Newest Member: Loyalandbetrayed

Just Found Out :
Long Distance soul mates end suddenly

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 Eternitysky (original poster New Member #75904) posted at 3:49 PM on Tuesday, November 24th, 2020

My wife(28 Canadian) and I(35US) had an argument on Oct 26. We haven’t been able to see each other since summer of 2019 and with COVID it was shaping up to be a little longer before we could. Things had been coming to a boiling point that month and she had a rather hard week ignoring me/making excuses on why not to talk. I figured she was going through a rough week and just wanted to talk about it. She just got angry and we argued sometimes but we always bounced back. She ended up hanging up on me that night and started to soft ghost me.

For the next 3 brutal weeks I tried to talk to her about things and she was cold and consistent about suddenly wanting to end things. She had done this before, her anger would control her and she would mention divorce but after a week or two we would talk it out. We had always come back from arguments before and became stronger for it but this time felt colder, meaner. I couldn’t sleep, barely ate, cried for hours a day and constantly felt sick to my stomach because of anxiety.

On the 16th of Nov I discovered she had been seeing a guy close to her. I found this out by a shared steam account we played games on together and he was freshly added. I did some sleuthing and found him on Facebook and discovered that he lived an hour away. I knew at that point she had been seeing him. On her break that day I asked about him and she admitted to a sexual relationship. She got off work early because was she "distressed" and we talked on the phone for an hour and a half. It was a good heart to heart that we hadn't had in a long time and it felt great to connect with her again. She has anger issues and will always hold things inside instead of bringing them to me. It's been hard to deal with that for so long. She told me she had only been seeing him for a few weeks(since our argument) and I believed her. I couldn't have been more stupid.

I had been messaging him on Facebook trying to figure out how long this had been going on and he would give vague answers but it was somewhere between a few months but not anywhere close to a year. She had lied about the timeframe and she had lied about seeing him again that night which he informed me was happening. He pleasantly took the time the next morning to flame me and said that she had told him I was "a mistake from her past" among many other cruel things to make me look bad. That's when my heart broke.

I didn't respond well and lashed out at both of them on Facebook, calling him scum and how he was actively ruining a marriage when he should know better because the same thing happened to his 9 year relationship earlier this year. I blasted her on Facebook and immediately got a nasty message from her aunt calling what I had done "unforgiveable" and I was showing my true colors. She was so quick to paint me as the bad guy and I lashed out at her also. Anger was the only thing keeping my anxiety from taking over and I was enjoying holding onto it.

After that the ghosting began. I tried to reach out to my wife anyway I could, tried to bargain and reason and when I got ignored I would get angry and call her out for treating me so badly. Nothing worked and it only got worse. It's been the longest week of my life and I'm still ignored. Nothing in my life could hurt more. It may sound like the dumbest thing ever but we believed that we would always be together and we were soul mates. Through thick and thin we pushed through to make it to 7 years and for her to just give up and ignore me was never something I thought possible. I could write an entire book how amazing and soul binding the years have been with her, our love was so pure and strong we both always came back to that foundation. We have had our issues in the past and it had been two years since those and now everything has fallen apart suddenly.

I've suffered from separation anxiety since Oct 26 and it had started to get better last week until I found out about him and its started all over again. I'm ghosted by her entire family, him and my wife. I sit here and deal with my anxiety the best I can, am I crazy for wanting some closure? For wanting her to give him up and just come back to me. She even admitted that night I confronted her that she thought we were soul mates and we had a great bond but she kept being negative saying things like "all good things come to an end". I'm torn because I can't keep doing this to myself but I can't stop thinking about all the good we have had. I've tried to show her that its still there and what we've had but its just day after day of ghosting. How could she do this to me for someone so new? I have plenty of guilt and shame for not doing things better, for getting angry and for overwhelming the situation searching for answers. I just never imagined after all we have been through and knowing that when were together its the best we have ever had that she would do this to me. She was always the one asking me to stay with her forever because she was scared I would find a local girl and now this.

Why can’t I stop being hopeful?

Why can’t I get through to her on things I KNOW she understands about us? Why can’t she see just see that she is letting him fill the void that was supposed to be for me?

Why is he better then me?

