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When A WS Leaves For Their OP Part 2

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hopefullife posted 1/15/2020 06:48 AM

That, and a whole lot of factors. I know his lies to the AP was legit as I did my investigation. He lied to her as much, if not less or more, than he did to me. Major factor of course, is the child. We didn't have any, made it a whole lot easier to decide.

I guess what's making this entire betrayal even harder for me is... I sometimes think his decision was right. He was right to leave me, he was right to hurt me once the kid came into picture. I hate and understand him all at the same time. Because there's a child that needs to be prioritized, I sometimes feel hurting me to the core was all justified. I know having his A was bad enough to damage me, but the betrayal, abandonment and cruelty after that destroyed me, was maybe something... right. I mean, I'm the adult here.

Of course at other times there's no such feeling. POSH is just POSH and he hurt me in a really bad way. But it is there sometimes. I wish it's easier to just hate all the way and let go. But because I understand, it's making it all harder to process.

F*ck, damn POSH for all this.

ShatteredSakura posted 1/15/2020 08:26 AM


I can understand your situation. When there's a child with the AP, there are no good outcomes. Either you have the AP in your life now forever in some way (...unless if you're a male and your WW claims the baby is yours...can't do that in your situation) or he leaves. I'm really sorry that happened to you.

Did you want children with him? I can see that being a huge blow too...another instance of "why him/her and not me?". We often focus on sex acts with that question...but I think it applies to a lot more life experiences they choose to have with the AP and not the person they swore vows to or put a ring on their finger.

A few years ago I remember saying I wanted to start having kids around 30. Instead I got an affair and now I'm 32. I wanted to have children with her, but in retrospect I'm glad I didn't. I don't think she would have been able to handle the stress right now in her life, considering she hasn't been able to handle it up to this point. AP offered something I could not...no responsibility and a large social group that frequently went out to parties and happy hours. I never wanted to meet her ex-turned-AP or his friends so I had no presence in that group.

I actually became afraid that if we had children she'd run off and abandon them with me. Or worse, they wouldn't be mine. She even agreed with me once that I wasn't nuts for thinking that.

I agree that it sucks when you kind of understand why they abandoned you. It never justifies the evil they did to you though. I don't think her reasons were necessarily that mature (at least with a child he's taking some responsibility), but you can say she wanted different things. Although maybe you can say that about the majority of cheaters since they wouldn't do what they do if they were content with their lives.

[This message edited by ShatteredSakura at 8:30 AM, January 15th (Wednesday)]

ThisIsSoLonely posted 1/15/2020 08:36 AM

Weird, the AP in my world has this as well, and my WH mentioned it as a large part of "our" problem:

[AP had] a large social group that frequently went out to parties and happy hours

It just so happens that my WH can't have her large social group too as she already shares it with her H the OBS.

Granted I left my large social group to move here for WH's job, and have no one here now. My WH's social group was pretty much only people from work, and since he fucked up his social circle at work pretty badly by, you know, having a 2+ year affair with one of his co-workers, where he also works with the OBS (talk about a f-ed up triangle) and he's got a lot of alone time now.

hopefullife posted 1/15/2020 09:25 AM

We often focus on sex acts with that question...but I think it applies to a lot more life experiences they choose to have with the AP and not the person they swore vows to or put a ring on their finger.

THIS. He chose to be the partner of another and it kills me.

I wanted to adopt before I met him. Then fell in love and wanted a piece of both of us. Glad I'm not bringing a kid into this shitstorm. Maybe God is really telling me he's not the one I'll be making a family with. I'm 31 though, clock ticks for women. I hope it doesn't get me another 10yrs to heal from this.

[AP had] a large social group that frequently went out to parties and happy hours

His AP is like this as well. AP's social circle is huge, parties and drinks. I keep close friends and don't party nor drink.

@ThisIsSoLonely, can't imagine the feeling of the OBS working with your WH. Must be expert in anger management.

