SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Hi everyone, this is a place I never thought I’d be, but I have been reading posts for a few weeks now and I was hoping getting advice from people who have actually gone through a similar situation would help. Let me give you some background:

I (35F) have been with my WH (35) for 17 years. I was on vacation with my two children in June/July before my WH joined us a few weeks later. While there, I had a gut feeling something was wrong. I had these gut feelings a few times already, but just chalked it up to my grumpiness and overreacting. Well, a night or two after he joined us I went through his phone and found text messages to his brothers where he asked them not to post pictures with his friend and said what happened between brothers, stayed between brothers. He woke up and asked what I was doing and I asked him to explain who he was talking about. To make a long story short, I ended up going to a cousin’s house that night even though he asked me to stay and we fought through texts. I ended up getting into his call logs and saw he was calling a number several times a day for long periods of time, dating back as far as January (that was as far as I could see because the line was in my name before that), He actually got in touch with this woman as soon as I logged into the account (I know because he texted the wrong number, so it showed up on the log).

He swore it was just a friendship, that he felt like I didn’t listen to him anymore and he liked talking to her, even though she was just like another dude, said the friendship wasn’t important and he’d cut off all ties, etc. I never saw another call on his call log, but then other weird stuff started happening: he started blaming me for a lot of things going sour in our marriage, started talking about life with the kids (apparently, I wouldn’t be in the picture anymore), said he just couldn’t get over things I said after “d-day 1” (not sure if I should call it that since I technically didn’t know, but my gut told me it wasn’t anything good), I would see that they were connected on WhatsApp around the same times and even confronted him about it, but of course, everything was “in my head”.

I actually got in touch with the OW three times. One in front of him, one while he was in another room, and another through WhatsApp. She denied having a relationship all three times, although the last one she left it up in the air by saying I should know him and lying and cheating were something she’d never put up with. Anyway, I decided to play into her game and told her I believed her and my husband and thanked her for talking to me.

Fast forward almost a month (October 21, 2020), I start getting private calls during my IC and after ignoring three, she finally calls without blocking her number. We decide to meet and she confesses everything: they met three years ago, she approached him, 6 months later it started with a kiss, soon after they started having sex...at first with condoms, then without. Mind you, she is married with two kids as well, and only moved out of the house she shared with her husband and kids a year ago. Not only that, but all the time he was telling me he cut off all contact and acting like he wanted things to work between us, he was letting her know everything I was doing (found her Pinterest, seeing her other social media accounts, showing her picture to family members), etc. This fueled her to make post directed at me, which I would mention to him and he’d blow off...he even talked shit about her appearance and her stupidity, but she told me when I was away tending to a sister who had a nervous breakdown, he pretended to go into work, left my kids with my parents, and actually went to sleep at her house. She knew things about me I didn’t even know! I had a missed miscarriage over the spring and apparently she knew about every appointment, he told her when I fell down the stairs during the pregnancy, etc. Honestly, I was so hurt not only by the sex I know they had, but more so by all the stuff he talked to her about and all the lies he continued to tell me.

Honestly, he was a great husband before I found this out: he always sent me loving texts, he took me to work, he helped me whenever I needed something for work or otherwise (even when they were time consuming projects), he cooked, he helped around the house, was a loving father, made me feel wanted (although I was struggling with a lot of my own issues, and I can admit his advances weren’t always welcome, so we were probably having sex 4/5 times a month). He NEVER gave me hints that he was truly unhappy...except for seeming disappointed about the sexual advances not being reciprocated.

In hindsight, there were things like being on his phone a lot, slowly drifting away from my family (which he was super close to), going to the bathroom several times a day and taking a long time even if he didn’t go, not leaving his phone charging next to me even if it was low on battery, going to “the gym” a lot, not wanting to commit to buying a house, etc. that honestly should’ve been red flags, but I just chalked it up to either people changing and wanting new things or me overthinking.