We had promised to see each other soon and we even made plans a week before all of this happened. Then finding out that she has been having sex with him for months, I don’t know what to think. Was she just slowly letting me go on her terms or was she trying to get her cake and eat it to? I feel like I should be able to shake this off and realize how abusive its been but it’s the opposite. I wish I wasn’t the kind of guy who always looked for a solution, the right thing to say or just being positive but I’ve had to be to make it work this long since she has been an angry mess for years. She told me just a few months ago that she loved me and was so thankful she had me because I could bring her back from her angry hell every time, so how could she do this to me?

Everything hurts so much lately. I break down the entire day because a simple thing reminds me of her or I think of her with him and it’s just such a sad heavy story and I really don’t like being at the bad end of it. I sit here and think about how the future might look if she ever comes back, I can’t even think of loving another person it was that strong between us. I have no closure, I have no connection to my wife/soul mate anymore and she is letting her anger destroy us. I’ve never felt this lost in my life.

Thanks for reading

posts: 5   ·   registered: Nov. 24th, 2020   ·   location: Florida
id 8611831
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oldtruck ( Member #62540) posted at 4:03 PM on Tuesday, November 24th, 2020

you have been living apart for 1.5 years.

i suspect she has been cheating for a lot longer than 5 years.

maybe not this OM but another or others.

be glad you found out now so you can get out of infidelity

by divorcing your WW. Do not waste any more years on her.

a red flag to me is that long distance relationships never last.

problem is the both of you placed more importance on your

jobs then your marriage.

posts: 1383   ·   registered: Feb. 2nd, 2018
id 8611833
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Talisman ( Member #75398) posted at 4:55 PM on Tuesday, November 24th, 2020

From what you have said I doubt very much she was ever wonderful. Entitled yes. Selfish yes. Immoral yes. And of course you will be made out to be the bad guy. What you need to do now is open your eyes and see her for what she is and see the situation for what it is. I am assuming you don't have kids so count yourself lucky.

You escaped a pending tragedy with your soul and scalp in tact.

posts: 72   ·   registered: Sep. 11th, 2020   ·   location: UK
id 8611847
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IronStitches ( New Member #49315) posted at 5:27 PM on Tuesday, November 24th, 2020

Eternitysky,

Please look into betrayal trauma. Honestly, it doesn't sound like you ever had a healthy relationship. If you have anxiety issues, sounds like you ended up with someone who only exacerbates them with her anger always threatening the relationship. And sounds like you always had to placate her. The dynamic sounds off, maybe a bit of co-dependence? I know it's a dreaded word but it does happen in relationships.

Very sorry to hear your W is playing games with this yes/no-ness. It can be soul crushing to think the past was either a lie or is over. People do grow apart or you're finally seeing her character flaw. Whatever you do:

1) Don't think you caused this or are responsible for her actions.

2) It sounds so trite but honestly, take care of yourself the best you can. Focus on you.

If she wants back in the M, let her work for it. Why should you chase someone who disrespected you. It's like you're running after her saying, "Kick me some more! Please!" Back off, she might be getting off on your pursuit or it makes you look pathetic and who wants someone who is pathetic?

Betrayal isn't something anyone should be able to shake off. I'd be more concerned if you did. That sounds more pathic than stoic.

"Never be ashamed of a scar. It simply means you were stronger than whatever tried to hurt you." - Unknown

posts: 40   ·   registered: Aug. 27th, 2015
id 8611854
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Buster123 ( Member #65551) posted at 5:49 PM on Tuesday, November 24th, 2020

She's a proven cheater and a liar, she's gone, file for D and move on, I know it hurts, I know it's hard but you have to go through it, get help from family or friends and/or go to counselling for help, call a D attorney and file for D, also don't forget to get tested for STDs, this may not be her first rodeo but just the first time you found out about it, you didn't mention any kids and based on what you posted I don't think you had a great M, you really dodge a bullet, so stop the "pick me dance" (it never works) and lay down the "hopium" pipe, you deserve so much better than a proven cheater and a liar, DO NOT take her back even if she tries to convince you of it in the future.

posts: 2408   ·   registered: Jul. 22nd, 2018
id 8611858
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Tanner ( Member #72235) posted at 6:14 PM on Tuesday, November 24th, 2020

I sorry you are going through this. What you are feeling is normal. Like you, I’m a Mr fixit, my W took advantage of it and continued to jerk me around with trickle truth. Harness your anger and put your foot down!!! Be done with her shit, take care of yourself, and 180 her now!!