ShatteredSakura posted 1/15/2020 11:39 AM

Weird, the AP in my world has this as well, and my WH mentioned it as a large part of "our" problem

Yes I was accused of this too. We're both introverts (although she is more sociable than me IMO), but it was my job to give her friends evidently. We went to social events, had a regular board game group, tried to do things once a week...it wasn't enough, she wanted more. I hear she goes out a lot more now with the AP to these sorts of things. It's kinda easy to do that when you're the one being chauffeured around, and you don't cook and clean for yourself/others and maintain a house.

having a 2+ year affair with one of his co-workers, where he also works with the OBS (talk about a f-ed up triangle)

*10th ring of hell discovered*. I can't even imagine an AP, WS, and BS working together

WW worked with the AP, but they both lost their jobs because their business unit was sold off. She was laid off first because she was the weakest link on the team. This was the year before the start of the PA. I strongly suspect the loss of seeing him everyday greatly contributed to it. The months she was unemployed looking for work was an incredibly stressful time (and not because of money issues), she was difficult to live with and would be very nasty to me. And she also started resenting me because her new job came with a big pay cut (she made more than me, now makes about the same) and "because of me" she couldn't get a higher paying job in NYC.

We are in the same line of work, I secured her an interview at my company and they offered a position (same salary as me). She chose the company that was closer to the AP. It makes me question a lot about the first few years together.

I'm 31 though, clock ticks for women. I hope it doesn't get me another 10yrs to heal from this.

It ticks for everyone too, in different ways perhaps. My parents had me late in life, so they are getting up there now and my mom has a lot of medical issues that are steadily getting worse. We're going through the loss of her parents now, who had their kids at like 22. I wanted kids by at least 30 to give my children younger parents, and my WW stole that hope from me. I feel like she betrayed them just as much me, as they treated her like a second daughter and loved her.

I fear my parents will never see grandchildren, or be too old to make similar memories I had with my grandparents. I fear the hurt goes too deep that I won't make a similar connection with another women at all, let alone in a reasonable time frame. I gave her prime years to settle down and she pulled all this shit on me. And my worst fear is I finally meet someone who checks the boxes, and they put me through all of this all over again.

I too am not fond of partying or drinking and keep a small group of close friends (although many are now separated by distance). I thought I was doing everything right by being picky about dating, being careful about who I give my love too...I know myself, when I love, I love deeply...and I know I cannot easily discard people. WW a few times admitted that she felt bad "not living it up" in her 20s, and I feel so sad that she feels that way. None of those parties or happy hours ever made her truly happy otherwise I don't think she would have struggled with her depression; she always felt like people didn't like her or she wasn't cool enough and had this driving need to not miss out.

I don't very much like the idea of "party it up, sleep with everyone in your 20s and then settle down with someone else in your 30s". I thought she didn't either . The first month of dating, we started talking about hopes and dreams for marriage and how important it was to find someone that wants to get to that point and not just casually date.

I sometimes wonder if the only type of woman who will "get me" moving forward is a woman who has experienced being cheated on. I look at online dating and sometimes I feel like I'm a leftover, so many women in my age group already lived the life experiences I wanted with WW...and are single with kids. I'm not interested in that because 1) I don't want ex's involved in my life ever again and 2) I'd rather have my own children. Not all of them can be single because of infidelity, so that makes me wonder too.

[This message edited by ShatteredSakura at 11:56 AM, January 15th (Wednesday)]

AbandonedGuy posted 1/15/2020 12:10 PM

Shattered, sounds like our exes could be best of friends.

ShatteredSakura posted 1/15/2020 12:49 PM

Shattered, sounds like our exes could be best of friends.

Perhaps, her closest two female friends:

1. A woman who I liked, but lost respect for because she became the OW to a much older married man with kids. It was also an "open relationship" so she slept with other men. She called the man's wife a "crazy bitch" when she found out what her husband was doing and started divorce proceedings. I believe the BW confronted her in some way. The guy claimed he was going to eventually leave his wife and their marriage was already dead. Curious the wife had a freak out after learning of the affair.

2. The serial cheater I mentioned. I didn't like her one bit because of some of the things she said about me over the years. She was in a relationship with her former professor 15 years her senior when she was a graduate student, they both cheated on their former partners at a conference. Then she cheated on him with another grad student and forced her SO into an open relationship before dumping him two weeks in. She fantasized about the AP for a year and I know they started fighting about it. During and after she tried to convince WW how great polyamory would be. After things fizzled with the other grad student, she did a number of one night stands and a few short term flings until finding her current boyfriend.

