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I Can Relate :
Emotionless Infidelity Part 4

Topic is Sleeping.
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Perdita1 ( Member #67654) posted at 12:26 PM on Saturday, February 22nd, 2020

Falling - I’m sorry you’re struggling recently. I think we’re on similar timelines - I’m just coming up to the 2 year anniversary of D Day. Like you, I’ve been thinking about walking away. One thing that I’m trying to fix myself though is EMDR therapy. I think it has helped to lessen the trauma of D Day. Don’t know if that is an option for you?

Outofsorts - I’m sorry your WH’s actions were so unhelpful as you come up to your first D Day anniversary. Do you think he forgot, or do you think maybe he was trying to avoid it? I know my WH really struggles with facing his issues head-on, he actually told me (a long time ago now) that if we set a weekly time to talk about his actions he would want to stay at work to avoid it. And I was suggesting setting a weekly time to take the stress off him the rest of the time, because he was so fearful of me talking! Honestly, now I write that out I see how pathetic it is. Or maybe your WH just doesn’t get how traumatic these anniversaries are (I know my WH doesn’t)? Anyway, how was the 22nd for you? My second DDay anniversary is this coming week and I can feel myself getting tense. I’ve spent most of today ignoring WH.

[This message edited by Perdita1 at 6:29 AM, February 22nd (Saturday)]

posts: 85   ·   registered: Oct. 29th, 2018
id 8514006
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outofsorts ( Member #70701) posted at 2:09 AM on Monday, February 24th, 2020

Do you think he forgot, or do you think maybe he was trying to avoid it?

To be honest, I don't know. He says he just forgot (which would not be unusual for him). But either way it was just incredibly thoughtless to not check in with me before agreeing to work on that day in particular - I would be okay with every other day. And we were just talking about the anniversary on Dday in MC on Tuesday and how I was expecting it to be a hard day. I'm at a bit of a loss about this. But this is also the worst thing he has done in a while so.....?

The 22nd ending up being bad, but not as bad as I was worried it would be. The morning was really tough so I basically stayed in bed all day and read, played on the internet, and actually did some work to distract myself.

Perdita - I'm sorry to hear that you are still struggling and your WH hasn't been stepping up like he should! I am glad that the EMDR is helping. I hope that every is as easy as it possibly can be as you head into your 2nd Dday anniversary.

Me(BW): 40
WH: 40
Married 7 years, together 20.
Dday 2/22/19
Reconciling

posts: 327   ·   registered: Jun. 4th, 2019
id 8514660
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Sadismynewname ( Member #63897) posted at 11:35 PM on Wednesday, April 8th, 2020

I am 2 years out today and I am still struggling with seeing Asian women on tv, movies, or in person without wanting to strangle them and think what a horrible culture they have for thinking happy ending massages are ok. I know mentally they don’t all give bj’s but viscerally I just get nauseous when I am around them! I wish this thread were more active and receptive also. I know others have somewhat similar experiences to me.

posts: 157   ·   registered: May. 25th, 2018   ·   location: Northwest
id 8530601
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Butforthegrace ( Member #63264) posted at 12:21 AM on Thursday, April 9th, 2020

struggling with seeing Asian women

I completely understand your struggles. Perhaps it might help a bit to see that coin from another side. In the west, Asian women are widely viewed as objects of fetish; they are also widely viewed as naive bimbos, sort of another version of the stereotypical blonde. As a result, a lot of Asian women are victims of sex trafficking (a large percentage of Asian women giving happy ending massages are in this category -- they don't choose that lifestyle); a lot of them experience limited life choices because men are only after them for sex; and a lot of them encounter hurdles against advancing in professional careers because of the stereotype that they are giggling naive dummies.

"The wicked man flees when no one chases."

posts: 3771   ·   registered: Mar. 31st, 2018   ·   location: Midwest
id 8530611
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outofsorts ( Member #70701) posted at 2:09 AM on Thursday, April 9th, 2020

Hi SIMNN,

I completely relate to what you are saying. I've had the same experience and still occasionally get triggered by the same thing but I do feel like I'm getting better.