Dday Sept 7 2019 working toward R
BH 54
WW 47
M 30 years, 4 kids 2 grown, twin boys 12 yo 2 grandkids

One day you will tell your story how you overcame what you are going through now, and it will become part of someone else’s survival guide.

posts: 715   ·   registered: Dec. 5th, 2019   ·   location: Texas DFW
id 8611863
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BigNoob ( Member #75807) posted at 6:28 PM on Tuesday, November 24th, 2020

Brother she is very far away from you. I would delete your SM or block her and her family. Anything that reminds you of her put it in a box and give it to one of your family members to hold on to. "Please hold onto this until I am emotionally okay."

1. Stop playing the pick me game. Stop messaging/calling her.

2. Hit the gym.

3. Eat healthy.

4. Ask your family and friends for emotional support.

5. Distract yourself. Hobbies, work, socializing.

6. If you haven't already file for divorce. Do NOT chase after her in Canada.

[This message edited by BigNoob at 6:32 PM, November 24th (Tuesday)]

posts: 207   ·   registered: Nov. 5th, 2020
id 8611866
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guvensiz ( Member #75858) posted at 6:57 PM on Tuesday, November 24th, 2020

"She said this, this and this; so how can she do that to me?" Because it's easy for a liar. Don't pretend that all she said is true and grow hope on it, accept that all were lie. Skip that "why" questions. Don't try to contact her, block her in all areas, file for D and go on living your life.

posts: 476   ·   registered: Nov. 14th, 2020
id 8611873
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Happenedtome2 ( Member #68906) posted at 8:09 PM on Tuesday, November 24th, 2020

You're still young. Get out of this now and go live your life. She is nothing but bad news at this point and she's not even sorry.

BH
DDay August 2018
Not so sure about R at this time.
My original post :
https://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=633451

posts: 446   ·   registered: Nov. 23rd, 2018
id 8611896
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newlife03 ( Member #56527) posted at 8:24 PM on Tuesday, November 24th, 2020

oldtruck, where did you read this? I didn't see where he spoke of jobs in different cities; there could be multiple reasons for why they aren't living together.

problem is the both of you placed more importance on your

jobs then your marriage.

Me - 50
Kids 25, 22, 18
1st DDay in 2006, 2nd in 2007
D in 2009
Happily Committed to SO since 2011

posts: 657   ·   registered: Dec. 22nd, 2016   ·   location: ID
id 8611901
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BigBlueEyes ( Member #71441) posted at 8:26 PM on Tuesday, November 24th, 2020

Sorry you are here,

Please stop 🛑 The pick me dance never works, it just makes you look weak in their eyes,

Now you need to be strong, be decisive, be courageous,

Don’t contact her or her family, you can bet your last $ she is spinning many many lies to any & all of them.

1st, Find yourself an IC

2nd, Call on friends & family for support,

3rd, Try to see your Doctor for advice or support in your area, (not sure of the protocol in US)

4th Find a shark lawyer & get things rolling,

Seriously you don’t deserve to be treated this way, ghosted, manipulated, lied to, it’s enough to drive anyone to the edge, please seek out someone to be there for you.

Sending strength & virtual hugs

Me- BW, 47
Multi Dday's,
DB A's x 2 BFF
Multi ONS's, Online shit.
Serial cheat, Abuser,
D 18.02.20
Stay strong, just because it’s hard today, doesn’t mean that next week it won’t get easier!!

posts: 674   ·   registered: Mar. 11th, 2019   ·   location: A tiny dot in a big 'ol World
id 8611902
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newlife03 ( Member #56527) posted at 8:31 PM on Tuesday, November 24th, 2020

I'm sorry you're here and dealing with this. It's something none of us expected but dealt with it. Thankfully we are on the "other side" now and can see things a bit more clearly.

Why can’t I get through to her on things I KNOW she understands about us? Why can’t she see just see that she is letting him fill the void that was supposed to be for me?

She is in a different world right now. Her life isn't about marriage, it's about being free. Unfortunately your distance makes it easier to get to this point, and I'm sorry your living arrangement isn't better. Like others have said, I doubt it only went on a few months; my guess is that it has been longer, at least emotionally if not physically. And for her family to be angry at you tells me she's already talked to them about leaving you, or they're in denial about the horrible mistake she has made. Either way, it's safe to say they won't be supportive. Stick to your family and friends for support and guidance.

