SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Unfortunately, this is a very commonly held misconception by therapists and counselors. There's a very good reason why a BS has "an impossible time accepting this very basic concept." It's a flawed concept.

This is my belief also -- that it is a misconception.

Going one step further, who does this misconception hurt the most?

I would argue this misconception hurts that wayward spouse the most. Wayward spouses have some deep problems and this misconception almost enables them to stop digging and to not understand their issues, thus preventing them from truly reconciling.

If you read the Wayward forum here, I think the overwhelming majority of the veteran wayward spouses (if not 100%) would agree with me. They are very firm when dealing with new members in the Wayward forum, forcing them to dig deeper.

To be honest, reading the veteran wayward spouses do this is one of the more inspiring parts of this website. I want my wayward spouse to see her flaws and to fix them. I want to have a happy marriage. These wayward spouses give me considerable hope -- I hope that my wife, someday, can be like them.

affairs rarely happen in a vacuum — they are almost always in reaction to vast, unmet needs...

I agree with this part of the statement. The WS has unmet "needs" in that there is a character gap and they believe that it is someone else's responsibility to fulfill their needs and/or that they can control/manipulate others into giving them what they want.

unmet needs in the marriage...many BS have an impossible time accepting this very basic concept. A poor marriage is not an excuse for an affair — there is no excuse – but it is almost always the reason.

However, the diagnosis then goes off course by blaming the BS for not fulfilling all those needs. The MC/IC allows the WS to excuse their actions and avoid digging into their own character gap.

WW here. I cheated because I was vulnerable and had the opportunity. BH was also vulnerable and also had the opportunity. Where we differ is I felt entitled to cheat and he didn’t. I was selfish and he wasn’t.

I guess their is debate in the counseling world (IDNK). The first IC I saw said my WW was broken and the adultery was caused by her internal issues. The second IC and the one I am currently seeing states she (WW) has internal issues that led to her moral failures and her infidelity.... We have a responsibility as a spouse to protect the marriage. If problems develop in a marriage we have the responsibility to bring them forth and address them. My health status and marital issues we faced at that time did not cause her to eradicate boundaries. Her selfishness, entitlement, need for external validation, and resentment are internal aspects of her character and not caused by marital issues ...especially over 30 years together.

I’ve heard this before as well. Your only contribution to the A was actually trusting your H. That trust allowed him to cheat. Taking responsibility for the status of the M at the time of the A is noble. Taking responsibility for “contributing” to the A is absolutely repellent.

Sorry Barcher, reverse rolls on ny last post from H to WW etc..

My contribution to him having an affair was I didn't kick his useless ass to the curb before it started.

Crushed7 - nailed it!

WTF book is that? Wanna make sure I never ever read it.

Our first MC (who did do SOME good - in that I didn't file for D w/in the 1st week) hinted at some of this too. We are no longer seeing her.

In my sitch - I realized something was wrong. W/in 10 days of WH's first sex with AP I began seeing an IC. I asked WH to see an MC and he refused. I confronted him on distance, drinking, etc. No change. I continued in IC for 1-2 years. Did some work on me. Gave up trying to fix/change WH, which I felt was the only thing I could do.

It SOOOOOOOOO pisses me off. If WH was in the same shitty M, then why not see an MC when I asked him to w/in a few months of the first PA?

Why? Because he didn't really want to fix the M. He wanted some cake, and wanted to excuse that choice by telling himself I did/did not [insert excuse]. Or maybe he realized that if we saw an MC, his A may have come to light?

To the extent my WH never expressed his "unmet needs" I don't feel terribly responsible - I'm not a mind reader. I knew things were "off" with him, I asked, he blamed work, I saw an IC, I continued to ask, and he continued to distance.... and continued his A.

I can't change the past. I wasn't an angel- I basically gave up on WH and focused on doing my own thing, and I slowly lost more & more interest in what was going on with WH.... without really addressing my anger/control issues. That is still my responsibility, but to think that had I continued to nag him about going to see an IC or MC or drinking or whatever, it would not have made one bit of difference - he'd already tasted blood (so to speak).

Now, I focus on me. I want to work on letting go of that anger. The control is a work in progress, but seems to be going better.

