Thumos ( member #69668) posted at 9:45 PM on Wednesday, July 21st, 2021
Unrepentant. Wallowing in lust (see Proverbs 30:20). Limerant. Lacking in remorse. Nothing to work with.
Next. Move on.
"True character is revealed in the choices a human being makes under pressure. The greater the pressure, the deeper the revelation, the truer the choice to the character's essential nature."
BH (me): 50, WW: 49 Married: Feb. 1996 DDAY1: 12.20.16 DDAY2:
SnowToArmPits ( member #50943) posted at 10:18 PM on Wednesday, July 21st, 2021
She is still sending the guy nudes.
She doesn't sound like much of a wife, she's making a joke of her marriage sending nudes to other men. Doesn't sound like she's worried about losing you. Sorry man.
You can try filing for divorce and see if that snaps her out of this. You can always stop the divorce if she comes to her senses.
BreakingBad ( member #75779) posted at 10:33 PM on Wednesday, July 21st, 2021
My strong support comes your way--especially since you are still a couple days out from your first telehealth appt.
The number of days you are out from your legs being knocked out from under you are SO few...yet you are standing again, thinking, moving forward...getting up each day and drawing in breath. Your posts demonstrate a level-headedness that is amazing with your DD so close. (Ps. the horror movie metaphor was spot-on!)
My guy (seems a better lead-in than "Dude"):
Pain and shock are so at war in those early days. I'm not surprised at all that you are still monitoring the communication. The new pain it brings is awful, but it reassures you that you are so right to move forward with shaking off this relationship with this person who is not who you thought she was and not what you deserve. She isn't even trying to be who you deserve. It's no fault of yours. She's broken in some fundamental way that she isn't trying to acknowledge or fix. She's in "this new shiny thing will make me feel better" mode (and likely also in "if this new thing works out long term, I wasn't a POS cheater...because this new thing was real & true love so I don't have to feel bad about myself" mode) and that allows her to not own what she's really done, the devastation she's caused...and what that all says about who she is.
You are early days and you've come so far!!! You really are doing great! Your situation sounds a bit lonely, so reach out IRL to your friends/family as much you can tolerate to and as long as it is helpful to you. Set a goal each day to do at least one, specific kind thing for yourself: work out, go for a walk, bike ride, drive, read, or watch something that brings you joy or comfort.
We see your struggle, but we see your strength too. We are cheering you on!
WH had online affairs
Married 30 yrs now
2 kids, both in HS
Dday#4=11/25/20...1st A with cOW was actually 2 1/2 years
BW & WH in IC & MC. Working toward R, but day by day
guvensiz ( member #75858) posted at 10:51 PM on Wednesday, July 21st, 2021
If I had listened to everyone here I’d have already been complete no contact and a bit further down the road. Instead I’m still spending time doing this. But yes, good information to know, bad information to see.
Don't be unfair to yourself. You're handling it pretty well. How many days has it been? Some never reach this stage, while others take years.
I'm glad your resources aren't gone. There is nothing wrong with that.
scaredwoman ( member #78680) posted at 11:30 PM on Wednesday, July 21st, 2021
Seems like a pretty clear 'exit affair' and yet through all these actions she won't give me the closure of admitting it's over for her.
If she admits it's over there's no going back. Her safety cushion is removed from underneath her. Cheaters are cowards and they will live the best of both worlds for as long as possible. You already know, deep down, that it's over. Keep moving forward.
Maxwell354 (original poster member #79092) posted at 11:47 PM on Wednesday, July 21st, 2021
She doesn't sound like much of a wife
She's either the best liar I ever met (because I thought she was a terrible liar) or something really shifted internally in the relatively recent past.
Thanks for all the support. I'm reaching out to family and (choice) friends who have been great. But they are all as shocked and disgusted as me and don't have the experience of the great group here.
guvensiz ( member #75858) posted at 12:24 AM on Thursday, July 22nd, 2021
No, she is still terrible liar. Otherwise, you wouldn't know about her A now.
Marz ( member #60895) posted at 12:48 AM on Thursday, July 22nd, 2021
Make no mistake this is who she is.
You aren’t loosing a thing.
nekonamida ( member #42956) posted at 3:07 AM on Thursday, July 22nd, 2021
She's either the best liar I ever met (because I thought she was a terrible liar) or something really shifted internally in the relatively recent past.