Why is he better then me?

He isn't! Any man (or woman) who takes on a relationship with a married person is NOT better. Their choice makes them pitiful.

Remember that her decision was NOT your fault. Yes, both partners contribute to the issues in a marriage but it was HER decision to cheat. It's time to take care of YOU. Eat right, exercise, and do things that make you feel good. Don't chase her. You are the one who should be chased and asked for forgiveness, and if she's not willing to do that it may be time to move on.

[This message edited by newlife03 at 2:35 PM, November 24th (Tuesday)]

Me - 50
Kids 25, 22, 18
1st DDay in 2006, 2nd in 2007
D in 2009
Happily Committed to SO since 2011

posts: 657   ·   registered: Dec. 22nd, 2016   ·   location: ID
id 8611904
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BigBlueEyes ( Member #71441) posted at 8:32 PM on Tuesday, November 24th, 2020

Also I Just wanted to say,

You will get lots of awesome great advice, some (what we call) 4x4’s (hard truths) & then you’ll get some you just want to leave behind!!

Basically Take what you need & leave the rest!!

Stay safe

Me- BW, 47
Multi Dday's,
DB A's x 2 BFF
Multi ONS's, Online shit.
Serial cheat, Abuser,
D 18.02.20
Stay strong, just because it’s hard today, doesn’t mean that next week it won’t get easier!!

posts: 674   ·   registered: Mar. 11th, 2019   ·   location: A tiny dot in a big 'ol World
id 8611905
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 Eternitysky (original poster New Member #75904) posted at 11:56 PM on Tuesday, November 24th, 2020

I appreciate everyone's input I really do. I try to be as open minded as possible in any situation. It can hurt me in a situation like this because like many said here I'm approaching it wrong. Reading a lot of these responses makes things easier tonight.

That first night I found out about the cheating, we an amazing heart to heart talk and she said we could just be on a break. Then that night saw him after lying about it and telling him those horrible lies about me and her, I realized I had more self respect then that. That's why I blasted her on social media because I'm her husband not her side guy. This is the most betrayal I have ever felt in my life but I know she is trying to keep what is making her feel safe and secure through this. Him. Which makes it even worse. So heavy =/

I have been motivated the past month to work towards being a better person for myself and maybe eventually her. I still think we had something that not many find but always search for. There's always rules for coming back together after something like this so until I meet my hard standards of who I want to be in life I will not entertain an actual conversation about that subject with myself or her if she reaches out. I want it to be healthy again and be financially stable to actual move in together, not this horrible distance.

Again everyone's input is greatly appreciated. I do need to stop being hopeful and giving her attention. I was told today by a friend that me reaching out constantly is just giving her more validation and closure and just hurting myself. I agree and this morning before work I had reached out with a calm email saying I was letting her go to work on myself and that I wished her love happiness and self care. I know I had emotional dependency on her and for a while I had been overwhelming her for attempts to talk about our issues. Sometimes talking to much is worse then not talking at all.

Thanks to everyone again it means a lot. Looking forward to the day I can think of her and not break down.

[This message edited by Eternitysky at 5:59 PM, November 24th (Tuesday)]

posts: 5   ·   registered: Nov. 24th, 2020   ·   location: Florida
id 8611952
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Tanner ( Member #72235) posted at 4:07 AM on Wednesday, November 25th, 2020

I have been motivated the past month to work towards being a better person for myself and maybe eventually her.

When I felt my WW pull away I worked hard to be the best H I could be. This show of weakness back fired and she took advantage of all the work I was doing, went behind my back and had an A.

I still think we had something that not many find but always search for.

We all did, what you had was big lie. It took me a while to get here, but it IS what exactly it looks like, a giant knife in the back from the one you thought had your back.

You need to really turn 180 and head the other direction.

Dday Sept 7 2019 working toward R
BH 54
WW 47
M 30 years, 4 kids 2 grown, twin boys 12 yo 2 grandkids

One day you will tell your story how you overcame what you are going through now, and it will become part of someone else’s survival guide.

posts: 715   ·   registered: Dec. 5th, 2019   ·   location: Texas DFW
id 8612000
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BindassBP ( Member #75283) posted at 5:29 AM on Wednesday, November 25th, 2020

I have been motivated the past month to work towards being a better person for myself and maybe eventually her.

Do it for yourself. You have to live on with/ without her.