Well, after d-day 2 (or the official d-day?), obviously I told him to get the fuck out and I told him I had gotten in touch with my attorney (when things were rocky, I let him know I had reached out to two to see what my rights were), and that he should find one too. Well, when he arrived from work the next morning (the fighting had happened via calls and text because he was working the night his AP came to see me), he went out to look at some apartments and came back with a card from his lawyer—he filed a petition for divorce. He found an apartment, signed the lease, and moved out Sunday (this happened Wednesday night while he was at work/Thursday). I was floored. Yes, I said I wanted one because I was reeling in pain. I couldn’t understand how even after I was so close to finding out, he was still in touch with this woman. Obviously, his coworkers knew about his affair to some degree, she visited him often...or so it seems. I have felt so ashamed, stupid, angry...and yet I don’t want to let him go.

I have told him several times that he can withdraw the petition, that we can try working on this and his response is “I think I have taken our love relationship to a place of no return. It has been 2.5 years of hurt and betrayal”. He has also told me “I am carrying a lot of shit/dirt/baggage/guilt. I don’t know how to deal or proceed, but I know I don’t want to hurt you any further”. He has mentioned missing me and hanging out, but not wanting to confuse me...doing this without the kids knowing because he doesn’t want to get their hopes up and then have things not work out again, how attractive I am, that he knows he fucked things up (because he was horny...he says he wasn’t in love...but after everything, should I even believe him?)...I am even embarrassed to say this weekend I went over to his place and we had sex for the first time in a month (since before his AP confessed). He says he doesn’t want to hurt me and the kids again and I just keep on hearing “I want to be single while I ‘figure myself out’, but I also want to keep you around as a plan B”. Am I wrong in thinking this way? Could he really be so confused by everything that even though I want to reconcile he pushes back?

He managed to piss me off again after I told him our two kids had a rough night Sunday. I told them I wasn’t feeling well and without thinking I said “what if I’m dying and I don’t know it? What would you do?”, to which my son (12) replied “I would kill myself”. Obviously, I was not expecting that response and after I talked to him about it, my daughter (7) started lashing out too...WH blamed it on me for making comments about dying (especially after my daughter’s pet turtle had just died—mind you, she had him for a month and he was over at her dad’s, so it’s not like she saw him often, anyway), but he refused to accept that this lashing out/the comments they make are directly related to them being blindsided by this relationship and him being so okay with leaving. He knows he is entitled to 50:50 parent allocation by the way, and has only kept them one night a week since leaving. This week he committed to two nights even though he could’ve had them FOUR. He texts them in the morning and at night, but I just really feel like he has dropped the ball. My son is so upset with him, we set him up for IC. He always makes comments about him not being trustworthy, breaking our hearts, expecting respect but not giving it to his children, having a better relationship with me, etc., and it’s almost like WH is too dumbfounded right now to even begin repairing their relationship. He thinks buying them everything they want right now is a good start 🙄

Anyway, I know this post is super long, but honestly it is just scratching the surface. I guess I’m wondering, especially if any WS gets through my rant...is it posible that he really is confused or is he just stringing me along by saying he doesn’t know what he wants and then leaving it open to interpretation with the flirting, wanting to hang out, saying we both need a reset, that maybe in the future xyz? I’m just as confused as he says he is, but I guess if he still hasn’t withdrawn his petition for a divorce it’s for a reason, right?

I think he wants to avoid making an irrevocable decision. I think he'd rather sit on a fence than look inside and take responsibility for himself.

Have you thought seriously about what you want? My bet is that you haven't, if only because of all the feelings that come with being betrayed - grief, anger, fear, shame....

I recommend being mindful and thinking about what you want. Check to see if feelings interfere with thinking. If so, a good IC can help sort out your thoughts and feelings.

If you can think, you may find yourself coming down on one side or the other. If you want R, I think your best bet is to figure out your requirements for R and see if your H will sign on.

R is eminently possible if both of you do the necessary work. R is impossible if one of you doesn't.

IMO, recovery pretty much starts with figuring what you want.

I'm really sorry you've been betrayed.

I'm so sorry you're here. You will find that everyone here is very helpful and will offer an abundance of advice. Some of it will hurt, some it will sting, but it's all to help you. We've been there and understand your pain. Again, I'm so sorry.

