist AND do it. Nothing has to change. You will still be her work partner. She will still live apart from you. She will continue with her affairs. But the pretext that you are married will be removed.

Move on. Get yourself in shape, and go find someone else. Please start a new life. You are not a young person (nor am I) and time is precious. She is simply unworthy and never will become what she once seemed to be. You are not even her plan B.

posts: 414   ·   registered: Sep. 7th, 2020
id 8688360
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Marz ( Member #60895) posted at 1:38 AM on Tuesday, September 14th, 2021

You probably only know the tip of this iceberg. She demands privacy to cheat.

Indecision on your part is your wife’s best friend and your worst enemy.

Cake eaters love their cake. Don’t you think it’s time you cut her off?

All you are currently getting is an extended stay in limbo.

[This message edited by Marz at 1:42 AM, Tuesday, September 14th]

posts: 6616   ·   registered: Oct. 3rd, 2017
id 8688365
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Bigger ( Guide #8354) posted at 1:47 AM on Tuesday, September 14th, 2021

I think trying to get hate instead of love is a terrible idea. It’s allowing your divorced former spouse free rent in your brain. Negative rent at that.

Go for indifference.

Fact is IF you divorce you will still interact with your wife on family events and such. You don’t have to agree with her or even like her or whatever, but IF you divorce you hopefully move on. Maybe in a year or two or three you will have a new "friend" and despite her actions NOW I would hope your wife managed to settle down with someone more stable than random sales-reps. It’s unavoidable that after all these years there will be some connection, albeit not a romantic one.

She will be the grandmom of your grandkids, mother to your kids. I doubt you two will meet for coffee or phone each other to chat, but I would hope that you are civil.

The way I see it is more like something inevitable.

Like Aron Ralston – the guy that self-amputated his arm when stuck in a gully in Utah.

He went through ALL his options until he had two: die or amputate. He then decided on his timeline for when he had to start amputating and did his preparations. Once he was convinced he couldn’t wait any longer he cut away and managed to find help. He will share that he didn’t want to lose an arm, but even less did he want to die. This was his only viable choice, and by implementing it he saved his life.

I see the stance I suggested as comparable. You start your preparation for what might be inevitable and then carry it through.

If a hiker had found Ralston BEFORE he started cutting I’m 100% certain he would have accepted being rescued and not amputated his arm. Same with you – IF on the path out of infidelity another option or opening is offered you can select to go that way.

[This message edited by Bigger at 2:10 AM, Tuesday, September 14th]

"If, therefore, any be unhappy, let him remember that he is unhappy by reason of himself alone." Epictetus

posts: 9858   ·   registered: Sep. 29th, 2005
id 8688368
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Humbled123 ( Member #62947) posted at 2:02 AM on Tuesday, September 14th, 2021

Your story is not unique. The longer you are on here you will realize just how repeatable it is.
This was going on longer than you know, definitely the reason she " needed" space. They all do so they can screw their new partner.
Can you really live with knowing she had sex with numerous men over 32 months while you probably didn't get shit. That shit will eat at you like crazy. The woman and marriage you knew died. Forever gone. I know how hard that is, i lived it too. Please please do yourself a favor and divorce her. Time is extremely valuable at your age

posts: 188   ·   registered: Mar. 5th, 2018
id 8688369
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thatbpguy ( Member #58540) posted at 2:28 AM on Tuesday, September 14th, 2021

Since my discovery, she has developed an extreme interest in security of all phone and online accounts. She now has a Proton email account and tight phone security. She has said that she will never let me see her phone again, and that it's not my business what is on her phone or computer.

AKA, I'm going to continue to betray you and you will never know.

Not wanting to mince words, either put up with her betraying or file for divorce. She's made it clear she will not stop. Also, I strongly suggest you expose her to the kids. Maybe some peer pressure will help.

ME: BHHer: WWDDay 1, R; DDay 2, R; DDay 3, I leftDivorcedRemarried to a wonderful woman

"There are far, far better things ahead than any we leave behind." C.S. Lewis

As a dog returns to his vomit, so a fool repeats his folly...

posts: 4451   ·   registered: May. 2nd, 2017   ·   location: Vancouver, WA
id 8688373
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 Notsonaivenow (original poster New Member #79390) posted at 2:35 AM on Tuesday, September 14th, 2021

Thanks again, everyone.
Wise words and no BS - exactly what I needed to hear.

Bigger, I like the stance of indifference over hate.
Halftime 2017, yes it is a waste to throw away 42 years. But as so many of you have advised, it would be a shame (and bigger waste) for me to put up with her crap any longer.
src9043, fortunately I am already in shape and look younger than most guys my age, so there's that. I am not of the mindset to find anyone else while still married, and I'm sure it will be awkward as shit when I do date again. But now that I have found this site, I know there are many of you who will support me with tips and advice when the time comes!