I was told today by a friend that me reaching out constantly is just giving her more validation and closure and just hurting myself.

Your friend is 100% correct. So, NO MORE CONTACT EXCEPT DIVORCE PAPERS. Because what you are doing is called PICK ME DANCE and IT NEVER WORKS.

posts: 72   ·   registered: Aug. 29th, 2020
id 8612010
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burcm ( Member #55812) posted at 10:46 AM on Wednesday, November 25th, 2020

Read your story, could not keep myself from saying something. You have been ghosted by the cheater WW - Looks like you are a "too nice" guy with soft attitudes (your manner of writing hinted at this) towards a woman who can easily cheat and run all over your ego with no remorse. You need to man up and cut contact, serve her with the D papers and move on with your life. Believe me you will never regret it (Cuz I went through a similar experience during 2016-2017 and feel as light as a feather after divorcing her). Plus, sounds like you do not have kids, so just cut loose and run, never looking back.

Edit: In case you guys get together in the future, your "reconciled" relationship will likely be far from a peaceful and relaxing one, full of anxiety and policing on your side. I learned the hard way that tolerating a cheater in the aftermath is just as painful as the D-Day itself. You will also hit the anger stage and that is when permanent decisions are often made after realizing what had been "put on your lap" by the cheater.

[This message edited by burcm at 5:06 AM, November 25th (Wednesday)]

Divorced the XWW and remarried to a wonderful woman much higher in both quality and beauty.

posts: 299   ·   registered: Oct. 29th, 2016   ·   location: Istanbul
id 8612029
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Bigger ( Guide #8354) posted at 11:07 AM on Wednesday, November 25th, 2020

Eternitysky

I think one of the main reasons we generally react so badly to infidelity is because we neither expect it or plan for it. Even if we had given it any thought then we really don’t know how we would react until we are there. I think it can help to replace infidelity with some other, maybe more logical, understandable trauma.

Like if you wake up in the middle of the night and smell something unusual. Realize it might be smoke. Of course you get out of bed and investigate. You open the door to your kitchen and see flames. I think that for most of us it’s clear what we do: get everyone awake and out, call 911, maybe try to extinguish the flames, save valuables…

What we wouldn’t do is close the door and go back to bed hoping the fire will go away. We don’t negotiate with the flames. We don’t ask the firemen to only extinguish part of the fire. We don’t phone the contractor to fix the damage before the fire is out. We don’t spend time shouting out about the unfairness of the world and why you – a good decent guy – have to experience your home burning.

Fires in homes generally end in one of two ways: Once the flames are out and the damage evaluated you realize if the structure is still salvageable, if the damage repairable and if the loss can be compensated or replaced. In marriage terms this is what is called reconciling. The other option is realizing that the damage is too extensive, the house completely burned or is not worth recovering. That’s when you cut your losses and move on from the charred ruins.

Honestly – nobody here can tell you if your home (marriage) is so damaged from the flames that it’s totally unrepairable. We have seen marriages survive what most would consider worse, we have seen marriages end from what most would consider less. What we CAN say with 100% conviction and what extensive experience has show us is that NO MARRIAGE can survive or recover while the affair is ACTIVE.

Just like having the contractor start fixing the kitchen cabinets while the fire is still burning doesn’t make sense. Or replacing the wet carpets while the firemen are still dousing the flames. Just doesn’t work. Doesn’t make sense.

With that in mind it’s only sensible to do what you can do, rather than what you might want to do.

The distance and the separate nationalities might make things different and more complex. The distance is definitely not conductive to reconciliation.

These are the steps I would probably be looking at if I wore your shoes:

Right away – like NOW – get legal advice on divorce. Where would you file? Can you file in Florida? Does her being in Canada change things? What is the process? The big issue here IMHO is that MAYBE the one that files has slightly more control over the whole process. I would worry that if she files you might be required to retain a Canadian attorney, maybe have to go to court there in person or something like that. Having home-ground can be a benefit both in time and cost.

File. Beat her to it if she insists she wants a divorce ESPECIALLY if there is the threat of the divorce being processed in Canada.

It’s a process – it can be stopped if both agree and the one filing usually has (slightly) more control over the timing. Going back to the burning home analogy: Filing is calling 911. You don’t want the fire, don’t want the firemen spraying water all over your things, but even less you don’t want everything to burn. It’s doing what you need to do rather than what you want to do.