As for DDays, I think you are correct in that #1 was the initial discovery; at that time it was at the very least an emotional affair if he was relying on her for support. #2 was definitely the conversation with her where everything came out. I'm curious as to whether or not she plans to stay with him and why she decided to "come clean" with you. But she's not the problem, your husband is.

My xWH blamed me for everything too; it was my fault that he strayed, it was my fault to didn't encourage him to be better, blah blah blah. Both in a marriage are responsible for it but HE chose ON HIS OWN to cheat. HIS choice was NOT your fault.

The hysterical bonding you've gone through (where he's not around but then you connect) isn't real bonding. He's still with her and it seems he has no intention of reconciling with you while she's around. xWH did the SAME to me, and I wasted over a year playing that game of "I hope he chooses me eventually." Yes, he's stringing you along as a Plan B. Or, he may have no desire to leave her but still keep you because it's fun for him to feel desired .

Don't tell him he can withdraw his petition; if he really wanted to he would, I'm sorry. I think he has been ready for sometime and just needed an excuse (aka you) to do it. If I hadn't filed myself years ago I'd probably still be married because xWH was too much of a coward to do it himself.

I echo everything Newlife said. I went through exactly the same thing. I wanted our marriage to work so badly.

If I had it to do over again I would have done things differently. For starters, I would have filed for divorce as soon as he signed a lease for an apartment. That was a very clear indication that he had no intention of saving our marriage. And by not doing that, I gave him more time to pillage our joint assets.

He said all the same things your WH is saying. How he was so confused, and he loved me but didn't know what he wanted, that he wanted to be single while deciding. He said he didn't want to confuse me or hurt me also while he had no problem having sex with me and dangling the carrot that I was still in the running.

Ya know what? You can't have a wife and be single at the same time. You can't have a wife waiting in the wings while you explore other options. He loved having a wife that desperately wanted him and a mistress who wanted him too and that's what I think your WH is doing. To them, two is better than one.

I can't tell you what you should do. I can only assure you that you are not crazy for feeling like plan B because unfortunately you are at the moment. Sisoon is right about figuring out what YOU want. And I can assure you that the more you work at seeing this situation for what it is, the easier your decision will be. I remember down to the minute when it all became clear to me. You'll get there too. Don't let him take your power.

So Sorry, KeepingIt. This is especially tough during the holidays. The Covid situation puts even more stress on the kids. What a tough and exhausting time for you trying to Keeepit2gether.

I think your WH has told you what he wants. He wants to be single or at least he wants to act like it while you mind the house, the bills, the kids, etc.

I suggest saying to him, "Look this isn't what I want, but I will not stay in infidelity. You need to pick one or the other, because both are not an option. You can come home, we can work on our marriage & family without AP in the midst, or you can choose AP. I will survive either way."

With that you do the hard 180, talking only about bills & kids, and nothing else if he stays away. By Monday, get yourself a lawyer and let the lawyer handle your counter claim. If he comes home, set the tough rules and don't waiver.(Many posts list all the requirements ).

You will keep your dignity and self respect. You deserve better. Also, tell your families and friends the truth. And call AP's partner if they aren't divorced yet.

Good Luck. You may think you can't do this, but you can! She has 2 children. He has 2 children. They have a lot to handle when the fog clears.

So many great people will help you here if you let them....LET THEM

Also, get to your lawyer and start the process on your end, look up the 180 (only communicate about your children), take your life back. Make sure her husband knows everything.

Don't touch him again...get a full panel STD test done.

[This message edited by SlapNutsABingo at 12:05 PM, November 25th (Wednesday)]

First, I'm sorry you are here. Sadly I could have written half of what you said (minus any kind of confessional from the AP).

Could he really be so confused by everything that even though I want to reconcile he pushes back?

My feeling is, no, he can't. Sisoon is, per usual, spot on:

I think he wants to avoid making an irrevocable decision. I think he'd rather sit on a fence than look inside and take responsibility for himself.