I plan to call a lawyer tomorrow to make an appointment.

posts: 12   ·   registered: Sep. 12th, 2021
id 8688376
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masti ( Member #54237) posted at 3:54 AM on Tuesday, September 14th, 2021

After 42 years one expects cheating to be factored out of relationships. Maybe she never got caught before.
NotNaive how has she been financing herself in the last two years? Are you a victim of financial infidelity too?
Your children are adults, they also deserve to know.

posts: 119   ·   registered: Jul. 19th, 2016
id 8688387
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Buster123 ( Member #65551) posted at 4:12 AM on Tuesday, September 14th, 2021

I'm sorry you're here, let me tell you that your situation is far from unique, but to you it certainly is. Based on what you posted your WW is a serial cheater, you probably know the tip of the iceberg but based on that alone, I suggest you file for D, at this point you have nothing to lose, right now your M is a farce and she's not even regretful nor remorseful, you have absolutely NOTHING to work with, but here's my recomendation if you insist on trying to R.

1) File for D, have her served and expose her As with the entire family. Full exposure typically kills the "beautiful, romantic and exciting" aspects of an A and replaces them with pure shame and embarrassment, which in turn helps with regret and ultimately remorse. No true remorse, no chance to R successfully, stop hiding her As and expose her immediately far and wide, start with children, parents if alive, siblings and close friends, and of course OBSs (Other Betrayed Spouses or significant others) consequences for her huge betrayal, let her deal with the fallout and explanations, don't worry about pushing her away, she's already gone, if full exposure and D papers don't shock her back to reality, then nothing will, if so just let the D process run its course and get out of infidelity.

2) She needs to offer full on demand access to her phone and all electronic devices and passwords FOREVER, no questions asked, there should not be such a thing as "my privacy" in a M other than toilet time, once you tie the knot if becomes "our privacy", and if there ever was one she lost it after her huge betrayal.

3) She needs to send an NC FOREVER text to OMs right in front of you, make sure you watch her hit "send".

4) She needs to get tested for STDs (you should too just in case), she may have cheated before the separation and exposed you to potentially life threatening STDs/STIs. Let her do the walk of shame to the doctors office, again, consequences.

5) Demand she gives you a written timeline of all As both physical and EAs, then make sure she reads them out loud to you, this again could help wit remorse and helps to prevent her from changing her stories (happens a lot). I also recommend you demand a polygraph.

6) Consult a D attorney to know your options, while you're at it ask for a postnuptial agreement in your favor in case she cheats again (no alimony, she doesn't touch your retirement, etc.).

7) Demand she goes to IC with an infidelity specialist to find out her whys (forget MC for now), how a married woman gave herself permission to cheat with multiple partners and betray her family in the most horrible way.

These are some of the basics and standard advise that have stood the test of time and given here on SI and other forums, look at your member number, every situation is different but cheaters typically follow a similar script, and we've literally "seen it" play out THOUSANDS of times, those who take decisive action typically have much better results.

Keep posting frequently, the collective wisdom of SI could help you go through this difficult situation and get out of infidelity whether than means D or R.

posts: 2412   ·   registered: Jul. 22nd, 2018
id 8688389
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Bigger ( Guide #8354) posted at 9:55 AM on Tuesday, September 14th, 2021

Maybe your biggest advantage is time.

As is you are in a maintainable situation, but not a sustainable one. It won’t make the big difference to the end-outcome if you file tomorrow, in ten days or in a month.
With the length of marriage, being successful (in your own words) and a business both work in then how to proceed is maybe not as clear as in the "standard" marriage. Having a clear and realistic view on how things might go can pay dividends. To me the only possible advantage to filing right away is if there is any danger of her manipulating marital assets. (Filing often/sometimes establishes a date from where both parties are more accountable for financial actions, making moving assets, debt etc harder without it impacting a possible share in the division of assets).

The path I suggested in my first post on this thread is exactly geared at that. It gives you a direction to head on, the destination is to get out of infidelity, the path (for the time being) and control of the pace. Filing and having her served are only possible milestones on that path rather than some destination.

Very often human behavior and interaction is controlled by expectations and fear rather than wants or sensibility. You have expressed a desire to reconcile. Some posters have doubted if you should or could, but IMHO that is totally up to you. I have seen couples reconcile from what many would think worse, I have seen couples divorce from what many would consider less. Maybe when YOU start moving out of infidelity your wife might see some light and move along with you. Or not. Irrespective of her response at least YOU will be getting out.

"If, therefore, any be unhappy, let him remember that he is unhappy by reason of himself alone." Epictetus

posts: 9858   ·   registered: Sep. 29th, 2005
id 8688402
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 Notsonaivenow (original poster New Member #79390) posted at 11:43 PM on Wednesday, September 15th, 2021

Here's my update as of today.

Yesterday was our last couples counseling session. I called an end to it because STBXW (I'm learning the abbreviations!) has not changed her tune: "I don't know what I want; I have no feelings for you right now and I don't know how to get the spark back; it's SO MUCH WORK, etc., etc." Our therapist agreed with my decision, saying essentially if both partners aren't willing to work on the relationship, then there really is no relationship to save.