Some times people are just not that deep. Meaning she could have genuinely loved you and meant everything she said before. However, her love doesn't include fidelity, honesty, and respect. She never matured enough in that respect so it was easy for her to give it up when something new and shiny came along to throw ego kibbles her way. That's why her answers to you sounded like those of a teenager - not wanting to give up her friends or the validation of the OM even when faced with losing the marriage. Her love is shallow.
Maxwell354 (original poster member #79092) posted at 10:40 AM on Thursday, July 22nd, 2021
That…fits pretty well. Looking back, I had ignored a lack of depth. I figured it would come when we got closer. But that flower never blossomed. Everything was always surface level…which was my biggest problem with the relationship we had.
HalfTime2017 ( member #64366) posted at 6:14 PM on Thursday, July 22nd, 2021
Again, so many similarities in our stories. My exWW, lacked emotional maturity. It was actually the reason I believe we didn't argue much. She just wasn't aware, on top of holding some stuff in. Even her best friends would complain to me about my WW that she just lacked emotions. That's kind of a big deal for a woman.
As others have said, take it easy on yourself, you're still early days. Do your televisit, workout, sleep when you can. The first 2-3 months is the toughest to get through. YOu want answers, and you want results, and you want your WW to come running back to you apologizing and admitting her wrongs. Unfortunately that is not going to be your reality.
Infidelity and Divorce takes a long time to get out from under, unlike when you get married and its just 1 single piece of paper. So prepare yourself for a marathon, it will be 1-2 yrs. You will start to feel better at 4-6 months, but your mind will still be on the affair, working on the D, and moving forward. So keep this in mind.
As for your WW, as mentioned previously, is moving on. This is her exit affair, she just never bothered to tell you that she was done. And as others have said, she is looking forward to trying this new relationship and seeing where it goes, if if crashes and burns, she may come running back at you. As a man, do you want that? Do you want to be her back up plan? There is no guarantee that if she came running back, that she won't again cheat at some point at a later date a few yrs down the road. She has to work on fixing her innerself. The one that like my exWW, lacked emotional depth. It takes lots of work, on top of the complete lost of trust between the both of you.
Right now, lets just put that point on the back burner, bc you don't currently have a wife that wants R. She is wanting to get with the other man, she is working her mom on that angle as well. Her story is she fell out of love with you, and she wants to move on. Its a very effective story, and doesn't make her look back. YOu get to tell your side, and I would share it with everyone. She cheated and exactly with whom, so that she cant just tell everyone later that they met during your divorce. Tell your friends and family now, that that was the cause of your divorce and keep that evidence to back up your claim.
Keep moving forward, b/c your WW has already done so. Do not leave any openings for her to branch her way back to you.
Maxwell354 (original poster member #79092) posted at 12:40 AM on Friday, July 23rd, 2021
It was actually the reason I believe we didn't argue much
Lightbulb went off in my head for this one. It also explains a lot of other behaviors...weird repressed tantrums when I tried to get her to do something she didn't want to (like clean up her clothes) and oh, yes, the messes everywhere. The only difference HalfTime is that my WW wore her happy face all the time. So she had 1 emotion and it was happy. It took a long time to realize there was so little expression of other emotion there. I mean she was happy right? Why ruin it? It also sounds like she (unsurprisingly) intended to run around behind me back for as long as possible. And for all I know that was going on for many months as she was back at that employer late last year. But I will try not to think about that.
Anyways, WW came over today to pick up some more property. We did talk briefly. She admitted that she's been done since early this year and honestly, looking back I don't blame her for being unhappy in the relationship itself. The lack of children thing really pushed us apart. And I was withdrawing.
She did also make some comments alluding to the lack of butterflies and sparks in our relationship of late. This led me to believe she doesn't understand what a long term marriage entails. The ups and downs. The work required. She wanted the 40 year honeymoon she was promised by the media. So in this sense it was probably doomed no matter what I did. Trying to maintain that level of infatuation long term is exhausting, impossible, or both. And obviously she took a real shit way out of the situation, a nasty side which would have shown up in other ways in the future.
Personally, I've come up with a lot of information about what I could have done better. I only hope I can internalize it because a lot of it is long running.