This was my WH, to a T. At one point, after d-day2 (false R for a year), my WH told me that he didn't want to hurt me anymore, that his baggage was too much and he feared his "personality traits" would make it hard if not impossible to reconcile. He did all of this to avoid making the decision to have me leave - although I know (and in all honestly knew then) that is what he wanted me to do...until I started to make real moves to leave. Now he's "all in" and "was a total idiot in the past" and I'm "so wonderful" etc...

The thing is, I think he believes what he is saying. At the time he was "so confused" and "so ambivalent" he really wasn't - he wanted me to leave - but he was scared he was making the wrong decision (hence the ambivalence). He really was trying to "choose" between me and his married AP co-worker and former friend's wife (who is also a co-worker - it's a true clusterfuck). Now, things have gone very south for him at work - the cat is out of the bag - everyone at his work knows that he ad the AP were fucking and carrying on an affair in front of her husband, who also works with them, and who is generally very well liked. My WH is now on the outside - judged - and shunned by the majority of his co-workers, while the AP (who is still married to her H) is allowed to be part of the circle of friends there by virtue of being married to her H. My WH is the "big loser" in this whole drama of his own creation, and now, he wants me again.

How do I believe that now? And more importantly, why would I want to continue with it, even if it were true? I believe that my WH is telling the truth about his feeling for me - that is how he feels - but his feelings are flakey, mushy, changeable, easily manipulated, and unreliable. Who wants that in a marital partner?

This land of flakiness is likely where you are too. Your WH moved out, and is now playing this little game with you (my WH actually admitted the A was "like a game" to him) and it's likely not because he is some evil being, but because he does not really care or more importantly, does not want to see how this game is damaging to you. It's just more selfishness on his part.

There will come a time when your desire to protect yourself will outweigh your heart's desire to have what it thought it used to have. It's a process and I don't blame you for feeling the way that you do - I was there once too. You will make it, and I'm not saying your WH cannot change - it's early goings and I'm not psychic. I'm also not saying that if/when he does change you may find yourself not wanting him anymore. Those are just some of the multitudes of things that could happen between now and that amorphous period called "later."

Breathe and give yourself some distance from him. It's not fair that this has happened to you (and me and everyone else on this site). Make yourself Plan A, as hard as that is sometime, and keep your distance from him. It's something I wish I had done sooner. One of the most important things I learned here was actions speak louder than words. Watch his actions. If he does little to try to convince you to give him another chance, then he really doesn't want one. If he does, then pay attention to what he's doing - there is a LOT of advice on her about that process. It's that simple and that hard all at the same time. But for now, stop answering his booty calls (and stop answering his calls in general). Make a list, put it in writing, and give it to him, of what you would need to even consider R, and if he doesn't try to make that happen, then it's because he doesn't want to. Let's face it - we are dealing with people who worked very hard to keep a secret for a long long time (my WH's A was over 2 years as well) - they are fully capable of working for what they want if they want it. Don't let them word-game you into thinking that all of a sudden being honest and genuine is too hard for them - that's just bullshit.

And keep posting here as you need - it really was a lifesaver for me.

[This message edited by ThisIsSoLonely at 2:56 AM, November 26th (Thursday)]

Your husband does NOT sound like he wants to reconcile at all. You are giving him a branch to grab onto by even considering R but he is just using you.

he filed a petition for divorce. He found an apartment, signed the lease, and moved out Sunday (this happened Wednesday night while he was at work/Thursday). I was floored.

He did not even try and fight to stay together with you and already had his escape route set up.

He has also told me “I am carrying a lot of shit/dirt/baggage/guilt.

Blame shifting his infidelity onto you. Marriage is 50-50, infidelity is 100% onto him

I want to be single while I ‘figure myself out’,

"I want to sleep around while you wait for me." -Translation

but I also want to keep you around as a plan B”. Am I wrong in thinking this way

You are not wrong at all you are currently plan B in his eyes.

You need to start writing down how often you take care of the kids. Start looking up and doing the 180, keep communication on just the kids. If you continue to do the Pick Me Dance by offering Reconciliation and contacting him this will be a loss.

He needs to realize that he WILL lose you if this divorce goes through.

Reconciliation takes 2 people. Divorce only takes 1 person.