After the session we talked for quite a while longer. She (again) explained all the hurts she felt over many years, both related to me being emotionally closed and (as she sees it), putting my medical career ahead of her needs. She said she really does not want a divorce, but does not want to get back together yet! Of course she doesn't, because she has the best of all worlds presently. She can still carry on the facade to family and friends without facing her own shame. And, since I have been patient for this long, I don't think she believes I would take the next step. I said, it's too late unless you are willing to make some major changes and a true commitment. I know she won't.

My first lawyer appointment is tomorrow. I want to be fully prepared before I serve her, so I did not tell her yet. As Bigger pointed out, time is on my side right now. We have a business partnership, which I have to decide whether to continue with her, and we have a 42 year married history, of which there is much more good than bad. But at this point, I plan to proceed with divorce and, as Booyah said, take back my life.

posts: 12   ·   registered: Sep. 12th, 2021
id 8688665
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 Notsonaivenow (original poster New Member #79390) posted at 11:50 PM on Wednesday, September 15th, 2021

As an addendum to the above post, my closest friend and confidant said that I would feel a sense of relief and recovery of self esteem now that I have made the decision to file for divorce.

Well, I've gotta tell you that I am feeling no joy right now. It is more of a sense of grief and deep sadness.

I know this is probably normal, and it will take time to feel better about things. But it sure sucks today.

posts: 12   ·   registered: Sep. 12th, 2021
id 8688667
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SnowToArmPits ( Member #50943) posted at 11:56 PM on Wednesday, September 15th, 2021

She wants! She wants!

OP, a couple of years of that would be enough for most men. Enough is enough, time to do what you want.

42 years, any of us would grieve that. Living out your retirement with a wife who's not living with you and who's fucking other men, no grief letting that go pal.

This probably seems harsh to read, but good riddance.

posts: 344   ·   registered: Dec. 25th, 2015   ·   location: Canada
id 8688668
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Blandy ( Member #79252) posted at 12:28 AM on Thursday, September 16th, 2021

Of course no one goes into a marriage wanting to divorce or for it to end like this. The grief and sadness is natural. The relief comes when you realize that you've taken back control of your life and you are now in the driver's seat.

posts: 59   ·   registered: Aug. 8th, 2021   ·   location: TX
id 8688676
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goalong ( Member #57352) posted at 2:22 AM on Thursday, September 16th, 2021

I'm learning the abbreviations!) has not changed her tune: "I don't know what I want; I have no feelings for you right now and I don't know how to get the spark back; it's SO MUCH WORK, etc., etc.

Reading between the line - I am the catch, BS still wants me, knowing that I can really enjoy my cheating. Pull the plug she will not enjoy her cheat as much.

For some reason you have tolerated her distant attitude for this long. May be the past between you and WW has been good, or may be it is for practical reasons, regardless as others say you need to regain your dignity. Hope you and WW have been equally sharing the responsibility of your son. Otherwise tell her that it should be the case and it can be a start to show her the consequences for her actions

who is the OM ? you have not mentioned anything. She wants to keep her good stance with family. It is time to change this. If you divorce you can also use the secrecy she wants as a trump card for a better deal. But if circumstances are there expose the OM. Also it is better to have people who care about you in the circle for help.
I think her plan is to keep you in tow until she has had enough of the 'fun' then she wantyou to take care of her in her sickness and old age

[This message edited by goalong at 2:39 AM, Thursday, September 16th]

posts: 772   ·   registered: Feb. 9th, 2017   ·   location: USA
id 8688691
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 Notsonaivenow (original poster New Member #79390) posted at 1:45 PM on Thursday, September 16th, 2021

Goalong, I think there is a lot of truth to your hypothesis. She is the catch, and likes the fact that she, in her words to me previously, gets "hit on by other men all the time." She looks 20 years younger than her age (64 tomorrow), thanks to good genes, keeping in shape, and modern facial rejuvenation techniques. However, I'm no slouch in the looking younger than my age department either. The difference? I do not put myself out there to be attractive to other women because I was committed to my marriage.

As far as I can tell, there is no OM at the present time. However, I think she has hook up sites and profiles on a burner phone and this is only a lull.

I think one of her biggest worries and reason she said she doesn't want a divorce is that she will have to step back into a more active role in our son's life. I have largely alleviated this burden from her for the past 32 months while she "heals."
It has been beneficial for my relationship with him, but I am not doing it alone any more.

First lawyer appointment today. I wasn't ready before, but sure am now.

posts: 12   ·   registered: Sep. 12th, 2021
id 8688740
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Buster123 ( Member #65551) posted at 4:08 AM on Friday, September 17th, 2021

Don't tell her anything, just file and have her served, also expose her far and wide to ALL family and close friends also without warning, you don't owe her anything, let her deal with the consequences of her huge betrayal.

posts: 2412   ·   registered: Jul. 22nd, 2018
id 8688902
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