And I think I've developed some stress trauma from this. One of the images sent to OM was paired with a response that I read "still thinking about you" and eventually lined up to the day of the admitted sexual activity. I know there have to be more, but this one I know of and with all the pieces together it is burned into my mind. Her sitting on our couch, taking this picture after having done what she did then crawling into bed with me. Meanwhile I think it's any other day.
The image inserts itself into my mind without any warning.
[This message edited by Maxwell354 at 6:47 PM, July 22nd (Thursday)]
steadychevy ( member #42608) posted at 1:16 AM on Friday, July 23rd, 2021
Personally, I've come up with a lot of information about what I could have done better.
Couldn't we all, Maxwell. In everything. I could have done so much better as a parent and I was very present as a parent. Many the night I thought before I went to sleep that I sure screwed that up.
What you could have done better or things you shouldn't have done at all are not why your WW cheated and still is. It is in her internal workings.
She did also make some comments alluding to the lack of butterflies and sparks in our relationship of late. This led me to believe she doesn't understand what a long term marriage entails. The ups and downs. The work required. She wanted the 40 year honeymoon she was promised by the media.
I think this is evidence of a juvenile brain that hasn't matured. I believe my XWW is the same. They are never fully committed with both feet in. It isn't a deep, mature, enduring love. It's more puppy love, crush love, etc. that comes and goes depending on emotions.
We all have done better in a lot of life events. That isn't why your WW committed adultery though. In a marriage you work together as a team. You understand that there are ebbs and flows. Enduring love is a decision and not a feeling or butterfly emotion.
My best wishes to you, Maxwell. It isn't over. It takes time and effort and work to heal from the trauma of adultery. Take care of yourself.
BH(me)70; XWW 64; M 42 yrs
LTA-09/02-06/06? OM - COW
"dates" w/3 lovers post engagement;ONS w/stranger post commitment, lies, lies, lies
Separated 23/09/2017; D 16/03/2020
HalfTime2017 ( member #64366) posted at 1:30 AM on Friday, July 23rd, 2021
Max, your wife has no idea how to be and to hold onto a long term marriage or relationship. What most likely happened, is she was so emotionally repressed, that when a player (AP) presented himself to her, she felt an awakening. Honestly, I feel this way about my ex. The problem is, once she gets used up, do you want her back? She so easily through you away for a player. A loser, who preys on married women.
Butterflies? Fucken butterflies? I was with my ex for 17 yrs, tend of them married. In a long term relationship, there is happiness and you get set into a groove. I'm not saying its a great thing, but you do have a routine and we also had children. I'm sorry, but I have to put the children first, they're young and we have to care for them. My ex ran off and introduced my kids to her AP before I even found out she was having an affair. I learned this from my kids after I caught her. That she would take them to the mall to meet this doucebag.
People like this view relationships like a fucken movie. There is not "Love Actually" in real life. We have jobs, laundry and bills to pay. Shit is real. And we also had a great marriage. A very nice life, vacations, homes, nice cars, great family and friends. Everyone thought that we were the perfect couple, including myself. But guess what, she didn't, and she never bothered telling me so that we could have worked on it. I really chaulk this up to her lack of understanding of how long term relationships work, her own mom and dad had a shit relationship that ended in D, and her dad did cheat on her mom at the end of their 35 yr marriage.
You're not going to miss out on much. YOu will move on. A nice and successful man, and you have no kids, are going to be high on most womens wish list in your 30-40s. Bank on it. I moved on, and found someone much better. Someone who loves me, and understands how long term relationships are going to flow. She loves my kids. All my family and friends see this too. Its so obvious to them, they tell me all the time.
Keep moving forward. YOu will be fine. Its painful right now, and will be for a bit, so just prepare yourself for it. But know, that many on this board before you have gone through this shit show, and came out in good shape and moved on. This is not the end, its just the end of your relationship with a cheating WW. In time, you'll see its not a huge loss.
[This message edited by HalfTime2017 at 7:32 PM, July 22nd (Thursday)]
beb252 ( member #78948) posted at 1:43 AM on Friday, July 23rd, 2021
She wanted the 40 year honeymoon she was promised by the media.
Pretty sure once she's done with the honeymoon phase with her much older lover, she will either get dumped or she will dump him. Especially since he's an older guy and of course you can't cheat time.