Unfortunately everything that Butforthegrace posted is also true. And I know it. And it makes me feel very racist when I do get triggered by this.

And I know I was not the only "victim" of my WH's massage parlor habit. At least one of the women at the out of state massage parlor was a victim of sex trafficking. And likely the in-state women were also victims of sex-trafficking. And I don't know where to go with this.

In general I just hate this part of the infidelity so much because too many conflicting things are true and I don't know where to go with it and it just swirls around in my head and makes me feel bad.

Me(BW): 40
WH: 40
Married 7 years, together 20.
Dday 2/22/19
Reconciling

posts: 327   ·   registered: Jun. 4th, 2019
id 8530650
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Sadismynewname ( Member #63897) posted at 7:30 PM on Thursday, April 9th, 2020

I am a very educated person and I have read and understand the sex trafficking aspect of it. This particular ex-bar girl (prostitute) now waitress knew he had been married for 36 years but knew her targets well. She had 135 old white men on her “books”. I know if my old POS husband valued me this would not of happened but she also thought she was entitled to con some money out of an old fool too!

posts: 157   ·   registered: May. 25th, 2018   ·   location: Northwest
id 8530880
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Perdita1 ( Member #67654) posted at 2:04 PM on Monday, April 27th, 2020

Oh SIMNN, I hear you. Except in my case the prostitute I could find background out about was from Brazil. It’s awful but I can’t deal with anything associated with that country without feeling ill. And it’s over two years post D-Day for me too.

How is everyone doing? Is everyone in sort some of lockdown? With / without the WS?

I am in semi-lockdown and WH is in the house. Children too. 2 years post D-Day and my most pronounced feeling towards him is disgust. There’s not much else.

He says he’s changed, that he’s working hard to fix this. And all I keep thinking is ‘yes, but why weren’t you a better person before? Why did you treat women as objects? Why did you betray me so badly?’

posts: 85   ·   registered: Oct. 29th, 2018
id 8536471
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Butforthegrace ( Member #63264) posted at 4:46 PM on Monday, April 27th, 2020

She had 135 old white men on her “books”. I know if my old POS husband valued me this would not of happened but she also thought she was entitled to con some money out of an old fool too!

Fair enough, but my point is that not all Asian women do this, not even a majority, and in reality a lot of Asian sex workers are forced into this life.

Triggering over an Asian woman has about as much rationality as triggering over a woman generally. After all, your WH cheated with a woman. Why not trigger over all women.

I realize that the pain and triggers associated with being betrayed aren't always rational. Just saying every Asian woman you see on the street is not a cunning slut willing to give up a bit of sex for some of your WH's money.

"The wicked man flees when no one chases."

posts: 3771   ·   registered: Mar. 31st, 2018   ·   location: Midwest
id 8536546
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Sadismynewname ( Member #63897) posted at 4:39 PM on Friday, May 1st, 2020

But for grace of course not every Asian woman isn’t a slut. I know young women of any nationality don’t go wow I really want to earn a living by giving old men happy endings. I don’t know why I am triggered by this and for so long. That is my dilemma. We have Asian exchange students I loved. So, this is so new to me.

Pertia isn’t it awful to feel such disgust towards wh and their choices so far out? I keep saying I don’t know if I like who you really are. Also, amazing how the internet has made finding out about virtual strangers? I met a Scottish woman living in Saigon that sent her Vietnamese friend to get info for me and that is how I know she was making a good side living with 135 old white dudes on her what she called “books”. My daughter had suggested that the con woman might not actually be a con woman and be someone that liked old men....50 years older??? That is why I did some snooping.