[This message edited by BigNoob at 12:35 PM, November 25th (Wednesday)]

Darn it, I’m new to this and lost a reply I had started, so hopefully I remember everything I said. First of all, thank you for all the replies!

As far as what I want, if he truly committed to reconciliation, I would want to try. As I mentioned in my first post, I had no clue this was going on because he always treated me like he was deeply in love—honestly, we seemed like a model couple to many. However, as many of you have stated, I think it’s pretty clear that R isn’t something he’s considering at the moment.

As far as the AP, I honestly think she confessed because he tried to cut off the affair. At least that’s what he said, and she actually told me at one point “So what, now he can leave me like I’m just some doll that he played with and now he can discard?” She mentioned she thought he might’ve manipulated her, used her, etc., but I know she can be lying again, just like she lied the three times I asked her for honesty before. However, after he moved out I got into the phone records again (about a week ago) and there were still no calls to her. Again, he could be using Snapchat or WhatsApp like he did in the past, but I won’t know for sure.

When I found out he retained a lawyer, I did the same. Once I received his petition, I filed a counter petition, but we really don’t have anything to fight over (we split our money at my request before I even knew it was a PA). The only thing I’m going after is a 5/2 schedule with the kids due to his work schedule (he works overnights), primary custody, lawyers’ fees, and child support. He has basically told me he’s not paying for my lawyer and that he wants joint custody so he can be involved in medical decisions because he knows I’ll make the best decisions as far as education (he has had little involvement in it besides art projects/picking them up and dropping them off)

ETA: I did go get an STD panel yesterday; he said he got one last year 🙄

It’s just hard to wrap my head around how he could be a completely different man literally from one day to the other...besides the things I mentioned, there were NO clues that he wasn’t deeply in love so now I’m just like WTF? Was it all a lie?!

[This message edited by Keepingit2gether at 1:04 PM, November 25th (Wednesday)]

Let's face it - we are dealing with people who worked very hard to keep a secret for a long long time (my WH's A was over 2 years as well) - they are fully capable of working for what they want if they want it. Don't let them word-game you into thinking that all of a sudden being honest and genuine is too hard for them - that's just bullshit.

Thank you, this is so true!

he wants joint custody so he can be involved in medical decisions because he knows I’ll make the best decisions as far as education

Our agreement was joint legal custody for those reasons (medical, education decisions, etc.) but physical custody with me. I'm sure there are lots of options to work with so that he has a legal say in their welfare but you still have them with you 5/2.

Double post

[This message edited by CaliforniaNative at 5:07 PM, November 25th (Wednesday)]

Was it all a lie?!

- yes. If you wrap your head around every lie, every date, every phone call, his brother, his coworkers, sex, talking behind your back, leaving you with the kids while he played, the money he spent, the relationship he had (it is long enough to be a relationship)- he led a double life. The last two years there were a lot of lies. Who knows what else he lied about. What you do know.... he is a really good liar. Protect yourself. Take care of yourself. Put yourself first. You have a long road to recovery, know that.

My x had a 2 year affair. It took me about 1.5 years to heal and I walked away.

He has basically told me he’s not paying for my lawyer and that he wants joint custody so he can be involved in medical decisions because he knows I’ll make the best decisions as far as education (he has had little involvement in it besides art projects/picking them up and dropping them off

Whoa down. Are you just letting him drive this bus?

From what I read you'd like to reconcile. You want your husband back.

If you're sure you do, then there are steps you can take, plans you can make. You don't have to sit there and just let a husband poacher take your man.

There are two wonderful books that you must read, titled "Love Must Be Tough" by Dr. James Dobson AND "Surviving an Affair" by Dr. Willard F. Harley, Jr. and Dr. Jennifer Harley Chalmers

They are on Amazon and if you want him back, do not delay reading them.

Maybe you think, "Geez they've been together so long he's so in love with her, I don't have a chance.

I say she's been letting her ugly side out ever since she left her H. She's pressuring him to move on the D. So you have to slow the whole process down. If you want.

He may be having second thoughts about her. If you stay sweet, calm, reassuring and all that, she isn't going to look very good in comparison.