She will do what she did to you no matter who her husband is, considering her way of thinking. Whoever was destined to be her husband, this, what's happening now is bound to happen with her. Even if it's not you, it will still happen because of her personality. She constantly seeks validation from somewhere. She got tired of you and it happened that she was able to find her validation from an older, much more experienced with affairs, guy.
Well, at least now your path is much clearer. Once your paperwork is done, establish full no contact with her.
Don't worry, her life will be in shambles soon enough. She might even try to come back crawling to you on all fours promising everything! It will be too late for her by then.
You're still young! You can still find someone who will truly love you.
All the best and good luck on your new life!
guvensiz ( member #75858) posted at 1:55 AM on Friday, July 23rd, 2021
She did also make some comments alluding to the lack of butterflies and sparks in our relationship of late. This led me to believe she doesn't understand what a long term marriage entails.
I guess she also has no idea about the lifespan of butterflies.
She will see how long the butterflies and sparks will last, which the man who has been divorced twice and married 3 times and cheated on his current wife with her, made her fly.
Marz ( member #60895) posted at 1:50 PM on Friday, July 23rd, 2021
You seem to still want this to be your fault. Why?
You could never fix her and the next one won’t either.
You should wake up to reality now.
Maxwell354 (original poster member #79092) posted at 2:30 PM on Friday, July 23rd, 2021
I felt that I have a majority of fault for the relationship status and I still believe that. Maybe that will change in time but, with respect, that story is not on this board so you don’t know anything of it.
I do not believe that her terrible actions were in any way appropriate, justified, or in any way my fault. Nor that the final failure of the relationship was my fault (as it was salvageable, if down). Those decisions are hers alone. I am referencing solely on my locus of control. My action or lack of action. Said another way, my actions did not justify the response or end of relationship in my opinion, but there were poor choices resulting from my own mental health problems.
Point is, I’m mentally separating the infidelity from the relationship issues up to that failure point, whenever it was. And thinking hard on how I can be a better, less critical person. Ironically, that criticism, which is was sometimes directed at her, is directed at myself currently. But I don’t think anyone on here can opine on the relationship as a whole.
[This message edited by Maxwell354 at 10:04 AM, July 23rd (Friday)]
jb3199 ( member #27673) posted at 3:15 PM on Friday, July 23rd, 2021
Nothing, and I mean NOTHING, makes us look introspectively with a 1000x magnification glass like we do after infidelity. It's a real eye opener.
And if I was to guess, you, like myself and most of the others, initially looked inward and took some responsibility for the affair. Then we get past the initial shock factor, and look at how our shortcomings did not help the state of the marriage. Then, finally, we accept that we had ZERO responsibility for the affair, and our behaviors/actions didn't 'pave the way', either.....because cheating is a character flaw---something we have NO control over.
Then afterwards, hopefully, that new insight motivates us to want to change those shortcomings. Many confuse this with "See? Infidelity, down the road actually helped our marriage." Wrong. It was merely a catalyst, and one that should never been introduced in such fashion. Like taking better care of your health after you get diabetes. Yes, it's great that your being healthy now, but you would have preferred that the motivation came from less damaging circumstances.
Married 28yrs.(together over 30yrs.)
All work and no play has just cost me my wife--Gary Puckett
Accepting that I can/may end this marriage 7/2/14
Maxwell354 (original poster member #79092) posted at 4:11 PM on Sunday, July 25th, 2021
Well I received an odd message from WW that made me wonder how deep the emotional IQ issues go...
Without getting too specific lets just say we have a shared account for a service with a rewards program. And the email is still in her name so when you use the service it sends the info to said email...Friday afternoon I used this service. And some 30 min later I get a 3 word message from WW basically saying to enjoy it...WTF?
It was the kind of message I'd expect from my wife if she were on a girls vacation or some other personal event and saw the message. Like "hey have fun while I'm gone!" Not shortly after she was discovered having an affair and a few days after telling me she had been done with the marriage for months and failing to deny the affair had ended (aka admitting it was continuing). I did respond once to confirm it wasn't a financial issue (i.e. didn't charge her account) ...but that was it.
I don't think she is bitter or messing with me. So I can only figure it is a level of disconnectedness I cannot even fathom...
[This message edited by Maxwell354 at 10:13 AM, July 25th (Sunday)]