[This message edited by Sadismynewname at 11:03 AM, May 1st (Friday)]

posts: 157   ·   registered: May. 25th, 2018   ·   location: Northwest
id 8537994
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Perdita1 ( Member #67654) posted at 1:47 PM on Wednesday, May 13th, 2020

The disgust, the contempt...it’s all been flooding back the last few days. EMDR brought up how much lying and planning goes into this, and I can’t seem to deal with it. WH keeps saying that this is nothing new, that of course there were lies - that’s part of the infidelity, but I am really struggling with it.

posts: 85   ·   registered: Oct. 29th, 2018
id 8541795
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Sadismynewname ( Member #63897) posted at 1:35 AM on Thursday, May 21st, 2020

Perdtia I really struggle with all the manipulation and lies too. I never saw him as a liar and now I catch him in lies all the time. He was given a pass on so many things and now he find it hard when I hold him accountable now.

posts: 157   ·   registered: May. 25th, 2018   ·   location: Northwest
id 8544377
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Perdita1 ( Member #67654) posted at 1:43 PM on Friday, May 22nd, 2020

Yes, I see lies all the time now. White lies, nothing that violates trust, but they jar me. But the fact that he’s willing to white lie bothers me (but then I’m not big into white lies myself).

Started with a new MC this week - just the assessment. Part of me can’t wait to give it a go, the other part is worried it’s going to be a waste of time, and yet another is worried that we’ve landed on some hideous therapist who is going to rug-sweep his behaviour. I’ve very clearly stated that I’m never going to stop blaming him for what he did, so no need to ask me to do that, and that I want to look at how my trauma resurfaces and how he should deal with that. So...fingers crossed.

[This message edited by Perdita1 at 7:44 AM, May 22nd (Friday)]

posts: 85   ·   registered: Oct. 29th, 2018
id 8544826
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Sadismynewname ( Member #63897) posted at 9:33 PM on Saturday, June 13th, 2020

Permits how did the new counselor do?

posts: 157   ·   registered: May. 25th, 2018   ·   location: Northwest
id 8550819
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Perdita1 ( Member #67654) posted at 1:37 PM on Friday, June 19th, 2020

Thanks for asking SIMNN. Had a few sessions with the new MC. I think she’s definitely better than the old one - she doesn’t let him run away from hard conversations, or just throw his hands up and say ‘that’s how he is’ when talking about his defects.

I’m not loving that amount of work I have to put into this process though - it seems very unfair that I have to do so much work when he messed up so badly. And there have been some comments on my mindset and the lens through which I view the situation that I need to think about and decide how they sit with me.

How are things with you SIMNN?

posts: 85   ·   registered: Oct. 29th, 2018
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Sadismynewname ( Member #63897) posted at 9:47 PM on Friday, June 19th, 2020

Perdita Oh I get it. They put this baloney into our lives and we end up doing most of the work. I seem to have entered a phase of kind of acceptance now a little over 2 years out. It stinks that a marriage and a man I was so proud of is now a source of embarrassment.

posts: 157   ·   registered: May. 25th, 2018   ·   location: Northwest
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Perdita1 ( Member #67654) posted at 1:05 PM on Tuesday, June 23rd, 2020

The embarrassment is killing me. There was a point when I was so proud of him. That’s gone. Sex workers for crying out loud. I have no words for how disgusted I am when I think about it.

Oh, and I had a killer line today. Apparently at the time he was thinking that emotionless infidelity was not ‘really’ stepping out on the marriage. Yeah right, so why not tell me about it? I’m surprised I could listen to such rubbish so calmly. I lost it later in the day though, so maybe it was just a slow burning rage.

So my individual therapist said something that helped when I was talking about the work and the unfairness of having to do so much. I can’t recall it word for word, but she basically acknowledged the unfairness but pointed out that the reality is I am in the situation (though I shouldn’t be). I’m not sure how that helped (maybe it was the acknowledgment of a professional?) but I’m feeling better about having to work (for today at least).

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DevastatedDee ( Member #59873) posted at 1:24 PM on Tuesday, June 23rd, 2020

Apparently at the time he was thinking that emotionless infidelity was not ‘really’ stepping out on the marriage.