So delay if you can. If he doesn't want to pay your lawyer fees, stand firm on that point and insist that he pay. I mean, what do you have to lose?

He probably got the idea from her anyway.

And you ought to tell him, sweetly of course, that during this time of introspection, maybe he should not see her at all.

[This message edited by Ariopolis at 5:46 PM, November 25th (Wednesday)]

Two cents on the settlement ....

You said you split the money already. Are you in a no fault state? And does youre lawyer agree with the division percentage? A 50/50 of assets might not be in your favour and maybe you are entitled to more particular as the primary custody of the children.

I'm sure there are lots of options to work with so that he has a legal say in their welfare but you still have them with you 5/2.

You’re right, I suppose I’m just annoyed that it even matters to him when he’s okay with only getting two nights a week.

CaliforniaNative, I’m unable to quote you now (I’m still learning how to use this site), but I’m sorry we’re in similar situations. Do you mind me asking what made you walk away? Was your WS unwilling to do the work or were you just unable to forgive/forget? You’re right, he did live a double life. Makes me wonder if he was thinking about leaving the marriage for some time or just trying to fill a void. Again, he keeps feeding me the “I have to work on myself” crap and basically says since it keeps coming up now, he knows it’ll always come up later.

Ariopolis, I have been sweet, I have been sad, I have been angry...and I still don’t think any of it has worked in my favor, unfortunately. I understand to a point—-what he did is despicable. However, if he truly believed his behavior was abhorrent and he wanted to save his marriage, he would try given that I have offered so many opportunities. It almost feels like if I’m not willing to rugsweep there’s no chance.

Tortured, we are in a no fault state. I asked him to go to the bank before even talking to a lawyer...honestly, I thought a lot of the things I was doing would scare him—I think they only motivated him to continue on his path to being a bachelor again 🤷🏽‍♀️

[This message edited by Keepingit2gether at 10:48 PM, November 25th (Wednesday)]

Sometimes it’s not the affair that kills the marriage but the behavior from the cheater after Dday that does.

This sounds like one of them.

You are in limbo. He’s expecting you to live with him and his infidelity. Good for you for not allowing that!

The frustrating aspect of affairs is that you are left dealing with an irrational mindset. The cheater “believes” this new relationship is the answer to their unhappiness. However the betrayed can see all the reasons it is flawed.

It’s very hard to watch someone you love make a huge mistake. And it’s not that the betrayed spouse thinks the marriage is the answer for the cheater — but the betrayed can see the affair is not the solution to the issues the cheater has.

To me the affair is like an addiction in some cases. The thrill or joy the cheater gets - followed by guilt and shame the cheater faces - is like a vicious cycle. (Obviously some cheaters don’t have guilt or shame or even acknowledge it). But for those that do, it’s like an endless roller coaster ride.

Just remember you are not dealing with the same person you once knew. Cheaters become irrational and morph into someone you don’t recognize. The addiction of the affair changes them into someone completely different.

Like an addict unless the cheater wants to change or stop cheating, there is very little the betrayed can do.

Sometimes it’s not the affair that kills the marriage but the behavior from the cheater after Dday that does.

Oh man, this is so true. I wish my WH would open his eyes to this.

Just remember you are not dealing with the same person you once knew. Cheaters become irrational and morph into someone you don’t recognize. The addiction of the affair changes them into someone completely different.

I have been thinking about this a lot! I imagine there’s a lot of adrenaline involved and I imagine, especially with a LTA, that the adrenaline rush becomes addictive. You’re also right in saying it must be like a rollercoaster ride, full of highs and then intense feelings of guilt/shame. I just wonder why that shame wasn’t enough to get him to stop.

Sometimes it’s not the affair that kills the marriage but the behavior from the cheater after Dday that does.

Not just sometimes. I think it’s most of the time because most BS’s stay for at least a little bit. If they get the usual toxic cocktail of DARVO, trickle truth, blameshifting, continued gaslighting, rewriting the history of the marriage and so on — while also still dealing with the horrible shock and trauma of the initial betrayal abuse — they eventually wake up and realize this is untenable and they are with a toxic person.