[This message edited by gmc94 at 1:37 AM, July 23rd (Monday)]

While in hindsight I can see some things in our marriage that weren’t perfect. And also in hindsight I see things I personally could have done better. There were more things he could have been doing better. That is the absolute truth. My husband 100% owns his cheating and should. Because everyday during his A I made sure he had dinner, I’d clear snow off the driveway early in the morning so he could come home. I’d do things spouses do for other spouses and he ignored me. I didn’t waiver. What I’m saying, is sure go back and see what things you could do better not because you caused the affair but because we should always try to improve ourselves and situation. But please don’t feel like you have to find how you caused it. You didn’t.

Besides you know what I learned I could have done differently is I should have called bullshit on some of his childish behaviors prior to the A. I should have demanded more attention from him. I shouldn’t have settled. So yeah I’m sure that’s how I caused the A. 😂😆

If your spouse is at all causing you for the A, they need to pull their heads out of their ass and reflect on themselves. With that said if at sometime you want to discuss problems in the marriage independent of the A, I think that is smart.

T/J for a minute. It is this kind of ignorance from “professional” counselors that turns me off. While I know good ones exist, many seem to be clueless. We’ve had 3 experiences with counselors. One with my son and self esteem issues and two with our marriage. I’ll be honest all of them sucked. My husband and I made it through this crisis because of pure determination, reading good resources and because despthr fact my husband screwed up, we both have very good internal resources. We were both able to grasp from prior experiences things we could use. While we all have foo issues, some of us also have FOO strengths. I feel strongly that it was our FOO strengths that pulled us through. I’m actual sick thinking about the ignorance of these “professionals” as they give advice to broken people. Again, I know good ones exist. But they are hard to find.

Only you know your story. BUT if you contributed to his feelings of isolation, emotional distress, abandonment, financial stress, needs not being met, etc. that is a point that should be discussed with among yourselves and/or MC.

However. You did NOT, I repeat NOT cause him to have an affair. That is 100% on HIM and HIM alone.

We all have ways to cope with stress. Life and marriage and kids and chores and bills and...

We all have the ability to choose how we cope. He CHOSE the A. He had any number of options. He CHOSE to have an A.

Oversimplified - you MAY have contributed to his feeling. You did NOT force him to take the action of an A.

We all have choices. He chose poorly.

[This message edited by Chaos at 9:08 AM, July 23rd (Monday)]

I screwed up 1/2 the marriage.

She screwed up 1/2 the marriage.

But the affair is completely on her! I take ZERO percent of the responsibility for that.

My wife actually agrees with the above.

I've got enough crap to deal with, I'm not taking ownership of that.

The decision to have an A, is completely on the WS. There is no excuse to betray someone, there are numerous other choices that could have been made.

Our marriage counselor wanted to talk about pre-A issues. We both told her we didn't feel like that was the step we were on. I told her that I was in IC and that I needed to understand why I chose this cowardly and intensely hurtful way of coping. We told her we wanted to concentrate on how to heal from the A. And, to her credit, she did switch gears but if she hadn't we would have hired someone else.

Honestly, I don't know if we'll ever need to address the pre-A issues now. It seems like we have been working to heal ourselves and as we start putting the pieces of our relationship back together again we are so different and vigilant that it just doesn't look anything like it did before. I think this article is a huge misconception.

WW here. My IC is firmly in the I contributed to 50% of M issues as did my BH camp. I do agree with this statement. However, I am solely responsible for MY decision to betray my H. Nothing he did (or didn't do) led me to that decision. I had to dig deep and find the root of my selfish behavior and make the necessary changes. Only then coyld my BH and I address the issues in our M, and fix what was broken to get to a healthy relationship.

Only you know your story. BUT if you contributed to his feelings of isolation, emotional distress, abandonment, financial stress, needs not being met, etc. that is a point that should be discussed with among yourselves and/or MC.

However. You did NOT, I repeat NOT cause him to have an affair. That is 100% on HIM and HIM alone.

We all have ways to cope with stress. Life and marriage and kids and chores and bills and...

We all have the ability to choose how we cope. He CHOSE the A. He had any number of options. He CHOSE to have an A.

^^^^^this exactly

Our marriage was unhappy for a long time. Part of the responsibility for that can go to me and part to my husband. But I had other better choices for dealing my unhappiness besides having EA’s. The fact that I chose an unhealthy hurtful destructive way to “fix” my unhappiness is my fault. No one else’s.

It is possible that it is not directed at me and it is more for the WH to be explore how he articulates his needs and whether they are healthy or not...

I think this is highly important. It's important for a WS to examine what "needs" they had that were "not being met," and how they communicated that need to their spouse and whether or not that was a true need or something else.