Ironically WW was worried her friend would steal me away when we first started dating. The woman's behavior repulses me.


Because of her friends and the cheaters people describe on SI, many are cut out of the same mold. It's like they all belong to the same social club.

[This message edited by ShatteredSakura at 12:52 PM, January 15th (Wednesday)]

hopefullife posted 1/16/2020 04:40 AM

My STBXH's AP could be best friends with your WWs.

My parents treated him like their own child. He was loved by everyone in the family. Trusted him way even before we were married. I tried to save my parents the pain by thinking we'd reconcile first and I'll tell them when it's all history to me. But then Dday2 came and honesty is all I can really offer.

I still remember the feeling when he told me on Dday2 that he loved (in past tense) me, maybe we were just comfortable with each other and that we've never tried to be apart. Oh yes, you begged me to stay, remember? I was played like a fool all because I chose to love this person all over again despite his major flaws.

I do feel like a leftover. They affair down, but if they are happy, did they really? Sometimes I find it more peaceful to think that he simply just fell deeply in love than thinking he's a horrible broken person who I am way better without. I'm pissed I have to be involved in someone else's love story, but accepting the horrible truth that he may have just really found the 'one' is maybe something I have to accept to move on. Whatever works.

ShatteredSakura posted 1/27/2020 20:42 PM

"I'll never forget you"

WTF, how is that supposed to make anyone feel better?

hopefullife posted 1/31/2020 10:51 AM

It's OP's birthday. I wish I never learned so I don't have all these thoughts.

ShatteredSakura posted 1/31/2020 12:25 PM

Yeah I get that. It's hard not to think about because you know what he's doing now or will be doing. And it isn't with you.

My birthday and WW's are one week apart and she left shortly after mine in October. She actually stood me up on her birthday, we were supposed to go out together. She had made plans with AP long before and didn't want to break them and didn't bother telling me. She didnt come home that night...and told me they had a fight too that left her crying (as if that made it okay she didn't come home). She came home the next day to a very frigid house...

...and then pulled the same crap the day after that, he hosted a small birthday party for some of their mutual friends (not our mutual friends). She had a makeover done (she rarely wears makeup) and had the nerve to send me a picture of herself all dolled up...and she didn't come home that night either. IMO all I could see was a whore who I didn't know and didn't respect me.

What the flying fuck. I went off on her for that. I don't know why she thought I would want to see her like that in that context.

Moral of the story: at least he isn't sending you pictures of whatever he's doing today, right?

hopefullife posted 1/31/2020 12:49 PM

Thanks for the silver lining.

I saw pictures of his last year. He didn't send to me directly but common friend did. All smiles (parents even there) celebrating his birthday (our wedding anniversary) hosted by AP. I won't look this time and hope no one sends me anything. I'm just so tired of hurting I don't want to hate anymore. I'll let them have their fun, let me have the peace.

ShatteredSakura posted 1/31/2020 13:15 PM

Other silving lining: At least with his birthday being your wedding anniversary, you only have to "forget" one date moving forward, rather than having multiple dates giving reminders and triggers!

Why would a mutual friend send you pictures?? Lay the smackdown on anyone who would just send that without your request...there is nothing good that can come out of those pictures and those people should know it or be told it.

And yeah, pictures of them and everyone smiling and acting happy...it is rage inducing. I've seen some during the LTA, and all I can feel is those people (at least the ones I know) are condoning it...none of them reached out to me, no one said boo. Maybe it's not their business, but it still spurs those thoughts. You feel like no one cares about you or what happened...left behind...

I don't think WW has posted many pictures of them on Facebook lately (at least that's what she tells me), but I do know that some that she carefully protected with permissions so certain people that we know, or that I know won't see...because she doesn't want to be embarrassed.

[This message edited by ShatteredSakura at 1:16 PM, January 31st (Friday)]

hopefullife posted 1/31/2020 22:56 PM

I actually had a hard time deleting his birthday in google calendar. I googled how to do it and found others experiencing the same. I deleted his info and tried everything else but didn't do the trick. I got so frustrated I had to let it go then one day when I looked at my calendar it was just gone lol.