If you want to reconcile then let her know. But be realistic:

“Wife. I think we have something and would want this marriage to work. But I won’t share you nor will I stand in your way if you think OM is the one for you. I refuse to share and have initiated the steps to end our relationship, both emotionally and legally. It’s a process and takes time. If you want this marriage then you need to let me know but the further along I go the less likely am I to want to reconcile”

Don’t argue with her, her OM or her family. The situation is actually quite simple. No matter what they throw at you: You were neglectful, unattentive, a loser… whatever they throw at you. The stock answer is something like:

“Maybe so but that’s not really relevant. Whatever issue I or we might have had could have been dealt with and might have eventually led to divorce. That does not justify her decision to have an affair and hide it from me for so long. She was totally free to file for divorce or demand change at any time.”

Be truthful but factual on social media or whenever/wherever you tell people the condition of your marriage: “My wife is having an affair with OM. I do not share my wife and she does not want to end the affair. We are divorcing.”

Nobody “wins” divorce. You don’t get graded and the one that scores higher gets a medallion. Divorce is IMHO all about damage control. Have your attorney give you a fair and expected result and work from that. You can hedge your position, but the likely outcome will be the one the attorney originally suggests.

Don’t expect her family to take sides. They will – they will take HER side. But this can end in one of two ways: If you reconcile then the family will side with her and reconciliation. If you divorce… well… they won’t matter anymore. They will simply be the family of your ex wife in Canada.

With a pragmatic and realistic view of what lies ahead you create the base for your personal recovery. It’s playing with the cards you were dealt. Might be more twos and threes than Aces and kings, but two twos and three threes is a full house and beats a king and an Ace.

"If, therefore, any be unhappy, let him remember that he is unhappy by reason of himself alone." Epictetus

posts: 9858   ·   registered: Sep. 29th, 2005
id 8612036
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KingofNothing ( Member #71775) posted at 3:03 PM on Wednesday, November 25th, 2020

Why were you living apart like that?

Rex Nihilo, the King of Nothing
----------------------------------
“If you’re going through hell, keep going. Just please stop screaming, it’s not good for morale.”
— Winston Churchill

BS 3 DDays/Attempted R, it failed. In a better place

posts: 769   ·   registered: Oct. 7th, 2019   ·   location: East Coast USA
id 8612080
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Junior ( Member #22589) posted at 5:21 PM on Wednesday, November 25th, 2020

Right away – like NOW – get legal advice on divorce. Where would you file? Can you file in Florida? Does her being in Canada change things? What is the process? The big issue here IMHO is that MAYBE the one that files has slightly more control over the whole process. I would worry that if she files you might be required to retain a Canadian attorney, maybe have to go to court there in person or something like that. Having home-ground can be a benefit both in time and cost.

File. Beat her to it if she insists she wants a divorce ESPECIALLY if there is the threat of the divorce being processed in Canada.

It’s a process – it can be stopped if both agree and the one filing usually has (slightly) more control over the timing. Going back to the burning home analogy: Filing is calling 911. You don’t want the fire, don’t want the firemen spraying water all over your things, but even less you don’t want everything to burn. It’s doing what you need to do rather than what you want to do.

This is especially important advice.

Having gone through a recent probate of former WW's estate due to a lost original will by the Attorney in the USA turned into a nightmare. The lost will caused me to need an additional probate Attorney and private detectives in British Columbia. A long process. The provinces all have different laws regarding probate and I believe divorce.Finding the extra legal representation took time and was expensive. My former WW (a resident alien)and I divorced decades ago and we were both in Washington at the time. We eventually got back together but did not remarry. Having had assets in both countries up until the time of her recent death complicated matters. Just finding a competent CPA to file her taxes and FBARS over the years with the IRS was no small feat and we lived in a border state.

So do yourself a favor and star the information gathering process, post haste.

Echoing the sentiments of others, it appears that your marriage has been over for some time now. Sadly, you have just recently been informed. Focus on performing a quick rear guard action. you need to try to get ahead of the curve at this point.

My condolences on the "death" of the person you are married to. It sucks for certain but that person is gone and I would look at the new person as my chief adversary going forward.

[This message edited by Junior at 11:22 AM, November 25th (Wednesday)]

posts: 198   ·   registered: Jan. 24th, 2009   ·   location: Pacific Northwest
id 8612115
Topic is Sleeping.
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