In many cases (mine was no exception) those missing "needs" don't come up until the WS is in the affair, which says to me that these weren't really "needs" after all, but comparing the bright and shiny affair to the marriage, which is frequently going to show the marriage in a poor light.

My ex didn't have unmet needs as much as he had real issues with entitlement, truthfulness, transparency and vulnerability/intimacy. Confronting these would have meant confronting large issues within himself for which he felt (rightfully so) a great deal of shame. Needless to say, he never got fixed, the marriage never got the healing it needed and he's blown through various other relationships (including the AP) since leaving the marriage.

Wherever he goes, there he is.

Cat

Edited to add the signature

As other have said, if the M wasn't meeting the needs of either spouse, both have some responsibility to have correct that. However, it is 100% on the WS to have chosen an A to "solve" whatever may have been broken, whether it was something in the M or something in the WS.

As my fWH and I come to better understand in a deeper way the Whys of his A, we both realize that often it's a "perfect storm", even in an M like ours, solid for 35+ years. That is, an A can happen even in a "good" M as a result of several intersecting and interacting reasons (aka the 'whys), each necessary but insufficient on its own. We discovered that the most important of these are unaddressed issues of the WS: FOO, trauma, addiction, ADHD or other conditions, etc. Often the BS HAS been working on their shit, as in my case, and the A becomes doubly painful. Because these issues have been left unaddressed, they often lead to regression, during which there is a tendency toward magical thinking -- and we all know there is probably nothing more divorced from reality than an A, and the belief that an A will make the WS "happy". Furthermore, those unaddressed issues often create distorted perceptions of their spouses' intentions and actions, leading a WS to think "he/she really doesn't love me." This often comes as a result of inauthentic communication, often due to the WS's tendency to hide behind walls they erect themselves, and not just as a result of BS's criticizing or other "four horsemen" behaviors. Entitlement is another key factor, the "I deserve to be happy", "I deserve to have more than one woman" distorted thinking the WS tells him/herself. Finally, a key "necessary but insufficient" factor is opportunity, such as a separation due to work, as in my case, and/or an AP that spots their potential prey and makes him/herself clearly available.

In hindsight, many of us saw the warning signs and thought our Ms were immune. But without belaboring the point, whatever dip may exist in a M, and these are normal in any long M, NEVER excuses the choice to engage in such selfish, self-centered deceitful behavior, bringing such devastation to all involved. In our case, it's really unclear if ANYTHING I could have done would have prevented my fWH's A.

-----

BS (me): 56 at time of A

WS (H): 58 at time of A

9+ month EA/PA, with a month of BS, so two DDays: 10/18/16 and 11/19/16

In R all in since DDay. Seeing in the not too distant horizon full R, but still dealing with some "Get me out of here!" dips.

[This message edited by hurtbutresilient at 12:15 PM, July 23rd (Monday)]

I think if examine the Pre-A issues it is important to point out that neither one contributed 100% to it or is solely at fault. There are a few that exists, but most often it can linked another issue.

My W would say that I never spent any quality time with her prior to her A. That is true. However she was depressed and lacked motivation to do certain things that needed to be done (kids, house, jobs, etc.) So I spent a lot of time making sure everything that needed to got done.

I could say that she never initiated sex. She could say that she did not feel in mood because I never spent any time with her.

You see it go round and round. The Pre-A stuff needs to come later in the process when you are stronger. Too early it damages the BS and the M more than it helps.

It is about building a new M with the stuff you like and leaving the bad stuff in the past. You negotiate a new M that works for both of you. You focus on the future then it becomes less of what you did or did not do versus I'd like to go out on more date night.

Blame versus a shared goal.That is where R needs to go if you want it to be successful.

An ESSENTIAL point I forgot to include:

R is all about trust building, and the BS asks over and over "How can I trust you after what you have done?," and is "looking for any reason they can find not to trust (WS)" (In Coston book). Any "reason" that is not 100% on the WS sends the message that "I refuse to take full responsibility for my behavior", and will keep the BS from developing that needed trust. That is why IC for the WS is so key, to develop insight into his/her own whys and patterns of behavior.

Good MC focuses on rebuilding a new M because in the process of rebuilding a new M, many of the old dysfunctional patterns go away without the need to play a blame game, thereby building the trust back. As numb&dumb. pointed out, a shared goal, not blame, is key to successful R.

If you have a MC who is saying this then the simple answer is to find another MC. Complete bull$hit