Oh common friend refrained from doing so, kept the photos until I shared about my legal battles with WH. Thinking I could find it of use. Had to fight depression the days following but it did give me a clear picture of the hypocrites (including in laws). Cutting them all off. I don't have Facebook, so I at least have that drama out of the picture.

3greatkids posted 2/1/2020 07:01 AM

A little over a year ago cheating POS got caught lying about spending multiple nights multiple times at his very attractive single boss’s house, while he was supposedly “moving heaven and earth” to reconcile after multiple previous affairs and multiple d days and trickle truth blah blah blah. I gave him an ultimatum; quit the job and start focusing on saving our family, or move out so we can have the year legal separation and start divorcing. He told me he loved the job, got so angry he punched a post and broke his hand.

Fast forward a year, he’s been refusing all sorts of divorce agreements, refuses me access to money to proceed with litigation, and insists he wants to reconcile. Meanwhile is doing nothing to even try to be a better man, and is a raging jerk about separation issues. And the kicker? This boss just fired him. Guess the novelty of their sneaking around has worn off. Ugh.

ShatteredSakura posted 2/2/2020 23:06 PM

I feel like I'm starting to develop micro anxiety attacks. More fuel to add to the general malaise I'm in.

I think about the future - my future - maybe the woman I'll one day meet and the feeling of "oh god oh god oh god this is real this is happening, I'm never going to see WW again, I'm never going to be with her again" comes crashing down on me like a giant wave of water. Intense foreboding and a tightness and then a minute later, gone.

I'm not prone to anxiety/panic attacks. I've only ever had one in my life before this ordeal. Actually involves WW - specifically her mother and how she acted when we announced our engagement. When we left her home, I was so shaken by what she was doing that I accidently bumped into WW's father's car when I was backing up in my car.

I'm trying to occupy myself with stimulating activities but often when I'm done and have free moments where my mind wanders, everything just floods back. I think partly because most of my routine involved sharing with her the happenings and comings and goings of the minute details of my life. It's like I'm Curly (3 stooges) turning to my right after getting slapped by Larry and no one is there.

Now on top of all that, anxiety attacks??

[This message edited by ShatteredSakura at 11:08 PM, February 2nd (Sunday)]

AbandonedGuy posted 2/3/2020 02:43 AM

I feel better now so I got rid of my pissy rant. I needed to vent into the void I guess.

[This message edited by AbandonedGuy at 5:55 PM, February 4th (Tuesday)]

ShatteredSakura posted 2/6/2020 09:54 AM

Glad you feel better. Straight to /dev/null I suppose.

This morning I felt better only to have it all come crashing down. I haven't spoken to WW for a week, but she tried everyday to spark a conversation, like sending a funny image or a single message like SS?. Today she asked about a bill which I did respond to, and used the opportunity to tell me how angry she was that I was ignoring her...

I can't believe this woman. She has no right. I'm alone (and missing her), she barely talks to me as it is (like last week when I was feeling really low), and is off with another man acting like a couple. I'm supposed to be there to respond whenever she has the itch to talk? Not communicating is to not generate new hurts. She has no right to me when she's off with another man

I may sound angry, but I broke down when reminding her of these details. And just when I woke up feeling okay for the first time in a while.

[This message edited by ShatteredSakura at 9:59 AM, February 6th (Thursday)]

AbandonedGuy posted 2/6/2020 10:44 AM

What's her long term strategy with this? Does she want to keep you as a friend or something? I'll never understand people who can't accept other people's reactions to their shitty behavior and insist that you play their little game.

Your no contact is still your best bet. You're stuck having to keep dealing with her, so working through these little reminders of your ex are going to tax the hell out of you, but give it some time. It became a lot easier once my ex and I closed our joint account and I could just deal exclusively with her lawyer who was filing our paperwork.

[This message edited by AbandonedGuy at 10:46 AM, February 6th (Thursday)]

ShatteredSakura posted 2/6/2020 10:50 AM

I don't think she has one. It's just she's used to having access to me.

Two weeks ago I told her I was looking at rentals and she acted hurt. I told her what did she expect with our lease up soon (in a few months but I wanted to start now to find a place I really liked), would I just stay? She actually said she didn't think that far in the future. She's in lalaland.

[This message edited by ShatteredSakura at 10:53 AM, February 6th (Thursday)]

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