I heard the same thing. I suggested that he was a really inconsiderate asshole not to have shared that with me, as he had deprived me of years of casual sex with any number of men that I wouldn't even have had to pay for. For some reason it wouldn't have been okay for me to do the same things he did.

The risk to your health alone is an outrage. I wouldn't touch any man who I knew was engaging in sex with prostitutes, and there I was sharing a bed with one of those men every night. Completely unprotected sex with the kind of guy I wouldn't even knowingly kiss. Your disgust is completely natural.

DDay: 06/07/2017
MH - RA on DDay.
Divorced a serial cheater (prostitutes and lord only knows who and what else).

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Sadismynewname ( Member #63897) posted at 11:42 PM on Tuesday, June 23rd, 2020

Oh Devastated Dee I also got not really an affair. I was a faithful wife to a completely impotent man for 21 years. I also said well I could have been out there enjoying sex for free all this time then!

posts: 157   ·   registered: May. 25th, 2018   ·   location: Northwest
id 8553921
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BlackRaven ( Member #74607) posted at 8:07 AM on Tuesday, July 7th, 2020

I'm 3 months out from DD1 and 2.5 weeks out from DD2 after TT. My WH had four affairs, dating back 16 years, all with COWs. The first three were - in his own words - opportunistic. There was no emotional involvement, no big flirtation lead up, nothing being mirrored. It was just 2 (married) people staying late in the office and bam, she was over his desk, or in the bathroom, or in the lounge. The most recent one, the one I discovered, was emotional, and they'd known each other a few years at least, through he really knew nothing about her.

WH wants to reconcile and since DD1 has been doing some serious work in IM, dealing with a lot of FOO shit and ACoA. It's nice, but I wish it had been 20 years ago, and I don't trust it yet.

One of the things that's been going through my mind a lot lately is that I can't think of him screwing these women in such an absolutely meaningless way without thinking that it was somehow directed at me, intended to hurt me. At least the most recent one was someone he flirted with, and he had been really unhappy for a while, but the earlier ones - they don't make much sense.

I once had a long term bf before and found out he was engaged to someone else the entire time. It devastated me, and I always told my WH that an affair would kill me (and that I'd leave him.)

We're separated now and I don't know if we will R or D, but I do know that I feel like the affairs were somehow directed at me.

Has anyone else experienced this? Did you come to believe it wasn't an assault on you?

posts: 283   ·   registered: Jun. 17th, 2020
id 8558343
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outofsorts ( Member #70701) posted at 3:28 AM on Friday, July 10th, 2020

Hi BlackRaven,

I am so sorry you are in this situation. But since you are SI is a good place to be.

There are people a lot wiser than me that periodically check this thread out and hopefully one of them will be along shortly with better help for you.

One of the things that's been going through my mind a lot lately is that I can't think of him screwing these women in such an absolutely meaningless way without thinking that it was somehow directed at me, intended to hurt me. At least the most recent one was someone he flirted with, and he had been really unhappy for a while, but the earlier ones - they don't make much sense.

I think I did feel like this very briefly - that WH's cheating was kind of a big FU to me. But - for whatever reason - this was not one of the many painful aspects of infidelity that seem to linger for so long. I did have the hardest time not blaming WH's cheating on myself, and still struggle with this on occasion. I wonder if this is just another way of blaming yourself for the infidelity....

I obviously have no idea if this was one of your WH's reasons why he told himself that he was cheating. Even IF it was though, it still speaks way more about him and how he is broken than anything you may have possibly done.

It might be helpful to ask about this in the BS Questions for WS thread in this Forum. Also, if you haven't already, try discussing it in counseling.

(((hugs))) Your so early in the process, it really sucks right where you are.

Me(BW): 40
WH: 40
Married 7 years, together 20.
Dday 2/22/19
Reconciling

posts: 327   ·   registered: Jun. 4th, 2019
id 8559692
Topic is Sleeping.
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